Worst paying college degrees

[ChicosBailBonds]

http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/career-articles-worst_paying_college_degrees-1263

[rocky_warrior]

Odd, in an apparent editing mistake they left "Forum moderator" off the list

[Hards Alumni]

in addition to being the worst paying, forum moderator is also the most thankless.

[PBRme]

I really thought I would have found Romance Languages and Art History at the top (Bottom) of the list.  Kind of surprised with Spanish and Education.

[ChicosBailBonds]

I really thought I would have found Romance Languages and Art History at the top (Bottom) of the list.  Kind of surprised with Spanish and Education.

For the life of me I never understood why someone would go to a private school to get a degree in education.  So much cost and loans for a job that has a small financial return.  You'll spend way too many years of your life to pay that off. 

[reinko]

Sigh Chicos.

Weird, my dad said the same thing to me in 1999.  As an educator, MU taught me to critically think about social issues, asses student needs in a fair way, and treat my students with respect and dignity.  Not trying to be lame, but those lessons make me a stronger educator.

MU also taught me the importance of serving ones community, setting me up to volunteer teach for a few years after school in low-income neighborhoods. 

So yeah, my 20K in loans was "worth it", at least for me

[Lennys Tap]

Sigh Chicos.

Weird, my dad said the same thing to me in 1999.  As an educator, MU taught me to critically think about social issues, asses student needs in a fair way, and treat my students with respect and dignity.  Not trying to be lame, but those lessons make me a stronger educator.

MU also taught me the importance of serving ones community, setting me up to volunteer teach for a few years after school in low-income neighborhoods. 

So yeah, my 20K in loans was "worth it", at least for me

I totally agree. One of my daughters has her masters in social work and works (for not much money) with people who are both poor and mentally challenged. It's never occured to me (or her) that the extra cost of St Louis U wasn't worth it.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Sigh Chicos.

Weird, my dad said the same thing to me in 1999.  As an educator, MU taught me to critically think about social issues, asses student needs in a fair way, and treat my students with respect and dignity.  Not trying to be lame, but those lessons make me a stronger educator.

MU also taught me the importance of serving ones community, setting me up to volunteer teach for a few years after school in low-income neighborhoods.  

So yeah, my 20K in loans was "worth it", at least for me

I'm very happy it worked for you.  I'm saying for me, I never understood the long term ROI on it. I'd rather if someone is going to come out of school with $80K in debt, that they have a chance to climb out of it in a reasonable time period.  I'm glad it worked out for you and it sounds like the debt wasn't that bad.  In today's world at today's cost, it's a mountain of debt load.

http://ezinearticles.com/?Going-to-College?-Figure-Out-Your-ROI-First&id=3767442

[Mayor McCheese]

Maybe it is because I am in the field but does anyone find it odd that Education is in the top 10 of this list.

I mean, I'm not surprised, because I know what I make, but holy hell, talk about importance of the field coupled with not paying the field

[Hards Alumni]

Maybe it is because I am in the field but does anyone find it odd that Education is in the top 10 of this list.

I mean, I'm not surprised, because I know what I make, but holy hell, talk about importance of the field coupled with not paying the field

I am anticipating this thread spiraling out of control.

As the son of two life long educators, I couldn't agree with you more.

[mu-rara]

Alright, this needs to be said, at the risk of being hissed off the board.

The total compensation of an educator is really not that bad. (Salary, generous benefits, retirement at a young age, the ability to double dip on your pension)

Based on the number of applicants for each job, I think that educators know that too.

[🏀]

Alright, this needs to be said, at the risk of being hissed off the board.

The total compensation of an educator is really not that bad. (Salary, generous benefits, retirement at a young age, the ability to double dip on your pension)

Based on the number of applicants for each job, I think that educators know that too.

+1

[Benny B]

It's good to know that a mid-career theology major makes about the same income as my prosecutor wife.

Now if only she had theology major student debt instead of lawyer student debt.

[WellsstreetWanderer]

I'm surprised such rewarding majors as Women's Studies or "Ethnic Studies" aren't on the list. Can't think there is much call for the angry victim.

I also agree that teacher's salaryies may be low because there is a plurality of candidates. I am a big proponent of paying well for teacher's performance but exceptional teachers are few and far between in So Cal and the dress code is on par with the janitorial staff.

[Hards Alumni]

Alright, this needs to be said, at the risk of being hissed off the board.

The total compensation of an educator is really not that bad. (Salary, generous benefits, retirement at a young age, the ability to double dip on your pension)

Based on the number of applicants for each job, I think that educators know that too.

total crap.  When my parents got HOME from work, they usually had papers to correct, tests to grade, and this after working an 8 hour day.  Nevermind the 'summer off' fallacy.  Teachers have to continuously take classes to keep their certification.  Additionally, my mother (a superintendant) had to attend school board meetings, and CESA meetings.

I will concede that the benefits are great as a teacher, but the unions have worked hard for decades for those benefits.

As for retirement at a young age, my parents invested really well, and were able to retire around age 58.  That is early by a couple of years.  I had teachers at my high school who didn't retire until they were in their 60s.  I'm not sure what 'average' is, but 60 can't be too early.

I also agree that teacher's salaryies may be low because there is a plurality of candidates. I am a big proponent of paying well for teacher's performance but exceptional teachers are few and far between in So Cal and the dress code is on par with the janitorial staff.

I couldn't agree more, and neither could my parents.  My father wore a shirt and tie every day teaching public school, and my mother wore dress clothes everyday as well.  I think that when students see teachers dressing like bums they don't have the respect that they should for the teachers.  This is only the fault of the teachers and the districts that allow them to get away with it.

[WellsstreetWanderer]

I had a conference with my son's Junior High Science teacher and when he entered the room I actually thought he was there to empty the wastebasket! Faded jeans and a T-shirt so old it should have been in the rag bin.  When I think of  a teacher I am reminded of John Pick who taught Englihs Lit at MU. he wore a jacket and tie to every class and the rumour was it was never the same outfit

[4everwarriors]

I had a conference with my son's Junior High Science teacher and when he entered the room I actually thought he was there to empty the wastebasket! Faded jeans and a T-shirt so old it should have been in the rag bin.  When I think of  a teacher I am reminded of John Pick who taught Englihs Lit at MU. he wore a jacket and tie to every class and the rumour was it was never the same outfit

And the rubber chicken around is neck was priceless when discussing the albatross in "The Rhyme of the Ancient Mariner."

[Chicago_inferiority_complexes]

total crap.  When my parents got HOME from work, they usually had papers to correct, tests to grade, and this after working an 8 hour day.  Nevermind the 'summer off' fallacy.  Teachers have to continuously take classes to keep their certification.  Additionally, my mother (a superintendant) had to attend school board meetings, and CESA meetings.

I will concede that the benefits are great as a teacher, but the unions have worked hard for decades for those benefits.

As for retirement at a young age, my parents invested really well, and were able to retire around age 58.  That is early by a couple of years.  I had teachers at my high school who didn't retire until they were in their 60s.  I'm not sure what 'average' is, but 60 can't be too early.

I'm in my first real job, age 25. Most of the people I've met here, at a very legitimate large corporate, expect that age 65 is the absolute earliest they could retire. I know in Wisconsin teachers can retire with full benefits and salary for 10 years at age 55. Pretty sweet deal.

My guess is also that the number of kids a couple has, has a great effect on the age of retirement.

[Ari Gold]

Alright, this needs to be said, at the risk of being hissed off the board.

The total compensation of an educator is really not that bad. (Salary, generous benefits, retirement at a young age, the ability to double dip on your pension)

Based on the number of applicants for each job, I think that educators know that too.

+1
Disregard whatever hards said. As soon as he said "the unions worked hard" he ruined his argument.

[Hards Alumni]

+1
Disregard whatever hards said. As soon as he said "the unions worked hard" he ruined his argument.

lol Ari get a clue.

This forum isn't supposed to be about politics, and that is why politics is banned here.  Yet a few people here routinely bring them up.  Namely, you, MU-rara, and willie warrior.

If you want to have a polite political discussion rather than tossing barbs feel free to PM me rather than injecting it into your posts.

Simply because you are anti-union (based on your ideology's, rather than any intelligible reason, my guess) does not mean that teachers unions didn't fight hard for their benefits.

[JWags85]

I couldn't agree more, and neither could my parents.  My father wore a shirt and tie every day teaching public school, and my mother wore dress clothes everyday as well.  I think that when students see teachers dressing like bums they don't have the respect that they should for the teachers.  This is only the fault of the teachers and the districts that allow them to get away with it.

I had teachers at my HS (one of the top 2-3 public HS in WI) that would wear windpants almost everyday.  Even at 14-15 I thought they dressed like completely unprofessional idiots.  Now, going to grad school, I can't imagine what I would think if a professor came in dressed like that.  They made Bob Huggins look stylish.

[CrazyEcho]

I had teachers at my HS (one of the top 2-3 public HS in WI) that would wear windpants almost everyday.  Even at 14-15 I thought they dressed like completely unprofessional idiots.  Now, going to grad school, I can't imagine what I would think if a professor came in dressed like that.  They made Bob Huggins look stylish.

Out of curiosity, which public high schools would you consider to be the "top 3" in Wisconsin?  I have no real metric, but my guess would be: 

Madison West
Waukesha West
Nicolet

[reinko]

Out of curiosity, which public high schools would you consider to be the "top 3" in Wisconsin?  I have no real metric, but my guess would be: 

Madison West
Waukesha West
Nicolet

I heard Middleton is also up there.

[StillAWarrior]

lol Ari get a clue.

This forum isn't supposed to be about politics, and that is why politics is banned here.  Yet a few people here routinely bring them up.  Namely, you, MU-rara, and willie warrior.

If you want to have a polite political discussion rather than tossing barbs feel free to PM me rather than injecting it into your posts.

Simply because you are anti-union (based on your ideology's, rather than any intelligible reason, my guess) does not mean that teachers unions didn't fight hard for their benefits.

This could turn into an interesting discussion (i.e., speak now before the thread gets locked).  I have great respect for good teachers.  I had many and I wish they were better compensated.  I have little respect for teachers' unions.  You mentioned that the unions worked hard for the benefits, and that might be true.  I work hard to pay for those benefits.  One thing I think was interesting, though, was your comment that some teachers dress poorly because the district lets them get away with it.  That's undoubtedly true, but I'll go ahead and lay much of the blame of that on the unions.  In many places (I can't speak for the district where your parents work because I don't know where that is) the unions work very hard to protect mediocre (and worse) teachers.  I have been personally involved in grievance arbitrations where the union fought tooth and nail for teachers that absolutely deserved to be fired.  You can debate me all you like, but I know what I'm talking about (at least for the districts I am familiar with).  Also, many of the same districts that you suggest are rolling over and allowing poor teachers to get away with things are rolling over in negotiations with the union and letting them have whatever they want -- the union isn't necessarily having to work terribly hard to get the benefits.  Clearly the fault is with both parties.

My community has very good schools.  Historically, it has never failed to pass a levy for the schools.  Last year our levy failed because the board came to the community asking for a large increase before the next round of negotiations with the union because they anticipated increases in the CBA.  The voters in our community suggested that before they come to us for more money to pay for a future union contract, perhaps they should "strap on a set" and seek concessions from the union.  We'll see how things go.

[Hards Alumni]

This could turn into an interesting discussion (i.e., speak now before the thread gets locked).  I have great respect for good teachers.  I had many and I wish they were better compensated.  I have little respect for teachers' unions.  You mentioned that the unions worked hard for the benefits, and that might be true.  I work hard to pay for those benefits.  One thing I think was interesting, though, was your comment that some teachers dress poorly because the district lets them get away with it.  That's undoubtedly true, but I'll go ahead and lay much of the blame of that on the unions.  In many places (I can't speak for the district where your parents work because I don't know where that is) the unions work very hard to protect mediocre (and worse) teachers.  I have been personally involved in grievance arbitrations where the union fought tooth and nail for teachers that absolutely deserved to be fired.  You can debate me all you like, but I know what I'm talking about (at least for the districts I am familiar with).  Also, many of the same districts that you suggest are rolling over and allowing poor teachers to get away with things are rolling over in negotiations with the union and letting them have whatever they want -- the union isn't necessarily having to work terribly hard to get the benefits.  Clearly the fault is with both parties.

My community has very good schools.  Historically, it has never failed to pass a levy for the schools.  Last year our levy failed because the board came to the community asking for a large increase before the next round of negotiations with the union because they anticipated increases in the CBA.  The voters in our community suggested that before they come to us for more money to pay for a future union contract, perhaps they should "strap on a set" and seek concessions from the union.  We'll see how things go.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I am not a full backer 100% of teachers unions.  I would side with you here.  I know my parents (my mother specifically) had to deal with bad teachers and the unions that back them.  I was merely stating that the unions worked hard for the benefits.  If the benefits weren't so good, we would have to pay teachers more or we would have (probably, speculation here) worse teachers.

Another thing I have a serious problem with is political activism of unions.  While I understand they are simply trying to further the union, some people have a serious problem with unions giving money to campaigns since not everyone in the union has the same political ideology.  Why should one teacher be forced to give up their money to support candidates who don't share their political ideology?  Heck why should any union member have to?!?  But I guess this is a discussion for another day.