Scout 2008 Top 100

[OneMadWarrior]

Scout just released their top 100 for 2008 and It looks like Marquette has 4 top 100 targets having already signed one. I just hope He (Nick Williams) is as good as advertised, although I am disappointed at the lack of Big men targeted.

[Harrison]

Pretty sad when schools like, St. Louis, Xavier, Seton hall and Rutgers are mentioned as often or more than MU.  Numerous players from the Midwest with nary a mention of MU.  Saw Angel Garcia in the Indiana title game.  Dirk Nowitski-esque as a 6'11" ball handling sophomore running the break and burying threes and dishing.   Landing 6'6" PF's over Hofstra ain'g gonna cut it.  ???

[Chili]

Just because a team is not listed with a player on Scout (or any website) does not mean that a team is not involved.

[Harrison]

You may be right I guess I am just concerned based on the lack of success of our last 2 recruiting classes.  Mbakwe is the only Top 100 recruit out of 7-8 kids.  Wont get it done as the top half of the Big East is signing Top 100 players left and right mixing in McD's AA's as well.   Crean got short handed after his nice class with Wade, Merritt, etc. matriculated in one form or another and he will get burned again after the 3 Amigos if something does not change with the 2008 class.  1 good year out of every 4 will continue the ups and downs.  Especially given creans offensive systems tendencies, it requires players to amke plays one on one alot.  Hard to do with lesser talent. 

[OneMadWarrior]

Our last two recruiting classes include 5 major contributors to lat years team. I am not sure what you are talking about Harris.

[bma725]

You may be right I guess I am just concerned based on the lack of success of our last 2 recruiting classes.  Mbakwe is the only Top 100 recruit out of 7-8 kids.  Wont get it done as the top half of the Big East is signing Top 100 players left and right mixing in McD's AA's as well.   Crean got short handed after his nice class with Wade, Merritt, etc. matriculated in one form or another and he will get burned again after the 3 Amigos if something does not change with the 2008 class.  1 good year out of every 4 will continue the ups and downs.  Especially given creans offensive systems tendencies, it requires players to amke plays one on one alot.  Hard to do with lesser talent. 

Hayward was top 100 talent but in the official rankings scout doesn't includ prep school guys.  They had him as the #13th ranked shooting guard in the country and a 4 star player.  The 12th ranked SG was #58 overall and the 14th ranked was #59, so Hayward was right around there but because of his school, wasn't included.

[herboturbo]

We're officially on the lists of :
no.11  Anthony Crater
no.13 Jamychal Green
no.44 Korie Lucious
no.46 Demar Derozan
and no.74 Nick Williams

We're also on the list of a person he mentioned in the accompanying article as being a fast riser just outside the top 100, 6'11'' Maurice Sutton.

Plus theres at least 7 guys on the top 100 we were recruiting at one time, if not still

[sailwi]

Korrie L alraedy committed to MSU so for all practical purposes he can delete taht one as a top 100 player interested in MU.

[dwaderoy2004]

crater already commited to ohio state...

[Final Four or Bust]

I've always been a "star-whore" when it comes to recruiting -- more often than not the best players we have tend to be the highest ranked players in our class.  I don't think that is coincidence, either.  We need to recruit with the elite on this front.  When we don't get a couple of them I will complain as our status should warrant at least one Top 100 a year at a minimum.

I liked the prospects of the "Big Three", and liked Hayward.  Cubillian I was skeptical about, but he proved to be quite a player (and it seems to me the exceptions to the stars tend to be players who play on good H.S. programs against good competition).  Mbakwe sounds like a player, but I am skeptical on the other two big men, but lets see what they can do.  Williams also sounds like a player.

I don't know who we are looking at, but I'd love to snag Green but I think the chances of that are slim at best -- but who knows.

[Harrison]

Mover... I am referring to the freshman class and the incoming freshamn class.  Of trend, cubes, etc and Saunders, mbakwe etc.  There is only one consensus top 100 player.  That puts MU at the very bottom of the BE.  Now I will say that Cubes, and Hayward are nice players.  But they are not necessarily the types that will carry a team to BE titles or solid runs in the NCAA's.  nice contributors again but not those needed to go over the top.  For comparison sake, Syracuse, Nova, Depual, Pitt, Georgetown, Uconn, and Loisville all signed 1 or more Mcd's AA, in the case of all but Depaul numerous ones.  They also all signed 4-5-6 or more top 100 kids over that time. That is 7 teams. 

 As those kids become sophs, juniors etc.  and the 3 amigos graduate or leave we could be in trouble.  Also, while lazar is a decent players he does not get the minutes had Crean not made such horrendous errors as Kinsella, Lott and Trend. 

My point again while everyone rushes to defend Crean, is our last 2 recruiting classes while decent have not matched the other top BE teams.  In fact they are top half at best.  This needs to be compenated for with a real good upcoming class.  Nick williams is a start, the other 2 sinings will be make or break.    Otherwise we will face a marked falloff when the 3 amigos are gone. Just like in 2004-5

[Harrison]

agree with final 4.  Concensus top 100 players usually are those 1000 point type, 3 year starter type players.  Mu this fall will have 4 on the roster, if James returns.    the 3 amigos and Mbakwe.  This will be in the bottom third of the BE.  We did well last year but that was with DJ despite how "terrible" he is.  The top BE teams are signing 2-3-4- top 100 types a year.  We are bucking the odds much of that had to do with a down BE this year and an unconscious season by Novak the year before.  We need more talent and less whopping misteps ie Trend, Kinsella, Lott.

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

People can keep pretending there is no problem, but transfers and HUGE assistant coaching turnover hurts recruiting.

[herboturbo]

Korrie L alraedy committed to MSU so for all practical purposes he can delete taht one as a top 100 player interested in MU.

Well I wasn't really talking about interest in MU by these players, but just the fact that MU was on thier lists, since I thought thats where this thread was going (people saying were not 'in' on enough top 100'ers).  On a side note i really thought we had a chance with Crater - I never understood why he signed with OSU with them getting a point in the 06 and 07 classes. 

[Chili]

agree with final 4.  Concensus top 100 players usually are those 1000 point type, 3 year starter type players.  Mu this fall will have 4 on the roster, if James returns.    the 3 amigos and Mbakwe.  This will be in the bottom third of the BE.  We did well last year but that was with DJ despite how "terrible" he is.  The top BE teams are signing 2-3-4- top 100 types a year.  We are bucking the odds much of that had to do with a down BE this year and an unconscious season by Novak the year before.  We need more talent and less whopping misteps ie Trend, Kinsella, Lott.

Lazar was a 4 star recruit. Easily top 100. I mean he was the #13 SG recruit in the nation according to Scout.

[Harrison]

Ok Ok Ok so we dont have to belabor the point.  Lazar was top 100!!  That means we signed 2 top 100 players in 2 years.   Again depaul, Uconn, Nova, georgetown, Syracuse, Louisville, Pitt, have signed 4-5-6 or more.  Much turnover in the BE last year allowed us to go 10-6 and get an 8 seed in the NCAA.  But as the Be rises again we need to keep pace.  We need to be signing a couple minimum a year with some top 50's and ideally some top 30's in there.  2008 will be a critical class hopefully we can build on Williams.  Depth hurt us last year too. we need to avoid the Trend, Lott, kinsella blunders too.

[augoman]

if in fact lazar was a top 100 player, i feel let down by his performance.  either he 'hasn't adjusted yet', or isn't up to the stiffer competition of div 1.  if our recruiting were a little stronger, we'd have the luxury (a la bobo the ryan) of red-shirting such projects, rather than needing them to fill a hole immediately.  more aggressive planning and approriate recruiting is mandatory.

[Harrison]

I agree and while I think he did a good job as a freshamn, but the single factor of "earned significant playing time as a freshamn" does not hold much water.  he earned significant playing time because even at only 6'6" and a freshman he was better in the paint than our two seniors and a junior in Lott, Kinsella, and Trend.  He to a great degree got most of those minutes by default.  Had Crean signed a top 100 power forward a year or two ago in lieu of those 3 stumble bums Lazars minutes would have been dramaticaly reduced and Mu would have been far better off with a more mature and experienced player using those minutes. I beleive lazar will be very solid come his junior year, the question now is who will be his successor a top 100 kid or another Lott?  Same for the 3 amigos, some top 50 kids like themselves or not?

[downtown85]

Lazar was a 4 star recruit. Easily top 100. I mean he was the #13 SG recruit in the nation according to Scout.

SG but played at PF most of the year.  Hats off to him, but 2008, does not seem like it will add a lot of depth on the 4 or 5 spots.  Maybe Nick Williams can grow 5 more inches and bulk up 30 lbs.

[Coobeys Oil Depot]

People can keep pretending there is no problem, but transfers and HUGE assistant coaching turnover hurts recruiting.

Transfers have nothing to do with not landing top recruits. If it did, Pitino wouldn't be able to field a full squad. He loses 2-3 every April and still lands a top 20 class.

[rocky_warrior]

FWIW, in my mind we have 2 top 100 players coming in (for 2007).  Don't count Christopherson out - he was left out of the rankings primarily because he didn't play AAU ball last summer.  Nonetheless, the kid is a player.  If you didn't see the article linked from Cracked Sidewalks today - check it out. 

http://www.lacrossetribune.com/articles/2007/04/08/sports/1boyspoy8.txt

[bma725]

It's almost the opposite of what people call the Duke effect.  Someone commits to them and suddenly they're rankings rise and the player gets invited to the more presitigious camps etc.  Christopherson was a top 100 player when he committed as a sophomore.  Rivals had him in, HoopScoop had him in, HoopMasters had him in, I think Scout had him in....then he commits to MU and the rankings begin to drop.  It's a bit ridiculous. 

And some have no merit, HoopScoop had him as a top 100 recruit as a sophomore, but before he'd even started his senior season, they'd dropped him down to #266.  Despite the fact that he got better.

[ChicosBailBonds]

People can keep pretending there is no problem, but transfers and HUGE assistant coaching turnover hurts recruiting.

Too many examples out there to totally disprove this.  UCONN will have at least 2 if not 3 transfers this year.  Indiana just announced another 2 transfers this year.  Kansas again.

You can say it all you want, doesn't make it so.  There are just as many teams with transfers that do just fine year in and year out then those that go the other direction.

[Harrison]

Dont get me wrong..I hope christopherson turns out to be a great player for MU.  Anyhting nearing the level of a Pieper or maybe a Logterman, or a Diener or henry or a cliff would be a nice career.   But again i go back to our compettiton Depaul Lands Tucker a consensus top 30 SG.  Georetown lands freeman a Burger boy AA, Syracuse lands flynn another mcD's AA. luisville lands..., etc etc.  Are we keeping up with the Jones's throw in WVU as a playerin recruiting  now too.

[ppp098]

Need a big man.