MUScoop

MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: El Guerrero 2 on August 02, 2023, 05:39:06 PM

Title: Open Practice
Post by: El Guerrero 2 on August 02, 2023, 05:39:06 PM
Ben in a boot watching; let the rumor mill churn.

Lowry and Ross have very similar games and I think both will be used this year. Chase could be a real problem for opponents when his shot falls.

Sean looked healthy but he’s still 5’8. Didn’t see much from Norman to get excited about, but it was 30 minutes I watched.

Al looked surprisingly fluid and comfortable to me for a freshman big; I think he’ll be useful for 5-10mpg. Joplin actually passed the ball, so hopefully him getting more minutes will make him less of a black hole.

Kolek didn’t miss while I watched. He could do 16 and 8 this year, easy.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Uncle Rico on August 02, 2023, 05:58:20 PM
Ben in a boot watching; let the rumor mill churn.

Lowry and Ross have very similar games and I think both will be used this year. Chase could be a real problem for opponents when his shot falls.

Sean looked healthy but he’s still 5’8. Didn’t see much from Norman to get excited about, but it was 30 minutes I watched.

Al looked surprisingly fluid and comfortable to me for a freshman big; I think he’ll be useful for 5-10mpg. Joplin actually passed the ball, so hopefully him getting more minutes will make him less of a black hole.

Kolek didn’t miss while I watched. He could do 16 and 8 this year, easy.

He’s out for the year according to my sources
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: BCHoopster on August 02, 2023, 06:01:56 PM
If that is the case, why they redshirting the new player?
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 02, 2023, 06:02:27 PM
He’s out for the year according to my sources

Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: wadesworld on August 02, 2023, 06:04:51 PM
Consider the source that the sources are feeding.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Uncle Rico on August 02, 2023, 06:06:11 PM
If that is the case, why they redshirting the new player?

Shaka is playing head games
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 02, 2023, 06:08:55 PM
How was Ben injured??
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: We R Final Four on August 02, 2023, 06:08:58 PM
Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.
Cmon muggsy….
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: We R Final Four on August 02, 2023, 06:11:05 PM
Chase is the next player up….stronger….shooting the 3 with confidence…..leader.

Tre looks the furthest behind.
Great for Al to defend Oso. Al will be a nice player in the future.
All upper classmen look stronger.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 02, 2023, 06:12:30 PM
Chase is the next player up….stronger….shooting the 3 with confidence…..leader.

Tre looks the furthest behind.
Great for Al to defend Oso. Al will be a nice player in the future.
All upper classmen look stronger.

Outstanding.  Ty for the synopsis.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Uncle Rico on August 02, 2023, 06:12:49 PM
How was Ben injured??

Robbery
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: We R Final Four on August 02, 2023, 06:14:14 PM
How was Ben injured??
Izzo tripped him last March.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 02, 2023, 06:18:00 PM
Izzo tripped him last March.

Izzo knew about Nassar.  What a scumbag. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: ZiggysFryBoy on August 02, 2023, 06:18:55 PM
How was Ben injured??

3 gruff billy goats attacked him as they were trying to get away from the troll.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Jay Bee on August 02, 2023, 06:22:20 PM
Might have hurt it when Shaka made the team do demo on his old house to prep for the building of the new compound
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: real chili 83 on August 02, 2023, 06:25:05 PM
Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Muggsy is doomed! 😱😱😱
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Vander Blue Man Group on August 02, 2023, 06:31:58 PM
He’s out for the year according to my sources

I heard he was attacked by a group of angry Kiwis.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: El Guerrero 2 on August 02, 2023, 06:40:42 PM
I heard he was attacked by a group of angry Kiwis.

Stop peddling racist tropes. Kiwis aren’t as violent as they’re made out to be by the media.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Viper on August 02, 2023, 06:42:36 PM
I heard he was attacked by a group of angry Kiwis.
Brad Davison tried a nut punch but settled for the foot stomp.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: tower912 on August 02, 2023, 06:44:31 PM
Izzo knew about Nassar.  What a scumbag.

Nobody has ever produced an ounce of  proof of that.   The allegation was ever made in any of the court cases.  Investigations found nothing.  Pure fiction on your part.   

I think Izzo messed up how he handled the assault charges against his players.  That I will not defend.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Vander Blue Man Group on August 02, 2023, 06:53:07 PM
Stop peddling racist tropes. Kiwis aren’t as violent as they’re made out to be by the media.

I don't know...

Here is a police sketch of one of the attackers:

(https://www.shutterstock.com/image-vector/angry-running-kiwi-bird-vector-600w-2001469934.jpg)
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuMark on August 02, 2023, 07:44:40 PM
Shin splints for Gold

https://twitter.com/bensteelemjs/status/1686892678133243904?s=61&t=6XPB8f4sAKmJIzxgMcsCjw
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 02, 2023, 07:55:34 PM
Shin splints for Gold

https://twitter.com/bensteelemjs/status/1686892678133243904?s=61&t=6XPB8f4sAKmJIzxgMcsCjw

Ty.  Please, please, let the young man be healthy. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: tower912 on August 02, 2023, 08:06:43 PM
Gold in boot is great if you are in the World Cup. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Spaniel with a Short Tail on August 02, 2023, 08:28:38 PM
Gold in boot is great if you are in the World Cup.

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/7/6040/6428900779_9bee2b954a_b.jpg)

Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Mu8891 on August 02, 2023, 08:33:55 PM
Ben is NOT out for the year.  Good grief…
It’s 3 mos till their first game !

I did not see OSO take a single 3 during the multiple scrimmages.   And S Joans three point shot doesn’t look good.  Way too flat

Otherwise… they are supper athletic,
Joplin passed the ball, AL did a decent job defending the post.  TKO ?  Still great
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: PointWarrior on August 02, 2023, 08:41:00 PM
Jones the Younger did not grow in the off-season?  Disappointing….
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 02, 2023, 08:52:27 PM
Jones the Younger did not grow in the off-season?  Disappointing….

Can we please stop attacking our shorter citizens?
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 02, 2023, 08:55:06 PM
Nobody has ever produced an ounce of  proof of that.   The allegation was ever made in any of the court cases.  Investigations found nothing.  Pure fiction on your part.   

I think Izzo messed up how he handled the assault charges against his players.  That I will not defend.

My instincts disagree with you.    Izzo was in the same athletic dept for 20 yrs with this colossal scumbag Tower.  It's not conceivable he didn't hear things.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: tower912 on August 02, 2023, 09:12:26 PM
Your instincts are contrary to all the investigations and all of the court cases.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Dickthedribbler on August 02, 2023, 09:12:58 PM
If that is the case, why they redshirting the new player?

He was in a boot, and if you for some reason didn't see the boot, you would hardly notice even a limp. No crutches. He spent the entire 1:45 hour practice walking up and down the court or standing. He didn't sit down the entire time.

I'm no doctor, but from 40 feet away, things didn't look too bleak to me.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Mu8891 on August 02, 2023, 09:18:39 PM
Re:  Ben …

I was told “ not too bad “ … and yes, he was walking - a lot - really w / little or no limp.  Sure looks like he will be fine.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: TAMU, Knower of Ball on August 02, 2023, 09:21:30 PM
Ben is being held out as a precaution. No reason to think he will miss any games because of it.

That being said, i always get nervous when near 7 foooters  have leg issues
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 02, 2023, 09:35:10 PM
Your instincts are contrary to all the investigations and all of the court cases.

I'll just disagree with you here. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Jay Bee on August 02, 2023, 09:38:09 PM
I had shin splints. That’s the only reason I’m not playing pro today
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Dr. Blackheart on August 02, 2023, 09:39:12 PM
I had shin splints. That’s the only reason I’m not playing pro today

Shin splints = Too much, too soon.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: real chili 83 on August 02, 2023, 09:40:53 PM
Shin splints = Too much, too soon.

Shin splints = Doom
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MUCam on August 02, 2023, 09:59:16 PM
I'll just disagree with you here.

You’ll just disagree with all known facts, investigative reports, and conclusions by independent parties, and you’ll just go with what your gut says?

Par for the course these days, I guess.

Carry on standing by opinions based on conjecture.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MU62 on August 02, 2023, 10:02:32 PM
Greg Elliot was in the house.  Nice to see him.  No more eligibility that I know.  On to the money now. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: We R Final Four on August 02, 2023, 10:11:04 PM
Theo John as well……with a newborn baby!
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Spotcheck Billy on August 02, 2023, 10:34:41 PM
Ben is being held out as a precaution. No reason to think he will miss any games because of it.

That being said, i always get nervous when near 7 foooters  have leg issues
[/quote
Ben is being held out as a precaution. No reason to think he will miss any games because of it.

That being said, i always get nervous when near 7 foooters  have leg issues
Except the games in Italy
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Juan Anderson's Mixtape on August 02, 2023, 10:41:27 PM
Theo John as well……with a newborn baby!

That baby was born with 2 PF.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: wadesworld on August 02, 2023, 10:44:50 PM
Theo and Greg Elliott were at the Open Gym today? Two guys who transferred out and who were not from Milwaukee prior to coming to Marquette. That’s cool they’re back.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: TallTitan34 on August 02, 2023, 10:48:42 PM
That baby was born with 2 PF.

Breeding would have ejected the baby.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Dr. Blackheart on August 02, 2023, 11:19:25 PM
Theo and Greg Elliott were at the Open Gym today? Two guys who transferred out and who were not from Milwaukee prior to coming to Marquette. That’s cool they’re back.

Both MU diploma owners
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: mugrad_89 on August 03, 2023, 07:00:03 AM
He’s out for the year according to my sources

I heard a rumor that Shaka told Ben to stay in the boot until he turns into an aircraft carrier.  👀
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: We R Final Four on August 03, 2023, 08:00:01 AM
That baby was born with 2 PF.
Haha…well done.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: We R Final Four on August 03, 2023, 08:03:04 AM
Here is the new bruiser.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 03, 2023, 08:07:59 AM
You’ll just disagree with all known facts, investigative reports, and conclusions by independent parties, and you’ll just go with what your gut says?

Par for the course these days, I guess.

Carry on standing by opinions based on conjecture.

There was an investigation whether Izzo knew about Nassar?  It's not conceivable he didn't know anything about it being in the same athletic department for 20 yrs.  He's the face of the University. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: tower912 on August 03, 2023, 08:11:35 AM
Yes.  By law enforcement and the NCAA.   Not to mention the investigations for the civil cases.   
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: rocky_warrior on August 03, 2023, 08:11:42 AM
Here is the new bruiser.

"My dad can beat up your dad!" - I'd take that bet!
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on August 03, 2023, 08:17:13 AM
There was an investigation whether Izzo knew about Nassar?  It's not conceivable he didn't know anything about it being in the same athletic department for 20 yrs.  He's the face of the University. 

The Michigan State athletic department has a few hundred employees.

And the "face of the University" stuff isn't really relevant.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Uncle Rico on August 03, 2023, 08:36:06 AM
Theo and Greg Elliott were at the Open Gym today? Two guys who transferred out and who were not from Milwaukee prior to coming to Marquette. That’s cool they’re back.

Lowers my opinion of Shaka, TBH.  We don’t want those guys around. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 03, 2023, 08:39:28 AM
The Michigan State athletic department has a few hundred employees.

And the "face of the University" stuff isn't really relevant.

So you believe that in 20 years time Izzo hadn't heard a single thing about these crimes?  Nothing whatsoever?  I'm gonna go with a no on that one.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Hards Alumni on August 03, 2023, 08:42:10 AM
So you believe that in 20 years time Izzo hadn't heard a single thing about these crimes?  Nothing whatsoever?  I'm gonna go with a no on that one.

I hope you never sit on a jury.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on August 03, 2023, 08:43:22 AM
So you believe that in 20 years time Izzo hadn't heard a single thing about these crimes?  Nothing whatsoever?  I'm gonna go with a no on that one.


I mean, I think that's why he got away with it as long as he did right?
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: tower912 on August 03, 2023, 08:45:10 AM
You have wrong before.  You're wrong now. There is no documented instance of anyone approaching Izzo to complain about Nassar.

As opposed to Anderson at Michigan, Sandusky at Penn St, or Strauss at tOSU.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 03, 2023, 08:49:58 AM

I mean, I think that's why he got away with it as long as he did right?

He also made a ridiculously asinine statement after the victims told their stories about Nassar.  So tone deaf and absurd that many coaches would have been fired immediately.  I remember Aly Raisman's mom lit him up and rightly so.  I simply do not believe Izzo Fluffy.  I'm not saying he's guilty of covering up his crimes or anything but I don't find it plausible that he never heard a single word shout this scumbag.  And we know about the crimes of his players as well.  I frankly think the guy is a colossal asshead and used to respect the man. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Coleman on August 03, 2023, 08:50:53 AM
Both MU diploma owners

There's this cool latin word for that called alumni
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 03, 2023, 08:51:05 AM
You have wrong before.  You're wrong now. There is no documented instance of anyone approaching Izzo to complain about Nassar.

As opposed to Anderson at Michigan, Sandusky at Penn St, or Strauss at tOSU.

That's not what I stated or even implied. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Skatastrophy on August 03, 2023, 09:13:13 AM
There's this cool latin word for that called alumni

Alumni means you attended a school whether you graduated or not. Just being pedantic.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: real chili 83 on August 03, 2023, 09:20:10 AM
He also made a ridiculously asinine statement after the victims told their stories about Nassar.  So tone deaf and absurd that many coaches would have been fired immediately.  I remember Aly Raisman's mom lit him up and rightly so.  I simply do not believe Izzo Fluffy.  I'm not saying he's guilty of covering up his crimes or anything but I don't find it plausible that he never heard a single word shout this scumbag.  And we know about the crimes of his players as well.  I frankly think the guy is a colossal asshead and used to respect the man.

Izzo is doomed!😱😱😱
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Its DJOver on August 03, 2023, 09:23:02 AM
What a vicious series of attacks against someone that is innocent until proven guilty, unless we're no longer living in 'merica, I ain't no commie.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 03, 2023, 09:25:10 AM
What a vicious series of attacks against someone that is innocent until proven guilty, unless we're no longer living in 'merica, I ain't no commie.

Vicious?  I didn't accuse him of a crime.  Anyway, have a good day all. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: JakeBarnes on August 03, 2023, 09:27:22 AM
Here is the new bruiser.

Todd already has him on a 2-a-day lifting program.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Its DJOver on August 03, 2023, 09:33:27 AM
Vicious?  I didn't accuse him of a crime.  Anyway, have a good day all.

Scumbag? Colossal asshead?

Hmmmm.  For someone who appears to be pretty sensitive and quick to call others disagreeing "attacks", I would think you would be more courteous.

Anyway, have a good day.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Viper on August 03, 2023, 09:46:54 AM
He also made a ridiculously asinine statement after the victims told their stories about Nassar.  So tone deaf and absurd that many coaches would have been fired immediately.  I remember Aly Raisman's mom lit him up and rightly so.  I simply do not believe Izzo Fluffy.  I'm not saying he's guilty of covering up his crimes or anything but I don't find it plausible that he never heard a single word shout this scumbag.  And we know about the crimes of his players as well.  I frankly think the guy is a colossal asshead and used to respect the man.
you seem like a Jack Smith kinda guy. Just sayin’.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: onepost on August 03, 2023, 10:34:50 AM
you seem like a Jack Smith kinda guy. Just sayin’.

Scoop in the offseason <<<<<
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Coleman on August 03, 2023, 10:38:14 AM
Alumni means you attended a school whether you graduated or not. Just being pedantic.

Today I learned
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on August 03, 2023, 11:01:58 AM
He also made a ridiculously asinine statement after the victims told their stories about Nassar.  So tone deaf and absurd that many coaches would have been fired immediately.  I remember Aly Raisman's mom lit him up and rightly so.  I simply do not believe Izzo Fluffy.  I'm not saying he's guilty of covering up his crimes or anything but I don't find it plausible that he never heard a single word shout this scumbag.  And we know about the crimes of his players as well.  I frankly think the guy is a colossal asshead and used to respect the man. 

I'm sure your opinion of him keeps him up at night.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MUCam on August 03, 2023, 11:16:46 AM
If Muggsy only did not mean to be taken seriously, he’d be the quintessential example of hyperbole.

Izzo’s first statement about Nassar was poorly worded. But let’s not make it something it is wasn’t. To call it asinine, frankly, is asinine. He referred to the victims as courageous and acknowledged the damage caused. His misstep was in supporting leadership at MSU that allowed this to occur under their watch, including the leadership of Lou Ann Simon who for 30+ years was considered one of the better university presidents in America. Perhaps he should have held back and placed all focus on the victims.

We can talk about what the “perfect” off the cuff statement right after a basketball game was, especially after learning the institution love and have dedicated yourself to is not infallible. I don’t know that there is a perfect statement in the face of such damage.

In the end, Izzo corrected himself and acknowledged his statements were less than ideal. Muggsy, on the other hand, and in the face of actual facts, has doubled down and extended his usage of outrageous adjectives against a man he has never met. This begs the question, who has shown real character here?

Like I said, doubling down on unsubstantiated personal opinion seems to be par for the course these days.

That’s asinine!

PS. We should be wary of throwing stones from glass houses. Even when built on the foundation of shiny adjectives, like asinine, colossal, and absurd.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MU82 on August 03, 2023, 01:44:18 PM
you seem like a Jack Smith kinda guy. Just sayin’.

Muggsy probably didn't speak personally to dozens of people who used to work for Nassar. Just sayin'.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 03, 2023, 03:43:30 PM
Muggsy probably didn't speak personally to dozens of people who used to work for Nassar. Just sayin'.

Muggsy isn't the only person who thinks Izzo is full of crap and an asshat.  Just sayin'.  And using strong language about someone is not a "vicious attack".  I don't care for the guy. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Viper on August 03, 2023, 06:30:28 PM
Muggsy isn't the only person who thinks Izzo is full of crap and an asshat.  Just sayin'.  And using strong language about someone is not a "vicious attack".  I don't care for the guy.
so…you know Izzo personally? Just curious.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 03, 2023, 07:57:33 PM
so…you know Izzo personally? Just curious.

I don't know him personally but I'm entitled to render an opinion. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: avid1010 on August 03, 2023, 08:39:40 PM
Muggsy isn't the only person who thinks Izzo is full of crap and an asshat.  Just sayin'.  And using strong language about someone is not a "vicious attack".  I don't care for the guy.
Shaka has spoken very kindly of him on numerous occasions...
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: tower912 on August 03, 2023, 08:46:16 PM
Yes, Shaka views Izzo as a mentor.  And both are trying to win through recruiting, retaining, and developing.    IIRC, they are the two high majors that did not bring in a high level transfer this offseason.   I am sure they will discuss that during their phone calls.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Lennys Tap on August 03, 2023, 10:27:42 PM
Shaka has spoken very kindly of him on numerous occasions...

True, but Rico (and others here) think he is scum.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Uncle Rico on August 04, 2023, 07:16:44 AM
True, but Rico (and others here) think he is scum.

I stand by that assessment.

There is a cult of the coach when it comes to college coaching.  These guys get put on pedestals by the national media to assure access and inside information.  The program at Michigan State under Izzo has been wildly successful but also a cesspool.  A lot of bad dudes have gone through there and been protected by Izzo and his staff.

Unlike Pitino who has been exposed at a dirtbag, Izzo still gets the saintly treatment.  I won’t be surprised if history isn’t kind to Tom Izzo and his tenure like many of the other saints of Big Ten Coaching
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on August 04, 2023, 07:26:34 AM
I have no problems with Izzo as a basketball coach. He is clearly a great one and deserves all of the accolades he gets.

But it's when they somehow are treated as more than that - as some sort of expert on "leadership" or a molder of young men. He's just a f*cking basketball coach.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 04, 2023, 08:37:37 AM
I have no problems with Izzo as a basketball coach. He is clearly a great one and deserves all of the accolades he gets.

But it's when they somehow are treated as more than that - as some sort of expert on "leadership" or a molder of young men. He's just a f*cking basketball coach.

This is fair.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Viper on August 04, 2023, 09:03:58 AM
I have no problems with Izzo as a basketball coach. He is clearly a great one and deserves all of the accolades he gets.

But it's when they somehow are treated as more than that - as some sort of expert on "leadership" or a molder of young men. He's just a f*cking basketball coach.
true, I agree…but…Izzo, Self, Calipari etc etc oversee basketball programs that generate huge revenue. More than a coach, imo
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Elonsmusk on August 04, 2023, 09:08:14 AM
I have no problems with Izzo as a basketball coach. He is clearly a great one and deserves all of the accolades he gets.

But it's when they somehow are treated as more than that - as some sort of expert on "leadership" or a molder of young men. He's just a f*cking basketball coach.

You don't think D-1 basketball coaches are huge influences/molders in the lives of the players?  Weird.  Seems most players cite their basketball coaches as having had the biggest impact on their lives - particularly those who come from single parent households.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MU82 on August 04, 2023, 09:20:04 AM
You don't think D-1 basketball coaches are huge influences/molders in the lives of the players?  Weird.  Seems most players cite their basketball coaches as having had the biggest impact on their lives - particularly those who come from single parent households.

Sure, but that doesn't mean they are "good guys." (FWIW, I have no knowledge about whether Izzo is that or not. I don't know him, and I don't know anybody who knows him well enough to make that judgment.)
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 04, 2023, 09:40:06 AM
Sure, but that doesn't mean they are "good guys." (FWIW, I have no knowledge about whether Izzo is that or not. I don't know him, and I don't know anybody who knows him well enough to make that judgment.)

There are lot of people we make judgments about that we "don't know well enough"/personally.  Donald Trump and Joe Biden come to mind.  I'm probably on the high end of the spectrum on this count, and can hold grudges, but when it comes to specific traits that I strongly don't care for I don't see a problem in rendering an opinion.   I flew off the handle a bit with Izzo but I'm not accusing him of a crime or anything.  I have a difficult time believing he was completely in the dark...that's essentially what I was trying to convey. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on August 04, 2023, 09:57:36 AM
You don't think D-1 basketball coaches are huge influences/molders in the lives of the players?  Weird.  Seems most players cite their basketball coaches as having had the biggest impact on their lives - particularly those who come from single parent households.

And I think a bunch of players don't really care about their coach.

My point is, they are just basketball coaches. Let's not make them more than that.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: wadesworld on August 04, 2023, 10:12:56 AM
I highly doubt Izzo knew what was happening with Nassar. That’s never been his problem.

His problem has been handling sexual assault allegations by his players, keeping guys on staff (as a volunteer assistant, no less…not even an important position) who have punched females in a bar, etc. And part of that falls on MSU as a whole, as victims were encouraged not to report these crimes to save the big money basketball program/players.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Hards Alumni on August 04, 2023, 03:33:12 PM
I stand by that assessment.

There is a cult of the coach when it comes to college coaching.  These guys get put on pedestals by the national media to assure access and inside information.  The program at Michigan State under Izzo has been wildly successful but also a cesspool.  A lot of bad dudes have gone through there and been protected by Izzo and his staff.

Unlike Pitino who has been exposed at a dirtbag, Izzo still gets the saintly treatment.  I won’t be surprised if history isn’t kind to Tom Izzo and his tenure like many of the other saints of Big Ten Coaching

+1
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Hards Alumni on August 04, 2023, 03:36:04 PM
I highly doubt Izzo knew what was happening with Nassar. That’s never been his problem.

His problem has been handling sexual assault allegations by his players, keeping guys on staff (as a volunteer assistant, no less…not even an important position) who have punched females in a bar, etc. And part of that falls on MSU as a whole, as victims were encouraged not to report these crimes to save the big money basketball program/players.

Could be both, we will never know.  Not sure I'd give him the benefit of the doubt.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: tower912 on August 04, 2023, 03:42:57 PM
Payne, Appling, Walton?  I have no problem applying them to Izzo's record.   Nassar?  Not a shred of evidence.  Applying Muggsy's logic, anyone at MU 87-90 was responsible for Dahmer.  There is no way all those murders could have happened that close to campus without the students knowing.


Finally, for fun, which Big 10 coaching legends have had their legacies improved by history?    Bo?  The other Bo?  JoPa?  Woody?  Knight?
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: MuggsyB on August 04, 2023, 05:27:55 PM
Payne, Appling, Walton?  I have no problem applying them to Izzo's record.   Nassar?  Not a shred of evidence.  Applying Muggsy's logic, anyone at MU 87-90 was responsible for Dahmer.  There is no way all those murders could have happened that close to campus without the students knowing.




Finally, for fun, which Big 10 coaching legends have had their legacies improved by history?    Bo?  The other Bo?  JoPa?  Woody?  Knight?

Tower,

If I intimated that Izzo was "responsible" for Nassar I apologize.  I don't think I did.  What I have stated is that it's not conceivable to me that in 20 years he never heard a single word about Nassar's predatory and criminal behavior.  And yes, you can also add he did nothing about the players you mentioned. 
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: tower912 on August 04, 2023, 05:44:42 PM
And I am saying that there is no evidence anyone ever mentioned Nassar's crimes to him before they were made public.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: mileskishnish72 on August 05, 2023, 08:11:05 PM
Breeding would have ejected the baby.

Ha! Missed that one until tonight.
Spot on, TT.
Title: Re: Open Practice
Post by: Dr. Blackheart on August 05, 2023, 11:44:16 PM
Ha! Missed that one until tonight.
Spot on, TT.

Hat tip comment for sure.

Breeding hates MU!