I DO NOT THINK THAT DIAMOND STONE WILL END UP COMING TO MU
However, there is still a slim chance. I have always found his recruiting process very odd and I think there are many reasons why he hasn't chosen a school just yet..........He doesn't like his options. 90 out of the ESPN top 100 players in 2015 have already committed. Whats the hold up?
His final four are OKLA ST, Maryland, UCONN, WISC. In my opinion, none of those schools seem like a good fit for him at all.
I used to love UConn as a program but who would ever want to play in that terrible conference. Very limited exposure, and how can you judge a guy as an NBA prospect while he's playing against Houston, Tulsa, Tulane, USF, UCF, and East Carolina? And UConn sucks this year(13-9) and don't project to be very good next year either. Also far from home.
Wisconsin is where many people think he is most likely to end up but there is a big problem. I heard from a reliable source tonight that as it stands now WISCONSIN WILL NOT TAKE HIM BASED UPON HIS ACADEMICS. Also, who can possibly see him playing in that system? I do not know where MU stands in terms of Stone's academic status.
To me MU seems like a no brainer. He has established a good relationship with Henry as teammates on the USA team, and they will spend a lot of time together as McDonalds All Americans. He also has a great relationship with former teammate Duane Wilson. Why not stay home, in Milwaukee and play in a great conference on a great team.
Like I said before, I do not think Stone will end up at MU. There is some reason why we didn't make his final four list. But I think that we are not officially out of the running, and if he does miraculously end up here I think the future is extremely bright. Go get em Wojo.
MU isn't involved, and won't be getting involved.
Whats your prediction as to where he ends up? Have any insight on academic issues particularly regarding UW?
I'm thinking Wisconsin. If they're still recruiting him, they must be confident he'll get in there.
If not WI, UCONN.
Quote from: Celtic Truth on February 10, 2015, 11:55:48 PM
Whats your prediction as to where he ends up? Have any insight on academic issues particularly regarding UW?
If it helps at all my brother plays against Diamond stone in conference play and has a few friends from Dominican. On all accounts he's apparently pretty stupid.
If Wisconsin won't offer Diamond due to academics, my guess is that MU won't either.
Marquette hasn't been recruiting him for a long time.
First, no need to trash the kid.
Quote from: MUfan12 on February 10, 2015, 11:53:53 PM
MU isn't involved, and won't be getting involved.
Second, this.
Quote from: theburreffect2 on February 11, 2015, 12:31:26 AM
If it helps at all my brother plays against Diamond stone in conference play and has a few friends from Dominican. On all accounts he's apparently pretty stupid.
[/quote
...and your brother and all his friends will be laughing all the way to the ivy league schools will they ?-(
Quote from: MUfan12 on February 10, 2015, 11:53:53 PM
MU isn't involved, and won't be getting involved.
This is 100% correct, the ship has sailed and will not be turning around....bank on it.
IMO he goes to UW if he can get through admissions. Otherwise UConn.
He isn't coming to Marquette.
Don't waste broadband width on this chit, aina? Stone needs to ACT the part.
I'm so glad you stopped signing your posts "the truth has spoken"
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 11, 2015, 01:45:13 AM
If Wisconsin won't offer Diamond due to academics, my guess is that MU won't either.
Agree 100%. Even thought Marquette looks at the entire person, instead of just grades, we have become pretty selective on the fliers we are willing to take. My guess is one of the conferences "with looser" academic standards will end up with him.
No chance at Diamond.
Jeez, people...let it go. He ain't coming. Focus on Henry...the stud who will actually be coming to MU.
Quote from: Celtic Truth on February 10, 2015, 11:50:19 PM
Wisconsin is where many people think he is most likely to end up but there is a big problem. I heard from a reliable source tonight that as it stands now WISCONSIN WILL NOT TAKE HIM BASED UPON HIS ACADEMICS. Also, who can possibly see him playing in that system? I do not know where MU stands in terms of Stone's academic status.
I was at the game last night too and I talked to a few people close to the program. They told me something similar. Namely, Stone has opened up his recruiting and will consider any school, including MU.
Another person that is close to the program told me it is going the other way. Stone is reaching out to Wojo but he was unsure if Wojo was reaching back. So yes MU has not been recruiting Stone, but if the talk is true, he now seems ready to talk to MU again.
My bottom line here I agree Stone does not end up and MU but things are moving on his recruiting and he does not end up at Bucky either.
Does anyone think Stone ends up at VT?
If academics is an issue then no way Wojo is recruiting. Not going yo happen at MU. But who knows the details really - if he is marginal, bad standing, etc. He is quite a talent but student is the first part of student-athlete.
Another possibility that hasn't been discussed is the Emmanuel Mudiay-route. Could Diamond possibly go to China for a season, earn some money, and then enter the NBA Draft?
Quote from: GoldenWarrior11 on February 11, 2015, 09:35:31 AM
Another possibility that hasn't been discussed is the Emmanuel Mudiay-route. Could Diamond possibly go to China for a season, earn some money, and then enter the NBA Draft?
I have heard that there have been inquiries along that line of thinking. I think NCAA qualification may be an issue right now.
Quote from: Daniel on February 11, 2015, 09:32:13 AM
He is quite a talent but student is the first part of student-athlete.
For a likely one and done? Really?
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 11, 2015, 01:45:13 AM
If Wisconsin won't offer Diamond due to academics, my guess is that MU won't either.
Neither will UCONN, neither will UK, neither will any NCAA school.
Quote from: theburreffect2 on February 11, 2015, 12:31:26 AM
If it helps at all my brother plays against Diamond stone in conference play and has a few friends from Dominican. On all accounts he's apparently pretty stupid.
So are you, apparently.
So what you're saying is someone might get a Diamond in the rough?
Have long thought UCONN will eventually be the spot. Still do but confidence level is small... don't know where he winds up. Just know he's an excellent player.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on February 11, 2015, 08:22:55 AM
Don't waste broadband width on this chit, aina? Stone needs to ACT the part.
I see what you did there, and it mirrors the lowdown that I have heard. However, purely specualtion. Damn, fine player though.
Serious question ....
I assume he will graduate from Dominican in good standing. So he will be a high school graduate with the necessary GPA. So to qualify he needs a minimum ACT (or SAT) score. Is this correct? What is the minimum score needed?
The ACT has these testing dates:
February 7, 2015
April 18, 2015
June 13, 2015
The SAT has these testing dates:
March 14, 2015
May 2, 2015
June 6, 2015
Could his recruitment stretch into late June as he waits for the results of his June tests? And if he achieves the minimum score at this late date, does that set off a recruiting frenzy for Diamond around the fourth of July?
Quote from: Heisenberg on February 11, 2015, 01:31:36 PM
Serious question ....
I assume he will graduate from Dominican in good standing. So he will be a high school graduate with the necessary GPA. So to qualify he needs a minimum ACT (or SAT) score. Is this correct? What is the minimum score needed?
The ACT has these testing dates:
February 7, 2015
April 18, 2015
June 13, 2015
The SAT has these testing dates:
March 14, 2015
May 2, 2015
June 6, 2015
Could his recruitment stretch into late June as he waits for the results of his June tests? And if he achieves the minimum score at this late date, does that set off a recruiting frenzy for Diamond around the fourth of July?
It depends.
(https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSCn36HKYFaFZQmu1omqjqGjiKbfYcolDeErE-_SJ4hrGifmJC9Oc4t-EMY)
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ6EgN2H0oUlxEaEEKqTavyny0yZ4uf9kGDu7OXSSgbC5A2xb2qmQ)
Marquette!!! You may have already won the Diamond Stone Sweepstakes but first you have to enter. Be sure to return your entry form. YOU MAY HAVE ALREADY WON!!!
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTep6JsC4iox0vByNi7p_MsB_gfFRgEB2Xz0dRMXKUr0rQmZSaA)
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 11, 2015, 01:45:13 AM
If Wisconsin won't offer Diamond due to academics, my guess is that MU won't either.
UW standards go out the window for top athletes. Ron Dayne got in without being able to read.
Quote from: ecompt on February 11, 2015, 02:28:37 PM
UW standards go out the window for top athletes. Ron Dayne got in without being able to read.
UW makes exceptions. But they don't make exceptions for everyone. FWIW, I have heard the same thing about Stone and UW from Marquette people.
Quote from: Heisenberg on February 11, 2015, 01:31:36 PM
Serious question ....
I assume he will graduate from Dominican in good standing. So he will be a high school graduate with the necessary GPA. So to qualify he needs a minimum ACT (or SAT) score. Is this correct? What is the minimum score needed?
Minimum SAT score of 820
Minimum sum ACT score of 68
I highly doubt Wisconsin would still be recruiting Diamond if his academics were in shambles? Not exactly easy to sneak kids past the new Chancellor
Quote from: WarriorPride68 on February 11, 2015, 02:49:51 PM
I highly doubt Wisconsin would still be recruiting Diamond if his academics were in shambles? Not exactly easy to sneak kids past the new Chancellor
They are.
Quote from: WarriorPride68 on February 11, 2015, 03:26:33 PM
Grades suck or easy to sneak kids into UW?
If he had the grades, he would have committed to UW months ago.
He's putting in extra work to try and make himself eligible for UW, not a knock on the guy. Good for him.
Quote from: PandTandMand... on February 11, 2015, 03:35:23 PM
If he had the grades, he would have committed to UW months ago.
He's putting in extra work to try and make himself eligible for UW, not a knock on the guy. Good for him.
+1. Genuinely appreciate the clarification.
Quote from: WarriorPride68 on February 11, 2015, 03:26:33 PM
Grades suck or easy to sneak kids into UW?
Can't sneak in anymore. It's a sliding scale. He should have transferred to a school that gives all A's so he could get a 12 on his ACT and qualify. See Junior Coudagan.
Core GPA SAT ACT
3.550&above 400 37
3.525 410 38
3.500 420 39
3.475 430 40
3.450 440 41
3.425 450 41
3.400 460 42
3.375 470 42
3.350 480 43
3.325 490 44
3.300 500 44
3.275 510 45
3.250 520 46
3.225 530 46
3.200 540 47
3.175 550 47
3.150 560 48
3.125 570 49
3.100 580 49
3.075 590 50
3.050 600 50
3.025 610 51
3.000 620 52
2.975 630 52
2.950 640 53
2.925 650 53
2.900 660 54
2.875 670 55
2.850 680 56
2.825 690 56
2.800 700 57
2.775 710 58
2.750 720 59
2.725 730 59
2.700 730 60
2.675 740-750 61
2.650 760 62
2.625 770 63
2.600 780 64
2.575 790 65
2.550 800 66
2.525 810 67
2.500 820 68
2.475 830 69
2.450 840-850 70
2.425 860 70
2.400 860 71
2.375 870 72
2.350 880 73
2.325 890 74
2.300 900 75
2.275 910 76
2.250 920 77
2.225 930 78
2.200 940 79
2.175 950 80
2.150 960 80
2.125 960 81
2.100 970 82
2.075 980 83
2.050 990 84
2.025 1000 85
2.000 1010 86
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 11, 2015, 01:45:13 AM
If Wisconsin won't offer Diamond due to academics, my guess is that MU won't either.
I understand Sandy Cohen really made the most out of a bad situation, but there were serious academic questions about him and you'll notice Wisconsin didn't offer but Marquette did. If anyone thinks Wisconsin has even average admissions standards relative to other big time athletic programs you should probably read a couple of articles:
http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/writer/dennis-dodd/24982746/wisconsins-admission-standards-pushed-gary-andersen-to-oregon-state
http://wisconsin.247sports.com/Article/Should-Wisconsin-reduce-academic-requirements-for-athletes-34871032
I have also heard Stone is having trouble getting to the point that he'll be accepted by UW, but to assume that that also means other schools won't take him is incorrect. Now, perhaps someone knows his exact GPA and current ACT score, but you can't infer his overall NCAA eligibility from UW's stance.
What about a year in a Prep School to pull up his grades? Oversea pro-play?
Quote from: alexius23 on February 11, 2015, 05:26:29 PM
What about a year in a Prep School to pull up his grades? Oversea pro-play?
Then he is a year further away from the NBA.
Remember he is projected to be a 2016 lottery pick. So he just looking for a landing spot for next season to mark his time before he gets paid.
Quote from: breadtree on February 11, 2015, 04:56:00 PM
I understand Sandy Cohen really made the most out of a bad situation, but there were serious academic questions about him and you'll notice Wisconsin didn't offer but Marquette did. If anyone thinks Wisconsin has even average admissions standards relative to other big time athletic programs you should probably read a couple of articles:
http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/writer/dennis-dodd/24982746/wisconsins-admission-standards-pushed-gary-andersen-to-oregon-state
http://wisconsin.247sports.com/Article/Should-Wisconsin-reduce-academic-requirements-for-athletes-34871032
I have also heard Stone is having trouble getting to the point that he'll be accepted by UW, but to assume that that also means other schools won't take him is incorrect. Now, perhaps someone knows his exact GPA and current ACT score, but you can't infer his overall NCAA eligibility from UW's stance.
Grain of salt.
Ron Dayne made it.
BJ Raji made at BC, which is known to be as 'tough as Notre Dame'.
Every school can make an exception, UW is no different. Speculation here, but I imagine Ryan doesn't want to stick his neck out for a kid that has no interest in being in any school longer than a year. I honestly don't think Bo would stick his neck out for too many kids, maybe a Henry or Butch.
Barry stuck his next out for players when necessary.
Apparently the ACT has changed its scoring since I took it. Does anyone have any idea what those numbers relate to on the old test with the high score of 36?
Quote from: Skitch on February 11, 2015, 06:00:49 PM
Apparently the ACT has changed its scoring since I took it. Does anyone have any idea what those numbers relate to on the old test with the high score of 36?
I also am only familiar with the act where 36 is highest. I believe it was 18 on that scale to play D1 sports
ACT = divide by 4 to get composite score.
Quote from: alexius23 on February 11, 2015, 05:26:29 PM
What about a year in a Prep School to pull up his grades?
May not work. In 2016 the sliding scale significantly changes, as do numerous rules surrounding initial eligibility... and not in a good way for students who struggle prior to college.
Quote from: breadtree on February 11, 2015, 04:56:00 PM
I understand Sandy Cohen really made the most out of a bad situation, but there were serious academic questions about him and you'll notice Wisconsin didn't offer but Marquette did. If anyone thinks Wisconsin has even average admissions standards relative to other big time athletic programs you should probably read a couple of articles:
http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/writer/dennis-dodd/24982746/wisconsins-admission-standards-pushed-gary-andersen-to-oregon-state
http://wisconsin.247sports.com/Article/Should-Wisconsin-reduce-academic-requirements-for-athletes-34871032
I have also heard Stone is having trouble getting to the point that he'll be accepted by UW, but to assume that that also means other schools won't take him is incorrect. Now, perhaps someone knows his exact GPA and current ACT score, but you can't infer his overall NCAA eligibility from UW's stance.
Christ, I am so tired of debating UW's academic standards. Congratulations, UW is above average. Now stop pretending they're on the same level as Stanford, Duke, Notre Dame, Northwestern, or other truly elite institutions.
Quote from: Groin_pull on February 11, 2015, 07:10:23 PM
Christ, I am so tired of debating UW's academic standards. Congratulations, UW is above average. Now stop pretending they're on the same level as Stanford, Duke, Notre Dame, Northwestern, or other truly elite institutions.
+1
UW is a very good state school. Stop there
Quote from: Groin_pull on February 11, 2015, 07:10:23 PM
Christ, I am so tired of debating UW's academic standards. Congratulations, UW is above average. Now stop pretending they're on the same level as Stanford, Duke, Notre Dame, Northwestern, or other truly elite institutions.
+1. UW is #47 in US News' rankings and MU is #76; a pretty narrow gap in the grand scheme of things. If I have to listen to one more Madison schmuck talk about how academic standards at UW are materially higher at UW, I may ring their neck.
Larger student body/alumni = more buttheads to crow about UW standards
Quote from: Ellenson Guerrero on February 11, 2015, 09:03:53 PM
+1. UW is #47 in US News' rankings and MU is #76; a pretty narrow gap in the grand scheme of things. If I have to listen to one more Madison schmuck talk about how academic standards at UW are materially higher at UW, I may ring their neck.
At the undergrad level, there is very little difference. As a research school with huge $$$ backing, yeah post grad goes to the state school. In the meantime, Gov. Walker is suggesting that some of these high paid folks on that side might actually try teaching. ;)
Quote from: Skitch on February 11, 2015, 06:00:49 PM
Apparently the ACT has changed its scoring since I took it. Does anyone have any idea what those numbers relate to on the old test with the high score of 36?
Pretty sure it's the combined score of the 4 test areas. Meaning, if you have a 3.55 GPA you can get a 9 on the ACT. You have a 2.0 you need t
Quote from: Ellenson Guerrero on February 11, 2015, 09:03:53 PM
+1. UW is #47 in US News' rankings and MU is #76; a pretty narrow gap in the grand scheme of things. If I have to listen to one more Madison schmuck talk about how academic standards at UW are materially higher at UW, I may ring their neck.
All I did was cite two recent sources about UW's approach to admissions of
athletes. Those articles would seem to be relevant to the discussion of what might happen should Stone not be accepted at Wisconsin.
I made no comment on the general quality of the universities or their general admissions policies.
Quote from: breadtree on February 12, 2015, 07:44:18 AM
All I did was cite two recent sources about UW's approach to admissions of athletes. Those articles would seem to be relevant to the discussion of what might happen should Stone not be accepted at Wisconsin.
I made no comment on the general quality of the universities or their general admissions policies.
Ron Dayne literally can't read. He had no problem getting into school, and had no problem remaining eligible at UW.
John Clay was academically ineligible his senior year at Racine Horlick High School (not exactly the toughest academic institution in the world). He had no trouble getting into UW, and he was an Honor Student at the almighty UW.
If a top athlete wants to be at UW, they will find a way to make it happen, despite pretending that they don't bend their incredibly difficult academic requirements.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 12, 2015, 07:59:27 AM
Ron Dayne literally can't read. He had no problem getting into school, and had no problem remaining eligible at UW.
John Clay was academically ineligible his senior year at Racine Horlick High School (not exactly the toughest academic institution in the world). He had no trouble getting into UW, and he was an Honor Student at the almighty UW.
If a top athlete wants to be at UW, they will find a way to make it happen, despite pretending that they don't bend their incredibly difficult academic requirements.
This
There have been some intellectual gems over the years. Certainly UW-madison is a very good school, many of their athletes are proficient on and off the court, but the revisionism over there is rather funny.
Quote from: breadtree on February 12, 2015, 07:44:18 AM
All I did was cite two recent sources about UW's approach to admissions of athletes. Those articles would seem to be relevant to the discussion of what might happen should Stone not be accepted at Wisconsin.
I made no comment on the general quality of the universities or their general admissions policies.
Not to be offensive, but those articles don't say anything other than people
think Madison's standards for athletes are higher. Madison's standards are no different than Marquette's. Why students get accepted to one school versus another has to do with the ambiguity of NCAA rules and compliance and what risks the university wants to take with the individual students.
If Stone doesn't get into Wisconsin because of academics it's because he either didn't achieve the NCAA minimums required or because admissions and Bo Ryan decided he wasn't worth the risk. Full stop.
Brent Moss on line one...
Quote from: wadesworld on February 12, 2015, 07:59:27 AM
John Clay was academically ineligible his senior year at Racine Horlick High School (not exactly the toughest academic institution in the world). He had no trouble getting into UW, and he was an Honor Student at the almighty UW.
John Clay played his senior season lol & didn't even go to Horlick. That would be Jamil Wilson.
Quote from: WarriorPride68 on February 12, 2015, 09:33:33 AM
John Clay played his senior season lol & didn't even go to Horlick. That would be Jamil Wilson.
IIRC, he was ineligible to play his freshman year at UW and was forced to reshirt.
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on February 12, 2015, 09:45:05 AM
IIRC, he was ineligible to play his freshman year at UW and was forced to reshirt.
+1
Quote from: mu03eng on February 12, 2015, 08:18:20 AM
Not to be offensive, but those articles don't say anything other than people think Madison's standards for athletes are higher. Madison's standards are no different than Marquette's. Why students get accepted to one school versus another has to do with the ambiguity of NCAA rules and compliance and what risks the university wants to take with the individual students.
If Stone doesn't get into Wisconsin because of academics it's because he either didn't achieve the NCAA minimums required or because admissions and Bo Ryan decided he wasn't worth the risk. Full stop.
Correct. The NCAA minimums are standardized, but every school interprets the risk a little differently.
I don't think UW or MU are some bastions of higher learning. But, neither is the biggest risk taker, either.
For a guy like Stone, it's likely that passing the minimums will be good enough for UW or MU... he seems to be worth the risk. He's talented, and doesn't seem to be a knucklehead/troublemaker (I could be wrong, I don't know him personally).
If Diamond were the 150th ranked recruit, and had a history of run-ins with law enforcement, then he'd likely be considered "too risky".
Quote from: alexius23 on February 11, 2015, 05:26:29 PM
What about a year in a Prep School to pull up his grades? Oversea pro-play?
Quote from: Heisenberg on February 11, 2015, 05:29:57 PM
Then he is a year further away from the NBA.
Remember he is projected to be a 2016 lottery pick. So he just looking for a landing spot for next season to mark his time before he gets paid.
Would he still be a year from the NBA? I thought you just had to be the age your graduating class would be 1 year after graduating.
I think he would have to go to Juco (or overseas) to be eligible after one year. Prep school just pushes his HS graduation out a year.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 12, 2015, 07:59:27 AM
Ron Dayne literally can't read. He had no problem getting into school, and had no problem remaining eligible at UW.
John Clay was academically ineligible his senior year at Racine Horlick High School (not exactly the toughest academic institution in the world). He had no trouble getting into UW, and he was an Honor Student at the almighty UW.
If a top athlete wants to be at UW, they will find a way to make it happen, despite pretending that they don't bend their incredibly difficult academic requirements.
Second hand, but FWIW, is that UW leadership is not budging and Bo is doing everything he can to get Diamond in, but for now Chancellor is saying:
(http://stream1.gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs4/2049606_o.gif)
You also have to take into consideration what he will do to your APR. If he is truly going to be one and done, he probably won't stay around after basketball season to get ready for the draft.
Quote from: reinko on February 12, 2015, 10:10:45 AM
Second hand, but FWIW, is that UW leadership is not budging and Bo is doing everything he can to get Diamond in, but for now Chancellor is saying:
(http://stream1.gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs4/2049606_o.gif)
This is exactly what I am hearing BTW. You guys can bring up all the past players you want, but I have been told that he wants UW but that UW won't admit him. If he ends up at a place like UConn, he will have met NCAA standards but not UW's.
Quote from: reinko on February 12, 2015, 10:10:45 AM
Second hand, but FWIW, is that UW leadership is not budging and Bo is doing everything he can to get Diamond in, but for now Chancellor is saying:
(http://stream1.gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs4/2049606_o.gif)
Have heard something similar, but they will find a way. They always do. Maybe his cousin who is going to ND next year has to take the ACT for him, but they'll make it work.
Yea, Breadtree pretty much nails it. UW seems to have a stricter admissions line then they have in the past. Anderson left because of it.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on February 11, 2015, 01:45:13 AM
If Wisconsin won't offer Diamond due to academics, my guess is that MU won't either.
Who knows? He's played high school basketball, and that's apparently the extent of one alumnus' qualifications.
Quote from: jakeec on February 12, 2015, 10:30:41 AM
Yea, Breadtree pretty much nails it. UW seems to have a stricter admissions line then they have in the past. Anderson left because of it.
Don't fear, Badger fan. They'll find a way to get your guy into school. Just a matter of time. Respect the process and let it play out, they always find a way.
Badger troll agreeing with another Badger troll? I never would have guessed it.
Quote from: breadtree on February 12, 2015, 07:44:18 AM
All I did was cite two recent sources about UW's approach to admissions of athletes. Those articles would seem to be relevant to the discussion of what might happen should Stone not be accepted at Wisconsin.
I made no comment on the general quality of the universities or their general admissions policies.
Agreed. Unfortunately, you paid the toll for trolls from the past who made academic standards comparisons for the two schools a hot button here.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 12, 2015, 10:26:33 AM
Have heard something similar, but they will find a way. They always do. Maybe his cousin who is going to ND next year has to take the ACT for him, but they'll make it work.
Again, he either academically qualifies by NCAA standards or not. There is no Madison "getting him in". Stone can do all sorts of things both "legal" and "illegal" to meet the standards. Madison then has to look at the total picture and decide if how Stone meets the standards is above board and/or worth a risk should the NCAA want to look into it.
The standards themselves do not change, merely what risk level a university wants to accept on a case by case basis.
I'm very willing to bet if Stone were a four year players, UW would take him. However because he has red flags AND is likely to be a one and done....there is too much risk for Madison to take him.
Quote from: LittleWade on February 12, 2015, 10:45:45 AM
Agreed. Unfortunately, you paid the toll for trolls from the past who made academic standards comparisons for the two schools a hot button here.
BTW Murray, you now referin' to your package as Wade, hey?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on February 12, 2015, 10:53:10 AM
BTW Murray, you now referin' to your package as Wade, hey?
Why not? It'd be playing in the All-Star Game, if it wasn't worn out.
...or maybe it started back in the thread about Wade's home basketball court.
Quote from: mu03eng on February 12, 2015, 10:50:22 AM
Again, he either academically qualifies by NCAA standards or not. There is no Madison "getting him in". Stone can do all sorts of things both "legal" and "illegal" to meet the standards. Madison then has to look at the total picture and decide if how Stone meets the standards is above board and/or worth a risk should the NCAA want to look into it.
The standards themselves do not change, merely what risk level a university wants to accept on a case by case basis.
I'm very willing to bet if Stone were a four year players, UW would take him. However because he has red flags AND is likely to be a one and done....there is too much risk for Madison to take him.
That's my point. Once he gets a passing grade to be eligible by NCAA standards, we will be hearing about his commitment to UW. There isn't some higher standard that UW is going to hold Diamond to than the NCAA minimum requirements, despite what they and their fans want you to think. See the other cases sited here.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 12, 2015, 11:11:03 AM
That's my point. Once he gets a passing grade to be eligible by NCAA standards, we will be hearing about his commitment to UW. There isn't some higher standard that UW is going to hold Diamond to than the NCAA minimum requirements, despite what they and their fans want you to think. See the other cases sited here.
If he is allowed to enter the hallowed halls of UW, what will all those Vadger boosters say about his book smarts?
My guess is we'll just hear crickets.
Quote from: Groin_pull on February 12, 2015, 11:17:26 AM
If he is allowed to enter the hallowed halls of UW, what will all those Vadger boosters say about his book smarts?
My guess is we'll just hear crickets.
Nah we'll hear about how hard working of a guy he is and how admirable it was that he worked so hard to get his grades straightened out. To go along with how great the confidence he has in himself is with his Twitter name AllEyesOnMe and the interview answers about how he's "pretty dominant, can do pretty much anything down in the post." Meanwhile, Henry's heNBA Twitter name is a sign of his arrogance and his parents are overbearing.
Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on February 12, 2015, 10:14:01 AM
This is exactly what I am hearing BTW. You guys can bring up all the past players you want, but I have been told that he wants UW but that UW won't admit him. If he ends up at a place like UConn, he will have met NCAA standards but not UW's.
Man, I have no insider info., but I have a hard time believing that if Stone qualifies UW won't take him.
Just seems like a no-brainer to me.
Quote from: Canned Goods n Ammo on February 12, 2015, 11:21:35 AM
Man, I have no insider info., but I have a hard time believing that if Stone qualifies UW won't take him.
Just seems like a no-brainer to me.
Exactly.
Right now the Chancellor is saying no to Diamond to UW because Diamond has yet to get the 18 on his ACT that he needs to be eligible to play for
any team in the NCAA. Kentucky's chancellor, Marquette's chancellor, UCONN's chancellor, etc. are all saying no to Diamond right now too. There is no other option. Once that 18 somehow shows up on his ACT, that answer will be changing very quickly.
Marquette basketball fan and UW football fan, follow the football recruiting closely. All I can tell you is that there have been around 8-10 football recruits who couldn't make it into Madison who were accepted at other schools. Craig Evans, who is from Wisconsin was the one Anderson cited for leaving, he is played for Michigan State last year. Things may have been different years ago, but now there definitely seems to be a much stricter guide line.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 12, 2015, 11:25:30 AM
Exactly. Right now the Chancellor is saying no to Diamond to UW because Diamond has yet to get the 18 on his ACT that he needs to be eligible to play for any team in the NCAA. Kentucky's chancellor, Marquette's chancellor, UCONN's chancellor, etc. are all saying no to Diamond right now too. There is no other option. Once that 18 somehow shows up on his ACT, that answer will be changing very quickly.
Exactly. The only way UW and MU would say no to Diamond if he got his "18" would be if they thought someone else took the test for him. Maybe UCONN or Memphis wouldn't care.
Quote from: mjenzie on February 12, 2015, 11:42:44 AM
Marquette basketball fan and UW football fan, follow the football recruiting closely. All I can tell you is that there have been around 8-10 football recruits who couldn't make it into Madison who were accepted at other schools. Craig Evans, who is from Wisconsin was the one Anderson cited for leaving, he is played for Michigan State last year. Things may have been different years ago, but now there definitely seems to be a much stricter guide line.
I'd guess certain kids are evaluated on a case by case basis.
A highly ranked recruit who struggles with test taking, but seems to have the track record, aptitude and attitude to succeed might be accepted.
A medium ranked recruit who has had "issues" and a low test score might not be accepted*
*I'm not speaking of anybody specifically, just throwing out a scenario.
Quote from: Canned Goods n Ammo on February 12, 2015, 11:52:21 AM
A medium ranked recruit who has had "issues" and a low test score might not be accepted*
*I'm not speaking of anybody specifically, just throwing out a scenario.
Damian Saunders
Quote from: Cooby Snacks on February 12, 2015, 11:57:08 AM
Damian Saunders
count MU out, he is going to get into Madison, by hook or by crook.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 12, 2015, 11:11:03 AM
That's my point. Once he gets a passing grade to be eligible by NCAA standards, we will be hearing about his commitment to UW. There isn't some higher standard that UW is going to hold Diamond to than the NCAA minimum requirements, despite what they and their fans want you to think. See the other cases sited here.
Except, as mjenzie points out, other players have been turned away even this year. The most recent example that people can come up with is John Clay - and that was seven years ago.
Maybe Canned is right - that they won't take risks on mid-level players, but will find a way for Diamond to get in like they found a way for Clay. I guess time will tell.
Quote from: mjenzie on February 12, 2015, 11:42:44 AM
Marquette basketball fan and UW football fan, follow the football recruiting closely. All I can tell you is that there have been around 8-10 football recruits who couldn't make it into Madison who were accepted at other schools. Craig Evans, who is from Wisconsin was the one Anderson cited for leaving, he is played for Michigan State last year. Things may have been different years ago, but now there definitely seems to be a much stricter guide line.
Step back, all schools have this going on, this is a universal truth of high level college athletics.....just most schools don't put themselves on a cross like Madison does about their "standards"
The whole thing is an arbitrary process determined by admission employees in conjunction with athletic department personnel and NCAA compliance officers. Each school will create a process that looks at the inputs of academics (character, transcripts, test scores, etc etc etc) and athletic (ranking, recruit evaluation,etc)....this produces the output of the student being in or not. Each student is going to be unique for each school. Additionally, they look at the risk in total of all students....so one student might not be admitted because they already have 6 "high risk" students in a sport, etc.
Schools will modify the results based on their risk threshold. A school might be more "stringent" because it's had run ins with the NCAA recently and is skating on thin ice. A school might be wide open because $EC.
So if Madison isn't admitting some student athletes, it's because in the culmination of the risk-reward of the total compared to the talent, it doesn't justify that student. To say Madison has higher standards implies some sort of altruistic believe in "student athletes" which is complete crap.
The Craig Evens issue is a classic example, just because he is at MSU doesn't mean that they have lower standards than Madison....could just mean in that particular recruit class that MSU had fewer risks than Madison did so they felt comfortable taking him where Madison didn't
Quote from: mjenzie on February 12, 2015, 11:42:44 AM
Marquette basketball fan and UW football fan, follow the football recruiting closely. All I can tell you is that there have been around 8-10 football recruits who couldn't make it into Madison who were accepted at other schools. Craig Evans, who is from Wisconsin was the one Anderson cited for leaving, he is played for Michigan State last year. Things may have been different years ago, but now there definitely seems to be a much stricter guide line.
Whatever. I'll bet part of letting Anderson escape was to allow UW to write his exit script. Thus, all that "the academics at UW are just too stringent" garbage. The way UW loves to stroke itself, this wouldn't shock me.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 12, 2015, 11:45:53 AM
Exactly. The only way UW and MU would say no to Diamond if he got his "18" would be if they thought someone else took the test for him. Maybe UCONN or Memphis wouldn't care.
FIFY ;)
I've seen it mentioned before about Dayne's brains if you will. Is there a link to a story once upon a time that revealed these tidbits? (for my Vadger co-workers that doubt)
Quote from: Michael Kenyon on February 12, 2015, 01:14:29 PM
I've seen it mentioned before about Dayne's brains if you will. Is there a link to a story once upon a time that revealed these tidbits? (for my Vadger co-workers that doubt)
Yep thanks. Mixing up the NFL and NBA eligibility rules again.
Quote from: Michael Kenyon on February 12, 2015, 01:14:29 PM
I've seen it mentioned before about Dayne's brains if you will. Is there a link to a story once upon a time that revealed these tidbits? (for my Vadger co-workers that doubt)
Google Ron Dayne Wonderlic, he's a member of the single-digit club
Some poor commentary here. Saying Dayne and Clay can't read? I don't think we should go there.
How do you guys know he hasn't reached the minimum qualification with the ACT? I have read elsewhere that is not the issue.
Just because someone meets the NCAA qualifications doesn't mean they will automatically get into UW. Not sure why this is hard to understand.
Quote from: jakeec on February 12, 2015, 01:34:44 PM
Just because someone meets the NCAA qualifications doesn't mean they will automatically get into UW. Not sure why this is hard to understand.
I don't think too many are arguing that.
There is a teacher from RUSD that posts here that can confirm Clay's elementary reading level.
I think the ACT thing is merely speculation considering his announcements have been delayed around ACT test times, and I think that theory started on a Badger board.
Quote from: jakeec on February 12, 2015, 01:34:44 PM
Some poor commentary here. Saying Dayne and Clay can't read? I don't think we should go there.
How do you guys know he hasn't reached the minimum qualification with the ACT? I have read elsewhere that is not the issue.
Just because someone meets the NCAA qualifications doesn't mean they will automatically get into UW. Not sure why this is hard to understand.
Who said Clay couldn't read? Dayne can't read. Clay wasn't eligible at Racine Park (my mistake on saying Horlick originally), yet was an honor student at UW.
I have heard from more than 1 person who I *trust* would not be telling me if he didn't know it that Stone has taken the ACT multiple times and cannot get the 18 that he needs to meet NCAA eligibility requirements. I believe there was a set of ACTs this past weekend, so maybe that news will change soon.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 12, 2015, 01:49:03 PM
Who said Clay couldn't read? Dayne can't read. Clay wasn't eligible at Racine Park (my mistake on saying Horlick originally), yet was an honor student at UW.
I have heard from more than 1 person who I *trust* would not be telling me if he didn't know it that Stone has taken the ACT multiple times and cannot get the 18 that he needs to meet NCAA eligibility requirements. I believe there was a set of ACTs this past weekend, so maybe that news will change soon.
Clay WAS eligible in HS. However, he didn't have the scores to be eligible to play at UW right away, needed to take summer classes and redshirted as a frosh. Not sure if the "honor student" at UW is true or not.
I though the eligibility issue at UW v some other schools dealt with the number of core classes taken in high school. Made up example...UW requires 3 years of foreign language for acceptance into the university while school X might only require 2 years.
I could be way off base on this.
Quote from: PandTandMand... on February 12, 2015, 01:31:22 PM
Google Ron Dayne Wonderlic, he's a member of the single-digit club
thanks but all I get from that is allegation on blogs/message boards
the 1 article I found (on Bleacher Report - I know: not a reliable source) listing the 10 lowest all time and he's not on the list which includes a few that scored a 10
Quote from: thehammock on February 12, 2015, 02:26:04 PM
I though the eligibility issue at UW v some other schools dealt with the number of core classes taken in high school. Made up example...UW requires 3 years of foreign language for acceptance into the university while school X might only require 2 years.
I could be way off base on this.
No, you're correct at least as determined by the information posted by a member on the vadger board. When I inquired over there shortly after Anderson departed amidst all their holier-than-thou rhetoric, they provided a link in which the story posted indicated something like 1 - 2 extra classes; and the article wasn't clear as to whether even more than one extra class was required.
Quote from: jakeec on February 12, 2015, 01:34:44 PM
Some poor commentary here. Saying Dayne and Clay can't read? I don't think we should go there.
How do you guys know he hasn't reached the minimum qualification with the ACT? I have read elsewhere that is not the issue.
Just because someone meets the NCAA qualifications doesn't mean they will automatically get into UW. Not sure why this is hard to understand.
Funny, you guys had no trouble opining if Vander had made it on your message boards.....only after he decommitted from UW-madison. snort snort
I think Dayne can read, it is when he speaks into a microphone that I shake my head.
Quote from: goinUptown on February 12, 2015, 02:45:14 PM
No, you're correct at least as determined by the information posted by a member on the vadger board. When I inquired over there shortly after Anderson departed amidst all their holier-than-thou rhetoric, they provided a link in which the story posted indicated something like 1 - 2 extra classes; and the article wasn't clear as to whether even more than one extra class was required.
Again, I think part of letting Anderson leave so soon was allowing UW to spin it as they wanted. Thus, the b.s. about academics being an issue.
Maybe Anderson just didn't want to be in Madison. Shocking, I know. ::)
Quote from: PandTandMand... on February 12, 2015, 01:31:22 PM
Google Ron Dayne Wonderlic, he's a member of the single-digit club
I worked in New York sports at the time, and a person very close to the team told me he had the lowest score of any player ever drafted by the Giants at that time.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 12, 2015, 11:20:54 AM
Nah we'll hear about how hard working of a guy he is and how admirable it was that he worked so hard to get his grades straightened out. To go along with how great the confidence he has in himself is with his Twitter name AllEyesOnMe and the interview answers about how he's "pretty dominant, can do pretty much anything down in the post." Meanwhile, Henry's heNBA Twitter name is a sign of his arrogance and his parents are overbearing.
Ugh, who cares? You don't become a 5 star recruit without some confidence.
MU landed a high profile recruit, UW wants to do the same.
Quote from: OnWisconsin on February 12, 2015, 06:23:46 PM
Ugh, who cares? You don't become a 5 star recruit without some confidence.
MU landed a high profile recruit, UW wants to do the same.
Apparently, your Vadger buddies care a whole lot. That's why they tar and feather any recruit who's not willing to crawl over broken glass for the privilege of living in Madison for four years.
UW hired a new person about 4 years ago from The U of Chicago. Since that hiring it has become much more difficult to get special recruits through the acceptance process. I have been told by writers that are on the Badger beat that most all the coaches are frustrated but they will not go on record for fear of sounding anti education. As a very proud UW grad I know that I would never be accepted today and I find the arrogance displayed by others of similar backgrounds to be annoying to say the least. Anderson's leaving was not set up by the UW. In fact his discussing UW's standards is a view shared by others no matter what Barry or Bo or any other person associated with UW might say to the press.
Quote from: Groin_pull on February 12, 2015, 06:27:19 PM
Apparently, your Vadger buddies care a whole lot. That's why they tar and feather any recruit who's not willing to crawl over broken glass for the privilege of living in Madison for four years.
99% of the fan base accepts that these guys are teenagers making a decision that they think is best for them. There's just as many over the top posters here as there is on any UW board.
Please, don't re-hash the Vander Blue saga either.
As for the actual topic of this thread, Diamond is not going to Marquette. It will be Wisconsin or UCONN, nothing has changed.
Quote from: OnWisconsin on February 12, 2015, 06:23:46 PM
Ugh, who cares? You don't become a 5 star recruit without some confidence.
MU landed a high profile recruit, UW wants to do the same.
That's my point. Badger fans blast Henry for being selfish and all about him and saying his parents are overbearing, all the while praising Stone for being more vocal about his confidnece/cockiness/whatever you want to call it and having more handlers.
Quote from: jakeec on February 12, 2015, 01:34:44 PM
Some poor commentary here. Saying Dayne and Clay can't read? I don't think we should go there.
How do you guys know he hasn't reached the minimum qualification with the ACT? I have read elsewhere that is not the issue.
Just because someone meets the NCAA qualifications doesn't mean they will automatically get into UW. Not sure why this is hard to understand.
So now the fake me is posting fairly normal comments. This just keeps getting more and more weird. This is one of the more inspired trolling efforts considering I dont post here much and they used my handle from the scout board.
On to Stone I dont think anyone knows the exact reason he is waiting. There are rumblings and certain things seem to make sense. Just like with Nick Noskowiak's or Vander Blue's situation we might never know everything. I have been quick to assume people with "insider knowledge" actually knew what was going on in the past but in the past few months I have moved to being bored (if not slightly disturbed) with all the rumors and speculation. I am landing on hoping Nick's stuff is resolved and he has a good rest of his senior year and hoping Diamond makes the right college choice for him when the time is right for him. I will root against teams but rooting against 18-22 year olds is something I something I embarrassingly have done is the past that I dont want to do anymore
Quote from: OnWisconsin on February 12, 2015, 09:55:38 PM
99% of the fan base accepts that these guys are teenagers making a decision that they think is best for them. There's just as many over the top posters here as there is on any UW board.
Please, don't re-hash the Vander Blue saga either.
As for the actual topic of this thread, Diamond is not going to Marquette. It will be Wisconsin or UCONN, nothing has changed.
Sorry, nice try, but it's not even close. Vadger fans are in a league of their own. But thanks for stopping by to monitor the situation.
The notion that somehow you can't get a person into a university because of lack of certain core classes etc., may be true but it's not an absolute. The key is to understand a student's capabilities and needs. In many cases, they're pretty bright but learn differently.
I suspect some of the athletes we ridicule -- and some the Badger fans ridicule as well -- fall into this category.
In fact, most state universities will consider the whole person. For example, many students who have learning disabilities will get into very good colleges on the basis that with the right type of support, the learning disabled student can perform on par with the general university population. The support is often more intense and may include untimed test taking, note takers, tutors etc.
I can't speak to any one student's issue. But the core of LD support is what's done with many athletic programs. With the right level of support, can a student-athlete do Madison or Marquette work? Or UConn for that matter? Time will tell.
Whether you're Marquette or Wisconsin, give a kid the benefit of a doubt.
Quote from: OnWisconsin on February 12, 2015, 09:55:38 PM
99% of the fan base accepts that these guys are teenagers making a decision that they think is best for them. There's just as many over the top posters here as there is on any UW board.
Please, don't re-hash the Vander Blue saga either.
As for the actual topic of this thread, Diamond is not going to Marquette. It will be Wisconsin or UCONN, nothing has changed.
First, the over the top stuff is worse on the Badger boards, especially for WI kids that don't go to UW, and second, the ones that do it the most on the Badger boards are the more established, regular and "respected" posters.
Quote from: Litehouse on February 13, 2015, 08:24:47 AM
First, the over the top stuff is worse on the Badger boards, especially for WI kids that don't go to UW, and second, the ones that do it the most on the Badger boards are the more established, regular and "respected" posters.
Yup. The examples of attacking non UW-madison kids and their parents is appalling.
So why not stay off the Badger boards?
Sam Madden and Craig Evans were both 4* football recruits with tons of Power 5 offers who could not get admitted to Madison who got admitted to Georgia and Michigan State respectively. Perhaps Stone might get in even with NCAA-minimum quals, but there are 2 well-documented recent examples in football of the point that NCAA minimums don't cut it for athletes at Madison.
http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/243411861.html
http://www.maizenbrew.com/michigan-football-recruiting/2015/1/18/7760617/sam-madden-father-talks-wisconsin-decommitment
Maybe Stone meets NCAA minimums, doesn't get into Madison, and also doesn't get into UConn or Maryland. IDK. But you're basically willfully ignoring facts if you pretend that getting into Madison for athletes is the exact same as every school
Quote from: breadtree on February 13, 2015, 10:44:48 AM
Sam Madden and Craig Evans were both 4* football recruits with tons of Power 5 offers who could not get admitted to Madison who got admitted to Georgia and Michigan State respectively. Perhaps Stone might get in even with NCAA-minimum quals, but there are 2 well-documented recent examples in football of the point that NCAA minimums don't cut it for athletes at Madison.
http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/243411861.html
http://www.maizenbrew.com/michigan-football-recruiting/2015/1/18/7760617/sam-madden-father-talks-wisconsin-decommitment
Maybe Stone meets NCAA minimums, doesn't get into Madison, and also doesn't get into UConn or Maryland. IDK. But you're basically willfully ignoring facts if you pretend that getting into Madison for athletes is the exact same as every school
Apparently Madison education never taught you the difference between correlation and causation. Just because Craig Evans didn't get into Wisconsin but did another school doesn't mean Madison's standards are higher....just that Madison's mix of student athletes is different right now.
Quote from: Michael Kenyon on February 13, 2015, 10:16:12 AM
So why not stay off the Badger boards?
I do. But Vadger fans insist on infecting MU boards.
Quote from: Groin_pull on February 12, 2015, 06:27:19 PM
Apparently, your Vadger buddies care a whole lot. That's why they tar and feather any recruit who's not willing to crawl over broken glass for the privilege of living in Madison for four five years.
FIFY
Quote from: Michael Kenyon on February 13, 2015, 10:16:12 AM
So why not stay off the Badger boards?
+1
This is the MU board, why should any of care what a bunch of badger trolls say?