Quote from: MuggsyB on Today at 06:07:43 PMWe don't have a spot shooter or a guy who can consistently use his handles, rise, fire, and bury jumpers.  Whether it be at the 3 pt line or anywhere else.  As for our unconscionable futility in the paint?  We almost never are balanced or play off of two feet.  We have no clue how to change angles or direction.  And we are wildly out of control like a bowling ball as opposed to a competent D-1 basketball player. 

You say this all the time and it's absolutely meaningless.

Quote from: BM1090 on Today at 06:43:38 PMAgree with this. And it's my main issue with the no mid-range strategy. You don't need to take mid-range often, but you do need to have a guy or two comfortable creating and scoring from that area when the defense successfully takes away the paint and the three point line.

NBA teams have all but eliminated the midrange, but when you get to the playoffs you see a lot more of it and teams that advance typically have guys that are comfortable there. The same is true for college.

Good points. Royce could be that man. Strong, tough guy with a 10' fadeaway would change things.

Quote from: wisblue on Today at 04:22:11 PMIt's more than just good shooters. It's having different types of shooters who can present more challenges to a defense.

For example, if a player is no threat to pull up and take a jump shot, the defender can play him tight around the three point line and not be concerned if he drives to the basket where he will be met by the big man who can park under the basket without being concerned that his man can step out for a 10 foot jump shot.

One of the criticisms of MU is that they miss too many "layups". While they have missed some real bunnies.a lot of those "layups" are tightly contested shots close to the basket that are much tougher than a shot from 12 feet directly in front of the basket.

Agree with this. And it's my main issue with the no mid-range strategy. You don't need to take mid-range often, but you do need to have a guy or two comfortable creating and scoring from that area when the defense successfully takes away the paint and the three point line.

NBA teams have all but eliminated the midrange, but when you get to the playoffs you see a lot more of it and teams that advance typically have guys that are comfortable there. The same is true for college.

Quote from: wisblue on Today at 06:14:29 PMSo, what everyone seems to be saying is that if a 5 point underdog winning is an upset, and a 12 point underdog winning is an upset, then a 12 point underdog winning is no "crazier" than a 5 point underdog winning.

I don't agree with that logic.

What I was saying is that if UW beating Marquette wasn't an upset, then neither was MU taking down #1 and eventual national champion Nova. And we all know the latter was an upset. So the former was too.

https://www.jsonline.com/story/sports/college/marquette/2022/12/03/wisconsin-badgers-vs-marquette-golden-eagles-college-basketball-game-updates-at-fiserv-forum/69694329007/

Here is the JSOnline story on that game. I see no reference to the UW victory being an upset, surprise, or shock.

I guarantee that, in the unlikely event MU wins on Saturday, some of those words will appear.

So, what everyone seems to be saying is that if a 5 point underdog winning is an upset, and a 12 point underdog winning is an upset, then a 12 point underdog winning is no "crazier" than a 5 point underdog winning.

I don't agree with that logic.

We don't have a spot shooter or a guy who can consistently use his handles, rise, fire, and bury jumpers.  Whether it be at the 3 pt line or anywhere else.  As for our unconscionable futility in the paint?  We almost never are balanced or play off of two feet.  We have no clue how to change angles or direction.  And we are wildly out of control like a bowling ball as opposed to a competent D-1 basketball player. 

Quote from: BM1090 on Today at 06:00:24 PMMarquette was favored by 6. It was an upset.

When Marquette upset #1 Villanova in 2017, we were 5 point underdogs.

Yes and Yes.

Quote from: wisblue on Today at 04:35:04 PMIn the context of this conversation, I am disputing the statement that a double digit underdog winning would be no "crazier" than a four point underdog winning.

Even if the Badgers win over MU in 2022 was technically an "upset" by the broadest definition of the word, it was not considered one or reported that way at the time.

Marquette was favored by 6. It was an upset.

When Marquette upset #1 Villanova in 2017, we were 5 point underdogs.

Quote from: Small Orange Soda on Today at 05:49:50 PMThat's what I'm wondering. In the past, a guy like Norman would've certainly transferred a level down after last season. Now? Keep those checks coming.

***GENERALLY SPEAKING, NOT NECESSARILY WITH THE CURRENT STATE OF OUR ROSTER/PROGRAM***, I'm just fine with a Tre Norman staying four years in a 15 scholarship scenario. Guy who can play bully ball and some defense, has been through it a bit, helps others, good teammate.. spot minutes here and there, insurance in case of hella injuries.. great.

And in the current state, I'm all good with him being here too.. wouldn't have him playing many minutes, but we have 15 freaking spots.

What I would do is have some guys ready to play who have a profile of being guys who need/want/can medium-high usage and it's natural and effective. We are very low on that. Lots of complementary dudes who just aren't that type of guy. Those types of players are JUST FINE and actually NEEDED. But, this team build lacks potential higher usage guys and that's tough on us.