Vander's Mom is smiling....

[Goose]

I love Vander!!

[Silkk the Shaka]

My bashing is pretty much exclusive to his inability to finish around the rim.  That is the same comments I am reading from other posters on this thread.  That is why I threw the joke out there "Why do you hate Blue?" because I don't hate the kid.  And being critical of a player for his play is not bashing.  I just wish he could finish around the rim because our team (although is very good) could be much better if he could finish.  That's what it was.  That's what it is.  Fun times ahead...

How about the several times you posted "Vander Blue sucks at basketball"?  Then when people called you out saying that he's good at pretty much everything but shooting you would defend that position to the death.  Now you want to say you were pretty much ONLY critical of his ability to finish around the rim?  Sorry dude, that's revisionist history.  No one claimed he was a good shooter.  No one claimed he was without flaws.  But there are other things you can do to help a basketball team that don't get all the glory, and he selflessly does those things.  It's not like he's Truck Bryant chucking up 15 shots a game shooting 30%.  That would actually hurt the team.  Nevertheless, he's clearly working on his shooting.  It has improved, and it will continue to do so, and you will continue to look like a moron.

[wadesworld]

My bashing is pretty much exclusive to his inability to finish around the rim.  That is the same comments I am reading from other posters on this thread.  That is why I threw the joke out there "Why do you hate Blue?" because I don't hate the kid.  And being critical of a player for his play is not bashing.  I just wish he could finish around the rim because our team (although is very good) could be much better if he could finish.  That's what it was.  That's what it is.  Fun times ahead...

You attempt to downplay Vander's contributions to the team any and every chance you get to.  There are numerous examples after just about any game Vander plays well in.  It does not start and end with his inability to finish around the rim.

For example, after the Villinova game where he clinched the win for us at the free throw line and played a very strong all around game, the first post on this page shows you trying to downplay what he did in that game:
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=30087.25

Here is the box score for that game:
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320280222
9 points, 7 rebounds, 2 assists, 1 steal, 1 turnover.  Played strong defense in the game.  A strong all around game.  In case you haven't noticed, you can be effective and have a good game without scoring 20 points.  No need to try to pretend he did not have a good game at Villinova.

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=29474.0
Claiming "the 5 star status" is what was "buying him minutes," as if Buzz actually gives a sh!t how many stars you come in with next to your name (DJO?  Crowder?  Butler?  Gardner?  Weird).  On the same page, saying "If you are a complete non-factor on offense and mistake prone you are not having a good game."  Was Bruce Bowen an ineffective NBA player?  He was a non-factor on offense...and made millions in the NBA.  By the way, here is that game's box score:
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320010269

He had 7 points, 4 assists, and 7 rebounds.  Again, where do you get the idea that 7 points and 4 assists equates to being a "complete non-factor on offense?"  Once again, you try to downplay his contributions and are just straight up wrong.  Did he score 30 points?  No.  That isn't the only way somebody is a "factor" on offense.  Foolish.

In that same thread you claim that Vander should not have allowed a layup while we were winning and the clock was running late in the game.  Do you know anything about basketball?  You don't foul in that situation, no matter what.  Give up the layup.  It does no harm.

The entire 10 pages goes on like that.  You do everything and anything you can to try to downplay Blue's (very important) contributions to Marquette.  It's a joke.  I'm not going to go through and point out every post you do that.  You can take a look at page 3 for my response to that.  You do not like Vander.  We get it.  You don't have to try to argue the facts every time somebody gives Vander credit, and then pretend that you don't do that.

[boyonthedock]

How about the several times you posted "Vander Blue sucks at basketball"?  Then when people called you out saying that he's good at pretty much everything but shooting you would defend that position to the death.  Now you want to say you were pretty much ONLY critical of his ability to finish around the rim?  Sorry dude, that's revisionist history.  No one claimed he was a good shooter.  No one claimed he was without flaws.  But there are other things you can do to help a basketball team that don't get all the glory, and he selflessly does those things.  It's not like he's Truck Bryant chucking up 15 shots a game shooting 30%.  That would actually hurt the team.  Nevertheless, he's clearly working on his shooting.  It has improved, and it will continue to do so, and you will continue to look like a moron.

This is accepting the fact that he won't ever get better at scoring/shooting. This kid can be great. making a layup won't make him suddenly worse at getting steals and rebounds. People don't look like a moron by pointing out what is obvious to people with eyes. We all love the team, and obviously like Blue as a player. Things said in the heat of the moment shouldn't cause you to turn against your fellow fan!

[JD]

You attempt to downplay Vander's contributions to the team any and every chance you get to.  There are numerous examples after just about any game Vander plays well in.  It does not start and end with his inability to finish around the rim.

For example, after the Villinova game where he clinched the win for us at the free throw line and played a very strong all around game, the first post on this page shows you trying to downplay what he did in that game:
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=30087.25

Here is the box score for that game:
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320280222
9 points, 7 rebounds, 2 assists, 1 steal, 1 turnover.  Played strong defense in the game.  A strong all around game.  In case you haven't noticed, you can be effective and have a good game without scoring 20 points.  No need to try to pretend he did not have a good game at Villinova.

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=29474.0
Claiming "the 5 star status" is what was "buying him minutes," as if Buzz actually gives a sh!t how many stars you come in with next to your name (DJO?  Crowder?  Butler?  Gardner?  Weird).  On the same page, saying "If you are a complete non-factor on offense and mistake prone you are not having a good game."  Was Bruce Bowen an ineffective NBA player?  He was a non-factor on offense...and made millions in the NBA.  By the way, here is that game's box score:
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320010269

He had 7 points, 4 assists, and 7 rebounds.  Again, where do you get the idea that 7 points and 4 assists equates to being a "complete non-factor on offense?"  Once again, you try to downplay his contributions and are just straight up wrong.  Did he score 30 points?  No.  That isn't the only way somebody is a "factor" on offense.  Foolish.

In that same thread you claim that Vander should not have allowed a layup while we were winning and the clock was running late in the game.  Do you know anything about basketball?  You don't foul in that situation, no matter what.  Give up the layup.  It does no harm.

The entire 10 pages goes on like that.  You do everything and anything you can to try to downplay Blue's (very important) contributions to Marquette.  It's a joke.  I'm not going to go through and point out every post you do that.  You can take a look at page 3 for my response to that.  You do not like Vander.  We get it.  You don't have to try to argue the facts every time somebody gives Vander credit, and then pretend that you don't do that.

Simply:   Owned.

[GGGG]

Exactly.  Erick is now diminishing his criticism because Blue has pretty much proven him to be wrong.  You were saying that he needs to play 10-15 minutes a game...said "he is not good," and words of the sort.

Simply put...he was wrong.

[real chili 83]

Don't feed the trolls.   

[ErickJD08]

You attempt to downplay Vander's contributions to the team any and every chance you get to.  There are numerous examples after just about any game Vander plays well in.  It does not start and end with his inability to finish around the rim.

For example, after the Villinova game where he clinched the win for us at the free throw line and played a very strong all around game, the first post on this page shows you trying to downplay what he did in that game:
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=30087.25

Here is the box score for that game:
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320280222
9 points, 7 rebounds, 2 assists, 1 steal, 1 turnover.  Played strong defense in the game.  A strong all around game.  In case you haven't noticed, you can be effective and have a good game without scoring 20 points.  No need to try to pretend he did not have a good game at Villinova.

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=29474.0
Claiming "the 5 star status" is what was "buying him minutes," as if Buzz actually gives a sh!t how many stars you come in with next to your name (DJO?  Crowder?  Butler?  Gardner?  Weird).  On the same page, saying "If you are a complete non-factor on offense and mistake prone you are not having a good game."  Was Bruce Bowen an ineffective NBA player?  He was a non-factor on offense...and made millions in the NBA.  By the way, here is that game's box score:
http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320010269

He had 7 points, 4 assists, and 7 rebounds.  Again, where do you get the idea that 7 points and 4 assists equates to being a "complete non-factor on offense?"  Once again, you try to downplay his contributions and are just straight up wrong.  Did he score 30 points?  No.  That isn't the only way somebody is a "factor" on offense.  Foolish.

In that same thread you claim that Vander should not have allowed a layup while we were winning and the clock was running late in the game.  Do you know anything about basketball?  You don't foul in that situation, no matter what.  Give up the layup.  It does no harm.

The entire 10 pages goes on like that.  You do everything and anything you can to try to downplay Blue's (very important) contributions to Marquette.  It's a joke.  I'm not going to go through and point out every post you do that.  You can take a look at page 3 for my response to that.  You do not like Vander.  We get it.  You don't have to try to argue the facts every time somebody gives Vander credit, and then pretend that you don't do that.

You must be a politician because you can really grab some small clips and spin. First, neither Nova game was really strong. They were average. Remember the game that he "clinched"? Remember how he played only 16 minutes and he was getting benched for Mayo? Remember how we were getting smoked in beginning and I think Buzz benched him for the last 12 minutes of the first half. My comments came after people were crowning Blue SOG when clearly DJO was the reason we won. Kudos to the kid for hitting clutch free throws but he missed two bunnies and made two bunnies. Again, he can have a much bigger impact if he could made lay ups. In the end, he had an average game.

The other Nova game he had 3 TOs, missed lay ups, and was 3 for 8 from the line. Again, he had an average game. But everyone gets jazzed with a 7pt, 4ast, 3TO performance. Its average.

You are going to have to reference the thread again where I criticized fouling or whatever. I couldn't find it.

Finally, it's funny that you COMPLETELY ignore the three game stretch where Vander was finishing well and playing well that I was giving him high praise. Funny how you ignored that. Very politician-like.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

You must be a politician because you can really grab some small clips and spin.

Here are some posts you made about Vander.

No spin here. Just the quotes. Most of these are from November, and I think that is when you gained your "rep".

I'll say it again... He just isn't that good.

Very true. He was a five star kid.  I was expecting that he would comfortable with a layup and he is not. Great defense though. Got to him him that

Can he make a layup?  Kinda important.

I am sorry but I just don't see how blue got his 5 star status. With less PT, Jones looks better and just more comfortable. Blue is still disappointing.

Can we compare sophomore stats between Blue, Wade, and McNeal again?  That would be fun.

[ErickJD08]

Here are some posts you made about Vander.

No spin here. Just the quotes. Most of these are from November, and I think that is when you gained your "rep".

Understood. I don't see that I said anything TERRIBLE. He struggles with layups. It's frustrating to watch. I am over the five star status. I think we have finally started to see improvement about two weeks ago. I kinda was expecting this kind of improvement around December. Big deal and it's taking him a little longer. He started to regress a bit lately but he seems to have this free throw stroke down so I absolutely want him on the floor at the end of the game with a lead.

I get a little frustrated when the fan base really amp'ed up about 7 points and 4 assists. Or like the start of this thread about how Vander has grow SO much. I completely understand offense is not the end all be all but he has a bunch of negative plays (blocked shots, TOs, sloppy passes) every game. And its the same ones every game.  And he shoot a really bad percentage for the quality of shots he gets.  Jae and DJO are studs but in the next two years, we are going to need him to be better on offense. On top of that, it is clear that the kid has a really high ceiling, especially on offense. I am not giving up faith. I feel like he can step it up and make this a championship team this year. The reality is that Blue and JC are going to need to be better in their own ways to make a run (and the studs have to be studs of course).

[MU_LOL]

Why do you hate Vander Blue?

Nah I get what boyonthedock is saying... VB did get better with layups and no-to-two footers but then he started sucking again in the past couple of games (or maybe at least the ones that he missed sticks out in my mind more than the ones that he makes). I like that his average is still in the double-digits though.

[CTWarrior]

Blue has improved by leaps and bounds this season.   Besides developing a somewhat reliable 10-15 foot pull-up jump shot (which is the most effective shot in a wing's arsenal, if you ask me), the next big thing he has to learn is to take the hit on his drive and still put up a reasonable shot.  When he takes contact, he just sorta wings the ball at the basket, not giving himself a chance to make the shot and relying on the ref to make a call.

[GGGG]

Understood. I don't see that I said anything TERRIBLE. He struggles with layups. It's frustrating to watch. I am over the five star status. I think we have finally started to see improvement about two weeks ago. I kinda was expecting this kind of improvement around December. Big deal and it's taking him a little longer. He started to regress a bit lately but he seems to have this free throw stroke down so I absolutely want him on the floor at the end of the game with a lead.

I get a little frustrated when the fan base really amp'ed up about 7 points and 4 assists. Or like the start of this thread about how Vander has grow SO much. I completely understand offense is not the end all be all but he has a bunch of negative plays (blocked shots, TOs, sloppy passes) every game. And its the same ones every game.  And he shoot a really bad percentage for the quality of shots he gets.  Jae and DJO are studs but in the next two years, we are going to need him to be better on offense. On top of that, it is clear that the kid has a really high ceiling, especially on offense. I am not giving up faith. I feel like he can step it up and make this a championship team this year. The reality is that Blue and JC are going to need to be better in their own ways to make a run (and the studs have to be studs of course).

First, I am absolutely amazed how you can say he has regressed the past few weeks.  He was all over the floor defensively in both the WVU and Georgetown games.  Outside of Jae, he was probably the best player on the floor against Georgetown.  

Second, you harp on his mistakes, but you do realize that he has a better A/TO ratio than everyone on the team but Junior and Jae.  He outrebounds everyone but Jae and Davante (yes, more per game than Jamil in only two more minutes of action).  And again, he is THE BEST on ball perimeter defender on the team.

Yeah, he misses some layups that he should make.  But my goodness that is a small negative compared to the positives that he brings to the floor.

[MU82]

I don't know where we'd be on the boards without Vander Blue.

Rebounding is our biggest weakness, and this skinny guard has been fearlessly battling the behemoths and averaging 5 a game since Gardner got hurt against Nova. He's had several games this season with 6, 7 or 8 boards.

He has flaws, yes. Who doesn't? He has improved in every facet, including shooting -- especially at the line, where his turnaround has been nothing short of remarkable. But it's on defense and on the boards that he has really helped us get to where we are. Nine more games of it would be just delightful!

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Understood. I don't see that I said anything TERRIBLE. He struggles with layups. It's frustrating to watch. I am over the five star status. I think we have finally started to see improvement about two weeks ago. I kinda was expecting this kind of improvement around December. Big deal and it's taking him a little longer. He started to regress a bit lately but he seems to have this free throw stroke down so I absolutely want him on the floor at the end of the game with a lead.

I get a little frustrated when the fan base really amp'ed up about 7 points and 4 assists. Or like the start of this thread about how Vander has grow SO much. I completely understand offense is not the end all be all but he has a bunch of negative plays (blocked shots, TOs, sloppy passes) every game. And its the same ones every game.  And he shoot a really bad percentage for the quality of shots he gets.  Jae and DJO are studs but in the next two years, we are going to need him to be better on offense. On top of that, it is clear that the kid has a really high ceiling, especially on offense. I am not giving up faith. I feel like he can step it up and make this a championship team this year. The reality is that Blue and JC are going to need to be better in their own ways to make a run (and the studs have to be studs of course).

I don't think your evaluation is entirely unfair, but quips like "Can he make a lay-up?" sounded bitter and naive. If Vander misses a lay-up in traffic, it doesn't mean he's bad at basketball. Consequently, if he makes a lay-up in traffic, it doesn't mean he's good. We all know that.

Your reaction to a developing soph. was more harsh than need be, and you are getting roasted for that.

In an ironic twist, posters here are now treating you (looking closely at every post) like you seemed to treat Vander (Focusing on specific mistakes instead of the whole picture).

[leever]

Now if he'd only learn to high five his teammates........

I believe Vander is much improved on the slap of five!

[real chili 83]

I believe Vander is much improved on the slap of five!

Yes, as a matter of fact, Vander was selected to the little heralded All-High Five Team for the Big East!   

And yes, I am cracking myself up!