Inside MU Basketball season-ending episode

[Pakuni]

It is as simple as this.

There are 2 new sheriffs in town.  They don't like what happened last year (2011).  They told Buzz so.  

He is learning the new rules.  Hope they all learn to get along.  

If they don't learn to get along, BOT has the new sheriff's backs, and so do many well heeled alums.  If you don't believe that, look at who is on the BOT.

I love Buzz.  I think many of the issues from this year were blown way out of proportion, but in the light of what happened last year, BOT wants this stuff to stop.

What he said.

[Hoopaloop]

No bashing from me Topper. I think your read is, unfortunately, dead on. For Buzz, the joy has been sucked out of his job, the loyalty and trust violated. Unless the powers that be can "bring back that lovin' feeling" it's a matter of when, not if.

Is it the administration or the powers that be or is it part of the normal process of being a human being.

They call it the honeymoon period for a reason.  Most people have a certain spark with their spouse when dating or the first few years.  Later, it changes.  You still may love your spouse but goosebumps aren't the same.  People are like this with jobs also.  The longer you are at a job, the expectations change, the responsibilities change, people begin to grate on one another sometimes.

I found his comments to be normal.  I'm tired of hearing all the ball squeezing comments.  If he is not feeling loved by what MU has done for him (giving him a job in the Big East), paying him in the top 15 in the nation, letting him admit kids that historically MU has not allowed, giving him huge budgets, then I would like to know exactly how much more love Buzz needs.   

Chalk this up to the rigors of the business of college basketball and the expectations that go with it.  He's happy but you're never totally happy and most jobs that come with those types of salaries bring plenty of misery.  People want things in return for $1million plus.  That's life.  Fans, administration, media, alumni, players.  That's life.

[Hoopaloop]

Yup, let's double down on the stupid, shall we?

+1

[mu_hilltopper]

It is as simple as this.

There are 2 new sheriffs in town.  They don't like what happened last year (2011).  They told Buzz so. 

He is learning the new rules.  Hope they all learn to get along. 

If they don't learn to get along, BOT has the new sheriff's backs, and so do many well heeled alums.  If you don't believe that, look at who is on the BOT.

I love Buzz.  I think many of the issues from this year were blown way out of proportion, but in the light of what happened last year, BOT wants this stuff to stop.

This is what I do not understand.  Every public comment from Buzz indicates that the fiber of his being is about character and respect.  I have zero doubt that he has, at no time, said "well, boys will be boys."   I have zero doubt that every time there's been an incident, major or minor, he (or admittedly, his staff) has invoked either on or off-court discipline.  I have zero doubt that for every skipped class, every "C" test, players have been jumped on, as their life is tightly controlled by their famous minute-by-minute schedule.

That there's 2 "new sheriffs" in town would not matter under these circumstances.  From what we know about Buzz, if the upper-admin said "stop these shenanigans" .. Buzz's response would be "Damn right.  Here are the 26 things I tried on color coded paper.  Got any other ideas?"

Yes, there've been incidents, yes there may be some poor academic results .. that the BOT "wants this to stop" is obvious, but suggests that Buzz is somehow OK with how things are.  Everything we know about him suggests otherwise and is on the same page.

This theory makes no sense to me.

[Hoopaloop]

This is what I do not understand.  Every public comment from Buzz indicates that the fiber of his being is about character and respect.  I have zero doubt that he has, at no time, said "well, boys will be boys."   I have zero doubt that every time there's been an incident, major or minor, he (or admittedly, his staff) has invoked either on or off-court discipline.  I have zero doubt that for every skipped class, every "C" test, players have been jumped on, as their life is tightly controlled by their famous minute-by-minute schedule.

That there's 2 "new sheriffs" in town would not matter under these circumstances.  From what we know about Buzz, if the upper-admin said "stop these shenanigans" .. Buzz's response would be "Damn right.  Here are the 26 things I tried on color coded paper.  Got any other ideas?"

Yes, there've been incidents, yes there may be some poor academic results .. that the BOT "wants this to stop" is obvious, but suggests that Buzz is somehow OK with how things are.  Everything we know about him suggests otherwise and is on the same page.

This theory makes no sense to me.

Well articulated

[lab_warrior]

I also have zero doubt that if Buzz were unhappy, he would say it. 

And if Buzz was seriously considering that SMU offer, that he would say it. 

[Goose]

Lab
Finally agree with one your posts. Well stated.

[MU82]

No bashing from me Topper. I think your read is, unfortunately, dead on. For Buzz, the joy has been sucked out of his job, the loyalty and trust violated. Unless the powers that be can "bring back that lovin' feeling" it's a matter of when, not if.

There might be no joy right this second, with the team having just lost and with all of these off-the-court situations to deal with ad nauseum, but Buzz Williams probably lets himself experience joyousness more often than any other coach in America.

Was there joy the night he danced in West Virginia? Was there joy the night he played a quick bongo number on Jae's head? Was there joy when he and Jae embraced and said they loved each other? Is there joy every time he high-fives a player coming off the court after a job well done? Is there joy every time he talks with pride about how hard his players work?

Yes, there are difficult situations that are less than joyful for any coach -- and for any person, for that matter. But come on. Name another coach who seems to get more day-to-day joy out of his job than Buzz does.

While many coaches admit that the sadness of defeat outweighs brief feelings of euphoria from victory, Buzz sure seems to be that rare guy who enjoys the journey as much as -- if not more than -- the destination. That's one of the main reasons I hope he has a very, very long stay in Golden Warrior Land.

[MU82]

Oh, and Buzz was absolutely right about the interest in him being a good sign for the program, because nobody comes a-callin' if the coach is losing. And he was absolutely right about Weber getting canned despite taking the team to the championship game and winning 3 out of 4 games.

A person has to be loyal to himself and his family, first and foremost. Because in sports, loyalty only flows one way. We want the winning coach to be loyal to us, but we'll run the losing (defined as winning only 3 out of 4 games at Illinois and many other places) coach out of town at the first opportunity.

[GGGG]

I also have zero doubt that if Buzz were unhappy, he would say it.  

And if Buzz was seriously considering that SMU offer, that he would say it.  

I don't agree necessarily with this.  His flirtation with SMU was real.  IWB had his tweet out there for a reason.  I know that he players didn't know if he were staying or going.  This wasn't simply about him being successful and programs come after successful coaches.  The entire thing could have been nipped in the bud very early and it wasn't.

I am not saying his is necessarily unhappy, and I think it is highly presumptuous for us to say "the joy has been sucked out of his job," but I am not sure he is as happy now as he was a year ago.

[Pakuni]

Yes, there've been incidents, yes there may be some poor academic results .. that the BOT "wants this to stop" is obvious, but suggests that Buzz is somehow OK with how things are.  Everything we know about him suggests otherwise and is on the same page.

This theory makes no sense to me.

Not necessarily.
It could be a matter of Buzz not being especially happy about two new guys coming in and telling him how to handle issues within the program. It may not be a matter of the two sides having different goals, but rather differences of opinion over how to achieve those goals, and how to most appropriately address situations that might interfere with achieving those goals.

I love my kids and think (hope) I'm raising them to eventually be disciplined, mature and productive adults. Their grandparents, no doubt, share these goals. But it still pisses me off to no end when the grandparents tell me how to raise my kids. We all want to same things, but it doesn't mean I'm happy when they nudge their way into what I see as my (and my wife's) realm.

[Goose]

Pakuni
Agreed completely with you analogy. I think the problem is Buzz s being told how to do things and not being allowed the freedom to coach/parent in his style. I have said several times that I think Buzz does have some Al in him and that is not for everyone. Al knew the rules and the guys followed for the most part but Al did not rule in orthodox manner. Buzz needs to be himself and not reigned in.

[wiscwarrior]

I don't agree necessarily with this.  His flirtation with SMU was real.  IWB had his tweet out there for a reason.  I know that he players didn't know if he were staying or going.  This wasn't simply about him being successful and programs come after successful coaches.  The entire thing could have been nipped in the bud very early and it wasn't.

I am not saying his is necessarily unhappy, and I think it is highly presumptuous for us to say "the joy has been sucked out of his job," but I am not sure he is as happy now as he was a year ago.

As was alluded to in other posts in other threads, Larry Williams has only been on the job for 90 days. Right in the middle of Buzz's busiest season. There was probably not much time for them to sit down and get acquainted. This can obviously cause discomfort between supervisor and subordinate. Maybe now that the season is over, there will be more time for them to become comfortable with each other. Maybe Buzz can get back to being as happy as he was last year.

[mu_hilltopper]

.. But it still pisses me off to no end when the grandparents tell me how to raise my kids. We all want to same things, but it doesn't mean I'm happy when they nudge their way into what I see as my (and my wife's) realm.

I think that's a good analogy.  Although ...  it may piss you off, I'm not sure you'd disown those grandparents and move 900 miles away to find a new set of grandparents.

[GGGG]

Actually I think it is a poor analogy.  The days of letting the coaches do the discipline and taking care of the troubles their players create is long gone.  Having standardized athletic codes of conduct, academic progress, etc. are the norm across athletics these days.  The fact is that you are told how you discipline your kids these days, and frankly the fact that you had a couple players who have been in trouble quite a bit over the last two years should tell you something.

[Bocephys]

I think that's a good analogy.  Although ...  it may piss you off, I'm not sure you'd disown those grandparents and move 900 miles away to find a new set of grandparents.

Depends what the new set was paying

[Rubie Q]

I think that's a good analogy.  Although ...  it may piss you off, I'm not sure you'd disown those grandparents and move 900 miles away to find a new set of grandparents.

But you might threaten to do it, just to see if that backs them off your case at all. And then they say: "Really? You're going to put the kids in a new school, and sell your house, and find new jobs, just because you think we're meddling too much?" And then you're back to having Sunday dinner with them in a week.

[Henry Sugar]

I think that's a good analogy.  Although ...  it may piss you off, I'm not sure you'd disown those grandparents and move 900 miles away to find a new set of grandparents.

The solution is as old as parenting itself.  More beatings for the children!

[Pakuni]

Depends what the new set was paying

Beat me to it.
Who knows, maybe those new grandparents have oil money.

[Goose]

Sultan
My point was the coach and his bosses are on the same page for the rules and understand each other. The rules are set by the bosses but coach has leeway in how they are followed. My way of parenting is a ton different than my parents but the morals/ethics I am teaching my kids were set by what I learned from my folks.

[Pakuni]

Actually I think it is a poor analogy.  The days of letting the coaches do the discipline and taking care of the troubles their players create is long gone.  Having standardized athletic codes of conduct, academic progress, etc. are the norm across athletics these days. 

Apparently Jim Tressel and Jim Boeheim never got that memo.
I'm sure I could come up with a few (dozen?) other coaches who haven't deferred to the rules and/or athletic departments when it's come to player discipline.

[mu_hilltopper]

Depends what the new set was paying

Two can play at that game.  It also depends on the fact that in your current situation, you have a few tens of thousands of dedicated, loving neighbors who rave about you, you are the BMOC, and your current job performance is excellent, so much so, you might just win the holy grail in 3-4-5 years.  But you don't like your grandparents kibbitzing on your kids.

900 miles away does pay better, although you're a rich man and 10 years ago a weekend at the Ramada was a big deal.  The new place gives you 1/4th the fan base, your new job will be to rebuild, and you play 2nd fiddle to another division in the company.

Oh, and those new grandparents are probably pretty keen on discipline just like your last ones.  

[Lennys Tap]

But you might threaten to do it, just to see if that backs them off your case at all. And then they say: "Really? You're going to put the kids in a new school, and sell your house, and find new jobs, just because you think we're meddling too much?" And then you're back to having Sunday dinner with them in a week.

If you already have a new job and a new house and less meddling grandparents/employers waiting for you, the meddlers might find themselves awfully lonesome on Sundays.

[Bocephys]

Two can play at that game.  It also depends on the fact that in your current situation, you have a few tens of thousands of dedicated, loving neighbors who rave about you, you are the BMOC, and your current job performance is excellent, so much so, you might just win the holy grail in 3-4-5 years.  But you don't like your grandparents kibbitzing on your kids.

900 miles away does pay better, although you're a rich man and 10 years ago a weekend at the Ramada was a big deal.  The new place gives you 1/4th the fan base, your new job will be to rebuild, and you play 2nd fiddle to another division in the company.

Oh, and those new grandparents are probably pretty keen on discipline just like your last ones.  

Haha, well played Hillltopper.

The whole SMU thing never made sense to me for exactly the reasons you stated above, but clearly it did to Buzz.  I think Texans that no longer live in Texas have this unfathomable fondness for their home state that they think can only be satiated by moving back there.  I'd imagine disappointment quickly follows, but I'm not from there, so what do I know.

[Goose]

SMU gig was just a dance with another girl to let your lady know you still got it. Problem is with a move like that you might end up sleeping on the couch. Buzz knows what he is doing and will ultimately do what is best for him. If I had to place a sizable bet today I would say one and done for Buzz.