Marquette Tribune Editorial: Stop Glorifying Athletes

[MU82]

This is probably the dumbest article I've ever read from a university supported newspaper. Whoever wrote this should be terminated immediately.... NCAA is in the midst of implementing a stipend for athletes i.e. giving them some money for living and PLAYING BASKETBALL and our own newspaper comes out with an article about how they're 'put on a pedestal?'. Name one non-mens basketball student that generates millions of dollars over a 5 month period of time? Point-in-fact - these guys are not here to go to school... they're here to promote the school through their god-given basketball talents and provide entertainment, fun, and school pride all in one. In essence they are celebrities... Some of these guys are future NBA players (i.e. celebrities)... They play on NATIONAL TV every week.. THEY ARE CELEBRITIES. Most unintelligent piece of 'journalism' I think I have ever read, and embarrasses me as an alum to have something like that represented in our own newspaper. And makes our communications school look like even more of a disgrace than it really is... Pathetic.

Chill out, dude! You really want to start firing kids because they happened to write a student newspaper editorial you didn't care for?

If one of the student managers doesn't get DJO a water in a timely manner during a timeout, I guess you'll be advocating the death penalty.

Get ahold of yourself. Keep things in perspective. It's an editorial in a student newspaper. Jeesh.

[Dawson Rental]

Chill out, dude! You really want to start firing kids because they happened to write a student newspaper editorial you didn't care for?

If one of the student managers doesn't get DJO a water in a timely manner during a timeout, I guess you'll be advocating the death penalty.

Get ahold of yourself. Keep things in perspective. It's an editorial in a student newspaper. Jeesh.

Writing editorials on unpopular topics is an act of integrity and courage.  However, I believe that this editorial must be the product of bias against the basketball teams because the writer advocates changes after admitting that their is no reason to believe that the problems that they wish to remedy are present at Marquette.  They want to take decisions for running the athletic program out of the hands of professionals since "perhaps" there could be a problem sometime, and because they "felt" that it might be a good idea.  It's incredibly poor journalism, at best.

[Warriors10]

Writing editorials on unpopular topics is an act of integrity and courage.  However, I believe that this editorial must be the product of bias against the basketball teams because the writer advocates changes after admitting that their is no reason to believe that the problems that they wish to remedy are present at Marquette.  They want to take decisions for running the athletic program out of the hands of professionals since "perhaps" there could be a problem sometime, and because they "felt" that it might be a good idea.  It's incredibly poor journalism, at best.

It is not really an act of integrity and courage when you don't own up to it.

[Dawson Rental]

It is not really an act of integrity and courage when you don't own up to it.

The point I was trying to make was that that wasn't the case here, and the reaction to the editorial was not just knee jerk reaction by fans to advocating changes in the program.

[MU82]

OK, let's say every charge against the writer(s) is correct. He/she is a bad writer who had a bad idea and offered bad examples in making bad points and just did a bad job, period.

He/she wasn't attacking Marquette athletes. There was no libel, no slander. The writer(s) did absolutely nothing to get fired ... other than write a piece that some people don't like.

It's college. It's a school newspaper. It's a learning lab. Somebody with potential as a writer who really wants to be a better journalist will use this experience to get better. That's what college is for.

I worked at the Tribune 1,000 years ago. Looking back, most of us on the staff sucked -- present company included. Those of us who cared enough improved ... just as some basketball players who suck but care enough to improve do so.

Again ... chill and keep things in perspective, please.

[spartan3186]

If the goal of an editorial is to create discussion and generate reads, this article certainly did its job as evidenced by a thread with over 100 responses...

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

OK, let's say every charge against the writer(s) is correct. He/she is a bad writer who had a bad idea and offered bad examples in making bad points and just did a bad job, period.

He/she wasn't attacking Marquette athletes. There was no libel, no slander. The writer(s) did absolutely nothing to get fired ... other than write a piece that some people don't like.

It's college. It's a school newspaper. It's a learning lab. Somebody with potential as a writer who really wants to be a better journalist will use this experience to get better. That's what college is for.

I worked at the Tribune 1,000 years ago. Looking back, most of us on the staff sucked -- present company included. Those of us who cared enough improved ... just as some basketball players who suck but care enough to improve do so.

Again ... chill and keep things in perspective, please.

Agreed.

The topic itself could be interesting. The writing and the logic used were vague and borderline inflammatory.

There was a good editorial buried in there, and unfortunately the student editors weren't able to bring that out. That's part of being a student newspaper, I suppose. They might miss the mark sometimes.

[Hoopaloop]

This just in:  The Jesuits are returning their car fleet to Bergey, citing a conflict of interest with their vows of poverty.

Do Jesuits take a vow of poverty?  Don't think they do

[reinko]

Do Jesuits take a vow of poverty?  Don't think they do

If they take the perpetual vows, then indeed they do.

http://onlineministries.creighton.edu/CollaborativeMinistry/becomingajesuit.html

http://www.jesuits.ca/join-us/vows

http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/dictionary/index.cfm?id=35533

[Hoopaloop]

This is probably the dumbest article I've ever read from a university supported newspaper. Whoever wrote this should be terminated immediately.... NCAA is in the midst of implementing a stipend for athletes i.e. giving them some money for living and PLAYING BASKETBALL and our own newspaper comes out with an article about how they're 'put on a pedestal?'. Name one non-mens basketball student that generates millions of dollars over a 5 month period of time? Point-in-fact - these guys are not here to go to school... they're here to promote the school through their god-given basketball talents and provide entertainment, fun, and school pride all in one. In essence they are celebrities... Some of these guys are future NBA players (i.e. celebrities)... They play on NATIONAL TV every week.. THEY ARE CELEBRITIES. Most unintelligent piece of 'journalism' I think I have ever read, and embarrasses me as an alum to have something like that represented in our own newspaper. And makes our communications school look like even more of a disgrace than it really is... Pathetic.

That is the case at Marquette, but what about at 200 (at least) DI schools where the players don't make millions of collars for the school.

When you say these guys are not here to go to school, that is a statement that doesn't sit well with me or many others.  They are here to go to school.  They are here to get a degree.  They are here to play basketball, but it's all of the above.  This is not the minor leagues.  Most of our guys will not be going on to play professional basketball.  Instead, basketball is a vehicle for them to get a free education, travel the country, get access to people that most of us wouldn't.  But they are certainly not here to only play basketball.  We are fortunate to have a high major DI program, but there are 350+ DI basketball programs and most do not make millions of dollars.  That doesn't even begin to address the DII, DIII NAIA and other associations where student athletes are playing their various sports.

The article has many problems, most of which been mentioned here.  However, their core point is a good one.  As a society, we put them up on a pedestal.  We make them out to be bigger than life.  We are the ones that start attacking coeds at MU because they dared to accuse some basketball players of sexual assault.  If the accused was an Engineering student that didn't play ball would anyone give a crap?  We all know the answer is no, or certainly we know that we wouldn't be bashing the coeds for taking down an Engineering student.  That's the situation I think the editors were trying to get at, but they took a strange path to get there.

You also have to take the article in stride based on who is reading it.  Don't think for a second that the 50% plus MU students that could not care less about men's hoops or athletics in general don't believe almost every word of that editorial.  We're here on a sports board so we are bias as to the benefits of sports.  The general populace is not that sympathetic and feels athletic teams and star athletes are put on a pedestal, from high school on up.  To ignore this would be wrong.  We all know stories of our own personal histories of athletes getting away with things that you and I couldn't.  Whether it was an inflated grade in high school, a prank that would have suspended everyone but the star athlete, extra "stuff" for the star athlete, along with a number of other things.  That rubs some people the wrong way.  For others, it's just the cost of doing business in a win at all costs society.

[TallTitan34]

I think the Jesuits shouldn't be allowed to live in the Jes Res seperated from the rest of the Marquette community.  What have they done to get their own place with a private garden?  They should have to live in the dorms like everyone else!

[tower912]

It is a topic worthy of discussion.    We are discussing it.    They took a bold stance.    I can see their argument and remember when the freshman basketball players lived at McCormick with the rest of us.    So student writers wrote a less than perfect editorial.    5 pages worth of vitriol says more about us than it does about the editorial writers.    Let it go.  

[wyoMUfan]

worst op ed since some kid trashed "Sam's Town" back in 06'

First The Killers, now The Men's Basketball Program! What is wrong with this university / newspaper?

[Hoopaloop]

If they take the perpetual vows, then indeed they do.

http://onlineministries.creighton.edu/CollaborativeMinistry/becomingajesuit.html

http://www.jesuits.ca/join-us/vows

http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/dictionary/index.cfm?id=35533

Seems some priests do and others do not.  Appreciate the links.  

Dioscean priests don't take a vow of poverty typically.

Religious orders or communities typically do.  Franciscans certainly do.  Redemptorists can hold property and have a will to leave property to whomever he wishes.  Wasn't sure about the Jebbies.  

[reinko]

Seems some priests do and others do not.  Appreciate the links.  

Dioscean priests don't take a vow of poverty typically.

Religious orders or communities typically do.  Franciscans certainly do.  Redemptorists can hold property and have a will to leave property to whomever he wishes.  Wasn't sure about the Jebbies.  

And the word poverty in my research seems a bit outdated, and many advocate now a "simple" lifestyle, rather than one of poverty.  But appreciate the additional thoughts.

[Lennys Tap]

OK, let's say every charge against the writer(s) is correct. He/she is a bad writer who had a bad idea and offered bad examples in making bad points and just did a bad job, period.

He/she wasn't attacking Marquette athletes. There was no libel, no slander. The writer(s) did absolutely nothing to get fired ... other than write a piece that some people don't like.

It's college. It's a school newspaper. It's a learning lab. Somebody with potential as a writer who really wants to be a better journalist will use this experience to get better. That's what college is for.

I worked at the Tribune 1,000 years ago. Looking back, most of us on the staff sucked -- present company included. Those of us who cared enough improved ... just as some basketball players who suck but care enough to improve do so.

Again ... chill and keep things in perspective, please.

Agree 100%.

This is basically a naive, "wouldn't it be great if..." kind of editorial one would (should?) expect from college students. If they're still not looking for the rather obvious unintended consequences of their utopias 10 years down the road...not so good.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

I think the Jesuits shouldn't be allowed to live in the Jes Res seperated from the rest of the Marquette community.  What have they done to get their own place with a private garden?  They should have to live in the dorms like everyone else!

Awesome.

[Warriors10]

OK, let's say every charge against the writer(s) is correct. He/she is a bad writer who had a bad idea and offered bad examples in making bad points and just did a bad job, period.

He/she wasn't attacking Marquette athletes. There was no libel, no slander. The writer(s) did absolutely nothing to get fired ... other than write a piece that some people don't like.

It's college. It's a school newspaper. It's a learning lab. Somebody with potential as a writer who really wants to be a better journalist will use this experience to get better. That's what college is for.

I worked at the Tribune 1,000 years ago. Looking back, most of us on the staff sucked -- present company included. Those of us who cared enough improved ... just as some basketball players who suck but care enough to improve do so.

Again ... chill and keep things in perspective, please.

I agree with you, but shouldn't there be a point where somebody tells he/she that this piece needs a lot of improvements and won't be printed.  It is not like this article coincided with any special event that it needed to be rushed to print.

[strotty]

I agree with you, but shouldn't there be a point where somebody tells he/she that this piece needs a lot of improvements and won't be printed.  It is not like this article coincided with any special event that it needed to be rushed to print.

In the Tribune's defense (certainly not an excuse), the turnaround from winter break, dealing with different deadlines and finding sources over a holiday weekend made this a hectic issue to get ready for print for the editors. Again, not an excuse, but things were different following break.

[DienerTime34]

worst op ed since some kid trashed "Sam's Town" back in 06'

First The Killers, now The Men's Basketball Program! What is wrong with this university / newspaper?

I worked at the Trib in '06 and the "Sam's Town" review in Marquee was very positive. Maybe I missed an Op-ed that someone wrote though.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

That is the case at Marquette, but what about at 200 (at least) DI schools where the players don't make millions of collars for the school.

When you say these guys are not here to go to school, that is a statement that doesn't sit well with me or many others.  They are here to go to school.  They are here to get a degree.  They are here to play basketball, but it's all of the above.  This is not the minor leagues.  Most of our guys will not be going on to play professional basketball.  Instead, basketball is a vehicle for them to get a free education, travel the country, get access to people that most of us wouldn't.  But they are certainly not here to only play basketball.  We are fortunate to have a high major DI program, but there are 350+ DI basketball programs and most do not make millions of dollars.  That doesn't even begin to address the DII, DIII NAIA and other associations where student athletes are playing their various sports.

The article has many problems, most of which been mentioned here.  However, their core point is a good one.  As a society, we put them up on a pedestal.  We make them out to be bigger than life.  We are the ones that start attacking coeds at MU because they dared to accuse some basketball players of sexual assault.  If the accused was an Engineering student that didn't play ball would anyone give a crap?  We all know the answer is no, or certainly we know that we wouldn't be bashing the coeds for taking down an Engineering student.  That's the situation I think the editors were trying to get at, but they took a strange path to get there.

You also have to take the article in stride based on who is reading it.  Don't think for a second that the 50% plus MU students that could not care less about men's hoops or athletics in general don't believe almost every word of that editorial.  We're here on a sports board so we are bias as to the benefits of sports.  The general populace is not that sympathetic and feels athletic teams and star athletes are put on a pedestal, from high school on up.  To ignore this would be wrong.  We all know stories of our own personal histories of athletes getting away with things that you and I couldn't.  Whether it was an inflated grade in high school, a prank that would have suspended everyone but the star athlete, extra "stuff" for the star athlete, along with a number of other things.  That rubs some people the wrong way.  For others, it's just the cost of doing business in a win at all costs society.

The problem is, you can't have it both ways.

"Let's not put them on a pedestal."

Great. It's actually pretty easy. No more national TV. No more large arena. Play games at the Al, and become more like Loyola. 

Done.

If there are students who feel the basketball players are put on too high of a pedestal, and they really don't care for it, they could/should attend a D3 school (or loyola).

[RyanConroy]

I don't have time to read five pages worth of responses, but I think some students should back down for the basketball players' sake. These guys are college students. Their off-the-court experiences should not be influenced by their play on the court.

A quick "good game guys!" doesn't hurt, but students asking for autographs is WAY over the top. At the end of the day, these guys take the same classes as non-athletes everyday.

[Lennys Tap]

It is a topic worthy of discussion.    We are discussing it.    They took a bold stance.    I can see their argument and remember when the freshman basketball players lived at McCormick with the rest of us.    So student writers wrote a less than perfect editorial.    5 pages worth of vitriol says more about us than it does about the editorial writers.    Let it go.  

When I was a freshman, Brian Brunkhorst and Jimmy Burke were junior starters on the basketball team. They lived on 4South at Schroeder with me and 37 other guys. They played softball on our intramural team and when we lost the championship game they bought a couple cases of beer and hosted a party in their room. When the RA knocked on the door to break up the party (drinking was verboten in the dorms then), Brian told him to join us or f#@k off. So I'm all about the "good old days" when the athletes were more a part of the student  body. It's a worthwhile topic of discussion - sometimes the "good old days" really were just that - but the only way that genie's going back in the bottle is if MU basketball becomes Ripon basketball.

[StillAWarrior]

I don't have time to read five pages worth of responses, but I think some students should back down for the basketball players' sake. These guys are college students. Their off-the-court experiences should not be influenced by their play on the court.

A quick "good game guys!" doesn't hurt, but students asking for autographs is WAY over the top. At the end of the day, these guys take the same classes as non-athletes everyday.

Seriously?  Does that actually happen?  Wow.  The basketball team lived in McCormick with us my freshman year.  I shared a meal or two with Joe Nethen in the cafeteria and lived to tell about it.  I got to know several of the basketball players a little bit in my four years at Marquette.  It never even crossed my mind to even consider asking for an autograph.

[LON]

Seriously?  Does that actually happen?  Wow.  The basketball team lived in McCormick with us my freshman year.  I shared a meal or two with Joe Nethen in the cafeteria and lived to tell about it.  I got to know several of the basketball players a little bit in my four years at Marquette.  It never even crossed my mind to even consider asking for an autograph.

If you're over 12 and asking for an autograph, you might be a loser.  I lump them into the same group of people that are over 12 and bring a baseball mitt into the stadium.