Hey dude. Gardner hasn't missed tonight. Literally. Why are you charging into a crowded lane with 30 seconds left on the shot clock up 3 with 3 minutes to go when your big man has scored your team's last 9 points? Why? Just why? Absolutely inexcusable.
Playing Hero Ball. Almost shot us out the game.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 27, 2014, 10:24:53 PM
Hey dude. Gardner hasn't missed tonight. Literally. Why are you charging into a crowded lane with 30 seconds left on the shot clock up 3 with 3 minutes to go when your big man has scored your team's last 9 points? Why? Just why? Absolutely inexcusable.
Know you are a Mayo hater...if you want to bash the guy on a night like tonight, please be sure to start threads for the games he's helped us win...
If he makes the buckets on drives..no whining...I don't have an issue with the guy going at basket - either get fouled, a shot from close in, or stripped...unfortunately got stripped on one of the 2 shots down the stretch..
Buzz should have been telling him that too
They had packed around Davante and no way was he going to get the ball. Todd did what he should have done. Ball just didn't go in
Bad Jamil showed up tonight too
Quote from: elephantraker on February 27, 2014, 10:38:04 PM
They had packed around Davante and no way was he going to get the ball. Todd did what he should have done. Ball just didn't go in
No but he forced both shots they were not good shots. Needed to pass both times.
Quote from: Ners on February 27, 2014, 10:36:29 PM
Know you are a Mayo hater...if you want to bash the guy on a night like tonight, please be sure to start threads for the games he's helped us win...
If he makes the buckets on drives..no whining...I don't have an issue with the guy going at basket - either get fouled, a shot from close in, or stripped...unfortunately got stripped on one of the 2 shots down the stretch..
Exactly. I hate a couple of certain players but I'll celebrate WINS and give props to whoever.
This is just gross.
Quote from: mugrack on February 27, 2014, 10:39:30 PM
Bad Jamil showed up tonight too
Bad Jamil and bad mayo and still won! ;D
Todd seems to have an inordinate ability to get stripped on his drives.
Quote from: elephantraker on February 27, 2014, 10:38:04 PM
They had packed around Davante and no way was he going to get the ball. Todd did what he should have done. Ball just didn't go in
+1
Quote from: mileskishnish72 on February 27, 2014, 10:41:40 PM
Todd seems to have an inordinate ability to get stripped on his drives.
Its almost Superhuman how often it happens, almost once a game. We won tho on to the next. . .
I've never liked the terms Good/Bad Mayo. I like Good Mayo/Frustrating Mayo. He drives me battier than Derrick, Dawson and even Jamil. Tonight was Frustrating Mayo.
Ebb and flow, I'll take the good with the bad, getting the w sure does help though
Quote from: Ners on February 27, 2014, 10:36:29 PM
Know you are a Mayo hater...if you want to bash the guy on a night like tonight, please be sure to start threads for the games he's helped us win...
If he makes the buckets on drives..no whining...I don't have an issue with the guy going at basket - either get fouled, a shot from close in, or stripped...unfortunately got stripped on one of the 2 shots down the stretch..
I'm the first to admit I ride Mayo for many reasons. But I have been very complimentary of him the times he has played intelligent, in system basketball this year. Tonight he did not. For someone who attempts to flaunt his basketball pedigree around here, if you are truly okay with Todd running into a lane with 3 Georgetown defenders with 30 seconds on the shot clock up by 3 points with Davante Gardner having scored our last 9 points and being 8/8 on field goals to that point then you have lost any and all credibility (you didn't have any before anyways, so I guess what does it matter?)
If you want to talk hypocrisy, where is your take on how inexcusable Dawson's missed open layup was that would have pushed our lead larger? That was a big turning point in Georgetown coming back, no? I seem to remember a game ago you and others calling out D-Rock for something incredibly similar...
Quote from: elephantraker on February 27, 2014, 10:38:04 PM
They had packed around Davante and no way was he going to get the ball. Todd did what he should have done. Ball just didn't go in
If that were the case then why did Todd run into said packed lane? And how did we have no problem getting the ball into Gardner on our next offensive possession? Not a good decision no matter what way you try to slice it. Just an inexcusable play at that point in the game.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 27, 2014, 10:47:58 PM
I'm the first to admit I ride Mayo for many reasons. But I have been very complimentary of him the times he has played intelligent, in system basketball this year. Tonight he did not. For someone who attempts to flaunt his basketball pedigree around here, if you are truly okay with Todd running into a lane with 3 Georgetown defenders with 30 seconds on the shot clock up by 3 points with Davante Gardner having scored our last 9 points and being 8/8 on field goals to that point then you have lost any and all credibility (you didn't have any before anyways, so I guess what does it matter?)
If you want to talk hypocrisy, where is your take on how inexcusable Dawson's missed open layup was that would have pushed our lead larger? That was a big turning point in Georgetown coming back, no? I seem to remember a game ago you and others calling out D-Rock for something incredibly similar...
If that were the case then why did Todd run into said packed lane? And how did we have no problem getting the ball into Gardner on our next offensive possession? Not a good decision no matter what way you try to slice it. Just an inexcusable play at that point in the game.
Nice try...you can go review thread..I never participated in that discussion...but if you want to get into it, I'll be glad to discuss all the layups Derrick has missed this year if you want...
As for Todd...no..he didn't go 1 on 3...into the paint...had a good angle on Trawick, but got stripped...the other he took his pull up floater from 4' that he makes a high percentage of the time. He's the only guy on team we have who can score going to the basket...
And as for your comment about playing within the "system," you also look at the floor and situation and make a decision as to what you are going to do...Todd felt driving ball was a good option...and I know you like to say he never passes...once again...had 4 assists tonight, tied for team high with Dawson...
Jamil was worse.
A thread about Mayo seems the perfect place to discuss Derrick vs. John. Lots of new ground to break here ::)
Quote from: Ners on February 27, 2014, 10:52:44 PM
Nice try...you can go review thread..I never participated in that discussion...but if you want to get into it, I'll be glad to discuss all the layups Derrick has missed this year if you want...
As for Todd...no..he didn't go 1 on 3...into the paint...had a good angle on Trawick, but got stripped...the other he took his pull up floater from 4' that he makes a high percentage of the time. He's the only guy on team we have who can score going to the basket...
And as for your comment about playing within the "system," you also look at the floor and situation and make a decision as to what you are going to do...Todd felt driving ball was a good option...and I know you like to say he never passes...once again...had 4 assists tonight, tied for team high with Dawson...
I have not said Todd never passes since very early this season. Again, when Todd plays within the offense I am very happy to compliment him. Todd has done that, to my pleasant surprise, for a large majority of this season. Overall I am very pleased with how Todd has played, especially in the conference season. But tonight Todd was bad, and this particular decision was awful. Horrendous. It happens to everyone. I'm just saying that a play like he made is not acceptable and he needs to learn from it. It was not a good decision no matter how you try to spin it. He could've had a wide open breakaway layup with all 5 of Georgetown's players on the other half of the court and Davante Gardner on our bench and the right play would've been to call a timeout to get Davante in the game and get him the ball (okay, I'm exaggerating there, but you get my point). I'm sure Todd thought it was a fantastic idea. I doubt Todd thought, "Hmm, this isn't going to end well and is a horrible decision, let's give it a try!" That's fantastic that that wasn't his thought process. That doesn't mean it's the right decision. It just plain wasn't. Everyone in the building knew who should've gotten the ball. Everyone but Todd, apparently.
Quote from: Warriors10 on February 27, 2014, 10:54:58 PM
Jamil was worse.
This is true. But at least Jamil realized he was worse and in the last 5 minutes every time he touched the ball he got it right into Davante in the post. Well done, Jamil. Some nights you just have to realize you're not on top of your game and ride the hot hand.
Quote from: Ners on February 27, 2014, 10:36:29 PM
Know you are a Mayo hater...if you want to bash the guy on a night like tonight, please be sure to start threads for the games he's helped us win...
Know you are a Mayo lover...if you want to constantly argue that he's great and only needs more opportunities, please be sure to acknowledge when he's wasting his opportunities by playing selfish inconsistent ball.
I have been happy with Mayo's play of late, but he reverted back to his frustrating get mine game tonight. He took a few bad shots during key stretches late in the game when Gardner was owning the post and fouling every single big out of the game.
If you are here defending the particular Mayo drives in this thread, you should be over defending Juan in the other thread because the situation was the exact same.
People are so foolish in thinking that you can simply "Give it to Gardner" every single possession. Every possession is different and on a couple occasions Jamil and Jake were just standing on the perimeter basically forcing Todd to drive to make the offense even move. He got stripped but when he gets through traffic and makes that, everyone loves him.
Quote from: MarkusSharkus on February 28, 2014, 12:17:07 AM
People are so foolish in thinking that you can simply "Give it to Gardner" every single possession. Every possession is different and on a couple occasions Jamil and Jake were just standing on the perimeter basically forcing Todd to drive to make the offense even move. He got stripped but when he gets through traffic and makes that, everyone loves him.
Just because he drives doesn't mean he has to shoot. If you don't have the shot, pull it out or pass it. Likewise, no one is saying that Gardner needs to shoot every possession, but give him the damn ball at least once in the possession.
Quote from: MUSF on February 28, 2014, 12:22:59 AM
Just because he drives doesn't mean he has to shoot. If you don't have the shot, pull it out or pass it. Likewise, no one is saying that Gardner needs to shoot every possession, but give him the damn ball at least once in the possession.
Easier said than done. The guy is getting walled off by up to 3 defenders at times. You can complain when it doesn't happen but it is simply hard to do when the other team knows what you intend on doing.
It's funny that you guys are calling this game a bad Mayo performance. He made key baskets early, had some big assists throughout the game and a couple of aggressive turnovers late (given the fouls being called, for all we know he could have been instructed to take it to the rim by our staff).
To put in into comparison, his game tonight would be a top five career game from either of our point guards this year. You guys are really silly.
Quote from: mattyv1908 on February 28, 2014, 01:44:47 AM
It's funny that you guys are calling this game a bad Mayo performance. He made key baskets early, had some big assists throughout the game and a couple of aggressive turnovers late (given the fouls being called, for all we know he could have been instructed to take it to the rim by our staff).
To put in into comparison, his game tonight would be a top five career game from either of our point guards this year. You guys are really silly.
No kidding, its how wadesworld roles.
He calls out other posters. He says they live in parents basements. He gets proven wrong.
Then contradicts everything he stands for and calls our one of the teams best players....and is wrong as usual.
Guy is an idiot. Somewhere Dwyane Wade is pissed off.
Quote from: mattyv1908 on February 28, 2014, 01:44:47 AM
It's funny that you guys are calling this game a bad Mayo performance. He made key baskets early, had some big assists throughout the game and a couple of aggressive turnovers late (given the fouls being called, for all we know he could have been instructed to take it to the rim by our staff).
To put in into comparison, his game tonight would be a top five career game from either of our point guards this year. You guys are really silly.
I think people tend to focus on the end of the game. His two turnovers in a row at the end really almost irreversibly changed the momentum of the game.
Whats actually hilarious about this thread is it was started by a guy who when I said Buzz was foolish for simply not playing Gardner more in the second half vs DePaul(1.5 games support me btw)
He asked me "what college basketball team are you coaching"
Alright, Sh it head what college basketball team are you playing on? None?
NEXT.
Quote from: HaywardsHeroes32 on February 27, 2014, 10:40:11 PM
Exactly. I hate a couple of certain players but I'll celebrate WINS and give props to whoever.
This is just gross.
Says the guy who is going emotionally unhinged at the coach for Davante's playing time.
I actually don't think Mayo was all that bad except for a couple of bad possessions in the second half.
Quote from: mugrack on February 27, 2014, 10:39:30 PM
Bad Jamil showed up tonight too
Have we ever had two talented players that were more consistently inconsistent that Jamil and Todd?
The last time Todd and Jamil were both this bad at the same time was the SJU game. Being at home helped, but it was an impressive step to see the rest of the team overcome it.
Quote from: HaywardsHeroes32 on February 28, 2014, 07:16:09 AM
Whats actually hilarious about this thread is it was started by a guy who when I said Buzz was foolish for simply not playing Gardner more in the second half vs DePaul(1.5 games support me btw)
He asked me "what college basketball team are you coaching"
Alright, Sh it head what college basketball team are you playing on? None?
NEXT.
Again, saying "Buzz being the fool that he is..." is much different than saying "Buzz was foolish to not have played Gardner more in the 2nd half of the game..." The first (which is exactly what you said) is calling Buzz a fool of a person. The second is saying Buzz made a bad decision, which I would not necessarily disagree with. If you don't want to be called out for calling someone a fool, think about what you are saying before you say it.
Can you stop crying now, 2 weeks later?
Quote from: HaywardsHeroes32 on February 28, 2014, 04:33:18 AM
No kidding, its how wadesworld roles.
He calls out other posters. He says they live in parents basements. He gets proven wrong.
Then contradicts everything he stands for and calls our one of the teams best players....and is wrong as usual.
Guy is an idiot. Somewhere Dwyane Wade is pissed off.
Aww, I made a sarcastic post in a sarcastic thread that was specifically asking what posters live in their parents basements? Are you calling every poster out who commented in that thread, or...? :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
Yes, that is how i "role."
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
Quote from: wadesworld on February 27, 2014, 10:24:53 PM
Hey dude. Gardner hasn't missed tonight. Literally. Why are you charging into a crowded lane with 30 seconds left on the shot clock up 3 with 3 minutes to go when your big man has scored your team's last 9 points? Why? Just why? Absolutely inexcusable.
Absolutely inexcusable? Really?
I'm happy to see the agression. Everyone criticizes him for not being "the man", so he took a shot and drove the lane. He missed the shot, we still won the game.
Quote from: MarsupialMadness on February 28, 2014, 08:47:17 AM
Absolutely inexcusable? Really?
I'm happy to see the agression. Everyone criticizes him for not being "the man", so he took a shot and drove the lane. He missed the shot, we still won the game.
Entirely inexcusable. Mayo
has been the man on a number of occasions down the stretch this season. If Davante hadn't scored the last 9 points for Marquette, fouled out 3 guys so far, and literally not missed a shot to that point then the shot may make more sense. But why are we charging into the lane with tunnel vision with 30 seconds left on the shot clock given those facts? I made a thread about this team not understanding "time and situation." This would be another example of that. Take away time on the shot clock, score, time left in the game, or anything that had happened up to that point in the game and the play was not a bad play. But given time and situation, it was an inexcusable play.
Quote from: MUSF on February 28, 2014, 12:02:27 AM
Know you are a Mayo lover...if you want to constantly argue that he's great and only needs more opportunities, please be sure to acknowledge when he's wasting his opportunities by playing selfish inconsistent ball.
I have been happy with Mayo's play of late, but he reverted back to his frustrating get mine game tonight. He took a few bad shots during key stretches late in the game when Gardner was owning the post and fouling every single big out of the game.
He isn't wasting opportunities...was he playing selfish ball when he rallied us back from Villanova. Ever see D-Wade, Wesbrook, or any other slasher get stripped going to the basket, turn it over. Todd is the one guy who will force action on the team, and can collapse a D. Not always easy among the trees. Todd took 4 shots last night...you want to call that "get mine," selfish, whatever. Todd had 4 assists too.
And yes, there is something about a defense knowing what is coming and doing what they can to shut it off....Gardner was that guy down the stretch..and GTown tried to take it away...Todd made decision to penetrate..he makes the 4' floater and doesn't get stripped on the other one...everyone is happy.
And BTW...what happened the last time we went to Gardner (who I love), he got double/tripled and missed the shot....there is such a thing as going to the well 1 too many times..
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 28, 2014, 12:12:41 AM
If you are here defending the particular Mayo drives in this thread, you should be over defending Juan in the other thread because the situation was the exact same.
Except Mayo has a track record of being able to finish with a hoop 50% of the time, and has shown he can be effective going to the basket...
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 09:14:27 AM
Except Mayo has a track record of being able to finish with a hoop 50% of the time, and has shown he can be effective going to the basket...
+1.
Criticizing our guards for attacking the basket! With 3 minutes left! Oh no. I guess Todd shouldn't touch the ball anymore with the game hanging in the balance for the final 3 minutes. I wonder why he was even in the game if not to only pass it to Davante?
Mayo has been nothing but a bright spot during conference play this year. I see Vander type numbers next year from him.
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 09:14:27 AM
Except Mayo has a track record of being able to finish with a hoop 50% of the time, and has shown he can be effective going to the basket...
Yup. If Mayo is driving and actually making to the basket, I'm happy. I'll take the miss or stripped-once-in-a-while for some aggressive baskets.
Quote from: esard2011 on February 28, 2014, 09:21:04 AM
Mayo has been nothing but a bright spot during conference play this year. I see Vander type numbers next year from him.
Your dreaming, does not have enough quickness, so he really has to be open to score and his range is not that good. He is average at best. Yesterday he had a 10 foot airball. He is old for
his age, do not see that much improvement. Vander was much quicker and much better in the open court. like the ability to dunk the ball, had a great left hand as well going to the hoop, Todd
not even close.
Quote from: BCHoopster on February 28, 2014, 09:31:41 AM
Your dreaming, does not have enough quickness, so he really has to be open to score and his range is not that good. He is average at best. Yesterday he had a 10 foot airball. He is old for
his age, do not see that much improvement. Vander was much quicker and much better in the open court. like the ability to dunk the ball, had a great left hand as well going to the hoop, Todd
not even close.
Again though, Vander was always talented but all it took was one offseason for the switch to turn on. I am not dreaming. Mayo will be averaging 16 a game next year.
The only thing Todd does better than Vander is shoot the ball from deep. They are equal in some areas, but Vander is better in most.
Quote from: esard2011 on February 28, 2014, 09:36:21 AM
Again though, Vander was always talented but all it took was one offseason for the switch to turn on. I am not dreaming. Mayo will be averaging 16 a game next year.
Time will tell, but he does nothing special. I can see maybe 12 next year, not 16. Then again I am not sure how they score points next year. Deonte Burton might be there leading scorer next year.
Quote from: BCHoopster on February 28, 2014, 09:31:41 AM
Your dreaming, does not have enough quickness, so he really has to be open to score and his range is not that good. He is average at best. Yesterday he had a 10 foot airball. He is old for
his age, do not see that much improvement. Vander was much quicker and much better in the open court. like the ability to dunk the ball, had a great left hand as well going to the hoop, Todd
not even close.
I totally disagree. Todd Mayo has a silky smooth drive and finish with his left hand. In fact, I think that's one of the most impressive parts of his game and it definitely rivals Blues'. I think your comment is based on large part on Blues' finish against Davidson last year, which was amazing, but I truly think Mayo is just as capable of that finish.
That aside, no question, Blue was more explosive and better in open court. But Mayo does have a lot of similar value to Blue, just not quite as much.
Quote from: The Sultan of Slurpery on February 28, 2014, 09:40:13 AM
The only thing Todd does better than Vander is shoot the ball from deep. They are equal in some areas, but Vander is better in most.
This is beautifully concise.
Quote from: BCHoopster on February 28, 2014, 09:31:41 AM
Your dreaming, does not have enough quickness, so he really has to be open to score and his range is not that good. He is average at best. Yesterday he had a 10 foot airball. He is old for
his age, do not see that much improvement. Vander was much quicker and much better in the open court. like the ability to dunk the ball, had a great left hand as well going to the hoop, Todd
not even close.
Well...he really isn't dreaming, because if you look at per 40...Mayo this year is better than Blue in virtually every measurable category...one big difference..Todd gets to the FT line at twice the rate Vander did.
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=todd-mayo&i=1&p1=vander-blue
I'd agree Vander is a better overall athlete, is a longer player - wingspan and height - not sure about a better first step. Vander was really good in transition last year....sadly, we don't really have a transition game this year...AT ALL.
Quote from: windyplayer on February 28, 2014, 09:45:38 AM
I totally disagree. Todd Mayo has a silky smooth drive and finish with his left hand. In fact, I think that's one of the most impressive parts of his game and it definitely rivals Blues'. I think your comment is based on large part on Blues' finish against Davidson last year, which was amazing, but I truly think Mayo is just as capable of that finish.
That aside, no question, Blue was more explosive and better in open court. But Mayo does have a lot of similar value to Blue, just not quite as much.
You must be drinking the same kool-aid on Todd, I sure do not see it. 16 a game next year, no chance.
Quote from: BCHoopster on February 28, 2014, 09:49:44 AM
You must be drinking the same kool-aid on Todd, I sure do not see it. 16 a game next year, no chance.
Ill quote it and put it in my tag line. If for no other reason that we have nobody else to score. 16 a game. Bank it.
Quote from: BCHoopster on February 28, 2014, 09:49:44 AM
You must be drinking the same kool-aid on Todd, I sure do not see it. 16 a game next year, no chance.
I never said anything about 16/game next year. Do you disagree that he has a quality left-handed finish around the rim?
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 09:48:43 AM
Well...he really isn't dreaming, because if you look at per 40...Mayo this year is better than Blue in virtually every measurable category...one big difference..Todd gets to the FT line at twice the rate Vander did.
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=todd-mayo&i=1&p1=vander-blue
I'd agree Vander is a better overall athlete, is a longer player - wingspan and height - not sure about a better first step. Vander was really good in transition last year....sadly, we don't really have a transition game this year...AT ALL.
I agree that Todd has had moments when you think he might break out and be the man, but that only has happened on rare occasions this year, Todd is much older than Vander. Vander was much younger and developed his game the third year, maybe was 20. Todd will be like 24 next year, not sure I can see that big an improvement next year. Secondly, Todd on the road has been horrible. Check his stats there.
Quote from: windyplayer on February 28, 2014, 09:53:05 AM
I never said anything about 16/game next year. Do you disagree that he has have a quality left-handed finish around the rim?
Todd has short arms compared to Vander, Vander was really long. Yes, Todd can make a lefty lay-up, but can not finish anywhere close to Vander did last year, Vander was a little taller
and had explosive hops to the hoop, Todd does not explode.
Quote from: BCHoopster on February 28, 2014, 09:55:21 AM
I agree that Todd has had moments when you think he might break out and be the man, but that only has happened on rare occasions this year, Todd is much older than Vander. Vander was much younger and developed his game the third year, maybe was 20. Todd will be like 24 next year, not sure I can see that big an improvement next year. Secondly, Todd on the road has been horrible. Check his stats there.
I'd agree there has been some disparity between Todd on the road versus home...yet the stats I linked are for the year...go down every single category....do you really think Vander is clear cut better than Todd?
We got a nice 3 game run from Vander in the NCAA..played huge...yet think that sometimes colors the overall recollection/memory of him as a player in a better light than what was the overall reality - that he was a good player...I wouldn't say great...and I feel the same about Todd.
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 10:07:45 AM
I'd agree there has been some disparity between Todd on the road versus home...yet the stats I linked are for the year...go down every single category....do you really think Vander is clear cut better than Todd?
We got a nice 3 game run from Vander in the NCAA..played huge...yet think that sometimes colors the overall recollection/memory of him as a player in a better light than what was the overall reality - that he was a good player...I wouldn't say great...and I feel the same about Todd.
I agree that Vander saved his best for last, in saying that lets see what Todd can do in the next two games, yesterday, he was average or below average. It seemed last year that Vander developed an outside game, even made some threes. Todd looks to drive all the time, like to see him take some more threes when he is open. Todd just is not explosive with the ball, he has not really shown me he can take his game to the next level, maybe it will happen next year, not sure. He will have a big opportunity next year as he will be a senior and the team is laddened with underclassman. Next year they really will be a guard oriented team, threes might rain next year as they will have no interior game like this year, will be a totally different team with really
no post player. Vander should have stayed, he was an above average college player only his junior year, I still think Vander was much quicker, better defender, reason, really long.
Quote from: BCHoopster on February 28, 2014, 10:24:20 AM
I agree that Vander saved his best for last, in saying that lets see what Todd can do in the next two games, yesterday, he was average or below average. It seemed last year that Vander developed an outside game, even made some threes. Todd looks to drive all the time, like to see him take some more threes when he is open. Todd just is not explosive with the ball, he has not really shown me he can take his game to the next level, maybe it will happen next year, not sure. He will have a big opportunity next year as he will be a senior and the team is laddened with underclassman. Next year they really will be a guard oriented team, threes might rain next year as they will have no interior game like this year, will be a totally different team with really
no post player. Vander should have stayed, he was an above average college player only his junior year, I still think Vander was much quicker, better defender, reason, really long.
I do agree Vander was a better overall athlete than Todd..and much longer..which helped him cover more court area defensively. I don't feel Vander was much quicker, laterally, anyway - probably straight line, yes...
But, Vander did have the benefit of playing with Junior running the point - Junior was great in transition, and pretty good in the halfcourt...and did require to be defended out to the 3 point line...I hate to belabor the point...but I think some just underestimate how hard it is to execute against the defense that can sag 6' off your PG...
Quote from: The Sultan of Slurpery on February 28, 2014, 08:15:05 AM
Says the guy who is going emotionally unhinged at the coach for Davante's playing time.
What does that have to do with giving props?
And emotionally unhinged? More at the way hes treated. Again, at least attempt to read. It does WONDERS.
As always, why always devils advocate? As much as some people want to say that there are trolls on here(there are none we are all fans in different ways) you qualify just as quickly. Anytime someone tries to point out something good....you immediately make it your lifes mission to shoot it down. Sorry if this is your life purpose but...
Quote from: wadesworld on February 28, 2014, 08:44:10 AM
Again, saying "Buzz being the fool that he is..." is much different than saying "Buzz was foolish to not have played Gardner more in the 2nd half of the game..." The first (which is exactly what you said) is calling Buzz a fool of a person. The second is saying Buzz made a bad decision, which I would not necessarily disagree with. If you don't want to be called out for calling someone a fool, think about what you are saying before you say it.
Can you stop crying now, 2 weeks later?
Stop crying? Don't flatter yourself. No tears have been shed. Sorry that you had nothing, resorted to the generic "are you coaching" comment and got owned. Pathetic.
Yet in your post right here you flat out call a player BAD. I said Buzz was foolish, for that decision the one I mentioned. Of course you go literal and take it as a whole. Either way....being a fool is a little better then being straight up BAD.
The hypocrisy is bordering on crazy.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 28, 2014, 08:45:39 AM
Aww, I made a sarcastic post in a sarcastic thread that was specifically asking what posters live in their parents basements? Are you calling every poster out who commented in that thread, or...? :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
Yes, that is how i "role."
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
Calling out spelling on a message board!!! More proof that you are out of options.
I didn't even bother fixing it because I thought, or what it hoped? People were capable of talking sports here not praying for an A in Internet English!!!
I'll give you props though, at least you weren't one of those "When did we get a Devante?" guys.
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 10:52:14 AM
I do agree Vander was a better overall athlete than Todd..and much longer..which helped him cover more court area defensively. I don't feel Vander was much quicker, laterally, anyway - probably straight line, yes...
But, Vander did have the benefit of playing with Junior running the point - Junior was great in transition, and pretty good in the halfcourt...and did require to be defended out to the 3 point line...I hate to belabor the point...but I think some just underestimate how hard it is to execute against the defense that can sag 6' off your PG...
I agree, all I can say about Derrick is that he is the worst offensive point guard I have watched this year. Buzz might love him, but he brings nothing to the table. Junior was 10 times the player, but he was not that good either. But next to Blue they had to defend both, does make a difference. I do not see how they will be able to play next year if he plays 30 minutes at the
point. Juan can not score, Derrick can not score, so that leaves Burton, Taylor, and Mayo. Fisher will make a difference but they will need scoring from the point next year. Burton, Taylor and Juan upfront will be a challenge at the beginning of the year.
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 09:14:27 AM
Except Mayo has a track record of being able to finish with a hoop 50% of the time, and has shown he can be effective going to the basket...
My point in saying that, is that, if you believe Mayo made the correct choice - attacking basket because the defense was collapsing around Davante - then you must also believe Juan made the correct choice in doing the same. Regardless of his "ability to finish", he made the correct basketball play.
Quote from: BCHoopster on February 28, 2014, 11:14:06 AM
I agree, all I can say about Derrick is that he is the worst offensive point guard I have watched this year. Buzz might love him, but he brings nothing to the table. Junior was 10 times the player, but he was not that good either. But next to Blue they had to defend both, does make a difference. I do not see how they will be able to play next year if he plays 30 minutes at the
point. Juan can not score, Derrick can not score, so that leaves Burton, Taylor, and Mayo. Fisher will make a difference but they will need scoring from the point next year. Burton, Taylor and Juan upfront will be a challenge at the beginning of the year.
I'd have to think Burton will get a TON of Jamil's minutes next year...give Burton another off-season of strength and conditioning work, his lateral quickness will improve, will have at least 1 year of experience under his belt defensively...and he should improve to be a solid on ball defender...and an absolute stud on offensive end.
Hopefully, Dawson can earn his way up to 20-25 minutes per game running point next year, or Duane Wilson for that matter - and Derrick can reduce down to 15-20 - which I feel he'd be effective and potentially give asset caliber minutes in those amounts.
Concern for me next year in addition to who will step up at PG will be rebounding..which is where McKay could have really helped. Steve Taylor may be able to do it, and replace what Jamil did along with Luke Fischer...
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 28, 2014, 11:31:34 AM
My point in saying that, is that, if you believe Mayo made the correct choice - attacking basket because the defense was collapsing around Davante - then you must also believe Juan made the correct choice in doing the same. Regardless of his "ability to finish", he made the correct basketball play.
Part of making the correct basketball play is also knowing your limitations. I don't totally disagree with your point/logic, yet Juan really struggles going to the basket...never seems to get squared up, or elevate strong vertically...always flailing diagonally. I'd rather he take a couple dribbles into a pull up 8-10 footer than try to get all the way to the basket...
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 11:31:50 AM
I'd have to think Burton will get a TON of Jamil's minutes next year...give Burton another off-season of strength and conditioning work, his lateral quickness will improve, will have at least 1 year of experience under his belt defensively...and he should improve to be a solid on ball defender...and an absolute stud on offensive end.
How much more strength does that kid need? Hes a bull.
Quote from: HaywardsHeroes32 on February 28, 2014, 11:02:31 AM
Stop crying? Don't flatter yourself. No tears have been shed. Sorry that you had nothing, resorted to the generic "are you coaching" comment and got owned. Pathetic.
Yet in your post right here you flat out call a player BAD. I said Buzz was foolish, for that decision the one I mentioned. Of course you go literal and take it as a whole. Either way....being a fool is a little better then being straight up BAD.
The hypocrisy is bordering on crazy.
Again, you did not say "Buzz was foolish, for that decision the one I mentioned." Whatever that means. You said, "Buzz being the fool that he is..." I quoted it two or three different times. If you want me to quote it a fourth I will. I don't know how else to say it or what else to do. It is a direct quote from you. Exactly, word for word, what you wrote. I called you out on it, and
then you changed it to, "I said Buzz was a fool for keeping Davante out of the game so long in the 2nd half" (paraphrasing, not a direct quote like the first one is). Those are two
very different things to say. I do not know how else to put it. If you had originally said the 2nd thing I would have never even responded to it at all, but you didn't until I had responded to it. That is on you, not on me.
As far as "Bad Mayo," you've been around this board, you know that many posters, including myself, refer to "Good Mayo," who thankfully has shown up far more often this season than I expected, when Todd Mayo is playing good basketball within the flow of the offense, and "Bad Mayo" (or "Frustrating Mayo" as someone else put it) when he is forcing shots and not looking to pass. Last night we saw "Bad Mayo."
That is about all I will say on this subject, as the first part I have stated over and over and have provided you with your own word for word quote multiple times yet you say I "got owned" (how is that? Because you changed your argument after you got called out for it? Hilarious), and the second part you know but you're just trying to show how I "role."
Seriously, move on. You got heated watching Marquette play poorly and you typed something differently than you meant it. I read what you typed and took it as if you meant it that way. All you have to do is say, "I didn't mean to say Buzz is a fool, I meant to say Buzz made a foolish decision," and I will say, "I gotcha, then you are correct." But instead you continue to deny that you said Buzz was a fool when I continue to put a direct quote in there where you (nobody else) said, "Buzz being the fool that he is..." There is no other way to interpret that than you think Buzz is a fool and was acting as he is, a fool. You didn't mean it that way, I now get that, but when you typed it that is what it read. Don't deny it, because it's written by you. Just say you mistyped/misspoke/said something you didn't mean. It happens. Denying it happened just makes you look childish and foolish, because it did happen and there's no denying it.
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 11:31:50 AM
Concern for me next year in addition to who will step up at PG will be rebounding..which is where McKay could have really helped. Steve Taylor may be able to do it, and replace what Jamil did along with Luke Fischer...
I think a healthy Taylor will be a great rebounder. I know nothing about Fischer, but I hope he can produce for us, because we're going to need another big body.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 27, 2014, 10:24:53 PM
Hey dude. Gardner hasn't missed tonight. Literally. Why are you charging into a crowded lane with 30 seconds left on the shot clock up 3 with 3 minutes to go when your big man has scored your team's last 9 points? Why? Just why? Absolutely inexcusable.
Inexcusable? What's inexcusable is your petty, ill-informed commentary about Marquette basketball players.
There's a great commercial where Payton Manning shows up at the workplace of the idiots who criticize his play. He jeers and derides their job performance. Puts things in a very different light.
Quote from: CTWarrior on February 28, 2014, 11:36:48 AM
I think a healthy Taylor will be a great rebounder. I know nothing about Fischer, but I hope he can produce for us, because we're going to need another big body.
Fischer is a stretch 5. Very Bucky like. We will see how Buzz utilizes him.
Bad mayonnaise would be a cool band name....or maybe the latest strain of maryjane
Quote from: keefe on February 28, 2014, 11:37:09 AM
Inexcusable? What's inexcusable is your petty, ill-informed commentary about Marquette basketball players.
There's a great commercial where Payton Manning shows up at the workplace of the idiots who criticize his play. He jeers and derides their job performance. Puts things in a very different light.
I get it. Taking a shot with 30 seconds on the shot clock is not inexcusable. Accidentally dropping a bomb from a fighter jet on an innocent civilian town is inexcusable, something I know nothing about. Thank you for once again reminding me how small my problems are.
Just like this Marquette team struggles to understand time and situation within the game, you struggle to take things in context. It is a completely inexcusable basketball play to make. In the grand scheme of life, you are correct, it's just one shot in a little game.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 28, 2014, 11:39:06 AM
Bad mayonnaise would be a cool band name....or maybe the latest strain of maryjane
A buddy of mine had a great trick for getting out of obligatory social functions. Call in and inform the hostess that you ate some bad shellfish. Nobody will ever question it or wish to explore the details of your suffering. Bad Mayo would work, too, if you used the tainted oysters story too recently.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 28, 2014, 11:35:39 AM
Again, you did not say "Buzz was foolish, for that decision the one I mentioned." Whatever that means. You said, "Buzz being the fool that he is..." I quoted it two or three different times. If you want me to quote it a fourth I will. I don't know how else to say it or what else to do. It is a direct quote from you. Exactly, word for word, what you wrote. I called you out on it, and then you changed it to, "I said Buzz was a fool for keeping Davante out of the game so long in the 2nd half" (paraphrasing, not a direct quote like the first one is). Those are two very different things to say. I do not know how else to put it. If you had originally said the 2nd thing I would have never even responded to it at all, but you didn't until I had responded to it. That is on you, not on me.
As far as "Bad Mayo," you've been around this board, you know that many posters, including myself, refer to "Good Mayo," who thankfully has shown up far more often this season than I expected, when Todd Mayo is playing good basketball within the flow of the offense, and "Bad Mayo" (or "Frustrating Mayo" as someone else put it) when he is forcing shots and not looking to pass. Last night we saw "Bad Mayo."
That is about all I will say on this subject, as the first part I have stated over and over and have provided you with your own word for word quote multiple times yet you say I "got owned" (how is that? Because you changed your argument after you got called out for it? Hilarious), and the second part you know but you're just trying to show how I "role."
Seriously, move on. You got heated watching Marquette play poorly and you typed something differently than you meant it. I read what you typed and took it as if you meant it that way. All you have to do is say, "I didn't mean to say Buzz is a fool, I meant to say Buzz made a foolish decision," and I will say, "I gotcha, then you are correct." But instead you continue to deny that you said Buzz was a fool when I continue to put a direct quote in there where you (nobody else) said, "Buzz being the fool that he is..." There is no other way to interpret that than you think Buzz is a fool and was acting as he is, a fool. You didn't mean it that way, I now get that, but when you typed it that is what it read. Don't deny it, because it's written by you. Just say you mistyped/misspoke/said something you didn't mean. It happens. Denying it happened just makes you look childish and foolish, because it did happen and there's no denying it.
I know what I typed. I just admitted it in the post you quoted. You took the literal meaning of it, that I think he is all around foolish. I am aware of the way I typed it and how it could easily be interpreted.
But what I just said is, If I did mean he is in general a fool you also just called a player bad. Calling someone a fool is a little less insulting then calling them straight up bad. But either way they are equivalent and I am pretty sure you don't play college basketball, just like I don't coach.
Point was that this is a message board for discussion. It can't all just be positive things would go stale. We all know that truthfully we couldn't do any better but if we see something in hindsight it's fine to not agree with it.
Someone can disagree with my opinion all they want I just want to know why my opinion is disagreed with rather than being pointed to the obvious that I am not a coach.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 28, 2014, 11:42:07 AM
I get it. Taking a shot with 30 seconds on the shot clock is not inexcusable. Accidentally dropping a bomb from a fighter jet on an innocent civilian town is inexcusable, something I know nothing about. Thank you for once again reminding me how small my problems are.
Just like this Marquette team struggles to understand time and situation within the game, you struggle to take things in context. It is a completely inexcusable basketball play to make. In the grand scheme of life, you are correct, it's just one shot in a little game.
You don't get it. It's not about context; it's about decorum and civility. Why you think it's ok to crap on these kids is beyond me. You must be pretty special or you are just a nasty f#ck.
Quote from: MarkusSharkus on February 28, 2014, 12:25:15 AM
Easier said than done. The guy is getting walled off by up to 3 defenders at times. You can complain when it doesn't happen but it is simply hard to do when the other team knows what you intend on doing.
First off, he wasn't walled off by 3 defenders. He only drew double teams when he got the ball, and many times they chose not to double him at all. That's how he managed to score so many points and foul out two players.
Second, Mayo was driving early in the shot clock without allowing the offense to even attempt to feed DG. If he made those plays with six seconds on the shot clock because Georgetown was denying DG the ball, your argument would be valid. That simply wasn't the case.
Quote from: HaywardsHeroes32 on February 28, 2014, 11:48:39 AM
I know what I typed. I just admitted it in the post you quoted. You took the literal meaning of it, that I think he is all around foolish. I am aware of the way I typed it and how it could easily be interpreted.
But what I just said is, If I did mean he is in general a fool you also just called a player bad. Calling someone a fool is a little less insulting then calling them straight up bad. But either way they are equivalent and I am pretty sure you don't play college basketball, just like I don't coach.
Point was that this is a message board for discussion. It can't all just be positive things would go stale. We all know that truthfully we couldn't do any better but if we see something in hindsight it's fine to not agree with it.
Someone can disagree with my opinion all they want I just want to know why my opinion is disagreed with rather than being pointed to the obvious that I am not a coach.
Fair enough. What I saw in your post was someone who clearly got heated over a poor performance and called our coach a fool as a result, despite him having gone to 2 Sweet 16s and an Elite 8 in the past 3 years. So my response was to get you to step back a little bit from the ledge.
Again, "Bad Mayo" is not intended as "Todd Mayo is a bad player." It is a term that many here refer to when Todd makes poor decisions on the court like, in my opinion, he did last night.
Quote from: keefe on February 28, 2014, 11:49:42 AM
You don't get it. It's not about context; it's about decorum and civility. Why you think it's ok to crap on these kids is beyond me. You must be pretty special or you are just a nasty f#ck.
Saying one play was inexcusable is crapping on a kid? Wow. Alrighty then, my fault.
This coming from a guy who rips on high school kids for calling 9-1-1 because they got burned by some hot chocolate.
Quote from: MUSF on February 28, 2014, 11:55:49 AM
First off, he wasn't walled off by 3 defenders. He only drew double teams when he got the ball, and many times they chose not to double him at all. That's how he managed to score so many points and foul out two players.
Second, Mayo was driving early in the shot clock without allowing the offense to even attempt to feed DG. If he made those plays with six seconds on the shot clock because Georgetown was denying DG the ball, your argument would be valid. That simply wasn't the case.
Bingo. Time and situation. Apparently many posters here do not understand that concept either.
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 09:13:27 AM
He isn't wasting opportunities...was he playing selfish ball when he rallied us back from Villanova. Ever see D-Wade, Wesbrook, or any other slasher get stripped going to the basket, turn it over. Todd is the one guy who will force action on the team, and can collapse a D. Not always easy among the trees. Todd took 4 shots last night...you want to call that "get mine," selfish, whatever. Todd had 4 assists too.
And yes, there is something about a defense knowing what is coming and doing what they can to shut it off....Gardner was that guy down the stretch..and GTown tried to take it away...Todd made decision to penetrate..he makes the 4' floater and doesn't get stripped on the other one...everyone is happy.
And BTW...what happened the last time we went to Gardner (who I love), he got double/tripled and missed the shot....there is such a thing as going to the well 1 too many times..
It's got nothing to do with the total number of shots he took. He made poor decisions late in the game that hurt us offensively. Driving and forcing a shot early in the shot clock when DG is absolutely wrecking their defense is selfish / get mine basketball. You are always wondering why Mayo doesn't get consistent minutes. That's why.
Are you honestly saying that at that point in the game that driving and forcing a shot early in the shot clock was a good idea? Is it a good decision to not even attempt to run through the offense for 25-30 seconds to see if we can get the ball into the post? Couldn't Mayo have made the same exact play with 6 seconds left on the clock?
These are guys playing a game, they aren't doing all sorts of mental calculus all the time. Mayo saw an opening and went for the rim. It closed up quicker than he expected and the Georgetown guy made a nice play. Usually after a nice defensive play like that the result would have been out of bounds to Marquette. We got a little unlucky that it didn't work out that way. The way last night was going there was also a good chance of a foul call. A great decision? No. An inexcusable decsion? Also no.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 28, 2014, 11:57:47 AM
This coming from a guy who rips on high school kids for calling 9-1-1 because they got burned by some hot chocolate.
I faulted the school administration for calling 911.
Quote from: CTWarrior on February 28, 2014, 12:32:17 PM
These are guys playing a game, they aren't doing all sorts of mental calculus all the time. Mayo saw an opening and went for the rim. It closed up quicker than he expected and the Georgetown guy made a nice play. Usually after a nice defensive play like that the result would have been out of bounds to Marquette. We got a little unlucky that it didn't work out that way. The way last night was going there was also a good chance of a foul call. A great decision? No. An inexcusable decsion? Also no.
I take it you played the game...well said. Mayo took all of 5 shots last night..had 4 assists...he wasn't playing me first/selfish ball.
As for Todd going to rack early in the shot clock in that situation - he had a good driving lane, and took what he saw the defense giving him/offensive opportunity.
There is no reason to play stall ball at the 3 minute mark in a 4 point game. Waiting to go until the shot clock is down under 10 puts a hell of a lot more stress on the team to get a good look, than taking the first available good shoot/offensive opportunity.
Yes, time and score matter - if we were up 8 at the 3 minute mark...I could say better strategy would be to try to run clock and not shoot prior to 10 seconds left on shot clock...but in last night's game...no..time/score weren't relevant...
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 01:22:51 PM
I take it you played the game...well said. Mayo took all of 5 shots last night..had 4 assists...he wasn't playing me first/selfish ball.
As for Todd going to rack early in the shot clock in that situation - he had a good driving lane, and took what he saw the defense giving him/offensive opportunity.
There is no reason to play stall ball at the 3 minute mark in a 4 point game. Waiting to go until the shot clock is down under 10 puts a hell of a lot more stress on the team to get a good look, than taking the first available good shoot/offensive opportunity.
Yes, time and score matter - if we were up 8 at the 3 minute mark...I could say better strategy would be to try to run clock and not shoot prior to 10 seconds left on shot clock...but in last night's game...no..time/score weren't relevant...
I get it. He had an opportunity and he took it. We also had a guy who had scored 9 straight points for our team, had fouled out 2 guys already, and who had shot 8 for 8 up to that point. He hadn't miss. Georgetown had absolutely no answer for him. None. Get him the ball. Jamil understood this. Derrick understood this. Even Jake, who was hotter than he has ever been at Marquette, understood this. Todd did not. One play, we won the game, it can be forgiven. But it was the wrong play to make even if he saw an opportunity.
It may have been poor shot selection, but you put a scorer in that situation and he is going to look for that shot. It wasn't *that* outrageous of a shot.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 28, 2014, 01:35:58 PM
I get it. He had an opportunity and he took it. We also had a guy who had scored 9 straight points for our team, had fouled out 2 guys already, and who had shot 8 for 8 up to that point. He hadn't miss. Georgetown had absolutely no answer for him. None. Get him the ball. Jamil understood this. Derrick understood this. Even Jake, who was hotter than he has ever been at Marquette, understood this. Todd did not. One play, we won the game, it can be forgiven. But it was the wrong play to make even if he saw an opportunity.
Well the game Jamil was having he had no business looking to score, and Derrick generally doesn't look to score as it is.
As you saw the last time we went to Davante..he missed on a virtual triple team...GTown was trying to shut him off prior to that point when Todd took the ball to the basket..because of the very point you make above...it was obvious Gardner was eating them up, and they took action to try to correct it...which gave Todd a good driving lane.
As I said, if we were up 8 at that point, and he took a shot at 25 second mark of shot clock..then I'd have more of an issue with it..but the game being as close as it was - believe 2 point margin at that time....you take the first available good shot/offensive opportunity...and Todd is a scoring guard..he's supposed to shoot the damn ball.
Wasn't outrageous in any manner... the paint was open for our top slasher, defender made a great play...Gardner missed on later possession...take what's there at the time.
Quote from: Stone Cold on February 28, 2014, 02:09:12 PM
Wasn't outrageous in any manner... the paint was open for our top slasher, defender made a great play...Gardner missed on later possession...take what's there at the time.
...to drop him to 90% field goal percentage on the game. "Going to the well 1 time too many" (I know that wasn't you but it was referenced earlier in the thread) may be true, but I'm fairly certain if a guy finally misses on his 10th field goal attempt that going to the well 1 last time may not qualify as "1 time too many."
Quote from: wadesworld on February 28, 2014, 02:19:10 PM
...to drop him to 90% field goal percentage on the game. "Going to the well 1 time too many" (I know that wasn't you but it was referenced earlier in the thread) may be true, but I'm fairly certain if a guy finally misses on his 10th field goal attempt that going to the well 1 last time may not qualify as "1 time too many."
Well at the time of the play you are so frustrated with...Mayo was 2 of 3 in the game...really not trying to bust your balls...but just find that Mayo is really quick to get labeled as "Bad Mayo," when the guy is one of our better players...and has provided many valuable contributions in games. Early in the season, many were all over him for never passing...he does pass...and he assists at a higher rate than Vander did last year, or Jake Thomas this year...
He is also a shooting guard, that can get himself a shot off...and we need his skill set. I'm not trying to compare him to Kobe...but sometimes shooting guards have to force the action...and take shots. Feel all in all Todd has been pretty measured and selective all year.
Quote from: The Sultan of Slurpery on February 28, 2014, 01:57:55 PM
It wasn't *that* outrageous of a shot.
I would argue it wasn't outrageous. Our top threat to drive seizes the opportunity Buzz wants him to seize.
What's crazy about this board is that it's a bunch of guys who never played major sports of any kind. Half will criticize a kid for doing something while the other half find fault for not doing something. I refrain from criticizing these players because I couldn't begin to do what they do on the court.
I was at Memorial Stadium as a 9 year old when a morbidly obese guy was screaming the most vile names at Paul Blair for not stretching a single into a double. Here was a guy who had been chain smoking for 5 innings and likely winded himself walking to the latrine criticizing an athlete for not running faster. It was a lesson that took hold.
Quote from: keefe on February 28, 2014, 02:32:20 PM
I would argue it wasn't outrageous. Our top threat to drive seizes the opportunity Buzz wants him to seize.
What's crazy about this board is that it's a bunch of guys who never played major sports of any kind. Half will criticize a kid for doing something while the other half find fault for not doing something. I refrain from criticizing these players because I couldn't begin to do what they do on the court.
I was at Memorial Stadium as a 9 year old when a morbidly obese guy was screaming the most vile names at Paul Blair for not stretching a single into a double. Here was a guy who had been chain smoking for 5 innings and likely winded himself walking to the latrine criticizing an athlete for not running faster. It was a lesson that took hold.
But only for the athletes? Unless you have coached basketball at the Division 1 level and had some success and I just don't know about it. Because you sure aren't shy to criticize someone like Tom Crean or question how Oliver Purnell could have a job next season. You can cut the "holier than thou" crap until you criticize nobody who is in a position that you have never been in. I criticize the crap out of Tom Crean, but I'm not pretending to be the golden standard for when it's okay to criticize an athlete or a decision an athlete made.
Mayo's plays at the end of the game weren't "outrageous" or "inexcusable" but they were not good and they hurt the team. Those types of plays is what gets Todd a seat on the bench, and deservedly so IMO.
It seems apparent at this point that Todd is going to do what he does regardless of the situation. He is going to look to score first. Sometimes that works out for him/us and sometimes it doesn't. When it doesn't, it's bad and he needs to sit. Especially when other players like Jake and DG are playing well offensively. Todd's play LATE IN THE SECOND HALF (bolded so people don't start throwing out season and total game stats as a counter) was disruptive to our offense.
Quote from: MUSF on February 28, 2014, 03:28:17 PM
Mayo's plays at the end of the game weren't "outrageous" or "inexcusable" but they were not good and they hurt the team. Those types of plays is what gets Todd a seat on the bench, and deservedly so IMO.
It seems apparent at this point that Todd is going to do what he does regardless of the situation. He is going to look to score first. Sometimes that works out for him/us and sometimes it doesn't. When it doesn't, it's bad and he needs to sit. Especially when other players like Jake and DG are playing well offensively. Todd's play LATE IN THE SECOND HALF (bolded so people don't start throwing out season and total game stats as a counter) was disruptive to our offense.
So you really have an issue with the team's 3rd leading scorer and shooting guard taking 5 shots in 23 minutes, while he hands out 4 assists?
Have you not enjoyed winning 5 of the last 6 games - which also coincided with Todd's minutes being increased to 29 per game on average - although last night was down to 23...
Mayo is a key factor to this team's success and to suggest he's a liability out there just seems way to ready to "hate."
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 03:33:31 PM
So you really have an issue with the team's 3rd leading scorer and shooting guard taking 5 shots in 23 minutes, while he hands out 4 assists?
Have you not enjoyed winning 5 of the last 6 games - which also coincided with Todd's minutes being increased to 29 per game on average - although last night was down to 23...
Mayo is a key factor to this team's success and to suggest he's a liability out there just seems way to ready to "hate."
Again, IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HIS TOTAL SHOTS AND ASSISTS! Late in the game he made poor decisions that hurt the team. I had a problem with his inability to adapt his game to the situation.
Yes I have enjoyed the last 5 of 6 games. I have also acknowledged that Todd has played well in those games.
Mayo can be a key factor to our success when he is playing well. We are certainly a much better team when he is playing well. However, when he plays like he did on a few possessions late in the game last night, he is a liability and needs to take a seat. He's a streaky scorer. Ride him when he's hot and sit him when he's not.
Ironically, I could substitute the name Derrick Wilson with Mayo in your last sentence to describe a large number of your posts this year.
Quote from: MUSF on February 28, 2014, 03:44:56 PM
Again, IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HIS TOTAL SHOTS AND ASSISTS! Late in the game he made poor decisions that hurt the team. I had a problem with his inability to adapt his game to the situation.
Yes I have enjoyed the last 5 of 6 games. I have also acknowledged that Todd has played well in those games.
Mayo can be a key factor to our success when he is playing well. We are certainly a much better team when he is playing well. However, when he plays like he did on a few possessions late in the game last night, he is a liability and needs to take a seat. He's a streaky scorer. Ride him when he's hot and sit him when he's not.
Ironically, I could substitute the name Derrick Wilson with Mayo in your last sentence to describe a large number of your posts this year.
I think its been shown by many posts and points in this thread that those weren't bad basketball plays by Todd...you can't have it both ways...and love how he single handedly put us on his back and got us to OT against Nova...and then go be critical of him and his decisions last night...
As for your last sentence, that's a fair point other than to say its a pretty big reach to say Derrick isn't a liability on the floor offensively...and I'm not sure how fair it is to say he's been a key factor to this year's team's success given his production as the leading minute getter on the team...
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 03:53:49 PM
you can't have it both ways...and love how he single handedly put us on his back and got us to OT against Nova...and then go be critical of him and his decisions last night...
Well of course he can. Why not?
Quote from: The Sultan of Slurpery on February 28, 2014, 03:56:13 PM
Well of course he can. Why not?
Because what Todd did last night, was essentially the same exact thing he did against Villanova. It was nice to see that you too agreed his decisions last night weren't bad basketball plays.
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 03:59:24 PM
Because what Todd did last night, was essentially the same exact thing he did against Villanova.
No. He made the shots against Nova.
Quote from: Ners on February 28, 2014, 03:53:49 PM
I think its been shown by many posts and points in this thread that those weren't bad basketball plays by Todd...you can't have it both ways...and love how he single handedly put us on his back and got us to OT against Nova...and then go be critical of him and his decisions last night...
As for your last sentence, that's a fair point other than to say its a pretty big reach to say Derrick isn't a liability on the floor offensively...and I'm not sure how fair it is to say he's been a key factor to this year's team's success given his production as the leading minute getter on the team...
Yes, I can in fact have it both ways. Those plays last night might not have been bad basketball plays when viewed without context. They were bad plays for the specific situation. Again, Todd seems to have basically one setting - score first. Like any streaky scorer he can shoot you into games and shoot you out of them. So, ride him when he's hot and sit him when he's not.
I don't think it's a big reach to say that Derrick isn't an offensive liability. He can't shoot, but he does other things well.
Had Todd made one of the two shoots, this thread would not even exist. His "sin" was he missed one, and was stripped once.
Obviously, on the strip, the opposing team has figured out by watching film, that he when he drives, he carries the ball low.
Anyway, this is the same guy who scored 10 points in 38 seconds against Villinova to put the game into overtime. He simply did not make them this time.
Relax all ....
Quote from: wadesworld on February 28, 2014, 02:50:37 PM
Because you sure aren't shy to criticize someone like Tom Crean or question how Oliver Purnell could have a job next season.
I criticize Tom Crean because I met him and he is an insincere charlatan. My wife met him several times and she said he is the most self-serving, narcissistic boor she has ever dealt with. This from a woman who worked decades at Microsoft! But what my wife found most disturbing was how he mistreated people - that is those whom he deemed unworthy of his consideration. For years I held my observations to myself until I watched how he slithered out of Milwaukee without a single regard for anyone but himself.
Oliver Purnell? I could care less. He's getting paid millions to deliver results that have yet to happen.
If you cannot possibly comprehend the difference between critiquing the highly visible, easily measured strategic job performance of a CEO-level executive and the on-the-court performance of a teenager you are more fatuous than you appear.
Quote from: keefe on February 28, 2014, 04:16:56 PM
I criticize Tom Crean because I met him and he is an insincere charlatan. My wife met him several times and she said he is the most self-serving, narcissistic boor she has ever dealt with. This from a woman who worked decades at Microsoft! But what my wife found most disturbing was how he mistreated people - that is those whom he deemed unworthy of his consideration. For years I held my observations to myself until I watched how he slithered out of Milwaukee without a single regard for anyone but himself.
Oliver Purnell? I could care less. He's getting paid millions to deliver results that have yet to happen.
If you cannot possibly comprehend the difference between critiquing the highly visible, easily measured strategic job performance of a CEO-level executive and the on-the-court performance of a teenager you are more fatuous than you appear.
I do see the difference. The point is I criticized one play from a college player. If you consider that "crapping" on Todd Mayo then I guess I crapped on Todd Mayo. Shoot.
I will from now on consult with you before I criticize someone to make sure it is an acceptable person to criticize. Maybe before I call 9-1-1 to determine whether it is necessary or not as well.
Quote from: UticaBusBarn on February 28, 2014, 04:10:44 PM
Had Todd made one of the two shoots, this thread would not even exist. His "sin" was he missed one, and was stripped once.
Obviously, on the strip, the opposing team has figured out by watching film, that he when he drives, he carries the ball low.
Anyway, this is the same guy who scored 10 points in 38 seconds against Villinova to put the game into overtime. He simply did not make them this time.
Relax all ....
You are missing the point. His "sin" wasn't that he missed and turned the ball over, it's that he drove the ball and tried to force shots early in the shot clock when we were protecting a lead and DG was killing GTown in the post.
How many times do I have to explain that my issue with Todd's play last night has nothing to do with what he did against Nova? That was a completely different situation. As I've said multiple times now; Todd's a streaky scorer who seems to struggle with adapting his game to the situation. Therefore, you ride him when he's hot and sit him when he's not.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 28, 2014, 04:20:52 PM
I do see the difference. The point is I criticized one play from a college player. If you consider that "crapping" on Todd Mayo then I guess I crapped on Todd Mayo. Shoot.
I will from now on consult with you before I criticize someone to make sure it is an acceptable person to criticize. Maybe before I call 9-1-1 to determine whether it is necessary or not as well.
You crapped on Todd Mayo. Corn & Peanuts.
Quote from: MarkusSharkus on February 28, 2014, 12:25:15 AM
Easier said than done. The guy is getting walled off by up to 3 defenders at times. You can complain when it doesn't happen but it is simply hard to do when the other team knows what you intend on doing.
especially when they are completely sloughing off guarding the PG. 12 year old daughter at MU game: "Daddy. why isn't anybody guarding #12?"
Quote from: MUSF on February 28, 2014, 04:07:25 PM
Yes, I can in fact have it both ways. Those plays last night might not have been bad basketball plays when viewed without context. They were bad plays for the specific situation. Again, Todd seems to have basically one setting - score first. Like any streaky scorer he can shoot you into games and shoot you out of them. So, ride him when he's hot and sit him when he's not.
I don't think it's a big reach to say that Derrick isn't an offensive liability. He can't shoot, but he does other things well.
He shot the ball 5 times last night...at the time of the shot you have an issue with he was 2 of 3 from the floor.
Todd is 3rd on the team in assists, but 5th in minutes played. The guys ahead of him in assists are Derrick and Jamil who have played 252, and 191 more minutes respectively...but yea, all he does is look to shoot.
And as for you not thinking its a reach to say that Derrick isn't a liability offensively....wow...even his staunchest supporters here could concede that point.
Quote from: MUSF on February 28, 2014, 04:21:14 PM
As I've said multiple times now; Todd's a streaky scorer who seems to struggle with adapting his game to the situation. Therefore, you ride him when he's hot and sit him when he's not.
That would be a bad result. Every possible replacement for Todd Mayo on this year's team would be more detrimental to this team's success than simply leaving him in the game.
Of course I'm assuming our best line up is on the floor already in Gardner, J Wilson, Mayo, Thomas, D Wilson.