MUScoop
MUScoop => The Superbar => Topic started by: Tugg Speedman on September 11, 2017, 10:46:22 AM
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NFL Kickoff Scores 21.8M Viewers, Down Double-Digits From 2016 – Update
http://deadline.com/2017/09/patriots-chiefs-nfl-kickoff-game-ratings-down-nbc-1202163914/
NFL’s opening night was a TV ratings disaster
http://nypost.com/2017/09/08/nfls-opening-night-was-a-tv-ratings-disaster/
https://www.wsj.com/articles/cmo-today-empty-department-stores-as-marketing-irma-hits-florida-and-nfl-ratings-publishers-weigh-privacy-regulations-1505132289
NFL’s kickoff game Thursday night, with 21.8 million people watching the Kansas City Chiefs beat defending Super Bowl champions, the New England Patriots, compared with 25.2 million for last year’s NFL kickoff game. Some suggest those stats imply viewer appetites for football could be waning, but others say Hurricane Irma could explain the dip, as people opted to keep up-to-date with the catastrophic storm as it hurtled toward Florida, CNN reports. Here’s a piece of interesting context, though. ESPN said ratings for Thursday night’s U.S. Open women’s semifinal were up 33% compared with 2016, suggesting the weather didn’t negatively impact viewership of that match too much.
The Uncertain Future of High School Football in America
The country wrestles with how to keep Friday Night Lights alive
https://www.wsj.com/graphics/high-school-football-uncertain-future/?mod=e2tw
The Colin Kaepernick Effect: CBS Study Says Protests Were Factor in NFL Ratings Decline
https://www.si.com/tech-media/2017/08/31/colin-kaepernick-nfl-ratings-cbs-study-sean-mcmanus
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Interesting topic. Maybe we should discuss this ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Good
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Likewise, I see no reason to discuss this topic. It would be like starting a thread to discuss that the sun is hot, or that urinals are not good places to eat lunch, or that Bill Cosby is a sex offender... sure, you might find some people to debate with you, but do you really want to argue with a moron (or someone who doesn't mind a little piss with their fruit cup)?
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'Tough start' for NFL season — ratings down 13% in Week 1
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tough-start-nfl-season-ratings-13-week-1-145729365.html
Nielsen had to delay its release of the television ratings for Week 1 of the new NFL season due to Hurricane Irma. Now the Week 1 ratings are out—and they aren’t good.
(https://s.yimg.com/ny/api/res/1.2/eWu3mZvqfs94oYAbbv8flg--/YXBwaWQ9aGlnaGxhbmRlcjtzbT0xO3c9MTIwMDtoPTU3OA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en/homerun/feed_manager_auto_publish_494/63a8dbe95432596f22f3e14d835edd4a)
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Good
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C'mon, death spiral. Without Kaepernick, who will the NFL scapegoat for bad ratings?
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C'mon, death spiral. Without Kaepernick, who will the NFL scapegoat for bad ratings?
Michael Bennett is killing the NFL ;D
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C'mon, death spiral. Without Kaepernick, who will the NFL scapegoat for bad ratings?
From the link above ... Hurricanes and Stephen King!
It’s worth noting that on the same NFL opening weekend, the Stephen King clown movie “It” was smashing box office records, which may call into question the notion that the NFL ratings dip is strictly due to people being glued to cable hurricane coverage.
The NFL is the clown movie.
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The NFL Is Seriously Concerned With Empty Stadiums
http://thebiglead.com/2017/09/13/the-nfl-is-seriously-concerned-with-empty-stadiums/
Second half kick-off of last week's 49er game.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJZRldwVoAAsYsx.jpg:large)
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Awesome. It being San Francisco, I wonder how many are staying away because of how Kaepernick is being treated.
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I saw some follow up tweets saying the reason that was so empty was due to it being directly in the sun (poor design of the stadium it sounds like) and coming back from halftime. I think it was overstated.
However, the TV ratings are interesting. I'm curious to see if it's a trend. The primetime games have been mostly snoozefests so far.
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I think it's safe to say that NFL is post peak. It's still enormous and may bounce back or level off though.
MLB slipped a generation ago and it's fine. NFL might just be going through the same generational shift.
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I think it's safe to say that NFL is post peak. It's still enormous and may bounce back or level off though.
Agreed, and it'll be interesting to see where it is in 15-20 years. Seems like a lot of parents are keeping their kids out of it. It'll take time to see a big shift, but as fewer kids grow up in the sport, I imagine the popularity will wane somewhat.
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I went to a high school game last night. Catholic high school, daughter's former school, son's future high school. Defending state champs, 16-1 over the last two years. Less than a thousand fans at the game, both teams combined. The band had more players than either team.
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I went to a high school game last night. Catholic high school, daughter's former school, son's future high school. Defending state champs, 16-1 over the last two years. Less than a thousand fans at the game, both teams combined. The band had more players than either team.
yeah, but did they stand, raise their fists, or kneel for the national anthem??
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A couple of kids on the bench of the Catholic high school took a knee during the anthem.
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BTW, crowds at both LA games are apparently terrible today. But USC had a huge crowd in LA just last night. And there were big crowds at a lot of the college games yesterday.
So is this a "football" thing? Or an "NFL" thing?
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A couple of kids on the bench of the Catholic high school took a knee during the anthem.
Dang them prayers
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The San Francisco photo may be a bit misleading. In Chicago, we have been Bears season ticket holders for 22 years. That's not uncommon here either as the fans either are buying food, going to the bathroom or mistimed their return.
Also, the 49ers and Rams, along with the Bears, Browns and Jets have the five worst teams in the NFL right now. The McCaskeys had an enormous number of empty seats last year in the last three home games. Given where things are going, this year should be no different.
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BTW, crowds at both LA games are apparently terrible today. But USC had a huge crowd in LA just last night. And there were big crowds at a lot of the college games yesterday.
So is this a "football" thing? Or an "NFL" thing?
I think it is an NFL thing.
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I think it is an NFL thing.
I think you are correct.
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I think it is an NFL thing.
LA just keeps on trying to drive the square peg thru the round hole. Hopefully someone is still paying the bills for San Diego county credit union stadium. The aztecs now play there and that ain't gonna cut it
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http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2017/09/17/redzone_is_the_cause_of_and_solution_to_all_of_the_nfl_s_problems.html
Maybe the NFL needs to move beyond the "two games at noon, one game at 3:30" mode of broadcasting. There are college games on every network on Saturday. I can watch whatever one I want.
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The San Francisco photo may be a bit misleading. In Chicago, we have been Bears season ticket holders for 22 years. That's not uncommon here either as the fans either are buying food, going to the bathroom or mistimed their return.
Also, the 49ers and Rams, along with the Bears, Browns and Jets have the five worst teams in the NFL right now. The McCaskeys had an enormous number of empty seats last year in the last three home games. Given where things are going, this year should be no different.
Browns don't have an empty stadium though. And they are better than the Bengals.
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On the other hand, the average franchise value rose 8 percent last year. Five teams are now worth more than $3 billion and the least valuable team (Buffalo) is worth $1.6 billion, which is twice as much as in 2010.
https://www.forbes.com/nfl-valuations/list/#tab:overall
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On the other hand, the average franchise value rose 8 percent last year. Five teams are now worth more than $3 billion and the least valuable team (Buffalo) is worth $1.6 billion, which is twice as much as in 2010.
https://www.forbes.com/nfl-valuations/list/#tab:overall
Yup.
And until we see three or four teams hit the market at the same time, owners know the money tree is still healthy and growing.
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how much of the ratings hit is due to people cutting the cord and watching at bars instead, or those who watch Red Zone?
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BTW, crowds at both LA games are apparently terrible today. But USC had a huge crowd in LA just last night. And there were big crowds at a lot of the college games yesterday.
So is this a "football" thing? Or an "NFL" thing?
This is what happens when you screw loyal fan bases by allowing a move to a TV market who couldn't support a pro team before. USC outdrew the two NFL teams combined. Add the Raiders to Vegas, and the NFL will have become Roller Derby (made only for TV). Rozelle was a brand builder. Goddell is a lawyer.
San Diego, the Bay Area and even St. Louis were loyal TV markets and loyal fan bases. LA has never embraced pro football.
https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2017/9/17/16322710/rams-chargers-attendance-usc-texas
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NFL doesn't "own" Sundays anymore. This past Sunday I watched the Arsenal and Cubs game. Both games would have been significantly more difficult to watch 15 years ago (living in Wisconsin). I have two children 4 and under, so fitting in another 3 hours to watch another sporting event, just isn't happening. As a healthcare provider, the concussion stuff really bothers me. And really all of the injuries just make the end of the season a war of attrition, keeping many of the more talented players out injured. Whether the politics have anything to do with it, the fact that the NFL was blaming it for low ratings was pretty laughable. Living in Wisconsin, I just don't see people stopping watching an event they have for 40 years because people are sitting for 2 minutes before the game.
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This may be the best article I have read on this. You have oil speculators like Jerry Jones running the league for short term gain.
https://www.sbnation.com/2017/9/19/16314082/nfl-ratings-colin-kaepernick-los-angeles-rams-owners-money
"If you see an NFL franchise as just another asset to be maximized and squeezed for every dime, being good at football — i.e. producing a good product — doesn’t matter. It’s not even rational to put effort towards anything but “value creation,” i.e. shuffling around pieces of the franchise until they sit in the most profitable positions. The Rams doubled their value overnight by leaving St. Louis and moving to L.A. They are a miserable football team run by a despised owner playing in an empty stadium, but the Rams could care less. The fourth most valuable team in the NFL sucks by design, and shines bright enough on the balance sheet to eliminate any real concerns about how bad the product is on the field."
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This may be the best article I have read on this. You have oil speculators like Jerry Jones running the league for short term gain.
https://www.sbnation.com/2017/9/19/16314082/nfl-ratings-colin-kaepernick-los-angeles-rams-owners-money
"If you see an NFL franchise as just another asset to be maximized and squeezed for every dime, being good at football — i.e. producing a good product — doesn’t matter. It’s not even rational to put effort towards anything but “value creation,” i.e. shuffling around pieces of the franchise until they sit in the most profitable positions. The Rams doubled their value overnight by leaving St. Louis and moving to L.A. They are a miserable football team run by a despised owner playing in an empty stadium, but the Rams could care less. The fourth most valuable team in the NFL sucks by design, and shines bright enough on the balance sheet to eliminate any real concerns about how bad the product is on the field."
Good article. At least Jones tries to put a winning team on the field as he tries to maximize his investment. Many owners have no interest in that.
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Good article. At least Jones tries to put a winning team on the field as he tries to maximize his investment. Many owners have no interest in that.
Only last year did they start to win, thanks to getting lucky in the draft with Zac Prescott. The previous 15 years they were as pathetic as the Chicago Bears.
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Only last year did they start to win, thanks to getting lucky in the draft with Zac Prescott. The previous 15 years they were as pathetic as the Chicago Bears.
Not a Bears fan, but pretty sure they were in a Super Bowl 10-11 years ago.
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Only last year did they start to win, thanks to getting lucky in the draft with Zac Prescott. The previous 15 years they were as pathetic as the Chicago Bears.
Well, not exactly.
Cowboys previous 15 years = 123-117, 5 playoff appearances.
Bears previous 15 years = 112-128, 4 playoff appearances.
You can say a lot of negative things about Jerry and be correct, but suggesting he's not a football guy, doesn't care about winning and is in the NFL only for the short-term gain is asinine.
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Well, not exactly.
Cowboys previous 15 years = 123-117, 5 playoff appearances.
Bears previous 15 years = 112-128, 4 playoff appearances.
You can say a lot of negative things about Jerry and be correct, but suggesting he's not a football guy, doesn't care about winning and is in the NFL only for the short-term gain is asinine.
So the Cowboys were 6 over .500 (rounding to an average season of 8-8 season) and failed to make the playoffs in 10 of the previous 15 years.
This was started because Jockey said:
At least Jones tries to put a winning team on the field as he tries to maximize his investment. Many owners have no interest in that.
Why don't these statistics make a strong case that Jones did not put a winning team on the field until he "screwed up in reverse" and drafted Prescott in the fourth round (135 pick) last year?
And yes, Jones is a football guy and he cares. But, as the self-appointed GM, he really sucks at it (see the record above) and will not fire himself.
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So the Cowboys were 6 over .500 (rounding to an average season of 8-8 season) and failed to make the playoffs in 10 of the previous 15 years.
This was started because Jockey said:
At least Jones tries to put a winning team on the field as he tries to maximize his investment. Many owners have no interest in that.
Why don't these statistics make a strong case that Jones did not put a winning team on the field until he "screwed up in reverse" and drafted Prescott in the fourth round (135 pick) last year?
And yes, Jones is a football guy and he cares. But, as the self-appointed GM, he really sucks at it (see the record above) and will not fire himself.
You need a little help at reading comprehension.
Jones did try to put a better product on the field AND he was a crappy GM who often didn't succeed at what he was trying to do.
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You need a little help at reading comprehension.
Jones did try to put a better product on the field AND he was a crappy GM who often didn't succeed at what he was trying to do.
What is the measure that you use that says Jones tried and what measure says other teams don't?
Are you a mined reader? Or, are you an angry bears fans and it makes you feel better the summarily announce that the Bears have not tried because it makes you feel better?
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What is the measure that you use that says Jones tried and what measure says other teams don't?
Are you a mined reader? Or, are you an angry bears fans and it makes you feel better the summarily announce that the Bears have not tried because it makes you feel better?
I dug deep to read Jones' mined.
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I dug deep to read Jones' mined.
That's my point, you made it up, and it is not even supported by his pre-Prescott record.
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NFL TV Ratings Slide Worries Wall Street
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/nfl-tv-ratings-slide-worries-wall-street-1041187
NFL's ratings woes continued in Week 2, and Wall Street is taking notice, given there are fewer excuses for falling viewership than there were a year ago when Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump were distracting TV-watching Americans.
While NFL games remain some of the most-watched content on television, ratings slid 12 percent in the NFL's opening weekend, with many blaming Hurricane Irma. But without dramatic weather, the second weekend was off 15 percent year-over-year. This comes after an 8 percent ratings slump last season.
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So the Cowboys were 6 over .500 (rounding to an average season of 8-8 season) and failed to make the playoffs in 10 of the previous 15 years.
My comment was in response to your foolish remark that Dallas was "pathetic" the previous 15 years. Finishing above .500 is not pathetic. It is, by definition, better than average.
And yes, Jones is a football guy and he cares. But, as the self-appointed GM, he really sucks at it (see the record above) and will not fire himself.
Sorry for the facts to interrupt, but since Parcells left, making Jerry the unquestioned shot caller, Dallas has done very well as far as personnel decisions. Since 2007, they've drafted 13 Pro Bowl players. For comparison's sake, over the same time period the Packers and Steelers ( two teams held up as models of consistent winning and smart front offices), have drafted eight and nine, respectively. Seattle has drafted 11. New England has drafted eight.
Look, I'm not a Cowboys fan and I'm loathe to defense Jerry Jones, but you've run far askew of reality here in your effort to prop up a clearly false narrative. Dallas has not been pathetic over the past 15 seasons and, like it or not, Jones has done a really good job of building that team.
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I think Stephen Jones deserves A LOT of the credit for the Cowboys draft success. I mean, ultimately the GM is Jerry, but I think it is his son that it's doing most of the work now.
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I think Stephen Jones deserves A LOT of the credit for the Cowboys draft success. I mean, ultimately the GM is Jerry, but I think it is his son that it's doing most of the work now.
I think that's a fair statement to some degree. Stephen, I think, reins in some of the old man's worst instincts (like talking him into drafting Zack Martin over Johnny Manziel), but Jerry's still making the final calls and deserves some credit for how that team;s been built over the past decade.
Again, I say this as someone who is not a fan of the Cowboys and thinks little of Jerry Jones as a human being. But I'm not letting my animosity for him or his team to eschew reality here.
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Sorry for the facts to interrupt, but since Parcells left, making Jerry the unquestioned shot caller, Dallas has done very well as far as personnel decisions. Since 2007, they've drafted 13 Pro Bowl players. For comparison's sake, over the same time period the Packers and Steelers ( two teams held up as models of consistent winning and smart front offices), have drafted eight and nine, respectively. Seattle has drafted 11. New England has drafted eight.
They missed the playoffs in 10 of 15 years. How does that count as successful?
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They missed the playoffs in 10 of 15 years. How does that count as successful?
He didn't say they were "successful." He said that they weren't "pathetic" as you claimed.
Moving goalposts again...
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No longer a question of "is it bad" but rather "how bad."
49ers-Rams tickets reselling for the price of two stadium pretzels
http://www.sfgate.com/sports/article/49ers-Rams-tickets-cheapest-levis-stadium-history-12215863.php
Thursday night's Rams-49ers game may be the toughest sell in the history of Levi's Stadium.
As of Wednesday, resale tickets were being offered on StubHub for as low as $14 to see the team host the Los Angeles Rams at 7 p.m. That price is just cheaper than buying a pair of $7.50 pretzels through the Levi's Stadium app and comparable to the price of a beer and a hot dog at the the three-year-old arena. According to the team's seat licensing map, the cheapest original face value for any seat is $85.
Media Circus: It's Early, But the NFL is Likely Concerned with TV Ratings Decline
https://www.si.com/tech-media/2017/09/20/nfl-ratings-decline-reasons-quality-quarterbacks-hurricanes
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No longer a question of "is it bad" but rather "how bad."
49ers-Rams tickets reselling for the price of two stadium pretzels
http://www.sfgate.com/sports/article/49ers-Rams-tickets-cheapest-levis-stadium-history-12215863.php
Thursday night's Rams-49ers game may be the toughest sell in the history of Levi's Stadium.
As of Wednesday, resale tickets were being offered on StubHub for as low as $14 to see the team host the Los Angeles Rams at 7 p.m. That price is just cheaper than buying a pair of $7.50 pretzels through the Levi's Stadium app and comparable to the price of a beer and a hot dog at the the three-year-old arena. According to the team's seat licensing map, the cheapest original face value for any seat is $85.
Why is this a thing? With few exceptions, bad teams struggle to fill their stadiums in every sport. Especially when paired against another bad team.
Cardinals vs Falcons, 1998:
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-5MQaK2E2NEA/VahcStcXYKI/AAAAAAAAAYk/zwcqt3DUFz4/s1600/roy-green.jpg)
Raiders vs Chiefs, 2012:
(https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--PSjyHzJO--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/18dxlns8ibyb3jpg.jpg)
Dolphins vs. Patriots, 2014
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bw8h77uIUAErNC3.jpg)
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Why is this a thing? With few exceptions, bad teams struggle to fill their stadiums in every sport. Especially when paired against another bad team.
Cardinals vs Falcons, 1998:
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-5MQaK2E2NEA/VahcStcXYKI/AAAAAAAAAYk/zwcqt3DUFz4/s1600/roy-green.jpg)
Raiders vs Chiefs, 2012:
(https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--PSjyHzJO--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/18dxlns8ibyb3jpg.jpg)
Dolphins vs. Patriots, 2014
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bw8h77uIUAErNC3.jpg)
Sure was nice for the Patriots, Chiefs and Falcons to decorate their stadiums to make their opponents feel like they were at home.
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http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2017/09/17/redzone_is_the_cause_of_and_solution_to_all_of_the_nfl_s_problems.html
Maybe the NFL needs to move beyond the "two games at noon, one game at 3:30" mode of broadcasting. There are college games on every network on Saturday. I can watch whatever one I want.
I'm surprised the NFL hasn't gone to more staggered start times. I think it would be great if they spread the games out over a weekend like this (start times Central):
Thurs
7:00 - 1 game
Fri
7:00 - 1 game
Sat
12:00 - 1 game
3:30 - 1 game
7:00 - 1 game
Sun
11:00 - 2 games
12:00 - 2 games
2:30 - 2 games
3:30 - 2 games
7:00 - 2 games
Mon
7:00 - 1 game
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I'm surprised the NFL hasn't gone to more staggered start times. I think it would be great if they spread the games out over a weekend like this (start times Central):
Thurs
7:00 - 1 game
Fri
7:00 - 1 game
Sat
12:00 - 1 game
3:30 - 1 game
7:00 - 1 game
Sun
11:00 - 2 games
12:00 - 2 games
2:30 - 2 games
3:30 - 2 games
7:00 - 2 games
Mon
7:00 - 1 game
Will never happen. Friday night is high school football. Saturday is college football. The NFL simply will not do this. If they were smart, they would get rid of Thursday night and make Monday night more compelling. Sunday night is now what Monday night used to be.
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I'm surprised the NFL hasn't gone to more staggered start times. I think it would be great if they spread the games out over a weekend like this (start times Central):
Thurs
7:00 - 1 game
Fri
7:00 - 1 game
Sat
12:00 - 1 game
3:30 - 1 game
7:00 - 1 game
Sun
11:00 - 2 games
12:00 - 2 games
2:30 - 2 games
3:30 - 2 games
7:00 - 2 games
Mon
7:00 - 1 game
Hate to inform you, but going head-to-head with college football would lower ratings, not increase them. And Friday night may even be worse.
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Will never happen. Friday night is high school football. Saturday is college football. The NFL simply will not do this. If they were smart, they would get rid of Thursday night and make Monday night more compelling. Sunday night is now what Monday night used to be.
The NFL won't, and shouldn't, get rid of Thursday night football. Even with ratings down slightly, it's by leaps and bounds the most watched program on Thursday nights. And there are millions more eyeballs watching the game than if that same contest were Sunday afternoon and shown only regionally. Think about Houston-Cincy last week. It drew more than 8 million viewers to a cable network not everybody has, and not counting one of the biggest states in the country.
You think they get nearly that many viewers as a regional Sunday game shown in Texas and southern Ohio? If your answer is no (and it obviously is), then you know why we have Thursday night football.
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NFL reportedly wants Chargers back in SD, cites bad optics of empty stadium
https://sports.yahoo.com/nfl-reportedly-considering-moving-chargers-010040080.html
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NFL reportedly wants Chargers back in SD, cites bad optics of empty stadium
https://sports.yahoo.com/nfl-reportedly-considering-moving-chargers-010040080.html
Would be interesting to see how the city reacts if they choose to come back. What's weird is why The chargers brass thinks LA is the place to be when they've had years of success just 100 miles south.
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Because they wanted a taxpayer funded stadium that gave them (the owners) all of the revenue, concessions, parking, and the area voters said no. So the owners took the team to LA.
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I don't see anyway the Chargers can return to SD with the Spanos family still owning the team. They poisoned the well down there. Would need a new ownership group to come in to restart the process for a new stadium.
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The NFL won't, and shouldn't, get rid of Thursday night football. Even with ratings down slightly, it's by leaps and bounds the most watched program on Thursday nights. And there are millions more eyeballs watching the game than if that same contest were Sunday afternoon and shown only regionally. Think about Houston-Cincy last week. It drew more than 8 million viewers to a cable network not everybody has, and not counting one of the biggest states in the country.
You think they get nearly that many viewers as a regional Sunday game shown in Texas and southern Ohio? If your answer is no (and it obviously is), then you know why we have Thursday night football.
It was a money grab based on greed. It puts player health at risk, that is not a good thing. It puts on display what has normally been subpar football historically on Thursdays, in part because on only 3 days to prepare, bodies broken down. It diminishes the product, for all to see on a Thursday night. Money grab and hurting football as a result.
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It was a money grab based on greed. It puts player health at risk, that is not a good thing. It puts on display what has normally been subpar football historically on Thursdays, in part because on only 3 days to prepare, bodies broken down. It diminishes the product, for all to see on a Thursday night. Money grab and hurting football as a result.
good input! packers just finished playing in the hottest home game in their HISTORY, it goes into overtime and they are down to playing the bouncers from the stadium view bar on their offensive line. 3 days rest and deja vu all over again. at least it's a home game, but i'm not going to say, at least it's only against the bears...but... ;D
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It was a money grab based on greed. It puts player health at risk, that is not a good thing. It puts on display what has normally been subpar football historically on Thursdays, in part because on only 3 days to prepare, bodies broken down. It diminishes the product, for all to see on a Thursday night. Money grab and hurting football as a result.
You're outraged over a business seeking to maximize its profits, even if that has negative consequences for its labor force?
Maybe you're not Chico's after all.
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‘Sunday Night Football’ Ratings Down Again On Day Of Player Protests
http://deadline.com/2017/09/redskins-sunday-night-football-ratings-nfl-protests-star-trek-discovery-donald-trump-nbc-1202176141/
AMERICANS NATIONWIDE BURN NFL TICKETS, SHIRTS IN SOLIDARITY WITH TRUMP
https://www.infowars.com/americans-nationwide-burn-nfl-tickets-shirts-in-solidarity-with-trump/
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ok, maybe it is less than 5% that are this angry at the NFL. But remember, the league wants tens of billions in broadcasting right. 5% is enough to throw their broadcasting partners into losses. See Disney's stock.
This is damaging the product.
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‘Sunday Night Football’ Ratings Down Again On Day Of Player Protests
http://deadline.com/2017/09/redskins-sunday-night-football-ratings-nfl-protests-star-trek-discovery-donald-trump-nbc-1202176141/
AMERICANS NATIONWIDE BURN NFL TICKETS, SHIRTS IN SOLIDARITY WITH TRUMP
https://www.infowars.com/americans-nationwide-burn-nfl-tickets-shirts-in-solidarity-with-trump/
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ok, maybe it is less than 5% that are this angry at the NFL. But remember, the league wants tens of billions in broadcasting right. 5% is enough to throw their broadcasting partners into losses. See Disney's stock.
This is damaging the product.
How damaging would it be if the NFL decided to limit free speech? More or less than 5%?
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‘Sunday Night Football’ Ratings Down Again On Day Of Player Protests
http://deadline.com/2017/09/redskins-sunday-night-football-ratings-nfl-protests-star-trek-discovery-donald-trump-nbc-1202176141/
AMERICANS NATIONWIDE BURN NFL TICKETS, SHIRTS IN SOLIDARITY WITH TRUMP
https://www.infowars.com/americans-nationwide-burn-nfl-tickets-shirts-in-solidarity-with-trump/
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ok, maybe it is less than 5% that are this angry at the NFL. But remember, the league wants tens of billions in broadcasting right. 5% is enough to throw their broadcasting partners into losses. See Disney's stock.
This is damaging the product.
I am gonna protest the NFL by burning tickets I already paid for, that'll show 'em. Weren't these the same mouthbreathers who boycotted Starbucks by going to Starbucks and buying drinks?
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‘Sunday Night Football’ Ratings Down Again On Day Of Player Protests
http://deadline.com/2017/09/redskins-sunday-night-football-ratings-nfl-protests-star-trek-discovery-donald-trump-nbc-1202176141/
AMERICANS NATIONWIDE BURN NFL TICKETS, SHIRTS IN SOLIDARITY WITH TRUMP
https://www.infowars.com/americans-nationwide-burn-nfl-tickets-shirts-in-solidarity-with-trump/
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ok, maybe it is less than 5% that are this angry at the NFL. But remember, the league wants tens of billions in broadcasting right. 5% is enough to throw their broadcasting partners into losses. See Disney's stock.
This is damaging the product.
Linking to Infowars ought to be a ban-able offense.
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I am gonna protest the NFL by burning tickets I already paid for, that'll show 'em. Weren't these the same mouthbreathers who boycotted Starbucks by going to Starbucks and buying drinks?
only a handful did that, mist burned jerseys, in at least five cities this morning (including Green Bay).
Before you revert to your elitist tendencies, how many pickup, beer and viagra ads are on NFL broadcasts.
Lose the mouthbreathers and the sport is in deep trouble.
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Linking to Infowars ought to be a ban-able offense.
Happy
http://insider.foxnews.com/2017/09/25/nfl-fans-react-national-anthem-protests-players-not-respecting-american-flag
http://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2017/09/25/angry-steelers-fans-burn-gear-over-national-anthem/
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-09-25/nfl-s-top-sponsors-stay-quiet-after-trump-s-call-for-boycott
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-09-25/anthem-protest
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only a handful did that, mist burned jerseys, in at least five cities this morning (including Green Bay).
Before you revert to your elitist tendencies, how many pickup, beer and viagra ads are on NFL broadcasts.
Lose the mouthbreathers and the sport is in deep trouble.
Elitist tendencies? You vomitted some clickbait BS that that has no semblance of fact or reason. I would say the same thing if Antifa or some Soros funded group did something literally that dumb, by burning things you already paid for like you are making some kind of grand statement. Stupidity does not have an ideology chief.
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Linking to Infowars ought to be a ban-able offense.
I was just about to post something similar. If that's your source of information, don't even bother. Just admit your wrong and move on.
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On the other hand, the average franchise value rose 8 percent last year. Five teams are now worth more than $3 billion and the least valuable team (Buffalo) is worth $1.6 billion, which is twice as much as in 2010.
https://www.forbes.com/nfl-valuations/list/#tab:overall
Remind me what Bear Stearns, AIG, Lehman Brothers, et al were worth on paper prior to the 2008 collapse?
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Remind me what Bear Stearns, AIG, Lehman Brothers, et al were worth on paper prior to the 2008 collapse?
Weren't BS, Lehman, and AIG all leveraged with tons of bad debt, thus when the market collapsed they didn't have the funds to their creditors?
I kinda get your point, and sports franchises are about perceived value, but last time I checked the Buffalo Bills don't have billions of outstanding debt and is a publicly traded company.
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Remind me what Bear Stearns, AIG, Lehman Brothers, et al were worth on paper prior to the 2008 collapse?
How is the NFL at all like an investment bank engaging in risky transactions?
Or is it your point that the NFL won't live on in perpetuity? OK, sure. Same with every other business (entity) on the planet, I suspect.
Strong take.
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How is the NFL at all like an investment bank engaging in risky transactions?
Or is it your point that the NFL won't live on in perpetuity? OK, sure. Same with every other business (entity) on the planet, I suspect.
Strong take.
My point is that things can look strong on paper, but that doesn't necessarily reflect the true health of the business. While not a perfect analogy, the NFL is currently engaged in a lot of risky areas that could result in a collapse of the model. I don't think current estimates like the one you highlighted are properly estimating the amount of risk in the NFL model.
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My point is that things can look strong on paper, but that doesn't necessarily reflect the true health of the business. While not a perfect analogy, the NFL is currently engaged in a lot of risky areas that could result in a collapse of the model. I don't think current estimates like the one you highlighted are properly estimating the amount of risk in the NFL model.
What are some of the risky practices NFL owners are engaging in that could lead to a sudden collapse of the league, or even a franchise?
Before you answer, keep in mind this is a business with an exceptional level of cost certainty that is directly tied to revenues thanks to its CBA, has cities and states willing to shell over hundreds of millions in taxpayer money for the sheer privilege of hosting a franchise and has guaranteed streams of massive revenues for at least the next five years 9from television)and beyond (from stadium deals, etc.).
And despite all the Chicken Littledom, it is still by far the most watched program on television, still by far the most popular sport in the country and even managed to bring in a record amount of ad revenue last year.
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I was just about to post something similar. If that's your source of information, don't even bother. Just admit your wrong and move on.
I agree it was careless of me to use infowars. That’s why I posted other sources, and a quick google search will show numerous stories of fans burning jerseys all over the country.
Curious, do you feel the same about Buzz Feed and Vox as you do about info wars?
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This doesn't fit the narrative.
This will be hard to explain for the people who complain about NFL protests and like to take credit for the drop in the league’s television ratings: With more protests and demonstrations in Week 3 than any other week in NFL history, ratings were up.
The ratings dip was always overblown. The NFL destroys every other sport in television ratings. Percentages might have been down for a couple weeks, but the NFL had set such a high bar that it was a prisoner of its own success when comparing ratings to previous years.
There was also some cherry-picking involved in bloviating about the ratings decrease. Mulvihill tweeted before Sunday’s games that of the seven windows for NFL football through two weeks, ratings had increased for four of them compared to 2016.
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/cbs-ratings-go-week-3-nfl-ratings-whole-expected-see-increase-154216596.html
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Not to mention the games were pretty darn good yesterday too.
Couple overtime games...couple with last minute drives to tie or win...one with a 61 yard FG to beat a team that scored 24 points in a quarter...one with an overturned TD call with less than 10 seconds to go.
All in all, the NFL was a great advertisement for itself yesterday.
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This doesn't fit the narrative.
This will be hard to explain for the people who complain about NFL protests and like to take credit for the drop in the league’s television ratings: With more protests and demonstrations in Week 3 than any other week in NFL history, ratings were up.
The ratings dip was always overblown. The NFL destroys every other sport in television ratings. Percentages might have been down for a couple weeks, but the NFL had set such a high bar that it was a prisoner of its own success when comparing ratings to previous years.
There was also some cherry-picking involved in bloviating about the ratings decrease. Mulvihill tweeted before Sunday’s games that of the seven windows for NFL football through two weeks, ratings had increased for four of them compared to 2016.
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/cbs-ratings-go-week-3-nfl-ratings-whole-expected-see-increase-154216596.html
You’re right it does not fit the narrative
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20814945/preliminary-tv-ratings-sunday-nfl-games-compared-last-year
http://es.pn/2jVaZxQ
But the real question is what happens going forward? 200 players, or 23% of the league, protested yesterday. What is the fan reaction in the upcoming weeks, not yesterday.
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‘Sunday Night Football’ Ratings Down Again On Day Of Player Protests
http://deadline.com/2017/09/redskins-sunday-night-football-ratings-nfl-protests-star-trek-discovery-donald-trump-nbc-1202176141/
AMERICANS NATIONWIDE BURN NFL TICKETS, SHIRTS IN SOLIDARITY WITH TRUMP
https://www.infowars.com/americans-nationwide-burn-nfl-tickets-shirts-in-solidarity-with-trump/
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ok, maybe it is less than 5% that are this angry at the NFL. But remember, the league wants tens of billions in broadcasting right. 5% is enough to throw their broadcasting partners into losses. See Disney's stock.
This is damaging the product.
Here is my question for you.
Do you think the decline is because people actually care about what happens during the National Anthem, remembering that these people are the ones who use the Anthem as the perfect time to run and take a piss before the actual game starts?
Or is it because Trump made a big deal about it and called for them to protest/boycott? And that several blogs/social media fabricated a rule book saying that the NFL was violating their own policies to favor the protestors, while denying other teams the right to support the police?
I'd argue it is the latter. So it isn't the NFL damaging its product, it is the president of the US damaging their product for political purposes.
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You’re right it does not fit the narrative
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20814945/preliminary-tv-ratings-sunday-nfl-games-compared-last-year
http://es.pn/2jVaZxQ
But the real question is what happens going forward? 200 players, or 23% of the league, protested yesterday. What is the fan reaction in the upcoming weeks, not yesterday.
Like you, Rovell is cherry picking from a few games and not looking at ratings for all games.
And what say you to Cuban's remarks?
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Here is my question for you.
Do you think the decline is because people actually care about what happens during the National Anthem, remembering that these people are the ones who use the Anthem as the perfect time to run and take a piss before the actual game starts?
Or is it because Trump made a big deal about it and called for them to protest/boycott? And that several blogs/social media fabricated a rule book saying that the NFL was violating their own policies to favor the protestors, while denying other teams the right to support the police?
I'd argue it is the latter. So it isn't the NFL damaging its product, it is the president of the US damaging their product for political purposes.
The decline is due to a few things ...
The game is boring and too long, Too many commercials, stoppage of play etc. The league is trying to address this but it has been slow.
People are viewing it like boxing, they don’t like watching people permentely impairing themselves. So the concussion thing is impacting it. It is also leading to kids not playing and losing interest ... future fans.
Arrogance of the game. First it was looking the other way when NFL players committed crimes. Now it is a general belief of disrespect for the country by kneeling.
So kneeling is not it alone, but it is part of the greater whole.
But what makes this unique is their is a number of people like you that defend it. You will not defend the game is boring, or that people should be fine watching a sport that phyicscally harms players. You will not defend special treatment for players that beat up their girlfriend (Elliott in Dallas) But you will defend kneeling on some first admendment right when it is a workplace and the employer is allowed to make the rules. Furthering this for some is the fact that many high school and college coaches are fired or reprimanded for leading players in prayers but no one can question kneeling.
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But you will defend kneeling on some first admendment right when it is a workplace and the employer is allowed to make the rules. Furthering this for some is the fact that many high school and college coaches are fired or reprimanded for leading players in prayers but no one can question kneeling.
I don't recall anyone here saying the NFL can't tell players not to kneel. I've seen arguments that it would be foolish - and apparently Roger Goodell and the owners agree - but I've not seen anyone say they can't do it.
No, "many" high school and college coaches have not been fired or reprimanded for leading players in prayer. I can think of one coach fired, and that's because he continued to do it after being told repeatedly (and correctly) by his bosses that it wasn't allowed because endorsement of a religion by a school employee. He wasn't fired for praying, he was fired for insubordination.
No one can question kneeling? Really, what world are you living in?
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What are some of the risky practices NFL owners are engaging in that could lead to a sudden collapse of the league, or even a franchise?
Before you answer, keep in mind this is a business with an exceptional level of cost certainty that is directly tied to revenues thanks to its CBA, has cities and states willing to shell over hundreds of millions in taxpayer money for the sheer privilege of hosting a franchise and has guaranteed streams of massive revenues for at least the next five years 9from television)and beyond (from stadium deals, etc.).
And despite all the Chicken Littledom, it is still by far the most watched program on television, still by far the most popular sport in the country and even managed to bring in a record amount of ad revenue last year.
-Concussions/CTE (impacts viewership and workforce supply chain)
-Let's call it social image (protests, player character issues)
-Labor unrest (CBA issues around player punishment, salary cap, etc)
-Substance issues (opioid abuse, stimulant abuse, PEDs, etc)
-Aging viewership
-Short term profit seeking at the expense of long term stability
-Assumption current revenue model will survive content provider retrenching
I'm not saying that the NFL is going away any time soon. Simply that the valuations are based on some pretty wacky assumptions and there are definitely signs of a potential bubble out there.
Edit to add: I certainly think the NFL is the riskiest bet of the 3 major professional sports in the US right now.
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-Concussions/CTE (impacts viewership and workforce supply chain)
-Let's call it social image (protests, player character issues)
-Labor unrest (CBA issues around player punishment, salary cap, etc)
-Substance issues (opioid abuse, stimulant abuse, PEDs, etc)
-Aging viewership
-Short term profit seeking at the expense of long term stability
-Assumption current revenue model will survive content provider retrenching
I'm not saying that the NFL is going away any time soon. Simply that the valuations are based on some pretty wacky assumptions and there are definitely signs of a potential bubble out there.
Edit to add: I certainly think the NFL is the riskiest bet of the 3 major professional sports in the US right now.
The valuations are backward looking based on a teams merchandise sales and TV revenues (which are national). If TV ratings and/or attendance continues to fall, it will affect future valuations.
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As a cranky old white man, the post play celebration after every friggin' play turns me off more way more than protesting the national anthem. Seems like every week some defensive lineman is dancing after a sack without realizing the ball is on the ground. Seems like every game at least one idiot takes a 15 yard penalty for a stupid celebration after scoring a touchdown. I especially dislike the moron that celebrates a big hit when his team is down 20 and the hit came after a 10 yard gain.
It just seems that modern players are more interested in self-aggrandizement than winning the game. I don't blame the players. Highlights always show that crap. It is a great way to get your name out there for endorsements, next contract, etc.
It happens in every sport. The basketball player forcing his team to play defense short-handed while moaning to the ref. The baseball player who jogs to first and doesn't start running hard until the ball is not caught or over the fence. On Saturday Travis Shaw hit the game winning home run and was basically walking to first until it got over the fence. This is with the Brewers SEASON on the line. What would have happened if that just missed and he ended up on first or second instead of second or third? I'll tell you what. Nobody would have said a thing, because it is so common now people don't even notice it anymore.
The players owe the fans and their teammates their very best effort while on the field. I get offended when I don't get that. Of course I'd rather they stand respectfully at attention during the national anthem, but if they choose to use that moment as a protest it doesn't bother me all that much.
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As a cranky old white man, the post play celebration after every friggin' play turns me off more way more than protesting the national anthem. Seems like every week some defensive lineman is dancing after a sack without realizing the ball is on the ground. Seems like every game at least one idiot takes a 15 yard penalty for a stupid celebration after scoring a touchdown. I especially dislike the moron that celebrates a big hit when his team is down 20 and the hit came after a 10 yard gain.
It just seems that modern players are more interested in self-aggrandizement than winning the game. I don't blame the players. Highlights always show that crap. It is a great way to get your name out there for endorsements, next contract, etc.
It happens in every sport. The basketball player forcing his team to play defense short-handed while moaning to the ref. The baseball player who jogs to first and doesn't start running hard until the ball is not caught or over the fence. On Saturday Travis Shaw hit the game winning home run and was basically walking to first until it got over the fence. This is with the Brewers SEASON on the line. What would have happened if that just missed and he ended up on first or second instead of second or third? I'll tell you what. Nobody would have said a thing, because it is so common now people don't even notice it anymore.
The players owe the fans and their teammates their very best effort while on the field. I get offended when I don't get that. Of course I'd rather they stand respectfully at attention during the national anthem, but if they choose to use that moment as a protest it doesn't bother me all that much.
had to love marcus cooper's "leon lett moment" yesterday. good thing the bears still won, but i'd love to hear what the coaches had to say to him
http://deadspin.com/marcus-cooper-fumbles-blocked-field-goal-return-at-the-1818705389
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Linking to Infowars ought to be a ban-able offense.
How else did you think he got edumacated?
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Linking to Infowars ought to be a ban-able offense.
i'm sure that was meant to be teal ?-( otherwise it would appear as though it ain't legit...in your mind
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You’re right it does not fit the narrative
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20814945/preliminary-tv-ratings-sunday-nfl-games-compared-last-year
http://es.pn/2jVaZxQ
But the real question is what happens going forward? 200 players, or 23% of the league, protested yesterday. What is the fan reaction in the upcoming weeks, not yesterday.
Week 3 this year will finish well above week 3 last year. Not only does the MNF game feature the Cowboys, but it is not going up against the Presidential debate like it did in 2016.
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One unfortunate outcome from this entire brouhaha: It has accelerated the spread on Facebook of this b.s. self-promoting video:
http://970wfla.iheart.com/onair/am-tampa-bay-1578/watch-his-players-disrespected-the-national-15449310/#.WHuAdscTMO4.facebook
I have had seen it posted several times in the past couple of days. :-\
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One unfortunate outcome from this entire brouhaha: It has accelerated the spread on Facebook of this b.s. self-promoting video:
http://970wfla.iheart.com/onair/am-tampa-bay-1578/watch-his-players-disrespected-the-national-15449310/#.WHuAdscTMO4.facebook
I have had seen it posted several times in the past couple of days. :-\
Squirmy.
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As a cranky old white man, the post play celebration after every friggin' play turns me off more way more than protesting the national anthem. Seems like every week some defensive lineman is dancing after a sack without realizing the ball is on the ground. Seems like every game at least one idiot takes a 15 yard penalty for a stupid celebration after scoring a touchdown. I especially dislike the moron that celebrates a big hit when his team is down 20 and the hit came after a 10 yard gain.
It just seems that modern players are more interested in self-aggrandizement than winning the game. I don't blame the players. Highlights always show that crap. It is a great way to get your name out there for endorsements, next contract, etc.
It happens in every sport. The basketball player forcing his team to play defense short-handed while moaning to the ref. The baseball player who jogs to first and doesn't start running hard until the ball is not caught or over the fence. On Saturday Travis Shaw hit the game winning home run and was basically walking to first until it got over the fence. This is with the Brewers SEASON on the line. What would have happened if that just missed and he ended up on first or second instead of second or third? I'll tell you what. Nobody would have said a thing, because it is so common now people don't even notice it anymore.
The players owe the fans and their teammates their very best effort while on the field. I get offended when I don't get that. Of course I'd rather they stand respectfully at attention during the national anthem, but if they choose to use that moment as a protest it doesn't bother me all that much.
I'm not into posting a string of photos like some here are, but if I were, I'd show celebrations from 30-40-50-60 years ago: White Shoes; Red lighting the victory cigar on the bench; Santo clicking his heels; the Butch Johnson "Earthquake"; McEnroe being McEnroe; Connors being Connors; Harold Carmichael and the Eagles "rolling dice," the Gastineau Sack Dance; the Ickey Shuffle; Reggie posing after hitting homers; Redskins' Fun Bunch; the Dirty Bird; Mark "the Bird" Fidrych; Valvano running around looking for people to hug; Jeffrey Leonard's "one flap down"; the Mutombo finger wag; Jordan trash-talking; Bird trash-talking; Ali pretty much every minute of every day; etc, etc, etc.
In other words, this ain't new.
Is there more of it now? Certainly. But it ain't new. Auerbach might have been the first "annoying celebrant." But at least he waited until he knew he won!
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One unfortunate outcome from this entire brouhaha: It has accelerated the spread on Facebook of this b.s. self-promoting video:
http://970wfla.iheart.com/onair/am-tampa-bay-1578/watch-his-players-disrespected-the-national-15449310/#.WHuAdscTMO4.facebook
I have had seen it posted several times in the past couple of days. :-\
You think it's B.S., Pakuni thinks it's "squirmy", I think it's great. Whatever floats your boat.
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You think it's B.S., Pakuni thinks it's "squirmy", I think it's great. Whatever floats your boat.
Oh, sheesh. Lighten up.
Also, Matthew 6:5.
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Also, Matthew 6:5.
Possibly my favorite piece of scripture. One of the most difficult pieces of the human condition to overcome.
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You think it's B.S., Pakuni thinks it's "squirmy", I think it's great. Whatever floats your boat.
I agree with the point t that Buzz was trying to make. But I find it pretty hard to believe that a film crew just happened to wander into the gym while this was happening.
To me, this is no different than a movie star's publicist letting the paparazzi know that their client will be at the local soup kitchen at noon. So self-serving....
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You're outraged over a business seeking to maximize its profits, even if that has negative consequences for its labor force?
Maybe you're not Chico's after all.
Radix malorum est cupiditas
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https://apnews.com/bf595941ba9640e9ab32e474459f529c/Nielsen:-Football-ratings-off-11-percent-this-year
Through three weeks, viewership for national telecasts of NFL games is down 11 percent this season compared to 2016, the Nielsen company said on Tuesday.
Nielsen said the games averaged 17.63 million viewers for the first three weeks of last season, and have dipped to 15.65 million this year. The Nielsen figures don’t include many of the Sunday afternoon games that are shown to a regional audience, but not a national one.
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I'm not into posting a string of photos like some here are, but if I were, I'd show celebrations from 30-40-50-60 years ago: White Shoes; Red lighting the victory cigar on the bench; Santo clicking his heels; the Butch Johnson "Earthquake"; McEnroe being McEnroe; Connors being Connors; Harold Carmichael and the Eagles "rolling dice," the Gastineau Sack Dance; the Ickey Shuffle; Reggie posing after hitting homers; Redskins' Fun Bunch; the Dirty Bird; Mark "the Bird" Fidrych; Valvano running around looking for people to hug; Jeffrey Leonard's "one flap down"; the Mutombo finger wag; Jordan trash-talking; Bird trash-talking; Ali pretty much every minute of every day; etc, etc, etc.
In other words, this ain't new.
Is there more of it now? Certainly. But it ain't new. Auerbach might have been the first "annoying celebrant." But at least he waited until he knew he won!
Celebrations after TDs aren't new, I agree. I remember Gastineau doing his obnoxious sack dance. That's the oldest celebration after a non-scoring play that I can remember, and I hated it then (and I am a Jets fan). Football is by far the worst with the in-game nonsense, but that is due, I think, to the nature of the game, with 30-40 seconds breaks between plays. At any rate, it annoys the hell out of me, but I doubt the NFL cares, nor should they. I've only been to a couple of NFL games, because the experience is so much better at home. A few years back an NFL HOFer (forget who) said he doesn't watch football any more because it has devolved into professional wrestling. With about 11 minutes of actual football playing during a 3 hour plus game time, and all the posturing and nonsense going on between the action, I think he had a point.
As for the older stuff, sure Reggie would gawk at a home run, but only when he knew it was 40 rows deep, and besides plenty of people used to despise Reggie for just that reason, and he risked getting himself or a teammate plunked as a result.
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I agree with the point t that Buzz was trying to make. But I find it pretty hard to believe that a film crew just happened to wander into the gym while this was happening.
To me, this is no different than a movie star's publicist letting the paparazzi know that their client will be at the local soup kitchen at noon. So self-serving....
Of course it is staged.
Just like the military reunions we have seen on broadcasts or members of the military shown on the sidelines. The government pays big money to embed these things in the broadcasts. The whole anthem thing (as it exists today) is a scam. It is not part of football. It was created in 2009 by the DoD paying the NFL to market the military to help recruitment. It was after these payments that the league set their policy on conduct for the anthem.
Finally, now that the creep has taken ownership of this issue, I no longer feel any desire to stand for the anthem - something that I have always done as a matter of respect and to honor our country.
On a slightly different note - I wish people would learn the difference between patriotism and nationalism. I am certainly patriotic - but am about as far removed from being nationalistic as is possible.
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Restaurant owners turning off the NFL
https://www.yahoo.com/news/restaurants-boycotting-nfl-refusing-show-171359662.html
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Interesting discussion .. The NFL has upward and downward pressure that is changing viewer habits.
I think the downward pressure items win out. The NFL isn't disappearing anytime soon, but I'd guess it'll continue losing a percent or two each year.
I am fascinated by what may happen over the next 2-3 weeks. Will some form of "fan unity" win out? If players/teams ask the fans to link arms "for unity" will they do that? Will liberals do it, with conservatives refusing? I imagine it'll be some of all of that, with a new barrel of monkeys spilled out, now folks knowing who is an American Packer Fan, who is "not."
In this day, it wouldn't shock me if black football players (not to mention NBA, NCAA sports) realize their audience is mostly white and plurality Trump supporters, now visually indicated by "not linking arms" or whatever unity pledge is going on. How do they react? The Missouri football team refused to play until their race-related demands were met .. who knows what happens on this new platform.
And .. how long will it all last? I watched a video of a dude burning his Packer gear in a 55 gallon drum, mad as hell. In January when GB is yet again sniffing the Superbowl, I want to see a followup on these jersey burning guys.
Interesting .. and awful .. times.
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Interesting discussion .. The NFL has upward and downward pressure that is changing viewer habits.
I think the downward pressure items win out. The NFL isn't disappearing anytime soon, but I'd guess it'll continue losing a percent or two each year.
I am fascinated by what may happen over the next 2-3 weeks. Will some form of "fan unity" win out? If players/teams ask the fans to link arms "for unity" will they do that? Will liberals do it, with conservatives refusing? I imagine it'll be some of all of that, with a new barrel of monkeys spilled out, now folks knowing who is an American Packer Fan, who is "not."
In this day, it wouldn't shock me if black football players (not to mention NBA, NCAA sports) realize their audience is mostly white and plurality Trump supporters, now visually indicated by "not linking arms" or whatever unity pledge is going on. How do they react? The Missouri football team refused to play until their race-related demands were met .. who knows what happens on this new platform.
And .. how long will it all last? I watched a video of a dude burning his Packer gear in a 55 gallon drum, mad as hell. In January when GB is yet again sniffing the Superbowl, I want to see a followup on these jersey burning guys.
Interesting .. and awful .. times.
You're correct that the viewership will only get hurt a few percent by the kneeling flap (if the protests and polls are correct). But that is enough to throw the NFL into chaos. The NFL is a high cost, high broadcast rights league. A few years of modest declines in viewers and attendance still keeps it as the top draw but causes enough losses at the broadcasters and to the league that the players will be asked to give back on the CBA which heightens the chance of another strike.
Point is the NFL has a real problem. The "easy" fix is for the players to stop kneeling. But that is perceived to be "caving" to Trump. Conversely, the other option is those upset by the kneeling to stop protesting. But they too are dug in. And again 3% to 5% staying away is enough to be a problem for the league.
I have no idea how this ends. And it until it does, the NFL loses and loses.
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You're correct that the viewership will only get hurt a few percent by the kneeling flap (if the protests and polls are correct). But that is enough to throw the NFL into chaos. The NFL is a high cost, high broadcast rights league. A few years of modest declines in viewers and attendance still keeps it as the top draw but causes enough losses at the broadcasters and to the league that the players will be asked to give back on the CBA which heightens the chance of another strike.
Point is the NFL has a real problem. The "easy" fix is for the players to stop kneeling. But that is perceived to be "caving" to Trump. Conversely, the other option is those upset by the kneeling to stop protesting. But they too are dug in. And again 3% to 5% staying away is enough to be a problem for the league.
I have no idea how this ends. And it until it does, the NFL loses and loses.
I suspect that if the NFL ever feels this issue will really hurt the owners in their pocketbooks they will just keep the teams off the field during the anthem - that's the easy fix.
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I think CTE and the quality of the game poses many more problems long term than the protests.
I feel like I'm watching less football than ever before. Mainly because the game is a little more boring and I'm too busy to focus on my fantasy team as much as I did when I was younger.
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I suspect that if the NFL ever feels this issue will really hurt the owners in their pocketbooks they will just keep the teams off the field during the anthem - that's the easy fix.
Keeping them off the field is way worse, Right now it is perceived as player driven. That would escalate it to a league approved protest.
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Check Into Cash founder pulls ads from NFL games, denounces league as 'unpatriotic'
http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/breakingnews/story/2017/sep/26/check-cash-founder-pulls-ads-nfl-games-denounces-league-unpatriotic/451276/
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Check Into Cash founder pulls ads from NFL games, denounces league as 'unpatriotic'
http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/breakingnews/story/2017/sep/26/check-cash-founder-pulls-ads-nfl-games-denounces-league-unpatriotic/451276/
Sleazebag who runs a company that preys on low income communities charging 50-100% interest loans, who has been sued multiple times is all of sudden taking his stand.
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Check Into Cash founder pulls ads from NFL games, denounces league as 'unpatriotic'
http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/breakingnews/story/2017/sep/26/check-cash-founder-pulls-ads-nfl-games-denounces-league-unpatriotic/451276/
Modern day loan shark takes a stand.
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Sleazebag who runs a company that preys on low income communities charging 50-100% interest loans, who has been sued multiple times is all of sudden taking his stand.
And yet the NFL accepted his advertising
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And yet the NFL accepted his advertising
That's not how it works.
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And yet the NFL accepted his advertising
Actually they didn't. It was local radio advertising.
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That's not how it works.
Umm, yes ... they always have a veto over all advertising at every level. Yes, they rarely exercise it, but they do.
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JPMorgan Suggests Bet Against CBS Amid NFL Anthem Controversy
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-09-27/jpmorgan-suggests-bet-against-cbs-amid-nfl-anthem-controversy
Strategist recommends buying options ahead of weekend games
Sales of player jerseys seen as proxy for fan sentiment
JPMorgan Chase & Co.’s Shawn Quigg is encouraging investors to bet against CBS Corp. stock ahead of this weekend’s NFL broadcasts. The bank recommends buying an option that gives you the right to sell the shares at $57.50 on the likelihood that the stock will fall below that price after the company discloses ratings for the games. CBS closed at $58 on Tuesday.
Quigg noted that the jersey of Alejandro Villanueva -- the only Pittsburgh Steeler to stand on the field during the national anthem during last weekend’s game -- was the best-selling jersey in the hours following the player boycott.
“If one uses player jersey sales as a proxy, fans appear to favor an on-field standing presence during the Anthem,” he said in the note.
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Umm, yes ... they always have a veto over all advertising at every level. Yes, they rarely exercise it, but they do.
That's not what you said.
Not that you would ever shift goalposts or anything.
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That's not what you said.
Not that you would ever shift goalposts or anything.
Why do you constantly want to pick anal meaningless fights? What purpose does it serve?
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Why do you constantly want to pick anal meaningless fights? What purpose does it serve?
Dude, you are the one who doubles down every time someone disagrees with you. 99% of your threads would die a natural death if you would just stop posting.
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Why do you constantly want to pick anal meaningless fights? What purpose does it serve?
You know, coming from most people that's an entirely fair question. It's not my best quality.
Coming from you? Holy lack of self awareness.
Anyhow, I guess it's because I'm not a fan of you consistently twisting facts and distorting reality to further your agenda ... which as far as can tell seems to be convincing yourself you're smarter than the average bear.
Why do you constantly change the subject when you someone points out you're wrong? I mean, it's not such a big deal to admit that the NFL does not accept local radio ads, is it?
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You know, coming from most people that's an entirely fair question. It's not my best quality.
Coming from you? Holy lack of self awareness.
Anyhow, I guess it's because I'm not a fan of you consistently twisting facts and distorting reality to further your agenda ... which as far as can tell seems to be convincing yourself you're smarter than the average bear.
Why do you constantly change the subject when you someone points out you're wrong? I mean, it's not such a big deal to admit that the NFL does not accept local radio ads, is it?
But they do, they have standards for all advertising. Like I said they rarely enforce it.
Every nationally syndicated program has the same standard.
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Has Heisy ventured into Ners territory with his posts?
Constant, repetitive predictive drivel over and over and over, ad nauseum.
Whatever the Russian twitter feeds are pushing, he is buying. (He was smart enough not to buy Apple, though.)
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I think CTE and the quality of the game poses many more problems long term than the protests.
I agree. The anthem thing is what investors would call "short-term noise." The CTE thing is going to linger and linger and linger, and most likely get worse and worse.
The hit in that Packers-Bears game last night that almost knocked Adams' head off is the kind of hit the president railed should be legal. (Few even bothered thinking about that part of his speech because of the concentration on the short-term noise.) To him, the "entertainment" of the violent hits outweighs the lives of the competitors.
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New Poll: NFL More Unfavorable Than Ever, Nosedives by 13 Percent in One Week
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2017/09/29/new-morning-consult-poll-nfl-more-unfavorable-than-ever-n2388490
According to a new POLITICO/Morning Consult poll, the National Football League is seen as more unfavorable than ever before.
http://view.e.morningconsult.com/?qs=1f9ab69dd9af853ee23a51b12ea43befa99e44bdab249383c21471464ec15db999623f17f116e900add0623c51d2a000c78e1041440c6f03d9c816b351a02146
"The NFL's net favorability has dropped from 30% on September 21 to 17% on September 28," the poll shows.
On September 21, 25% of Trump supporters said they had a very favorable view of the NFL and 11% had a very unfavorable view.
As of Sept 28, those numbers have dramatically changed with 33% of Trump supporters say they have a very unfavorable view of the NFL and 16% report having a very favorable view.
NFL's Brand Favorability Drops To Lowest Point Since Morning Consult Started Tracking: The NFL's net favorability has dropped from 30% on September 21 to 17% on September 28.
(http://image.e.morningconsult.com/lib/fe9413727161047c7d/m/1/TrumpNetFav.png)
NFL Takes Huge Hit Among Trump Supporters:
On September 21, 25% of Trump supporters said they had a very favorable view of the NFL and 11% had a very unfavorable view.
As of Sept 28, those numbers have dramatically changed with 33% of Trump supporters say they have a very unfavorable view of the NFL and 16% report having a very favorable view. You can see the trend lines here:
(http://image.e.morningconsult.com/lib/fe9413727161047c7d/m/1/TrumpVeryFavVeryUnfav.png)
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I agree. The anthem thing is what investors would call "short-term noise." The CTE thing is going to linger and linger and linger, and most likely get worse and worse.
The hit in that Packers-Bears game last night that almost knocked Adams' head off is the kind of hit the president railed should be legal. (Few even bothered thinking about that part of his speech because of the concentration on the short-term noise.) To him, the "entertainment" of the violent hits outweighs the lives of the competitors.
... because it goes against your political viewpoint. And since every rationalization you put forth has fallen apart, you're down to calling it "short-term noise." See the post above regarding your short-term noise.
Then, to make yourself feel better, you take a shot a Trump on some twisted made-up premise. What is the point of that other than, again, to make yourself feel better and superior?
Thank god you're still long Apple as little else in your sad life seems to be working.
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Bears/Packers game down 13% from a year ago. And the 2016 comparable was down 27% from the 2015 debut of Thursday Night Football on CBS.
http://deadline.com/2017/09/packers-win-thursday-night-football-ratings-down-bears-national-anthem-cbs-nfl-1202179245/
However, it still was not a good result for CBS and the NFL as the matchup went late and delivered 9.9/18 in metered market ratings. That’s down 13% from the 2016 TNF opener on CBS and NFL Network when the New York Jets beat the Buffalo Bills 37-31. In the first of five TNFs that CBS has this year, last night’s game was shown on NFL Network and made its live debut on Amazon Prime.
On a night of no competition from the other nets and with the matchup being shown live on Twitter, last year’s September 15, CBS kickoff game ended up with 15.4 million viewers and a 5.4/21 rating among adults 18-49. The start of the third season of TNF on the House of Moonves, those 2016 numbers were a 27% and 29% fall, respectively, from the 2015 TNF debut on CBS and NFL Network.
As for Thursday’s overnight numbers, the latest decline comes as the league, broadcasters and cable networks are biting already chewed nails over last year’s ratings and what could be coming down the line.
While ratings this year overall are actually up a tiny bit over last year right now, the 2016-2017 NFL season saw a nearly 10% decline from the year before. That’s a big hit for the big-money league, and the sting is being felt again with the likes of heavyweight Sunday Night Football hurting this year. Then, there is the increased political spotlight in the usually conservative NFL after President Donald Trump called for a boycott of the league and berated players for following now ex-San Francisco 49er Colin Kaepernick publicly protesting police brutality and racial injustice by not standing for the national anthem. Last night’s linking of arms by both teams was an attempt to deflect some of that attention.
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Heisy, you gotta chill out.
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Heisy, you gotta chill out.
Not till we all believe he is the oracle.
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I'm still not seeing why it is so danged important that the NFL has peaked. It probably has. So? Everything ebbs and flows. And CTE is going to have a longer term, deeper impact than protests. I accept and celebrate the notion that football's popularity may be on the wane.
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I'm still not seeing why it is so danged important that the NFL has peaked. It probably has. So? Everything ebbs and flows. And CTE is going to have a longer term, deeper impact than protests. I accept and celebrate the notion that football's popularity may be on the wane.
Yep. The decline in popularity has been going on for several years and has roots in, among other things, the prevalence of cord-cutting, lack of competitiveness, changes to game-play, diversionary current events which operate like its own form of "entertainment," and of course the awareness of permanent injury.
To attribute the NFL's flagging ratings to a single set of protests is reductive and impulsive.
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... because it goes against your political viewpoint. And since every rationalization you put forth has fallen apart, you're down to calling it "short-term noise." See the post above regarding your short-term noise.
Then, to make yourself feel better, you take a shot a Trump on some twisted made-up premise. What is the point of that other than, again, to make yourself feel better and superior?
Thank god you're still long Apple as little else in your sad life seems to be working.
So a poll taken four days after all the hullaballoo "proves" that it's not short-term noise? How do you handle investing, Smuggles? The CEO hiccupped! Sell, sell, sell!!!!
You're a piece of work, as usual. You need medication - stat!
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Yep. The decline in popularity has been going on for several years and has roots in, among other things, the prevalence of cord-cutting, lack of competitiveness, changes to game-play, diversionary current events which operate like its own form of "entertainment," and of course the awareness of permanent injury.
To attribute the NFL's flagging ratings to a single set of protests is reductive and impulsive.
MLB Ratings are up this year. Are they not impacted by cord cutting, diversionary current events and other forms of entertainment?
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Michael Bennett is killing the NFL ;D
Speaking of Michael Bennett, the other side of the story came out today with video.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20863146/las-vegas-police-release-video-incident-involving-seattle-seahawks-defensive-end-michael-bennett
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Speaking of Michael Bennett, the other side of the story came out today with video.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20863146/las-vegas-police-release-video-incident-involving-seattle-seahawks-defensive-end-michael-bennett
Yep. Two sides looked at the same footage and both came away thinking that their side was correct. Without seeing the video myself, I can't draw a conclusion either way.
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MLB Ratings are up this year. Are they not impacted by cord cutting, diversionary current events and other forms of entertainment?
Ratings down in 18 of 29 US markets
http://m.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2017/07/17/Media/MLB-ratings.aspx?
Last week's Sunday night baseball drew the smallest audience since 2013.
http://awfulannouncing.com/mlb/dodgers-nationals-terrible-ratings-espn-fox-last-weekend.html
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NHL is slowly becoming my favorite pro sport
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Speaking of Michael Bennett, the other side of the story came out today with video.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20863146/las-vegas-police-release-video-incident-involving-seattle-seahawks-defensive-end-michael-bennett
This seems irrelevant since Bennett didn't accuse the cops of excessive force. He alleged they singled him out and pointed a gun to his head for no reason other than his race.
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Ticket sales this week off 31% in one service, 18% in the other.
NFL starting to get the message?
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/nfl-national-anthem-protest-denting-ticket-sales/
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This seems irrelevant since Bennett didn't accuse the cops of excessive force. He alleged they singled him out and pointed a gun to his head for no reason other than his race.
Excuse me?
"The Officers' excessive use of force was unbearable," Bennett wrote. "I felt helpless as I lay there on the ground handcuffed facing the real-life threat of being killed. All I could think of was 'I'm going to die for no other reason than I am black and my skin color is somehow a threat.'"
I believe it was also you that was concerned about a lack of bodycam video, fortunately Vegas has cameras everywhere including those of the other police officers, who were also minorities incidentally.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20604486/michael-bennett-seattle-seahawks-accuses-las-vegas-police-excessive-force-considering-civil-lawsuit
Irrelevant? Completely relevant.
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ok, except for the officer on top of bennett not having his body cam on, there was still plenty of other video available to review. the vegas police will have to do their own investigation as to why the initial arresting officer did not have his body cam on. that aside, they had over 860 other videos to look at-oops!
no excessive force nor racial profiling was exhibited-they shook hands and disbursed
michael bennett does owe an apology as his initial statements could have or still could cause other officers across the nation to unnecessarily be in harms way by some thug who acts out on bennett's words. bennett was very disingenuous at best-not cool given the environment we are in
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20863146/las-vegas-police-release-video-incident-involving-seattle-seahawks-defensive-end-michael-bennett
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https://deadspin.com/new-michael-bennett-video-shows-exactly-whatever-you-wa-1819024503
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https://deadspin.com/new-michael-bennett-video-shows-exactly-whatever-you-wa-1819024503
So let me get this straight. The video is poor quality and does not have good accounts of why he was arrested or what happened right before being arrested, yet Chico's is adamant that this totally vindicates the police and that Bennett is a liar.
Seems consistent with Chico's ongoing agenda.
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So let me get this straight. The video is poor quality and does not have good accounts of why he was arrested or what happened right before being arrested, yet Chico's is adamant that this totally vindicates the police and that Bennett is a liar.
Seems consistent with Chico's ongoing agenda.
I've seen this on other message boards. Those who are predisposed to one side or the other find what they want to find in this video. It does mean that there is no reason to press charges because there isn't enough evidence, but it certainly doesn't mean Bennett needs to apologize.
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Ratings down in 18 of 29 US markets
http://m.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2017/07/17/Media/MLB-ratings.aspx?
Last week's Sunday night baseball drew the smallest audience since 2013.
http://awfulannouncing.com/mlb/dodgers-nationals-terrible-ratings-espn-fox-last-weekend.html
Look we get it, you think this is a terrible country, just like Kaepernick, and want the players to continue kneeling and telling everyone we suck. So you want to so badly believe that the country agrees with your unstable ideas so you keep trying in vain to convince us that the country does not care about the kneeling and nothing is really happening.
These posts are more a reflection on you, and your frightening beliefs, then any real information.
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Adam Silver is warning NBA players to stand at for the National Anthem. more proof that of the 320 million people in this country, only one person thinks this is NOT hurting the NFL ... Pakuni.
http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/wireStory/nba-suggests-teams-unity-ideas-reminds-anthem-rule-50192923
Tatum said the league supports and encourages players to express their views on matters that are important to them, while reminding of the rule that players, coaches, and trainers stand respectfully for the anthem.
"The league office will determine how to deal with any possible instance in which a player, coach or trainer does not stand for the anthem. (Teams do not have the discretion to waive this rule)," the memo says.
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Adam Silver is warning NBA players to stand at for the National Anthem. more proof that of the 320 million people in this country, only one person thinks this is NOT hurting the NFL ... Pakuni.
You probably should try being less of a hairy wet cat.
Pakuni wasn't saying that the NFL hasn't been hurt by the protests, he was disputing Chicos' #fakenews claim that MLB ratings are up.
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So a poll taken four days after all the hullaballoo "proves" that it's not short-term noise? How do you handle investing, Smuggles? The CEO hiccupped! Sell, sell, sell!!!!
You're a piece of work, as usual. You need medication - stat!
Every poll taken since Kaepernick started this last year has suggested this is hurting the image of the league.
THat's why the Packers pussied out from their protest last week and all stood Thursday and Rodgers even gave tickets to cops for the game. Five days earlier had Rodgers given tickets to cops he would have been chastised as a white racist and Mark Murphy would have considered punishing him for disrespecting the black players. But now they understand what a major F-U this has been they are desperately trying to undo it.
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Every poll taken since Kaepernick started this last year has suggested this is hurting the image of the league.
Five days earlier had Rodgers given tickets to cops he would have been chastised as a white racist and Mark Murphy would have considered punishing him for disrespecting the black players.
You have said a lot of ridiculous things in this thread, but this moves near the top of the list.
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No sport wraps itself in the flag more than NASCAR does. It is a lily-white sport owned by lily-white rich folks, filled with lily-white "athletes," watched by lily-white fans.
Despite all this patriotism, NASCAR ratings have been going down for years. This past season, they tanked. They would kill for the NFL's "ratings problem."
http://awfulannouncing.com/ratings/foxfs1-ends-2017-nascar-season-yet-another-ratings-low.html
Fox Sports has ended another NASCAR season and it continued its theme for 2017 finishing with another ratings low. The Monster Energy NASCAR Cup race at Sonoma on FS1 Sunday finished with a 2.0 final rating and 3.2 million viewers. That’s down 17% in ratings and viewership from last year (2.4/3.9 million).
That’s the lowest rating for the race dating back to 1998 and lowest viewership since 2002. Sports Media Watch points out that when the race aired on TNT in 2012, Sonoma had a 3.3 rating and 5.2 million viewers. For the season, Fox/FS1’s 15 Cup races either set or tied a multi-year ratings low. Twelve races set or tied multi-year viewership lows.
Whitey loves him some all-American patriotic sports! Plus, they've got Danica Patrick showing side boob in all kinds of advertisements.
How is that decline possible?
I won't even bother putting together a montage of photos showing NASCAR fans disrespecting the flag in all sorts of ways - wearing it as clothing, making doggie bandanas out of it, using it for tablecloths and - the down-home favorite - flying it on the same pole as the Confederate flag.
But those are some real patriots! Yee-haw!
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ok, except for the officer on top of bennett not having his body cam on, there was still plenty of other video available to review. the vegas police will have to do their own investigation as to why the initial arresting officer did not have his body cam on. that aside, they had over 860 other videos to look at-oops!
no excessive force nor racial profiling was exhibited-they shook hands and disbursed
michael bennett does owe an apology as his initial statements could have or still could cause other officers across the nation to unnecessarily be in harms way by some thug who acts out on bennett's words. bennett was very disingenuous at best-not cool given the environment we are in
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20863146/las-vegas-police-release-video-incident-involving-seattle-seahawks-defensive-end-michael-bennett
Says one side. The other side said the exact same video proved there was profiling and excessive force. And shaking hands means nothing. If someone just held a gun to my head and told me he would "blow my fing head" off as Bennett alleged, I would shake the man's hand if he offered it out of fear of what would happen if I refused.
No one here has any idea what happened that night. Claiming one side is definitely in the right or wrong is dishonest at this point.
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https://deadspin.com/new-michael-bennett-video-shows-exactly-whatever-you-wa-1819024503
this isn't news-it's opinion and it fits your agenda-nice try though
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this isn't news-it's opinion and it fits your agenda-nice try though
I never claimed it was anything. I simply pasted a link.
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Says one side. The other side said the exact same video proved there was profiling and excessive force. And shaking hands means nothing. If someone just held a gun to my head and told me he would "blow my fing head" off as Bennett alleged, I would shake the man's hand if he offered it out of fear of what would happen if I refused.
No one here has any idea what happened that night. Claiming one side is definitely in the right or wrong is dishonest at this point.
We are in complete agreement on your last sentence. As you will see in my responses, I did not say one side was right or wrong. However, I did point to the other side of the story which was not presented here and most definitely not presented in our media. It was supposition, cops dirty, race bating, etc. How many here or in the press automatically took Mr. Bennett's words as true, claiming that version or side was correct? Or espousing that police purposely didn't turn on body cameras?
Maybe what Mr. Bennett said was true, but as is almost always the case there are other sides to the story, usually many sides. The quick rush to judgment here and in the media often forgets this. We should do better, but you are correct that no one here has any idea what happened that night, but I'm glad to have provided some additional view points since so many already made up their minds.
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We are in complete agreement on your last sentence. As you will see in my responses, I did not say one side was right or wrong. However, I did point to the other side of the story which was not presented here and most definitely not presented in our media. It was supposition, cops dirty, race bating, etc. How many here or in the press automatically took Mr. Bennett's words as true, claiming that version or side was correct? Or espousing that police purposely didn't turn on body cameras?
Maybe what Mr. Bennett said was true, but as is almost always the case there are other sides to the story, usually many sides. The quick rush to judgment here and in the media often forgets this. We should do better, but you are correct that no one here has any idea what happened that night, but I'm glad to have provided some additional view points since so many already made up their minds.
Who here quickly rushed to judgement believing Bennett's version of events?
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"The quick rush to judgment here and in the media often forgets this"
that's putting it nicely 4/5. ohhhh, they don't forget. it's called censorship. censorship is not only disallowing certain viewpoints, but NOT reporting it as well.
this is where the media is really putting everyone, police included, in harms way. by telling everyone it was michael bennett being "mistreated" and it was racial and...just fuels the fire for antifa et.al
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We are in complete agreement on your last sentence. As you will see in my responses, I did not say one side was right or wrong. However, I did point to the other side of the story which was not presented here and most definitely not presented in our media. It was supposition, cops dirty, race bating, etc. How many here or in the press automatically took Mr. Bennett's words as true, claiming that version or side was correct? Or espousing that police purposely didn't turn on body cameras?
Maybe what Mr. Bennett said was true, but as is almost always the case there are other sides to the story, usually many sides. The quick rush to judgment here and in the media often forgets this. We should do better, but you are correct that no one here has any idea what happened that night, but I'm glad to have provided some additional view points since so many already made up their minds.
Personally, I've heard just as much "the cops are definitely right and Bennett is definitely lying" as the opposite. But I live in rural Texas so that might be a factor.
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Last night I attended a fund raiser in Canton, and had to drive by the Hall of Fame on the way there. I was surprised to see what looked like literally hundreds of flags around the HOF grounds. When talking about it at the dinner, I estimated that it was at least 500 flags. Turns out I was a few hundred short (http://www.cantonrep.com/news/20170929/pro-football-hall-of-fame-launches-huddleupamerica-campaign). It was quite striking, really.
I'm sure this means something. I'll leave it to others to hash that out. I just thought it was interesting in light of the issues being debated in a couple of these threads.
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Ratings down in 18 of 29 US markets
http://m.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2017/07/17/Media/MLB-ratings.aspx?
Last week's Sunday night baseball drew the smallest audience since 2013.
http://awfulannouncing.com/mlb/dodgers-nationals-terrible-ratings-espn-fox-last-weekend.html
Don't rebut Cheekz with facts. He will find a single wobbly anecdote that will "prove" you wrong. But that's standard for him and several others here. We can do better, all MU fans.
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Personally, I've heard just as much "the cops are definitely right and Bennett is definitely lying" as the opposite. But I live in rural Texas so that might be a factor.
In the media you have? The entity that drives the conversation in this country? A simple google search going back to the first week of Bennett's incident will show that isn't the case in that medium.
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Ratings down in 18 of 29 US markets
http://m.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2017/07/17/Media/MLB-ratings.aspx?
Last week's Sunday night baseball drew the smallest audience since 2013.
http://awfulannouncing.com/mlb/dodgers-nationals-terrible-ratings-espn-fox-last-weekend.html
You pulled last week's Sunday night game to extrapolate for the entire season?
You also pulled an article from July 17th, it's October today. I'm talking about the national ratings of national games. Your other article is about local games which are subject to how teams are doing in each market. The Royals, for example. That is not what I was talking about, but since I didn't make that clear I can understand how you got here. I am specifically talking about national baseball games on national broadcasts, which going into September were higher than last year. Final numbers are not out yet.
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Interesting take on the effects on AT&T's bottom line:
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4110863-worry-nfl-thing?ifp=0&app=1
As in many articles on this investing site, comment stream is at least as interesting than article, despite containing some comments from both extremes.
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In the media you have? The entity that drives the conversation in this country? A simple google search going back to the first week of Bennett's incident will show that isn't the case in that medium.
Yes, in the media I have. I've heard more criticism in the media around me, than I have support for what Bennett said.
I actually never heard about it in the media until their was the response from the police essentially calling Bennett a liar.
A simple google search shows article after article published in major media around Sept. 7th providing the police perspective and refuting Bennett. That was when I first heard about this story. I haven't heard much about it since until the video just came out.
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No sport wraps itself in the flag more than NASCAR does. It is a lily-white sport owned by lily-white rich folks, filled with lily-white "athletes," watched by lily-white fans.
Despite all this patriotism, NASCAR ratings have been going down for years. This past season, they tanked. They would kill for the NFL's "ratings problem."
http://awfulannouncing.com/ratings/foxfs1-ends-2017-nascar-season-yet-another-ratings-low.html
Fox Sports has ended another NASCAR season and it continued its theme for 2017 finishing with another ratings low. The Monster Energy NASCAR Cup race at Sonoma on FS1 Sunday finished with a 2.0 final rating and 3.2 million viewers. That’s down 17% in ratings and viewership from last year (2.4/3.9 million).
That’s the lowest rating for the race dating back to 1998 and lowest viewership since 2002. Sports Media Watch points out that when the race aired on TNT in 2012, Sonoma had a 3.3 rating and 5.2 million viewers. For the season, Fox/FS1’s 15 Cup races either set or tied a multi-year ratings low. Twelve races set or tied multi-year viewership lows.
Whitey loves him some all-American patriotic sports! Plus, they've got Danica Patrick showing side boob in all kinds of advertisements.
How is that decline possible?
I won't even bother putting together a montage of photos showing NASCAR fans disrespecting the flag in all sorts of ways - wearing it as clothing, making doggie bandanas out of it, using it for tablecloths and - the down-home favorite - flying it on the same pole as the Confederate flag.
But those are some real patriots! Yee-haw!
You’re such an idiot, amazing you can survive in society.
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Baltimore players kneel in prayer before (not during) the anthem and then stand for the anthem ... and get booed.
But remember, it's all about respect for the flag.
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You pulled last week's Sunday night game to extrapolate for the entire season?
I pulled the latest ratings available. If you have something more recent, please post.
You also pulled an article from July 17th, it's October today. I'm talking about the national ratings of national games. Your other article is about local games which are subject to how teams are doing in each market. The Royals, for example. That is not what I was talking about, but since I didn't make that clear I can understand how you got here. I am specifically talking about national baseball games on national broadcasts, which going into September were higher than last year. Final numbers are not out yet.
So you criticize me for not offering something more recent than the midseason ratings ... and then admit there's nothing more recent? Hmmm.
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Baltimore players kneel in prayer before (not during) the anthem and then stand for the anthem ... and get booed.
But remember, it's all about respect for the flag.
And NONE of this is about race...
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Interesting take on the effects on AT&T's bottom line:
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4110863-worry-nfl-thing?ifp=0&app=1
As in many articles on this investing site, comment stream is at least as interesting than article, despite containing some comments from both extremes.
Same website, different conclusion from day earlier. https://seekingalpha.com/article/4110495-t-nfl-sunday-ticket-disaster
Likely they won't know until Q4. If their math is right, all it would take is a few thousand cancellations to become a 7 digit revenue hit. We'll never know as those companies don't release that kind of information.
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I pulled the latest ratings available. If you have something more recent, please post.
So you criticize me for not offering something more recent than the midseason ratings ... and then admit there's nothing more recent? Hmmm.
You pulled one game. Nielsen has ratings every day if you have a subscription. You are referencing Sports Business which is a news source that hasn't gone to the trouble of aggregating the ratings.
The other flaw you have made several times on the NFL side is citing overnight HH ratings as if those are the same as metered market ratings which come in days later. For example, last week the media was abuzz that ratings were up year over year due to the overnights. By Wednesday night, when all the data came in, the actual Nielsen data showed a 3.7% drop year over year. Of course, much of the media didn't bother to run that story with the actual data.
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Yes, in the media I have. I've heard more criticism in the media around me, than I have support for what Bennett said.
I actually never heard about it in the media until their was the response from the police essentially calling Bennett a liar.
A simple google search shows article after article published in major media around Sept. 7th providing the police perspective and refuting Bennett. That was when I first heard about this story. I haven't heard much about it since until the video just came out.
OK.
Here is my reference point. Let's start with his accusations that he was roughed up, excessive force and it was done because of his race. That's where this started, Sept 6th with his claims. That's what was reported in early articles and people jumping on that theme.
Then, the police responded with their information, which is what you are referencing about. That's phase two, I'm talking about the initial reactions after one side of the story was given.
Then we had the back and forth of who is right, but as several have said, no one will know. That didn't stop Slate from saying the police are smearing him.
http://www.slate.com/articles/sports/sports_nut/2017/09/the_las_vegas_police_are_smearing_michael_bennett.html
Or this article in sporting news saying it was racial profiling http://www.sportingnews.com/nfl/news/michael-bennett-seahawks-police-cops-lawsuit-support-las-vegas-video/u7p8770ndhu219mvdslotp78n
Or ESPN's Smith from doing the same. And dozens of others. Countless rush to judgment that racial profiling was the cause when the facts hadn't come in. My opinion.
Bennett says he will sue the Vegas Sheriff, which if he does will likely illicit additional information and more conjecture.
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OK.
Here is my reference point. Let's start with his accusations that he was roughed up, excessive force and it was done because of his race. That's where this started, Sept 6th with his claims. That's what was reported in early articles and people jumping on that theme.
Then, the police responded with their information, which is what you are referencing about. That's phase two, I'm talking about the initial reactions after one side of the story was given.
Then we had the back and forth of who is right, but as several have said, no one will know. That didn't stop Slate from saying the police are smearing him.
http://www.slate.com/articles/sports/sports_nut/2017/09/the_las_vegas_police_are_smearing_michael_bennett.html
Or this article in sporting news saying it was racial profiling http://www.sportingnews.com/nfl/news/michael-bennett-seahawks-police-cops-lawsuit-support-las-vegas-video/u7p8770ndhu219mvdslotp78n
Or ESPN's Smith from doing the same. And dozens of others. Countless rush to judgment that racial profiling was the cause when the facts hadn't come in. My opinion.
Bennett says he will sue the Vegas Sheriff, which if he does will likely illicit additional information and more conjecture.
You seem to be focused more on media response to incidents.
Isn't the bigger issue racism, sexism, etc at large? With regards to NFL protests, you're focused again on media and portrayal. Shouldn't the far bigger discussion be on racism, etc and how to remove that from society?
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Baltimore players kneel in prayer before (not during) the anthem and then stand for the anthem ... and get booed.
But remember, it's all about respect for the flag.
And NONE of this is about race...
Ravens get booed for kneeling before anthem, stand during it
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/10/01/ravens-get-booed-for-kneeling-before-anthem-stand-during-it/
Jamison Hensley of ESPN.com reports that there was also a stadium announcement asking “for everyone to pray as a nation to embrace kindness, justice, unity and equality.”
The Steelers, who drew a lot of attention for their approach to the anthem last week, stood on the sideline while the song was playing this time around.
Here is the problem, the players no longer know why they are doing this anymore. Last week was about "sticking it to Trump." Before that, it was about praying for more dead cops, because that is what Kaepernick wanted (see below).
Now they redefining kneeling this week and we are all supposed to forget what it meant 7 days ago and go with this week's definition?. What will be the reason for kneeling next week? How about tonight's game, or Monday's game, what new definition of kneeling will those be about?
In the end, the "first mover" Kaepernick defined what this is all about. And no matter what BS left-wing words about "justice" and "equality" that trot out this week, below is what inspired all of this and every time a players knee hits the ground, this is what they are supporting. And this is why the booing and damage to the NFL will continue unto this all stops.
Colin Kaepernick’s Foundation Donates To Group Named After Convicted Cop-Killer Assata Shakur
Former 49ers QB gave $25,000 to radical group, Assata’s Daughters.
http://www.dailywire.com/news/21753/colin-kaepernicks-foundation-donates-group-named-ryan-saavedra
@Kaepernick7
A system that perpetually condones the killing of people, without consequence, doesn't need to be revised, it needs to be dismantled!
Didn't all you guys agree with MU painting over the Assata murial last year and firing the prof that was advising the group that did it?
Why not apply the same standard to NFL players? Or are they "allowed" to kneel in support of more dead cops?
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NFL ticket sales plummet 17.9%
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/nfl-ticket-sales-plummet-179/article/2635955
The National Football League is feeling the impact of the "Trump Effect."
Ticket sales since he called on team owners to fire players who take a knee to protest the National Anthem have cratered.
The online ticket reseller TickPick told Secrets that sales have dropped 17.9 percent, far more than the usual Week Three fall.
From TickPick:
17.9 percent decrease in NFL orders this week compared to the previous week.
Last year the drop was 10.8 percent in orders on Monday & Tuesday following Week Three games.
"We have seen a massive decrease in NFL ticket purchases this past week in comparison to years past. Week 3 seems to usually have less ticket orders than week 2, but this year ticket purchases are down more than 7 percent from this time last year," said TickPick's Jack Slingland.
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Ravens get booed for kneeling before anthem, stand during it
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/10/01/ravens-get-booed-for-kneeling-before-anthem-stand-during-it/
Jamison Hensley of ESPN.com reports that there was also a stadium announcement asking “for everyone to pray as a nation to embrace kindness, justice, unity and equality.”
The Steelers, who drew a lot of attention for their approach to the anthem last week, stood on the sideline while the song was playing this time around.
Here is the problem, the players no longer know why they are doing this anymore. Last week was about "sticking it to Trump." Before that, it was about praying for more dead cops, because that is what Kaepernick wanted (see below).
Now they redefining kneeling this week and we are all supposed to forget what it meant 7 days ago and go with this week's definition?. What will be the reason for kneeling next week? How about tonight's game, or Monday's game, what new definition of kneeling will those be about?
In the end, the "first mover" Kaepernick defined what this is all about. And no matter what BS left-wing words about "justice" and "equality" that trot out this week, below is what inspired all of this and every time a players knee hits the ground, this is what they are supporting. And this is why the booing and damage to the NFL will continue unto this all stops.
Colin Kaepernick’s Foundation Donates To Group Named After Convicted Cop-Killer Assata Shakur
Former 49ers QB gave $25,000 to radical group, Assata’s Daughters.
http://www.dailywire.com/news/21753/colin-kaepernicks-foundation-donates-group-named-ryan-saavedra
@Kaepernick7
A system that perpetually condones the killing of people, without consequence, doesn't need to be revised, it needs to be dismantled!
Didn't all you guys agree with MU painting over the Assata murial last year and firing the prof that was advising the group that did it?
Why not apply the same standard to NFL players? Or are they "allowed" to kneel in support of more dead cops?
Remember what I said about you twisting facts and distorting reality?
Case in point. Nobody in this discussion ever prayed for dead cops.
Have you no shame?
Try integrity once in a while, my man.
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Remember what I said about you twisting facts and distorting reality?
Case in point. Nobody in this discussion ever prayed for dead cops.
Have you no shame?
Try integrity once in a while, my man.
Go see some of Kaepernick's statements from last year. Kap started all this and he defined the meaning of kneeling.
You only see what you want ... just enough to maintain your moral superiority perch.
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Go see some of Kaepernick's statements from last year. Kap started all this and he defined the meaning of kneeling.
You only see what you want ... just enough to maintain your moral superiority perch.
Show us where Kap prayed for dead cops.
Thanks
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Colin Kaepernick’s Foundation Donates To Group Named After Convicted Cop-Killer Assata Shakur
Former 49ers QB gave $25,000 to radical group, Assata’s Daughters.
http://www.dailywire.com/news/21753/colin-kaepernicks-foundation-donates-group-named-ryan-saavedra
@Kaepernick7
A system that perpetually condones the killing of people, without consequence, doesn't need to be revised, it needs to be dismantled!
Didn't all you guys agree with MU painting over the Assata murial last year and firing the prof that was advising the group that did it?
Why not apply the same standard to NFL players? Or are they "allowed" to kneel in support of more dead cops?
I'm not going to defend Assata, as she was clearly not an upstanding member of the community, but you should look into the history of her court case. There are reasonable reasons people look at her as an example of bias in the legal system.
There was an entire FBI division, who intentionally listed her as the chief suspect in any case that involved a black woman on the East coast regardless of any actual evidence. The goal according to actual police officers was to brandish the young, intelligent black woman as a most-wanted criminal mastermind.
In the case where she was convicted, the entire jury was white. 1/3rd of the jury had close relationships to state troopers. The medical evidence said that she was shot with her arms up in a surrendering position. And that the wounds would have rendered her incapable of firing a weapon. Her fingerprints were not found on any weapon and her hands had no gunshot residue.
Her attorney's office was bugged and robbed with key court materials stolen. And much much more.
There are two things that are absolutely certain. She was a bad person. She did not get a fair trial and suffered immense mistreatment in the legal system.
Now, the organization that he donated to uses peaceful demonstrations to protest police violence. They also encourage and maintain community gardens to promote independence. It is not a radical group.
You either clearly have an agenda, or are incredibly uninformed about history and current events. Or...both.
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You seem to be focused more on media response to incidents.
Isn't the bigger issue racism, sexism, etc at large? With regards to NFL protests, you're focused again on media and portrayal. Shouldn't the far bigger discussion be on racism, etc and how to remove that from society?
Two fold answer. The media drives the discussion, they aren't playing it even handed which they should be. We can't ignore that or take the focus off that part.
Yes, it is important to understand what is going on, but Kap said originally this had to do with police actions against black men leading to deaths. Why, then, are they not focusing on where they can do so much greater good for the minority community? The deaths of minorities at the hands of other minorities would save countless lives. Thousands of lives a year lost.
Where should the focus be? Attacking police? Protesting an Anthem and flag? Feels like the focus is lacking and where the most good can happen is within the community in my opinion.
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Two fold answer. The media drives the discussion, they aren't playing it even handed which they should be. We can't ignore that or take the focus off that part.
Yes, it is important to understand what is going on, but Kap said originally this had to do with police actions against black men leading to deaths. Why, then, are they not focusing on where they can do so much greater good for the minority community? The deaths of minorities at the hands of other minorities would save countless lives. Thousands of lives a year lost.
Where should the focus be? Attacking police? Protesting an Anthem and flag? Feels like the focus is lacking and where the most good can happen is within the community in my opinion.
Ah, the ole "you are not supporting the right topic in the right way" line.
Why are you so condescending? He is protesting against something that is important to him. And you think you know better?
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No sport wraps itself in the flag more than NASCAR does. It is a lily-white sport owned by lily-white rich folks, filled with lily-white "athletes," watched by lily-white fans.
Despite all this patriotism, NASCAR ratings have been going down for years. This past season, they tanked. They would kill for the NFL's "ratings problem."
http://awfulannouncing.com/ratings/foxfs1-ends-2017-nascar-season-yet-another-ratings-low.html
Fox Sports has ended another NASCAR season and it continued its theme for 2017 finishing with another ratings low. The Monster Energy NASCAR Cup race at Sonoma on FS1 Sunday finished with a 2.0 final rating and 3.2 million viewers. That’s down 17% in ratings and viewership from last year (2.4/3.9 million).
That’s the lowest rating for the race dating back to 1998 and lowest viewership since 2002. Sports Media Watch points out that when the race aired on TNT in 2012, Sonoma had a 3.3 rating and 5.2 million viewers. For the season, Fox/FS1’s 15 Cup races either set or tied a multi-year ratings low. Twelve races set or tied multi-year viewership lows.
Whitey loves him some all-American patriotic sports! Plus, they've got Danica Patrick showing side boob in all kinds of advertisements.
How is that decline possible?
I won't even bother putting together a montage of photos showing NASCAR fans disrespecting the flag in all sorts of ways - wearing it as clothing, making doggie bandanas out of it, using it for tablecloths and - the down-home favorite - flying it on the same pole as the Confederate flag.
But those are some real patriots! Yee-haw!
http://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/04/nascar-denny-hamlin-race-attendance-richmond-international-speedway
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Two fold answer. The media drives the discussion, they aren't playing it even handed which they should be. We can't ignore that or take the focus off that part.
Yes, it is important to understand what is going on, but Kap said originally this had to do with police actions against black men leading to deaths. Why, then, are they not focusing on where they can do so much greater good for the minority community? The deaths of minorities at the hands of other minorities would save countless lives. Thousands of lives a year lost.
Where should the focus be? Attacking police? Protesting an Anthem and flag? Feels like the focus is lacking and where the most good can happen is within the community in my opinion.
Thank you for the response.
I view the protests (as they've been coopted) as more about equality, justice, fighting against racism, etc. In that regard, it goes beyond just minority communities, police, etc.
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http://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/04/nascar-denny-hamlin-race-attendance-richmond-international-speedway
Wow. Mind blown.
NASCAR driver drops a knowledge bomb that when it's hot, people might not sit in 90* heat to watch guys turn left for 3 hours.
(https://m.popkey.co/ea7a98/k8DQE_f-maxage-0_s-200x150.gif)
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I'm done arguing with two white boys who are convinced they are part of the persecuted class. It's a dark hole (pun intended), and I won't be dragged down it.
They can't have a civil discussion. Smuggles, out of ideas, resorts to name-calling as usual. The other guy was banned a year ago but has been allowed back to do what he does.
Anybody intelligent interested in discussing one of the most serious issues of our time (and I'm not talking about whether NFL popularity has peaked or not), I'm all ears. But I'm ignoring Smuggles and Banny McBannerson.
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I'm done arguing with two white boys who are convinced they are part of the persecuted class. It's a dark hole (pun intended), and I won't be dragged down it.
They can't have a civil discussion. Smuggles, out of ideas, resorts to name-calling as usual. The other guy was banned a year ago but has been allowed back to do what he does.
Anybody intelligent interested in discussing one of the most serious issues of our time (and I'm not talking about whether NFL popularity has peaked or not), I'm all ears. But I'm ignoring Smuggles and Banny McBannerson.
Just another failed journalist who can't accept a conservative black man.
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Just another failed journalist who can't accept a conservative black man.
Huh?
I wasn't talking about you, and in fact agreed with you earlier in this stream.
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(https://pics.me.me/an-im-notracist-or-anything-guide-exactly-when-where-how-28003509.png)
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Show us where Kap prayed for dead cops.
Thanks
He’s praised black lives matter, a terrorist organization that has had several people kill cops in their name, and had its members chant in rallies for the death of more cops.
His tweet a few post above calls for nothing short of the end of the United States. But you’ll let your ideology twist it into something nice, loving and what school children should be taught.
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I'm done arguing with two white boys who are convinced they are part of the persecuted class. It's a dark hole (pun intended), and I won't be dragged down it.
They can't have a civil discussion. Smuggles, out of ideas, resorts to name-calling as usual. The other guy was banned a year ago but has been allowed back to do what he does.
Anybody intelligent interested in discussing one of the most serious issues of our time (and I'm not talking about whether NFL popularity has peaked or not), I'm all ears. But I'm ignoring Smuggles and Banny McBannerson.
Again with the moral superiority. We’re all a bunch of mouth breathing hee-haws not deserving of your intellect.
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Wisconsin and Pennsylvania voted for Trump. And the biggest collection of Trump voters in those states is game this Sunday at Lambeau and Heinz Field. This is why these protests are so unpopular and have the owners so worried.
Long ESPN story detailing the owner’s worst nightmare. They’ve lost control of the players and they don’t know how to get it back. And they fear it’s going to destroy the league before it’s all over.
NFL owners struggled to retain control after Trump's attacks, rise of player protests
http://www.espn.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/20865444/inside-story-happened-players-took-control-nfl-national-anthem
Nobody was kidding when many of the NFL's highest-profile owners, including Robert Kraft of the New England Patriots and Jerry Jones of the Dallas Cowboys, expressed concerns last week that the optics of hundreds of players kneeling, sitting or remaining in the locker room during the playing of the national anthem had alienated many fans at a particularly perilous moment for the NFL. TV ratings for many of this year's games have continued a slide that began last season; some league sponsors have grown skittish about the backlash; and most surveys have shown that a majority of NFL fans are turned off by the politicization of the game.
To the commissioner's suggestion that the protests should end, Smith said, "My only response was, 'I don't have the power to tell our players what to do.' ... At the end of the day, this is a group of players who are exercising their freedom. There is no room for me to snap my fingers and tell our players, 'It's time for you to give up a freedom.' Just the idea offends me. It's almost as if the players are being asked, 'What's it going to take for you to stop asking to be free or to be treated like an American?'"
Then the topic turned to the subject of angry fan bases and nervous sponsors. The Green Bay Packers and Pittsburgh Steelers, in particular, each had received significant blowback from their fan bases and sponsors. Fans had booed the Patriots and Cardinals for kneeling, and disgusted fans posted on Facebook and YouTube videos of them burning NFL merchandise.
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He’s praised black lives matter, a terrorist organization that has had several people kill cops in their name, and had its members chant in rallies for the death of more cops.
His tweet a few post above calls for nothing short of the end of the United States. But you’ll let your ideology twist it into something nice, loving and what school children should be taught.
Dear God, Black Lives Matters is not a terrorist organization. They are a peaceful non-violent organization that has denounced anyone who has called for the killing of cops. Calling them a terrorist organization because a few crazy people have justified violence using their name would be like me calling all of Islam a terrorsist organization or all of Christianity a terrorist organization.
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Dear God, Black Lives Matters is not a terrorist organization. They are a peaceful non-violent organization that has denounced anyone who has called for the killing of cops. Calling them a terrorist organization because a few crazy people have justified violence using their name would be like me calling all of Islam a terrorsist organization or all of Christianity a terrorist organization.
Dear God, are you naive. They fit every definition of a terrorist organization, banking on guilty whites incapable of calling them what they despite the devastation done in their name.
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/449654/black-lives-matter-womens-march-embrace-terrorists-media-should-call-them-it
Let’s begin with a thought experiment. Imagine if one of America’s largest and most-respected pro-life organizations tweeted birthday greetings to Robert Dear, the terrorist who attacked a Planned Parenthood clinic in 2015. Imagine the reaction if an allegedly mainstream conservative organization said “happy birthday” to Dylann Roof, the white-supremacist murderer who slaughtered nine innocent people in Charleston. How would the media respond? What would the tweets reveal about the character and intentions of the people running the organization? Should well-meaning Americans continue to support groups that applaud violent, vicious terrorists?
How would the media respond? What would the tweets reveal about the character and intentions of the people running the organization? Should well-meaning Americans continue to support groups that applaud violent, vicious terrorists? The answers are obvious. Of course the media would and should absolutely roast any conservative group that applauded “pro-life” or white-supremacist violence. Of course well-meaning Americans should shun and withdraw support for groups that celebrate terrorists. And of course support for terrorists would reveal a moral corruption at the heart of even the most popular organizations. Unless, however, those groups are on the left, their leaders are progressive radicals, and the terrorists they applaud are cop-killers. Then, the media ignores the outrage, elevates the outrageous, and maintains the charade that key elements of the progressive #Resistance represent nothing more than a spontaneous, reasonable, and virtuous response to a dangerous and authoritarian president.
Doubt me? Consider the reverence reserved for the Women’s March and Black Lives Matter.
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/437694/black-lives-matter-hypocrisy-cheering-violence
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He’s praised black lives matter, a terrorist organization that has had several people kill cops in their name, and had its members chant in rallies for the death of more cops.
His tweet a few post above calls for nothing short of the end of the United States. But you’ll let your ideology twist it into something nice, loving and what school children should be taught.
(https://media.tenor.com/images/db7692ffaaef8aace8a8fa6e35347b1c/tenor.gif)
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Dear God, are you naive. They fit every definition of a terrorist organization, banking on guilty whites incapable of calling them what they despite the devastation done in their name.
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/449654/black-lives-matter-womens-march-embrace-terrorists-media-should-call-them-it
Let’s begin with a thought experiment. Imagine if one of America’s largest and most-respected pro-life organizations tweeted birthday greetings to Robert Dear, the terrorist who attacked a Planned Parenthood clinic in 2015. Imagine the reaction if an allegedly mainstream conservative organization said “happy birthday” to Dylann Roof, the white-supremacist murderer who slaughtered nine innocent people in Charleston. How would the media respond? What would the tweets reveal about the character and intentions of the people running the organization? Should well-meaning Americans continue to support groups that applaud violent, vicious terrorists?
How would the media respond? What would the tweets reveal about the character and intentions of the people running the organization? Should well-meaning Americans continue to support groups that applaud violent, vicious terrorists? The answers are obvious. Of course the media would and should absolutely roast any conservative group that applauded “pro-life” or white-supremacist violence. Of course well-meaning Americans should shun and withdraw support for groups that celebrate terrorists. And of course support for terrorists would reveal a moral corruption at the heart of even the most popular organizations. Unless, however, those groups are on the left, their leaders are progressive radicals, and the terrorists they applaud are cop-killers. Then, the media ignores the outrage, elevates the outrageous, and maintains the charade that key elements of the progressive #Resistance represent nothing more than a spontaneous, reasonable, and virtuous response to a dangerous and authoritarian president.
Doubt me? Consider the reverence reserved for the Women’s March and Black Lives Matter.
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/437694/black-lives-matter-hypocrisy-cheering-violence
This does not back up your argument.
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This does not back up your argument.
Your ideology blinds you this much? Further gone than I thought.
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(https://media.tenor.com/images/db7692ffaaef8aace8a8fa6e35347b1c/tenor.gif)
This. All of this. Thanks for the laugh.
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Your ideology blinds you this much? Further gone than I thought.
We say the same of you.
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Your ideology blinds you this much? Further gone than I thought.
Alright. I'm done with this and I'm done with you. Lashing out is all you have left.
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Heisey, Forgetful already explained the context for why Assata Shakur is held up by some as a civil rights leader. That does not make Black Lives Matter a terrorist organization. By that logic I could say the President is a terrorist for saying that the white supremacists at Charlotteville were very fine people.