A new sexual assault allegation on campus

[wadesworld]

I'd say there are what? 6 or 8 floors? I believe all of the scholarship student-athletes live there, not just basketball players. I lived there my junior year. All in all, maybe 500?

Not all scholarship athletes are there.  I know a lot of the soccer players live in Mashuda when they are freshmen and sophomores.  I know when I was a freshman there was a women's volleyball player in Abbotsford.  I see track athletes walking into and out of Mashuda a lot.  There were some women's soccer players living on my floor in 2040s last year.  I'm pretty sure the only teams that are required to live in Humphry for their entire time at Marquette are the men's and women's basketball teams.  I do know that other athletes live in there as well, but I'm pretty sure it's not required and I'm pretty sure it's not for all 4 years.

[reinko]

I really don't want to get in an argument, but why is conjecture as to the POSSIBILITY that a basketball player was involved immediately shot down? Personally, I dislike that the previous public rumors about who the first accusations were against were not talked about. I'd like to know that information and I'm mature enough to understand the difference between rumor and fact (as I am sure most on this board are as well).  

I would like to assume that we are all adults and would be able value information that is presented as "it is being rumored that...xyz" without running to the roof and reporting it as fact.

Clearly you are new here.

[immaeagle]

Clearly you are new here.

I get that that is kind of/sort of a joke, but it is a legit concern. I don't like the concept of information being prescreened before I have a chance to formulate my own opinions. If some people want to make ill-advised, inappropriate conclusions based on half-truths, well then a proper screeing of the information that gets to them isn't going to fundamentally fix that problem.

[reinko]

I get that that is kind of/sort of a joke, but it is a legit concern. I don't like the concept of information being prescreened before I have a chance to formulate my own opinions. If some people want to make ill-advised, inappropriate conclusions based on half-truths, well then a proper screeing of the information that gets to them isn't going to fundamentally fix that problem.

But at the end of the day, this is a private forum, and they have rules.  If you are so desperate for rumor and innuendo, beg and plead for a personal message from folks.  Then you can make that judgement for yourself.

[Brewtown Andy]

Now the JSonline is saying it was a male student athlete in the Feb 27th incident.

I'm incredibly fascinated as to how this information keeps getting out.

[immaeagle]

But at the end of the day, this is a private forum, and they have rules.  If you are so desperate for rumor and innuendo, beg and plead for a personal message from folks.  Then you can make that judgement for yourself.

That came across very condescendingly. Not sure if that was the intent.

[reinko]

That came across very condescendingly. Not sure if that was the intent.

My intent was this.  MUScoop is a private forum, run by the wonderful SoCal, Rocky, Sprial, and Hilltopper.  They have established rules.  Posters must adhere by said rules, or consequences will result.  Those consequences include but are not limited to the deleting of posts THEY see as unfit for public consumption, timeouts ranging from a few days to a few weeks, and lastly lifetime banning.

Now, if you don't like those rules, skip on down the road. 

[immaeagle]

My intent was this.  MUScoop is a private forum, run by the wonderful SoCal, Rocky, Sprial, and Hilltopper.  They have established rules.  Posters must adhere by said rules, or consequences will result.  Those consequences include but are not limited to the deleting of posts THEY see as unfit for public consumption, timeouts ranging from a few days to a few weeks, and lastly lifetime banning.

Now, if you don't like those rules, skip on down the road. 

I was way off on the condescending accusation. I apologize.

[foreverwarriors]

I'd say there are what? 6 or 8 floors? I believe all of the scholarship student-athletes live there, not just basketball players. I lived there my junior year. All in all, maybe 500?

Only 19 1br apts and 71 2br apts in the building. If all rooms are occupied at minimum occupancy (1p in 1br, 2p in 2br) its 161 people. All rooms at maximum occupancy (2p in 1br, 4p in 2 br) is only 322. I'd split the difference (not many people in Humphrey...or any university owned apt...have apts at full occupancy) and say maybe between 200 and 250 tops.

On another matter...and this is in no way trying to place blame on the female victims, I find it to be a very disturbing trend that it is taking so long for these to be reported. For the October incident how long it took to go to MPD. For the February incident, that it took so long to report to DPS.

edit: I saw this article from WISN after my initial post. It appears that the accuser in the February case went to DPS the morning of the assault but waited to file a formal complaint until March 31 http://www.wisn.com/news/27526059/detail.html

[HouWarrior]

....please leave the investigation to the authorities.

I strongly agree. The very precept of investigations of any sexual crime claim is that it be done in TOTAL confidence, and as privately as possible. It is central to the process. An accuser should never feel inhibited, for a moment, in making a report due to she, or her claims being pushed into public before trial. Likewise, the accused, who is presumed not guilty, is given all privacy protections, until a charge is pursued. It must work this way.
Harming or destroying this process, especially by world wide internet postings has negative effects. Accusers with real claims think twice on making any report--thereby easing it for the crooks. Accusers lacking support on their claims, learn pushing out even a false accusation, into publicity, gives them leverage for civil settlements, but.... false claims make it harder for real claims to be beleived/pursued in real crime cases--so the publicity, in the end hurts real crime pursuit. The accused, regardless of liability, should have complete privacy, until the state makes a charge-- at which time, its public, and 12 peers will decide the facts, not the net.
If one respects the system , and your fellow men/women, respect the need for its privacy.

Think of the sermon given by the priest, in the movie "Doubt", as the internet is a huge feathered pillow, you cant rescind once said.

[Brewtown Andy]

On another matter...and this is in no way trying to place blame on the female victims, I find it to be a very disturbing trend that it is taking so long for these to be reported. For the October incident how long it took to go to MPD. For the February incident, that it took 4 days to report to DPS.

Sexual assault is probably the most psychologically scarring crime to be victimized.  The victim has to be ready to undergo the process of repeating their story of what happened over and over and over again.

[MerrittsMustache]

On another matter...and this is in no way trying to place blame on the female victims, I find it to be a very disturbing trend that it is taking so long for these to be reported. For the October incident how long it took to go to MPD. For the February incident, that it took 4 days to report to DPS.

In the October incident, the accuser contacted public safety that same night. She didn't take it to the MPD for 5 months (i.e. when DPS found no evidence of assault).

Most cases of sexual assault go unreported so I wouldn't consider waiting 4 days to be "disturbing." If the accusations are true, it was likely a terrifying ordeal for the young woman.

I don't want to give the impression that I'm indicting anyone or have any insider info. Just trying to give some clarification.

[foreverwarriors]

In the October incident, the accuser contacted public safety that same night. She didn't take it to the MPD for 5 months (i.e. when DPS found no evidence of assault).

Most cases of sexual assault go unreported so I wouldn't consider waiting 4 days to be "disturbing." If the accusations are true, it was likely a terrifying ordeal for the young woman.

I don't want to give the impression that I'm indicting anyone or have any insider info. Just trying to give some clarification.

I got my dates and months confused (doh!). The victim from the latest incident says the assault took place on Feb 27. She then went to DPS the next day, however didn't lodge a formal complaint with DPS until a month later on March 31.

The victim from the October incident went to MPD on March 22 and MPD then said publicly on March 28th they were investigating the 4 men.

[immaeagle]

I strongly agree. The very precept of investigations of any sexual crime claim is that it be done in TOTAL confidence, and as privately as possible. It is central to the process. An accuser should never feel inhibited, for a moment, in making a report due to she, or her claims being pushed into public before trial. Likewise, the accused, who is presumed not guilty, is given all privacy protections, until a charge is pursued. It must work this way.
Harming or destroying this process, especially by world wide internet postings has negative effects. Accusers with real claims think twice on making any report--thereby easing it for the crooks. Accusers lacking support on their claims, learn pushing out even a false accusation, into publicity, gives them leverage for civil settlements, but.... false claims make it harder for real claims to be beleived/pursued in real crime cases--so the publicity, in the end hurts real crime pursuit. The accused, regardless of liability, should have complete privacy, until the state makes a charge-- at which time, its public, and 12 peers will decide the facts, not the net.
If one respects the system , and your fellow men/women, respect the need for its privacy.

Think of the sermon given by the priest, in the movie "Doubt", as the internet is a huge feathered pillow, you cant rescind once said.

I just don't know where the line is drawn. It is in the newspaper that student-athletes are involved. Are we supposed to just leave it at that and not wonder any further?

[madtownwarrior]

From WISN:

http://www.wisn.com/video/27525904/detail.html

"Another Marquette University Athlete Accused Of Sexual Assault"

I just don't know where the line is drawn. It is in the newspaper that student-athletes are involved. Are we supposed to just leave it at that and not wonder any further?

[rocky_warrior]

[snip]
If one respects the system , and your fellow men/women, respect the need for its privacy.

Despite only including part of your post in my quote, thank for you expressing much more clearly what I was getting at.

I just don't know where the line is drawn. It is in the newspaper that student-athletes are involved. Are we supposed to just leave it at that and not wonder any further?

There's no way we can keep you from wondering and speculating, you're free to have as many speculations as you like in your mind, or have hour long rumor-mongering sessions in person with your friends.  However, all I'm asking here is that the discussion here is kept to the public facts.

Allowing our users to speculate and post rumors here regarding criminal investigations would at best be irresponsible, and at worst could result in a libel suit against our users (or a user).

I'm sorry if you still don't understand my reasoning, but that's my stance.  Stick to the facts if you want to post about it.

[HouWarrior]

I just don't know where the line is drawn. It is in the newspaper that student-athletes are involved. Are we supposed to just leave it at that and not wonder any further?

The press report  of the existence of a complaint...should not affect your line boundry. If you cant see it in my earlier post...here is another, relative to the line to draw with the press/internet (which I posted viz the Oct 2010 issue)...this is where the line is ....quite far from any wonderment...it should be only your personal knowledge...to wit:

Quote from: Hamostradamus on April 03, 2011, 09:51:20 PM
WISN hasn't reported on this yet, apparently they were having trouble getting a quote from Derrick Wendler on the "word around campus."

It is bad  lazy reporting to run around the MU campus hoping to muckrake some rumors circulating among the students.

I hope no student would validate that, or even talk to WISN reporters, except to share what they have direct personal knowledge of,....as repeating a hearsay rumor, that is not true,  is libel.

Has the word around campus ever been wrong? DUH--yes!!
Trust your word and personal knowledge--but always be skeptical of that of others. Thanks.

[Jay Bee]

MUScoop is a private forum, run by the wonderful SoCal, Rocky, Sprial, and Hilltopper. 

You're being a little over the top again, reinkz. 

Although I do hope to run into Rocky at the Cathedral Basilica of the Immaculate Conception on Sunday and/or Monday. 

I also hate WISN's subtitle of "Second Alleged Incident In Matter Of Weeks".  Granted, one is more than I would hope to hear about, but this is the second incident to have been alleged in the past few weeks.... I fear the subtitle would infer to many readers that two incidents are alleged to have occurred in just the past few weeks.  That is an UNHOLY LIE.  We've got alleged October and February incidents, (un-)respectively.

[rocky_warrior]

Although I do hope to run into Rocky at the Cathedral Basilica of the Immaculate Conception on Sunday and/or Monday. 

Alas, my despite all my wonderfulishness, I'm not Catholic.  Unless you're saying they turned it into a sports bar.

[Clam Crowder]

I think that we should just wait, all of this will be clear in a month. Until then I guess we should all just shut up and realize that there probably will be 1 or more players punished for whatever happened if that is what the D.A finds. At the end of the day they deserve the punishment

[Jay Bee]

Alas, my despite all my wonderfulishness, I'm not Catholic.  Unless you're saying they turned it into a sports bar.

We'll, we can chat sports while others offer one another a sign of peace... and the price on wine at this spot is a real bargain.  

Or else stop on out to the Gold Crown Field House in nasty Lakewood.  I'll be out there for an AAU tourney (Double Pump - horrible name) and plan to vocally cheer against Indiana Elite (except for Nader).  

BTW... Marquette student athlete code of conduct.. or something similar.. what are the rules?  I know of schools where.. if someone is arrested and charged with certain infractions (including any sexual assault, etc), there is an automatic suspension.. it can be lifted, on a case by case basis, but the suspension is automatic.  I haven't read Marquette's 'rules' on anything for a number of years... and never really ever read them myself.. just was lectured on them and had them read to me. 

[GO_MU02]

Skimming through some public safety reports, I came across this incident from March 28th in Straz Tower:

http://marquettetribune.org/2011/03/31/news/dps-reports/dps-328-329/

[Clam Crowder]

That's cool Go MU but honestly most of these people care more if this is basketball players due to the nature of this site. College, alcohol, and girls in short skirts can often lead to issues. Read that report and you'll see the girl said she was assaulted for 2-3 hours...

[rocky_warrior]

you'll see the girl said she was assaulted for 2-3 hours...

I beleive that was a window of time, not all inclusive.

And for the old timers, Straz Tower is the former East hall, correct?

[Clam Crowder]

The wording of that report is pretty awful either way. I don't get how a girl could be assaulted again and again over that time frame...Just weird wording.