[PaintTouches]Character revealed?

[PaintTouchesSays]

Character revealed?
      

Written by: Andrei Greska
            

“Monarch has been with me throughout my tenure as a head coach and selfishly, I hope I am able to say that for the rest of my tenure.” – Buzz Williams 2011-’12 media guide On a warm August night when … Continue reading →


            

http://painttouches.com/2012/08/25/character-revealed/
      

[muwarrior69]

Great insight, Andy. When Buzz does leave and I believe he has no choice at this point I hope LW has a great replacement in mind. He and Fr. Pilarz must keep in mind that Basketball is what keeps Marquette on the national stage. Buzz always said he would stay at MU for as long as they wanted him. It's pretty obvious the admin is using the NCAA "new rules" in light of the Pen State scandal and firing his best friend to ease him out.

[jsglow]

Maybe I'm naive but didn't Scott bring this on himself and have to be fired?  Everything I know about Buzz is that he actually believes all of the 'character revealed' stuff he regularly talks about.  I would think he's profoundly disappointed at this time; in Monarch and himself for not seeing it, NOT LW or Fr. Pliarz.

I've never once believed Buzz to be a 'win at all cost' coach. So why would Buzz be anything but totally in sync with LW on this?  Quite the contrary, I personally believe Buzz would have lost some respect for MU had it acted to 'sweep this under the rug'. His own self imposed one game suspension fits a prior pattern we've seen with players.  'I effed up; I pay the price.'

That's not to say he's enjoying the added pressure LW is putting on him to 'clean this crap up'.  But we're seemingly not talking about philosophical differences over Juco transfers or 'traditionals' where there's no hard evidence that Buzz is at odds with the administration, only 'Hiroshima' speculation.  THAT kind of disagreement is what might drive Buzz away in my eyes, not their mutual commitment to run a squeaky clean Top 20 program.     

[bilsu]

I would think it all depends on hiw the new assistants do. They perform well and the problems do not show up again in the future, the happier the two Willimas are. They cause minor infractions or continue to recruit players that get in trouble and the two Williams will not be happy and Buzz will be gone. Of course, if Buzz himself, screws up he is gone anyways.

It seems to me that Buzz sees character revealled as two things. One being what you do when no one else is watching. The other would be getting back up when your bottle is knocked over. Buzz's bottle has been kncoked over and I would expect him to bounce back as hard as he can.

[jsglow]

It seems to me that Buzz sees character revealled as two things. One being what you do when no one else is watching. The other would be getting back up when your bottle is knocked over. Buzz's bottle has been kncoked over and I would expect him to bounce back as hard as he can.

Well captured.  Agree.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

It's pretty obvious the admin is using the NCAA "new rules" in light of the Pen State scandal and firing his best friend to ease him out.

Yep, LW forced Monarch to lie, so then he could fire him and piss off Buzz.

C'mon.

[muwarrior69]

Yep, LW forced Monarch to lie, so then he could fire him and piss off Buzz.

C'mon.

Of course not; but Buzz knows it's time to move on. As Andy concluded the future does look rather bitter.

[🏀]

Of course not; but Buzz knows it's time to move on. As Andy concluded the future does look rather bitter.

Buzz knows it's time to move on? How is that again?

Because his assistant lied repeatedly during an investigation? He should have been canned, and quite frankly I think Wainwright will bring more to the team than Monarch.

Wait...this is making sense now...LW & Pilarz force out Monarch...they require Buzz to hire Wainwright...Buzz leaves because he's so pissed off...Wainwright takes over to run a squeaky clean program...MU finally becomes SLU...

[real chili 83]

Well captured.  Agree.

Agree too.

[NotAnAlum]

Is LW wrong.  No.  But LW is taking a Black and White approach to this all.  Buzz is nothing more than an employee.  There is no attempt made to allow his "friends" to save face.  You may say that is the way it should be.  The coach is just a University employee, screw up and we apply letter of the law.  I can tell you that is not the way Calhoun is treated at UConn, its not the way Pitino is treated, its not the way virtually any Big Time Football coaches are treated (Alabama just reported over 20 "minor" recruiting infractions; Care to guess how many games Sabin will sit out).  Maybe Buzz will feel, "That's right, I'm not entitled to any special treatment".  If he feels that way his Character really is revealed for what he claims it is, and we are very lucky to have someone who is not changed by success.  Most people wouldn't put up with it.  They would go somewhere where their success earns them an administration that is willing to give the coach more latitude and take some chances in order to have a enduring success on the court.  I would think Buzz will look to leave but Buzz tends to work counter to the way you think he would.  Maybe he'll stay, if he does LW will have pulled off the trifecta.  I guess we'll see.

[KenoshaWarrior]

Yep, LW forced Monarch to lie, so then he could fire him and piss off Buzz.

C'mon.

Who cares if he lied about something minor.  I lie about minor things all the time to my customers just to get better tips.
Customer: Yea we are coming back from Fiji
Me: O Fiji I am told by everyone i know that it is a great destination 

I dont know anyone who has ever been to Fiji.   

The idea that people are mad about Lies is a myth, what people are really mad about is the fact that you did somethign against the rules and THAN Lied.   


This is extremely Minor, and at worst this should have also been a suspension for him as well.

[🏀]

Who cares if he lied about something minor.  I lie about minor things all the time to my customers just to get better tips.
Customer: Yea we are coming back from Fiji
Me: O Fiji I am told by everyone i know that it is a great destination 

I dont know anyone who has ever been to Fiji.   

The idea that people are mad about Lies is a myth, what people are really mad about is the fact that you did somethign against the rules and THAN Lied.   


This is extremely Minor, and at worst this should have also been a suspension for him as well.

Except you weren't under investigation, and then repeatedly lied.

[Pakuni]

Why is everyone so certain Buzz is backing Monarch here?
I see only three possibilities:
1. In addition to the investigators and administration, Monarch lied to Buzz about his actions.
2. Monarch told the truth to Buzz, who then either exposed this to the administration/investigators.
3. Monarch told the truth to Buzz, who then aided, at least by way of omission, his attempted cover up.

I'm hoping it's not the third. And if it's one of the first two, Buzz really can't be all that surprised by or opposed to Monarch's dismissal. As a boss, you can't have your employees violating the rules/ethics of your profession and then lying to you about it because that ultimately falls back on you negatively.

[muwarrior69]

Buzz knows it's time to move on? How is that again?

Because his assistant lied repeatedly during an investigation? He should have been canned, and quite frankly I think Wainwright will bring more to the team than Monarch.

Wait...this is making sense now...LW & Pilarz force out Monarch...they require Buzz to hire Wainwright...Buzz leaves because he's so pissed off...Wainwright takes over to run a squeaky clean program...MU finally becomes SLU...

I want Buzz to stay, but if the Administration is going to hold him accountable for every  future minor infraction by his staff or players under the threat of being dismissed, and from what we know he was'nt even aware of this one, is an untenable situation. As Andy has stated things just don't smell right between Buzz and the Administration.

[GGGG]

Why is everyone so certain Buzz is backing Monarch here?
I see only three possibilities:
1. In addition to the investigators and administration, Monarch lied to Buzz about his actions.
2. Monarch told the truth to Buzz, who then either exposed this to the administration/investigators.
3. Monarch told the truth to Buzz, who then aided, at least by way of omission, his attempted cover up.

I'm hoping it's not the third. And if it's one of the first two, Buzz really can't be all that surprised by or opposed to Monarch's dismissal. As a boss, you can't have your employees violating the rules/ethics of your profession and then lying to you about it because that ultimately falls back on you negatively.

I'm not saying that either occurred but there are two additional options.

4. Buzz knew about the violation when it occurred and either actively or passively participated in the cover up.
5. Buzz directed Monarch to commit the violation.

[jsglow]

I'm not saying that either occurred but there are two additional options.

4. Buzz knew about the violation when it occurred and either actively or passively participated in the cover up.
5. Buzz directed Monarch to commit the violation.

I'm hoping that the lengthy investigation fully satisfied LW AND Fr. Pilarz that neither are true.

[GGGG]

I'm hoping that the lengthy investigation fully satisfied LW AND Fr. Pilarz that neither are true.

Ditto. I just mentioned it because there were other possibilities.

[Pakuni]

I'm not saying that either occurred but there are two additional options.

4. Buzz knew about the violation when it occurred and either actively or passively participated in the cover up.
5. Buzz directed Monarch to commit the violation.

That's true, though I'm assuming Buzz's punishment would have been more than just one game had he actively participated in a cover up.

[Goose]

Pakuni
If one of sultan's points had happened and Buzz did more it does not mean his punishment has to match the infraction. I actually believe that LW protected the big picture and that is his job. If harsher punishment for Buzz it could have been cause for NCAA to take closer look. LW is not the bad guy IMO and think there is a chance he really did a great job on this case.

[madtownwarrior]

what a refreshing take on the situation - though, I am sure the muscoop mob is still at LW's door with tar and feathers...

Pakuni
If one of sultan's points had happened and Buzz did more it does not mean his punishment has to match the infraction. I actually believe that LW protected the big picture and that is his job. If harsher punishment for Buzz it could have been cause for NCAA to take closer look. LW is not the bad guy IMO and think there is a chance he really did a great job on this case.

[/b]

[Lennys Tap]

what a refreshing take on the situation - though, I am sure the muscoop mob is still at LW's door with tar and feathers...

[/b]

So when Goose disagrees with you he's part of some tin foil hat conspiracy nut fringe group, but when his opinion coincides with yours he's "refreshing". Awfully kind and reasonable of you.

[Goose]

Lenny
Madtown still thinks I am in tinfoil hat crowd.

[bilsu]

Logically

There are more than a few posters here that believe Larry Williams and Fr Pilarz are out to get Buzz. Assuming that is true they would have tried to tie Buzz in anyway to this so they could fire him. He did not get fired, so you can conclude one of two things. They could not find the evidence needed to fire him or they are not out to get him.

[NotAnAlum]

Logically

There are more than a few posters here that believe Larry Williams and Fr Pilarz are out to get Buzz. Assuming that is true they would have tried to tie Buzz in anyway to this so they could fire him. He did not get fired, so you can conclude one of two things. They could not find the evidence needed to fire him or they are not out to get him.

I think that assumes LW feelings about Buzz are Black or White.  I don't think its that simple.  I don't think LW hates Buzz.  I think LW doesn't have much repore with Buzz.  He tolerates Buzz and is wary of Buzz due to his success and his admiration by most fans.   LW thinks Buzz is kind of pain to manage.  He certainly doesn't think that Buzz is irreplaceable.  While no one is irreplaceable the odds don't favor the next coach being as good or better than Buzz.  If Buzz leaves MU is much more likely to be like Seton Hall or Providence in 5 years than they are likely to be Syracuse or Pitt.  I'm not sure LW thinks that would be such a bad thing.  That is what worries me.       

[Lennys Tap]

I think that assumes LW feelings about Buzz are Black or White.  I don't think its that simple.  I don't think LW hates Buzz.  I think LW doesn't have much repore with Buzz.  He tolerates Buzz and is wary of Buzz due to his success and his admiration by most fans.   LW thinks Buzz is kind of pain to manage.  He certainly doesn't think that Buzz is irreplaceable.  While no one is irreplaceable the odds don't favor the next coach being as good or better than Buzz.  If Buzz leaves MU is much more likely to be like Seton Hall or Providence in 5 years than they are likely to be Syracuse or Pitt.  I'm not sure LW thinks that would be such a bad thing.  That is what worries me.       

+1, except for the part about LW thinking we'll become Seton Hall or Providence. LW knows how much MU spends on bball and I'm sure he thinks he can make a hire that would result in MU not missing a beat. I disagree completely.