Wojo = Majerus

[MU82]

I think it's fair to say years 2 and 4 were disappointing for Marquette fans, and maybe not the greatest coaching jobs. I also think it's fair to say they weren't disasters like Wojo's first year or this year were. A couple slight changes and were in the tournament both those years .

Everything is easy to say now, looking back, knowing what we know today.

I'm not about to peruse Scoop from back in 2015-16. I can only say what I remember thinking, and what I remember from others. Wojo had never been a head coach at any level. He was learning on the fly. I looked at Year 2 as pretty normal progress. And I certainly looked at Year 3 as very good progress. I think most Scoopers did, too. I don't recall too many saying in the middle of Year 3: "He can't coach. Time to move on."

In another thread, somebody put up Wright's record and one Scooper said he'd be VERY happy if our next coach did at Marquette what Wright did. Well, 3 years in, Wright's record was arguably worse than Wojo's after 3 years. Zero NCAA appearances in 3 years, and an 18-17 record in Year 3. Knowing Scoop, there would be dozens, maybe hundreds, calling for his head right then and there. That's all I'm saying.

In Wojo's third season, we beat the No. 1 team, beat Creighton twice, had several other nice wins, avoided disastrous losses, finished the regular season with 4 wins in 5 games to secure an NCAA bid, and had a couple of freshmen who looked like they'd be standouts.

If looking at that as progress -- in real time, not with the benefit of 20/20 hindsight -- is "slurping," then I plead guilty. Slurp, slurp.

[cheebs09]

I think Wojo has a long ways to go to get to Majerus. For every Majerus, there's probably 10 Dukiet's.

I think Wojo's best option would be to go learn from a non-Duke coach for a year or two and get a different perspective on the game of basketball. That's similar to Majerus then.

[alexius23]

UW expressed interest in Rick. There were people who felt that Rick couldn't be allowed to leave. I am not saying Hank Raymond's was pushed out the door but he was nudged a bit.   It was quickly clear that Rick just wasn't fully ready to be a big time coach~yet.   Ball State allowed him to mature & become ready.

[Silent Verbal]

I didn't say it was a great season. It was Year 2 under a first-time coach. We won in Madison, we beat Ben Simmons as part of winning that Brooklyn event, we beat Cooley's best team twice, we also had some terrible losses, we knew we had some good recruits coming in. It was progress over Year 1. And Year 3 was generally seen as progress over Year 2.

But if you want to think Year 2 was an unmitigated disaster, and Year 3 was an embarrassment, go right ahead. Of course, it feeds right into the argument that if our next coach has the same progression as Jay Wright did at Nova, some here will want to run him out of town.

For me, the biggest red flag of year 2 was Wojo's handling of the Ellenson family.  I've always believed the Ellensons told Wojo that Henry would play 2 years at Marquette, and in turn, Wojo agreed to give 3 years of scholarship to Wally.  Wojo ended up getting screwed when Henry left, had to cut Wally and take some scholarships away from track kids in order to shut Mrs. Ellenson up, and by recruiting Henry, we lost Gabe Levin to transfer and may have missed out on other recruits who would've stayed longer at Marquette and produced far less drama.  So year 2 gave us a glimpse not only of Wojo's willingness to kowtow to a recruit's family, but also his inability to properly assess all the angles of a potentially bad situation.

We would see this type of thing happen again with both Markus and the Hauser family.  Wojo got into bed with Markus and the Howards to the detriment of the program.  People say the Hauser parents were selfish for wanting their kids to get more shots, but does anyone really think Markus' folks would've been okay with it if Wojo had told Markus he wouldn't be able to shoot whenever he wanted to?  I guess we'll never know, because Markus was never reigned in.  But Hausershima, when you think about it, was really just a worse, more damaging sequel to the Ellenson fiasco. 

So in year 2, not only did we have some bad losses and poor scheduling which resulted in a 20 win season where we missed the NIT, but we also had a player/family situation blow up in Wojo's face.  The latter was far more concerning; it was the first sign we had that Wojo was in over his head when it came to running his own program.

[vogue65]

For me, the biggest red flag of year 2 was Wojo's handling of the Ellenson family.  I've always believed the Ellensons told Wojo that Henry would play 2 years at Marquette, and in turn, Wojo agreed to give 3 years of scholarship to Wally.  Wojo ended up getting screwed when Henry left, had to cut Wally and take some scholarships away from track kids in order to shut Mrs. Ellenson up, and by recruiting Henry, we lost Gabe Levin to transfer and may have missed out on other recruits who would've stayed longer at Marquette and produced far less drama.  So year 2 gave us a glimpse not only of Wojo's willingness to kowtow to a recruit's family, but also his inability to properly assess all the angles of a potentially bad situation.

We would see this type of thing happen again with both Markus and the Hauser family.  Wojo got into bed with Markus and the Howards to the detriment of the program.  People say the Hauser parents were selfish for wanting their kids to get more shots, but does anyone really think Markus' folks would've been okay with it if Wojo had told Markus he wouldn't be able to shoot whenever he wanted to?  I guess we'll never know, because Markus was never reigned in.  But Hausershima, when you think about it, was really just a worse, more damaging sequel to the Ellenson fiasco. 

So in year 2, not only did we have some bad losses and poor scheduling which resulted in a 20 win season where we missed the NIT, but we also had a player/family situation blow up in Wojo's face.  The latter was far more concerning; it was the first sign we had that Wojo was in over his head when it came to running his own program.

You said it all, case closed, dog's dead.
Are parents around the country the same as Wisconsin parents'?
Was Maymon the same story For Buzz?

[Silent Verbal]

You said it all, case closed, dog's dead.
Are parents around the country the same as Wisconsin parents'?
Was Maymon the same story For Buzz?

Buzz nipped that situation in the bud by kicking Maymon off the team a month into the season after his dad interrupted a practice.

[vogue65]

Buzz nipped that situation in the bud by kicking Maymon off the team a month into the season after his dad interrupted a practice.

Perhaps it's a buttinski thing with Wisconsin parents.

[MU82]

For me, the biggest red flag of year 2 was Wojo's handling of the Ellenson family.  I've always believed the Ellensons told Wojo that Henry would play 2 years at Marquette, and in turn, Wojo agreed to give 3 years of scholarship to Wally.  Wojo ended up getting screwed when Henry left, had to cut Wally and take some scholarships away from track kids in order to shut Mrs. Ellenson up, and by recruiting Henry, we lost Gabe Levin to transfer and may have missed out on other recruits who would've stayed longer at Marquette and produced far less drama.  So year 2 gave us a glimpse not only of Wojo's willingness to kowtow to a recruit's family, but also his inability to properly assess all the angles of a potentially bad situation.

We would see this type of thing happen again with both Markus and the Hauser family.  Wojo got into bed with Markus and the Howards to the detriment of the program.  People say the Hauser parents were selfish for wanting their kids to get more shots, but does anyone really think Markus' folks would've been okay with it if Wojo had told Markus he wouldn't be able to shoot whenever he wanted to?  I guess we'll never know, because Markus was never reigned in.  But Hausershima, when you think about it, was really just a worse, more damaging sequel to the Ellenson fiasco. 

So in year 2, not only did we have some bad losses and poor scheduling which resulted in a 20 win season where we missed the NIT, but we also had a player/family situation blow up in Wojo's face.  The latter was far more concerning; it was the first sign we had that Wojo was in over his head when it came to running his own program.

OK. Lots of 20/20 hindsight. And I think you are in the vast minority of those who thought Ellenson was going to be anything other than a 1-and-done. Many of us hoped he'd stay another year, but most were very realistic about his situation. I have seen absolutely no evidence of his family promising Wojo that Hank would stay for 2. I'd love to see it, though. Thanks in advance.

[Small Orange Soda]

In another thread, somebody put up Wright's record and one Scooper said he'd be VERY happy if our next coach did at Marquette what Wright did.

Wow, who said that?

[burger]

I think Wojo has a long ways to go to get to Majerus. For every Majerus, there's probably 10 Dukiet's.

I think Wojo's best option would be to go learn from a non-Duke coach for a year or two and get a different perspective on the game of basketball. That's similar to Majerus then.

I think WOJO's best career decision would be to go to the NBA for a year or two under Popovich.....Tibadeau....type.....Somebody who has "real chops" at X and O's coaching.....

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I think WOJO's best career decision would be to go to the NBA for a year or two under Popovich.....Tibadeau....type.....Somebody who has "real chops" at X and O's coaching.....

Or his friend Quinn Snyder....

[SonOfWarrior]

What did Rick learn after he left Marquette?  What did he learn from his "failure" here?  A lot of the growth in the coaches occur from place to place, not during the tenure.  I'm not sure I saw any major growth in Wojo during his time here.  A good coach doesn't just recruit good players, they need to develop and adjust from game to same and season to season.  I saw more regression as the teams around Marquette adjusted to Wojo and its players.  I think Wojo will be a good coach if he figures out how to assemble a team and not great individual recruits that work in tandem. 

[Pakuni]

Can't wait for the Scoop posts in 2036 lamenting how he let Wojo get away.

[The Sultan]

I think Majerus also just needed to get away from Marquette and strike out on his own.  It wasn't just about Xs and Os.  The Bucks gig gave him a chance to do that, AND work with one of the great NBA coaches too.

[MU82]

Wow, who said that?

Here:

I would be VERY pleased if we hired a coach from a mid-major and they had these results in their first 5 years. 

2021–22    Marquette  19–13   7–9   5th   NIT Quarterfinal
2022–23    Marquette   15–16   8–8   T–3rd   NIT First Round
2023–24    Marquette   18–17   6–10   11th   NIT Quarterfinal
2024–25    Marquette   24–8   11–5   T–3rd   NCAA Division I Sweet 16
2025–26    Marquette   28–5   14–2   T–1st   NCAA Division I Elite Eight

avid and I ended up having a nice discussion. I know where he was coming from. Who wouldn't like our next coach -- or any MU coach -- to go to the S16 and E8 in back-to-back years?

But we all know Scoop. And if our next coach has zero NCAAT appearances in his first 3 years, and an 18-17 record in Year 3, a very vocal group of Scoopers would be killing that coach -- especially if he wasn't their choice to begin with.

[Heisenberg]

For me, the biggest red flag of year 2 was Wojo's handling of the Ellenson family. I've always believed the Ellensons told Wojo that Henry would play 2 years at Marquette, and in turn, Wojo agreed to give 3 years of scholarship to Wally.  Wojo ended up getting screwed when Henry left, had to cut Wally and take some scholarships away from track kids in order to shut Mrs. Ellenson up, and by recruiting Henry, we lost Gabe Levin to transfer and may have missed out on other recruits who would've stayed longer at Marquette and produced far less drama.  So year 2 gave us a glimpse not only of Wojo's willingness to kowtow to a recruit's family, but also his inability to properly assess all the angles of a potentially bad situation.

We would see this type of thing happen again with both Markus and the Hauser family.  Wojo got into bed with Markus and the Howards to the detriment of the program.  People say the Hauser parents were selfish for wanting their kids to get more shots, but does anyone really think Markus' folks would've been okay with it if Wojo had told Markus he wouldn't be able to shoot whenever he wanted to?  I guess we'll never know, because Markus was never reigned in.  But Hausershima, when you think about it, was really just a worse, more damaging sequel to the Ellenson fiasco. 

So in year 2, not only did we have some bad losses and poor scheduling which resulted in a 20 win season where we missed the NIT, but we also had a player/family situation blow up in Wojo's face.  The latter was far more concerning; it was the first sign we had that Wojo was in over his head when it came to running his own program.

I believe the bolded part is wrong.  He was always a one and done.  And as a first-round pick, he should have been one and done.

So, after the bolded part, the rest becomes moot.