Loyola

[DCHoopster]

Agree some, disagree some.

Rowsey is one of the worst defensive guards I've seen in many years. He often didn't even try on defense. And when he did try, he was too short and slow to make a difference. Markus at least tries. He will draw a charge, tip away a pass. Definitely not even mediocre on D but he (and everybody else) will look better on D because Rowsey's not out there. I say all that and I really, really liked watching Rowsey play, I understand his offensive value and I fully expect us to miss him next season.

Before Sam got really banged up late in the season, I actually was impressed with his defense much of the time. He's a max-effort guy, he fights for position, he fights for rebounds, he's not as slow as some make him out to be, he's long and he cares about defense.

Theo improved markedly on defense, got much better at challenging shots without fouling.

Sam and whichever center was out there at any given time were put in horrible position constantly because our perimeter defenders were terrible at containing the dribble and also could not challenge a pass - especially when both midgets were on the floor. Even guys who have potential to be good perimeter defenders - Cain, Elliott, Sacar - were too inexperienced and just not good enough yet. I like to think they will improve.

Another year for those three and Theo, the addition of Morrow, good health for Sam and not having a second midget on the court should help the defense substantially IMHO.

I would agree that Rowsey was a weak defender, but by far the most fun player to watch in years.  MU was fun to watch period.  Next year, defensively has to be better, can not be worse.  Elliott and Cain have to get stronger, not sure they can gain the weight needed but just being a little older will help.  Concerned a little bit
with the injuries moving forward, the Hauser boys need to get healthy.  Sam has minimal hops, has to get stronger.

[Silkk the Shaka]

Agree some, disagree some.

Rowsey is one of the worst defensive guards I've seen in many years. He often didn't even try on defense. And when he did try, he was too short and slow to make a difference. Markus at least tries. He will draw a charge, tip away a pass. Definitely not even mediocre on D but he (and everybody else) will look better on D because Rowsey's not out there. I say all that and I really, really liked watching Rowsey play, I understand his offensive value and I fully expect us to miss him next season.

Before Sam got really banged up late in the season, I actually was impressed with his defense much of the time. He's a max-effort guy, he fights for position, he fights for rebounds, he's not as slow as some make him out to be, he's long and he cares about defense.

Theo improved markedly on defense, got much better at challenging shots without fouling.

Sam and whichever center was out there at any given time were put in horrible position constantly because our perimeter defenders were terrible at containing the dribble and also could not challenge a pass - especially when both midgets were on the floor. Even guys who have potential to be good perimeter defenders - Cain, Elliott, Sacar - were too inexperienced and just not good enough yet. I like to think they will improve.

Another year for those three and Theo, the addition of Morrow, good health for Sam and not having a second midget on the court should help the defense substantially IMHO.

Agree completely, but especially with the bolded part

[Floorslapper]

Fair enough. For some reason, I glossed right over EFR's "challenge for a title" line.

The way I define "challenge for a title," I would be very surprised if we could do so next season.

A top 3-4 finish in the league (say 11-13 wins) and solidly in the tournament is more like what I'm thinking for next season, and that would be a very nice sign of progress. Once you do that, all it takes is a couple good games and you can have a nice NCAA run; that is the case more now than ever.

If that step is taken and then all key components come back, I would agree with EFR that we could seriously challenge for the BE title in 2019-20, get a top 3-4 NCAA seed and make a nice tourney run if things bounce right.

If all of that happens, in 6 years Wojo will have followed his first unwinnable year with 20-win season, NCAA, NIT, NCAA, NCAA. I think that would be a pretty nice foundation to build on.

Lots and lots and lots of "ifs" there, I realize.

And even if all that happens, there will still be some who say it's a "fact" that Wojo isn't a good coach because "they just know it's true." That's life in the fan world.

Painting the picture in the 6-year light above is a good exercise.  It does cast a different perspective on the body of work.

It stands a decent chance of happening, that we do make the NCAA the next two years.  Granted, I think we'll be a bubble team next year. 

My take on Wojo is his ceiling will ultimately be first weekend NCAA tourney, unless we start to be able to land McDonald's All-Americans/5-star talent.

Now, I could live with a program that goes to NCAA say 80% of  seasons, while making a run to Sweet 16 seasons roughly 40%.

[Silkk the Shaka]

Painting the picture in the 6-year light above is a good exercise.  It does cast a different perspective on the body of work.

It stands a decent chance of happening, that we do make the NCAA the next two years.  Granted, I think we'll be a bubble team next year. 

My take on Wojo is his ceiling will ultimately be first weekend NCAA tourney, unless we start to be able to land McDonald's All-Americans/5-star talent.

Now, I could live with a program that goes to NCAA say 80% of  seasons, while making a run to Sweet 16 seasons roughly 40%.

In the 5 years of the new Big East, only Villanova & Xavier meet this threshold. I could live with it too, I guess.

[Floorslapper]

In the 5 years of the new Big East, only Villanova & Xavier meet this threshold. I could live with it too, I guess.

Aim high.  I'm benchmarking off of where we were as a program prior to Wojo's arrival, in the "old" Big East, which featured even better teams, and our track record in those 9-years was 8 NCAA's, 3 Sweet 16s.

[Loose Cannon]

Unless Villanova implodes,  I see no way that we "compete for a conference title" next season. #2 in conference is possible,  I would say Creighton and X will be who we will be competing with for that spot.

In two years we could possibly be competing for a conference title. By then Bridges, Brunson, Booth,  and Paschall will all be gone. Spellman and Quinerley may have gone pro. I have no reason to doubt that Wright will recruit well and have them reloaded but you never know. We theoretically should only lose Heldt (and maybe a grad transfer)  between now and then. We should be trending up for the next two years.

I agree, I'm happy with a solid comfortable NCAA seed.  Then anything can happen even 6 more wins. 

[MU82]

Painting the picture in the 6-year light above is a good exercise.  It does cast a different perspective on the body of work.

It stands a decent chance of happening, that we do make the NCAA the next two years.  Granted, I think we'll be a bubble team next year. 

My take on Wojo is his ceiling will ultimately be first weekend NCAA tourney, unless we start to be able to land McDonald's All-Americans/5-star talent.

Now, I could live with a program that goes to NCAA say 80% of  seasons, while making a run to Sweet 16 seasons roughly 40%.

Before the tournament, what was your take on Moser's ceiling? Weber's ceiling? Hamilton's ceiling? Musselman's ceiling?

What do you think the average Tennessee fan's take on KO's ceiling was when they hired him away from us? I like to think they believed it was super-high - successful assistant at AZ, nice work at Marquette including a surprise win over Kentucky to reach the S16. How did that work out for Tennessee's "ceiling forecasters"?

We came darn close to having lower ceilings than Holy Cross in 2003 and Davidson in 2013. Thankfully, we made big plays at the right time and got a few lucky bounces, too. Hopefully, Wojo will benefit from the same the next couple of years. According to sources, the tourney is a crapshoot.

I'm not trying to be snarky or antagonistic, Ners. You are allowed to have your "feelings" about the height of Wojo's ceiling, as does everybody else. Time will tell if your "feelings" about Wojo's ceiling are superior to those of anybody else.

[HouWarrior]

On Bruce Weber...

Bruce is my age (61), and we played driveway Bball together as kids in NW Milw..Bruce's cousin Brent is my lifelong best friend and family gatherings usually included hoops till we dropped.  Bruce is a Milw lifer. As a kid he wasnt the most athletic of us but he was absolutely driven and very competitive. Still...a nice fun kid to hang with.

I think I recall Bruce went to Marshall High (class of 74), where he played basketball and baseball. At UWM I think he only made it in baseball. Bruce has lost his milw accent...but the MU gig would still be a return home to him.

Post Wojo..supposin'....Is a good power 5 BBgig at K-State better than the MU job? Pros to each position, and if KState wants him my guess is he'd stay there

[GoldenWarrior11]

Was it true that Bruce Weber was the head coach that reached out with interest when we were going through a coaching search after Buzz left?  I seem to recall someone saying someone knew a well-known head coach reached out with interest (and many were scared that it was, in fact, Brey lol). 

[GGGG]

Was it true that Bruce Weber was the head coach that reached out with interest when we were going through a coaching search after Buzz left?  I seem to recall someone saying someone knew a well-known head coach reached out with interest (and many were scared that it was, in fact, Brey lol). 

I thought it was after TC left.  Or maybe it was both.

[brewcity77]

Was it true that Bruce Weber was the head coach that reached out with interest when we were going through a coaching search after Buzz left?  I seem to recall someone saying someone knew a well-known head coach reached out with interest (and many were scared that it was, in fact, Brey lol).

When Buzz left, I believe the big name reaching out was Ben Howland. His name was floated through the media from "an unnamed source" for virtually every opening. All the speculation I heard was that Howland himself was the source.

[Billy Hoyle]

Was it true that Bruce Weber was the head coach that reached out with interest when we were going through a coaching search after Buzz left?  I seem to recall someone saying someone knew a well-known head coach reached out with interest (and many were scared that it was, in fact, Brey lol).

Weber did reach out as he is a Milwaukee native and that specifically drew him to the job.

Howland also reached out, but he was reaching out for every open job that year.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Weber did reach out as he is a Milwaukee native and that specifically drew him to the job.

Howland also reached out, but he was reaching out for every open job that year.

This sounds right.

Weber is a hell of an Xs and Os coach and very good at player development. The big concern with him is recruiting. His highest rated recruit at K State has been Malek Harris ironically enough at #96 per 247 composite. His second highest rated was Jevon Thomas (#143) who transferred to Seton Hall and choked a kid during a game of pickup basketball. Sneed (#144) is the 3rd highest. He's done a great job with his 2 and 3 stars but it seems like he's not the kind of coach that top players want to play for.

[Eldon]

Howland reached out.  He and Lovell chatted on the phone.  Howland wanted the MU job pretty badly.

There was also interest in Weber, though I have no idea who initiated the contact.  There was a K-State fan who came on to Scoop and said "you guys can have Weber...please please please take him off of our hands."

There were rumors that Brey was in town:

https://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=43386.msg605716#msg605716

(Re-reading that thread is great.  PRN's comment has me dying over here!)

I also seem to remember Jamie Dixon being rumored to be in the mix.  IIRC, we all laughed it off "why would he leave Pitt?!?!"  Well, not so funny in hindsight.  Maybe he saw the writing on the wall?

[NorthernDancerColt]

He da Man(atee)!!

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

He da Man(atee)!!

That manatee Geico commercial always cracks me up!