Kahlil Mcdonald-New Marquette commit

[Marquette84]

Um, you said it right here, on July 1, 2009 (see below).  In fact, you didn't say it was the baseline, you emphasized that it was the floor.  I took that as meaning that anything less than 4th place in the big east meant that Buzz was a worse coach and/or recruiter than TC.  Thank god we keep every post archived to keep you honest.  Oh wait, you say you were being sarcastic?  Never mind then.  Keep tellin' us how it is.  If you shift your argument enough, maybe we'll all get confused...

Do you honestly believe that was me stating my personal view?   Of course you didn't.  You knowingly took this quote out of context.  It was obviously a projection of what I think others should expect based on their oft-stated views of the relative comparison of coaching and recruiting, taken from the middle of a long thread, and a direct response to one of those who has often stated that we were poorly coached and lacked talent under the previous coach.  

Why else would you include this comment "Oh wait, you say you were being sarcastic?  Never mind then.  Keep tellin' us how it is."?

Its as if you knew exactly what my response would be.  Of course I was being sarcastic!

Nice try--that probably works on some people.  By any chance are you a politician?  Used car dealer?    

Sorry--your verbal gamesmanship doesn't change a thing.  You took that quote out of context and ignored other more direct statements:

For example, here:
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=15175.msg142640#msg142640


And here:
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=415&f=2850&t=4559902&p=2

Nonetheless, I'll take some of the blame since you still found a way to misinterpret that July 1st post.  Allow me to be more direct for you:  

1.  Anyone who is of the belief that we were poorly coached and lacked big east talent in 2006 (and that we have improved both recruiting and coaching since then) has an agenda if they don't expect similar performance this year.  

2.  I personally will be disappointed if we don't finish .500/8th place this year.  After evaluating our schedule (with an easy crossover draw) and overall talent--both on our team and across the league--I believe that is a reasonable expectation.

[GGGG]

I prefer "focused."

Heh...well done!   

[Skatastrophy]

Well done RW, well done.

Is it just me or doe sbuzz appear to be shaping into a real solid get for Marquette as a program?

His basketball philosophy rather than set plays seems to be attracting some pretty awesome talent on a regular basis.

I'm hopeful that you're right.

I'm really looking forward to watching our team play this year.  It will give us insight into how "Buzz's teams" will play in the future when they're filled up with guys that he recruited. 

[jmayer1]

Nonetheless, I'll take some of the blame since you still found a way to misinterpret that July 1st post.  Allow me to be more direct for you:  

1.  Anyone who is of the belief that we were poorly coached and lacked big east talent in 2006 (and that we have improved both recruiting and coaching since then) has an agenda if they don't expect similar performance this year.  

2.  I personally will be disappointed if we don't finish .500/8th place this year.  After evaluating our schedule (with an easy crossover draw) and overall talent--both on our team and across the league--I believe that is a reasonable expectation.

In response to 1:  That was prolly TC's best coaching job ever.  I think nearly everyone agrees that MU highly overachieved that year based on what expectations were prior to that season.

In response to 2: You could also make a case that this team has much less returning talent than either of Diener's last two teams, yet those teams only went 8-8 and 7-9 against much weaker competition.  Why do you insist on comparing the upcoming year to 05-06 instead of 03-04 or 04-05?  I realize this team has a similar set-up to that team but that's where the comparisons should stop in my mind. 

I would much rather see this team go 9-9 this year and for MU to actually get better year after year instead of staying about the same as the 3 amigos did.  9-9 may end up being too optimistic or it may end up being too pessimistic, but I'll reserve judgement about this team until I can actually watch them play in a game.  Trying to set any type of expectations (good or bad) is silly if you haven't ever seen 7/12 of the team suit up together, and if fact, you've only seen 2 of the guys playing healthy in the prior year.  My gut feeling is this team goes 10-8 this year, but I really have no basis for that judgement so it's really just a number I'm throwing out there based on pretty much nothing right now, but at least I'll admit I cannot validate that claim.

[rocky_warrior]

Do you honestly believe that was me stating my personal view?   Of course you didn't.  You knowingly took this quote out of context.  

I'm calling BS - AGAIN.  Click on the link above the quote.  It takes you directly to the post.  I quoted the entire thing.  You want me to post the entire thread so people can get the context of your posts?  Read the rest of your posts in that thread, there were only 3 other posts (well 4 counting a re-post of the one I quoted).  Two of them reiterated that you think MU fans have higher expectations than Virginia fans, and the third one links to Hoopscoop's page that ranks our recruiting class as #1.

Instead, you give me two examples where you had a different opinion on July 26, and Aug 3.  Could it be that after having a month of discussions on message boards you finally realized that your expectations were out of wack?

Let me try this again.  You asked where you ever suggested 4th place in the big east was a baseline for MU this year.  I responded with the exact post where you  suggested it.

And because of that, you claim I'm taking you out of context.

I'm not a politician, you're the one trying to pull a fast one.  I can understand it if someone wants to post something sarcastic, but you claim you did it for multiple posts in multiple threads.  Perhaps your humor knows no bounds.

Nonetheless, I'll take some of the blame since you still found a way to misinterpret that July 1st post.  Allow me to be more direct for you:  

Gee, thanks for take the high road in all of this.

Anyhow, is Kahlil on campus yet  

[GOO]

One starter back (Lazar).  One second year player (Butler) back who we can't call a starter.  One bench player in David Cubillan, who started by default some, but isn't a starter.... Two injured non-starters (Otule and Fulce)... And 7 (and maybe 8) new players.  Kind of hard to compare to the freshman year of the 3 amigos to this year.

Plus, it only works out once in a while when you inject 3 new starters (none of whom are top 25 type of recruits), so to say "it worked once so it should work again" is not an honest comparison.  

Actually, the three amigo's freshman year, I think we only had two new starters for most of the year: James and McNeal as Matthews only started a few games. This year we'll start 3 or 4 new guys all year, and they won't all be guards... non guards generally take a little longer to adjust.   Plus, this year the first bench players will probably be first year players.

I hope you can come back and say told you so, and it works out the same as 4 years ago.  I just don't expect it or compare it, since most of the time having 3 or more new starters equals a long season.  And this year is a lot different with the number of new players who will have to start and contribute. Four years ago was the exception and TC should be given props for it, along with James and McNeal and Matthews.  

[Kramerica]

Soooooooo....instead of this pissing match that this thread has devolved into, does anyone have any info on whether or not the Kahlil McDonald signing is going to happen or not.  I'd heard a rumor that he was a backup signing in case Junior wasn't going to be eligible.  Now that Junior has been cleared, anyone have any idea if this is going to happen still? 

[Lennys Tap]

I'm calling BS - AGAIN.  Click on the link above the quote.  It takes you directly to the post.  I quoted the entire thing.  You want me to post the entire thread so people can get the context of your posts?  Read the rest of your posts in that thread, there were only 3 other posts (well 4 counting a re-post of the one I quoted).  Two of them reiterated that you think MU fans have higher expectations than Virginia fans, and the third one links to Hoopscoop's page that ranks our recruiting class as #1.

Instead, you give me two examples where you had a different opinion on July 26, and Aug 3.  Could it be that after having a month of discussions on message boards you finally realized that your expectations were out of wack?

Let me try this again.  You asked where you ever suggested 4th place in the big east was a baseline for MU this year.  I responded with the exact post where you  suggested it.

And because of that, you claim I'm taking you out of context.

I'm not a politician, you're the one trying to pull a fast one.  I can understand it if someone wants to post something sarcastic, but you claim you did it for multiple posts in multiple threads.  Perhaps your humor knows no bounds.

Gee, thanks for take the high road in all of this.

Anyhow, is Kahlil on campus yet  

I thought I remembered 84 moving the goal posts on this subject. Kudos on the research that outed him.

[ChicosBailBonds]

But 75% of the people can't be wrong?   

http://msn.foxsports.com/cbk/story/9917528/Marquette-rebuilding-with-anonymous-group

[Henry Sugar]

Soooooooo....instead of this pissing match that this thread has devolved into, does anyone have any info on whether or not the Kahlil McDonald signing is going to happen or not.  I'd heard a rumor that he was a backup signing in case Junior wasn't going to be eligible.  Now that Junior has been cleared, anyone have any idea if this is going to happen still? 

I've heard similar information to Mark Miller.  If this commitment were to happen, there's a lot that needs to take place, and this is taken with the Cadougan clearance as known information.

[Marquette84]

I'm calling BS - AGAIN.  Click on the link above the quote.  It takes you directly to the post.  I quoted the entire thing.  You want me to post the entire thread so people can get the context of your posts?  Read the rest of your posts in that thread, there were only 3 other posts (well 4 counting a re-post of the one I quoted).  Two of them reiterated that you think MU fans have higher expectations than Virginia fans, and the third one links to Hoopscoop's page that ranks our recruiting class as #1.

Instead, you give me two examples where you had a different opinion on July 26, and Aug 3.  Could it be that after having a month of discussions on message boards you finally realized that your expectations were out of wack?

Your exhaustive search failed to point out that on July 4th I was saying the same thing I'm saying now:
 

I am not forecasting 4th place.  I'm questioning why those who said Crean underachieved haven't adopted Crean's performance as their minimum standard.

Big difference. 

If you still want to maintain that 4th place was my original view--then please at least do so with the understanding that I changed sometime between July 1 and July 4-not after a month as you claim. 

There's probably nothing more I can do to change your mind.  I wish I had put a stake in the ground sometime prior to that July 1 post--but I didn't.   All i can tell you is that I never believed 4th place--but I thought it was hypocritical for those who claim we've improved coaching and recruiting to not adopt that as their standard. 

It also doesn't change the fundamental issue here--that Lenny was misrepresenting what I have said pretty consistently--if not for all time, at very least since July 4th. 

[ChicosBailBonds]

Getting Lenny to admit that is a non-starter so you might as well give up that dream.

[Lennys Tap]

Your exhaustive search failed to point out that on July 4th I was saying the same thing I'm saying now:
 

If you still want to maintain that 4th place was my original view--then please at least do so with the understanding that I changed sometime between July 1 and July 4-not after a month as you claim. 

There's probably nothing more I can do to change your mind.  I wish I had put a stake in the ground sometime prior to that July 1 post--but I didn't.   All i can tell you is that I never believed 4th place--but I thought it was hypocritical for those who claim we've improved coaching and recruiting to not adopt that as their standard. 

It also doesn't change the fundamental issue here--that Lenny was misrepresenting what I have said pretty consistently--if not for all time, at very least since July 4th. 

One more time. Based on what I have seen so far I think Buzz is a better coach and recruiter than TC. I do not, however, believe that MU must finish 4th or higher in the Big East this year for this to be so. According to you this makes me a hypocrite. According to me this makes you illogical.

It's certainly defensible for you to be of the opinion that Buzz has to finish 4th or better this year to be Crean's equal or better. But to claim hypocrisy because someone finds this opinion off base is nonsense.

[Lennys Tap]

Getting Lenny to admit that is a non-starter so you might as well give up that dream.

There you go again crushing someone's dream.

[mu_hilltopper]

Gossip wire update: This is not going to happen.

FWIW.

[kmwtrucks]

MU-hilltopper is this something you have heard, or is that just your hunch.

[Brewtown Andy]

MU-hilltopper is this something you have heard, or is that just your hunch.

He did say "gossip", so I'm guessing it's based on something.

[muarmy81]

With BR out of the picture I say bank the scholly for next year and land either a PG or 1 of the 3 Big men we're currently in on.  (or both and oversign by 1)