http://ajerseyguy.com/?p=5365
The Big East Presidents and Athletic Directors will meet in Atlanta on Friday to discuss the timing and the details of the break up with the Catholic 7 group of schools who announced their departure from the conference in December.
Although no formal announcement is expected, the group, which includes all the schools still committed to the Big East, is expected to approve a plan which would sell the name "Big East' to the Catholic 7, as well as allow the group–which includes Seton Hall. St. John's, Georgetown, DePaul, Marquette. Providence and Villanova–to leave in July.
In exchange for leaving two years earlier than the scheduled departure date of July 2015, the Catholic 7, who will not attend the Atlanta meeting, would agree to take considerably less money from a reserve pool of conference money earned by the Big East from exit fees and NCAA basketball tournament shares which is reported to be in excess of 60 million dollars.
The financial details of this arrangement still must be worked out, but both sides appear ready to announce that the Catholic 7 group will leave in July and take the Big East name with them.
Once that is done, both conferences can move ahead with their future plans.
This would be a big win on a LOT of fronts.
This is awesome, awesome news! Since I feel as though we got the best possible deal and a way to solidify the short-medium term stability of the conference, I might as well ask the genie in the bottle for one more thing. My one last wish would be to have Notre Dame back out of their ACC agreement and rejoin us.
Quote from: TomW1365 on February 28, 2013, 03:16:43 PM
This is awesome, awesome news! Since I feel as though we got the best possible deal and a way to solidify the short-medium term stability of the conference, I might as well ask the genie in the bottle for one more thing. My one last wish would be to have Notre Dame back out of their ACC agreement and rejoin us.
That chick dancing in the bikini will spend the weekend with you before UND backs out of the ACC and joins the C7.
Quote from: keefe on February 28, 2013, 03:22:36 PM
That chick dancing in the bikini will spend the weekend with you before UND backs out of the ACC and joins the C7.
+1
HAHAHAHA. Yup.
Nooooooooooooooooooooooo way ND is backing away
from that vault filled with football money.
football money? they aren't joining for football.
Acc will be the next conference to fall apart. quote me on that
AWESOME NEWS!
Quote from: lab_warrior on February 28, 2013, 03:25:26 PM
+1
HAHAHAHA. Yup.
Nooooooooooooooooooooooo way ND is backing away
from that vault filled with football money.
First the vault filled with football money is called B1G, not the ACC.
Second, ND is not a full football member of the ACC as the pay cut would be too great for ND (same if they joined the B1G). Instead they keep all their Football money (estimated at $40 million/year) and agreed to play 5 games with ACC members with ND getting consideration for ACC bowl bids. This deal was cut in September. Now that they made the NC game and have either the #2 or #1 recruiting class, that changes the equation.
If UNC jumps and then other good teams like Miami/Clemson/Virginia jump, then ND is a team looking to play for a NC every year and saddled with playing 5 crappy games a year for consideration to a second rate ACC bowl they do not want. All of sudden this does not look like that good a deal.
ND stays and is happy with its current ACC deal if the conference remains intact. But if the ACC imploded, then things might change. Implode is defined as UNC bolting to the B1G. If that happens, a reasonable outcome is for ND to stay fully independent in football like now and a good option for all their other sports would be the C7 ... a perfect fit for ND.
Quote from: mugoose on February 28, 2013, 03:39:00 PM
football money? they aren't joining for football.
Acc will be the next conference to fall apart. quote me on that
I think you're right. UNC and either Virginia or Georgia Tech (or both???) are on their way to the Big 10. FSU and/or Clemson could also being leaving for the Big XII SEC.
Quote from: mugoose on February 28, 2013, 03:39:00 PM
football money? they aren't joining for football.
Acc will be the next conference to fall apart. quote me on that
If North Carolina and Virginia bolt for the Big Ten, Duke will be out of the ACC in a heartbeat.
I rather have them take their time and make solid decisions, than rush to exit the conference. The first year they may only have 7 teams in the conference, as you would have to expect other teams to give notices to their old conferences befoe they join the C7.
Quote from: TomW1365 on February 28, 2013, 03:16:43 PM
This is awesome, awesome news! Since I feel as though we got the best possible deal and a way to solidify the short-medium term stability of the conference, I might as well ask the genie in the bottle for one more thing. My one last wish would be to have Notre Dame back out of their ACC agreement and rejoin us.
They considered it...
http://zagsblog.com/articles/catholic-7-looking-to-buy-big-east-name-on-their-way-out/#more-89983 (http://zagsblog.com/articles/catholic-7-looking-to-buy-big-east-name-on-their-way-out/#more-89983)
This end result of having the name is awesome. I hated how every single article phrased it that we were splitting to form our own league. This end result of having the name and the seven core teams solidifies the impression that we kicked out the football cancer and all its lower tiered baggage. The teams are the big east.... And it's going to be strong as ever in 12 months!!!!
Quote from: bilsu on February 28, 2013, 03:44:16 PM
I rather have them take their time and make solid decisions, than rush to exit the conference. The first year they may only have 7 teams in the conference, as you would have to expect other teams to give notices to their old conferences befoe they join the C7.
If this report is true, I have to assume they already kow they will have 10 teams ready to roll next year.
Quote from: ecompt on February 28, 2013, 03:43:29 PM
If North Carolina and Virginia bolt for the Big Ten, Duke will be out of the ACC in a heartbeat.
Where would Duke go?
SEC? No way.
BIG? Doesn't fit the profile.
Big 12? Same reason as BIG.
Big East? no way.
Très bien. A little less "reserve" funding for the new conference, but doesn't sound like we get screwed out of that pool either. Well worth the name and especially the date...I'm sure the extra $1M for A-10 fees to leave immediately rather than a year later won't be an issue for anyone, and word from a fan here was Creighton can leave when it wants.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 28, 2013, 03:45:52 PM
If this report is true, I have to assume they already kow they will have 10 teams ready to roll next year.
Yep, it's just a matter of who #10 is after Butler and Xavier you'd assume.
I wonder if the C7 will retain the rights to play at MSG?
You people need to get over this ACC is gonna die and the C7 will get Duke.
Schools will leave the ACC, yes, but look the B12 is surviving.
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on February 28, 2013, 03:42:45 PM
First the vault filled with football money is called B1G, not the ACC.
Second, ND is not a full football member of the ACC as the pay cut would be too great for ND (same if they joined the B1G). Instead they keep all their Football money (estimated at $40 million/year) and agreed to play 5 games with ACC members with ND getting consideration for ACC bowl bids. This deal was cut in September. Now that they made the NC game and have either the #2 or #1 recruiting class, that changes the equation.
If UNC jumps and then other good teams like Miami/Clemson/Virginia jump, then ND is a team looking to play for a NC every year and saddled with playing 5 crappy games a year for consideration to a second rate ACC bowl they do not want. All of sudden this does not look like that good a deal.
ND stays and is happy with its current ACC deal if the conference remains intact. But if the ACC imploded, then things might change. Implode is defined as UNC bolting to the B1G. If that happens, a reasonable outcome is for ND to stay fully independent in football like now and a good option for all their other sports would be the C7 ... a perfect fit for ND.
Your point is certainly bwell taken but this is not about football money because UND gets that regardless of conference affiliation for other sports. This is about brand and the good fathers at UND much prefer the warm, rich burled walnut of UNC, UVA, and Duke than the Corinthian Leather of this upstart conference.
Which is why I so fervently wish for the cream of the ACC to leave for better addresses, thereby leaving the sons of Fr Hesburgh with little more than a toned down Big East. At which point I say
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3gC0qsC6oA
Quote from: Warriors10 on February 28, 2013, 03:51:50 PM
You people need to get over this ACC is gonna die and the C7 will get Duke.
Schools will leave the ACC, yes, but look the B12 is surviving.
Agreed.
If UNC and/or Virginia leaves (and there still remain multiple stumbling blocks to that happening), the ACC grabs UConn and Cincy, and life goes on.
Seems as if we have two mysteries left. MSG? #10 for '13-14?
Funny how the discussion can end on everything quickly when the Fox boys make it pretty clear they'd like programming next winter, checkbook in hand.
That's tight, but I was still digging "God's Conference."
Quote from: Warriors10 on February 28, 2013, 03:51:50 PM
You people need to get over this ACC is gonna die and the C7 will get Duke.
Schools will leave the ACC, yes, but look the B12 is surviving.
Who's saying Duke to the C7? They have football. There's no place for them to go...they'll stay in the ACC until it dissolves.
Quote from: Warriors10 on February 28, 2013, 03:51:50 PM
You people need to get over this ACC is gonna die and the C7 will get Duke.
The ACC is not going to die, but it will blow up.
And Duke isn't going to the C7 because there's no such thing as the C7. It's called the Big East.
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2013, 03:57:21 PM
Agreed.
If UNC and/or Virginia leaves (and there still remain multiple stumbling blocks to that happening), the ACC grabs UConn and Cincy, and life goes on.
I agree with the UNC/Virginia/GT replacements, but what if FSU and Clemson also leaves for the SEC? There aren't that many other good options besides UConn and Cinci. Not that I am saying Duke will leave for the C7. The ACC could "implode" but then it would just replace with more mid major teams and become similar to what the Big East is becoming.
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2013, 03:57:21 PM
Agreed.
If UNC and/or Virginia leaves (and there still remain multiple stumbling blocks to that happening), the ACC grabs UConn and Cincy, and life goes on.
Life will go on, but it will be a much more frugal lifestyle for the members. In fact, they'll probably be lucky to get even the original TV contract offered to the Big East, which given their new membership, would be ironic on so many levels.
Quote from: jsglow on February 28, 2013, 03:59:06 PM
Seems as if we have two mysteries left. MSG? #10 for '13-14?
Funny how the discussion can end on everything quickly when the Fox boys make it pretty clear they'd like programming next winter, checkbook in hand.
+1. Definitely why the reports from a day or two ago were very believable. It's not the conference calling the shots, it's Fox. And we are willing to go along with it because they will pay us to.
Quote from: Bocephys on February 28, 2013, 03:48:35 PM
Yep, it's just a matter of who #10 is after Butler and Xavier you'd assume.
It will be Creighton...
Quote from: keefe on February 28, 2013, 03:56:16 PM
Your point is certainly well taken but this is not about football money because UND gets that regardless of conference affiliation for other sports. This is about brand and the good fathers at UND much prefer the warm, rich burled walnut of UNC, UVA, and Duke than the Corinthian Leather of this upstart conference.
Which is why I so fervently wish for the cream of the ACC to leave for better addresses, thereby leaving the sons of Fr Hesburgh with little more than a toned down Big East.
But if UVA and UNC leave and they are replaced by Uconn and Cincy, to go with Lousville, Pitt and Syracuse ... congratulations to ND, they just joined the BE football conference! That is why they might change (again, if it implodes, if no implosion then ND is happy with the status quo).
Also chances of Duke to the C7 ... 0.000% They will need a Football conference. What will Duke do? Nothing. They will stay in the ACC no matter what, even if it becomes Conference USA.
Quote from: lawwarrior12 on February 28, 2013, 03:12:10 PM
This would be a big win on a LOT of fronts.
What is the dollar cost and is is worth it?
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2013, 03:57:21 PM
Agreed.
If UNC and/or Virginia leaves (and there still remain multiple stumbling blocks to that happening), the ACC grabs UConn and Cincy, and life goes on.
And when Clemson and FSU bolt for the Big 12? To be joined, possibly, by NCSU, Miami, VPI? Life will be very different.
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on February 28, 2013, 04:08:40 PM
But if UVA and UNC leave and they are replaced by Uconn and Cincy, to go with Lousville, Pitt and Syracuse ... congratulations to ND, they just joined the BE football conference! That is why they might change (again, if it implodes, if no implosion then ND is happy with the status quo).
Notre Dame didn't join any football conference.
And while I like the spot MU is carving out for itself with the C7, given the circumstances, I don't think ND will flee to it from a hoops conference featuring Duke, Pitt, Louisville, Syracuse, UConn, Wake, Cincy, etc.
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2013, 04:14:05 PM
Notre Dame didn't join any football conference.
And while I like the spot MU is carving out for itself with the C7, given the circumstances, I don't think ND will flee to it from a hoops conference featuring Duke, Pitt, Louisville, Syracuse, UConn, Wake, Cincy, etc.
How can you even say that considering that's exactly what they just did by leaving the Big East?
To which you respond: The demise of the Big East was imminent. ND did what they had to do to find a stable home for their O-sports.
To which I respond: And once the demise of the ACC is imminent, again I ask why wouldn't they do the exact same thing all over again?
(http://bios.weddingbee.com/pics/89094/celebration.gif)
Quote from: TomW1365 on February 28, 2013, 03:16:43 PM
This is awesome, awesome news! Since I feel as though we got the best possible deal and a way to solidify the short-medium term stability of the conference, I might as well ask the genie in the bottle for one more thing. My one last wish would be to have Notre Dame back out of their ACC agreement and rejoin us.
Very reliable PC poster confirms C-7 reached out to nd and were declined.
Quote from: Aughnanure on February 28, 2013, 04:23:52 PM
(http://bios.weddingbee.com/pics/89094/celebration.gif)
My emotions summed nicely.
Now if they announce Creighton or any school other than Dayton....
(http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lolv2tdbPu1qfyumho1_250.gif)
Quote from: tominsalem on February 28, 2013, 04:25:16 PM
Very reliable PC poster confirms C-7 reached out to nd and were declined.
Well, I bet the $50 million exit fee is holding them up #1. If the Maryland exit fee gets reduced to under $35 and there's a mass exit I bet they could get out much more reasonably (and Fox may help) and without trouble considering they can use the "this isn't the conference we committed to, and are not committing 5 games a year to UCF, USF, Louisville, Cincy, etc).
Still, I won't get my hopes up. We can always just expand from 12 teams to 13 if they want in, no questions asked.
Quote from: Benny B on February 28, 2013, 04:19:13 PM
How can you even say that considering that's exactly what they just did by leaving the Big East?
To which you respond: The demise of the Big East was imminent. ND did what they had to do to find a stable home for their O-sports.
To which I respond: And once the demise of the ACC is imminent, again I ask why wouldn't they do the exact same thing all over again?
Even if the worst case scenario plays out for the ACC (not the foregone conclusion some here think) and the conference loses UNC, Clemson, Florida State and Virginia - maybe even NC State and Va Tech - that still leaves a conference with Duke, UConn, Louisville, Pitt, Syracuse, Cincy, Wake, BC, Ga. Tech and Miami, perhaps more (Va. Commonwealth as hoops only, for example. Maybe WVU gets tired of the Big 12 travel? USF probably comes aboard for football).
Why does Notre Dame leave that? That's at least as good, and probably better, as a hoops conference as the C7. That's better for Olympic sports than the C7. It's better for soccer, baseball, etc.
Other than some make-believe wish that Notre Dame cares about being among other Catholic schools (they obviously don't), why would they leave that?
If this news ends up being true, that would fan-freakin'-tastic.
As for ND joining us, I'd love it. But I'd also love a night with Scarlett Johansson ... and that ain't happenin' either!
Keeping the name is awesome! I hope we keep the conference tourney at MSG as well (or maybe, hopefully they keep us).
QuoteIf unable to join the ACC in 2013-14, the Fighting Irish would consider spending one season in the Catholic 7 league before moving to the ACC in 2014, a source said.
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9000502/catholic-7-schools-keep-big-east-name-new-league-next-season-according-sources (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9000502/catholic-7-schools-keep-big-east-name-new-league-next-season-according-sources)
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2013, 04:54:02 PM
Even if the worst case scenario plays out for the ACC (not the foregone conclusion some here think) and the conference loses UNC, Clemson, Florida State and Virginia - maybe even NC State and Va Tech - that still leaves a conference with Duke, UConn, Louisville, Pitt, Syracuse, Cincy, Wake, BC, Ga. Tech and Miami, perhaps more (Va. Commonwealth as hoops only, for example. Maybe WVU gets tired of the Big 12 travel? USF probably comes aboard for football).
Why does Notre Dame leave that? That's at least as good, and probably better, as a hoops conference as the C7. That's better for Olympic sports than the C7. It's better for soccer, baseball, etc.
Other than some make-believe wish that Notre Dame cares about being among other Catholic schools (they obviously don't), why would they leave that?
The quality may be better, I don't dispute that... but that's not why ND made the jump to the ACC; the primary reason ND went to the ACC was for stability. Now, all these months later, the ACC is on the verge of the same instability they were facing as a member of the Big East. So they haven't solved their main concern.
Sure they got the bowl tie-ins they also wanted (read: not needed), and which, at the time, the ACC members were willing to concede... but the landscape is changing, and there are at least two ACC members who aren't very happy about ND having a "bowl preference" in certain scenarios, ND will be playing a flock of ACC teams that isn't what it was a year ago, the ACC is on the verge of having its billion-dollar contract thwacked, and the bowl system is being overhauled.
This Maryland lawsuit has some far-reaching consequences that most people don't realize... does all of this mean that ND ends up in the C7? Of course not, but those dismissing the possibility of ND being in the C7 as wild fantasy are much further off the mark than the optimistic ones of the bunch.
Quote from: Warriors10 on February 28, 2013, 05:21:15 PM
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9000502/catholic-7-schools-keep-big-east-name-new-league-next-season-according-sources (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9000502/catholic-7-schools-keep-big-east-name-new-league-next-season-according-sources)
Very, very interesting. The ND thing. The fact that they're naming names: Creighton, Dayton and SLU (because there is no other school that rhymes with Payton, I guess).
This is happening crazy-fast, and I think it's great. Say what you want about Katz, but he is a good reporter with good sources, so this lends a lot of credence to the whole shebang.
As a N.C. resident, my biggest concern continues to be this: Will I be able to watch virtually every Marquette game, as has been the case the last couple of seasons (thanks to ESPN3)? Here's hoping Fox knows what it's doing. I have my doubts.
Quote from: Benny B on February 28, 2013, 05:33:25 PM
The quality may be better, I don't dispute that... but that's not why ND made the jump to the ACC; the primary reason ND went to the ACC was for stability. Now, all these months later, the ACC is on the verge of the same instability they were facing as a member of the Big East. So they haven't solved their main concern.
I'm not sure why you're convinced ND's primary interest here was stability. I think they simply wanted to get into the best conference possible and they knew the disintegrating (Old) Big East wasn't it.
Go read what Mike Brey said this week about the C7. Notre Dame had every opportunity to hop on board, and instead chose the ACC. and they made that decision knowing the ACC faced the kind of volatility the C7 would not.
So if stability was their primary concern, they sure had a funny way of showing it.
Quotethe ACC is on the verge of having its billion-dollar contract thwacked,
Citation needed.
QuoteThis Maryland lawsuit has some far-reaching consequences that most people don't realize... does all of this mean that ND ends up in the C7? Of course not, but those dismissing the possibility of ND being in the C7 as wild fantasy are much further off the mark than the optimistic ones of the bunch.
It does have some far-reaching consequences, but not why you think.
The only important consequence comes from a Maryland loss. That would slow - if not outright slam - the brakes on teams leaving the ACC, as taxpayers and lawmakers in those states aren't going to be eager to shell out $50 million in meager resources to help college football.
A Maryland win merely upholds the status quo.
Your final statement is your opinion. All evidence - including Brey's most recent comments - indicate ND has no interest in the C7.
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9000502/catholic-7-schools-keep-big-east-name-new-league-next-season-according-sources
According to John Anderson on SportsCenter, we will keep the Big East name and start with a 9-team league in 2013 on Fox. We will expand to 12 teams in 2014, the three additional teams will be Creighton, Dayton, and St. Louis.
Love it. So happy to be wrong about the departure date.
Most of all I'm so proud of MU and the C7 for taking control of their destiny. Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam!
Not at all surprised this is being announced today (or rather...Tuesday). Makes sure everyone is talking about our breakaway league throughout March. Something tells me this timing was not at all an accident.
This may be how they are working out how the C7 gets their money back by leaving a year early. Fox pays the same and it gets split 9 ways for one year then up to the planned 12.
Quote from: MU82 on February 28, 2013, 05:38:23 PM
Very, very interesting. The ND thing. The fact that they're naming names: Creighton, Dayton and SLU (because there is no other school that rhymes with Payton, I guess).
This is happening crazy-fast, and I think it's great. Say what you want about Katz, but he is a good reporter with good sources, so this lends a lot of credence to the whole shebang.
As a N.C. resident, my biggest concern continues to be this: Will I be able to watch virtually every Marquette game, as has been the case the last couple of seasons (thanks to ESPN3)? Here's hoping Fox knows what it's doing. I have my doubts.
Why? I'm under the impression that Fox always knows exactly what they're doing and will give ESPN serious competition.
Is there still time to trade Dayton for a team to be named later?
By having only 9 teams the first year, does the 9-way split of the TV money offset the departure costs? In other words, the other teams wait a year while the C7+2 recoup their costs and then have a 12 way split from then on?
Quote from: PTM on February 28, 2013, 04:32:25 PM
My emotions summed nicely.
Now if they announce Creighton or any school other than Dayton....
You'll love this thread: http://www.udpride.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22855 (http://www.udpride.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22855)
Will make it only that much better if they don't get an invite.
Quote from: tower912 on February 28, 2013, 06:07:17 PM
By having only 9 teams the first year, does the 9-way split of the TV money offset the departure costs? In other words, the other teams wait a year while the C7+2 recoup their costs and then have a 12 way split from then on?
Depends on the yet-to-exist contract. Since (as far as we know) nothing is signed yet, Fox might want to pay less in the first year for less content/viewership. But, if Fox is willing to pay the same amount per year from day one, regardless of how many are in the conference, that would certainly help offset the costs!
Quote from: MU Fan in Connecticut on February 28, 2013, 06:04:56 PM
Is there still time to trade Dayton for a team to be named later?
Wait ... didn't UDPride assure us Dayton wouldn't stoop so low as to join this new conference?
Quote from: tower912 on February 28, 2013, 05:48:15 PM
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9000502/catholic-7-schools-keep-big-east-name-new-league-next-season-according-sources
A quote from this article:
"If unable to join the ACC in 2013-14, the Fighting Irish would consider spending one season in the Catholic 7 league before moving to the ACC in 2014, a source said."
They
would consider spending one season in the Catholic 7 league. Wow, how nice of them. I forget; what was the reason that UConn and Cincy's inquiries about joining the C7 went nowhere fast? And ND thinks that it'll be different for them. That's hubris.
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2013, 06:19:20 PM
Wait ... didn't UDPride assure us Dayton wouldn't stoop so low as to join this new conference?
All very strange since UDPride also pointed out that Fox would only offer what they offered due to the former A10 teams joining the conference. Yet, Fox will settle for only two A10 teams the first year, and
no Dayton. Hummmmm
Quote from: Avenue Commons on February 28, 2013, 05:56:39 PM
Love it. So happy to be wrong about the departure date.
Most of all I'm so proud of MU and the C7 for taking control of their destiny. Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam!
Agreed, Educating Men and Women for Others, for the greater glory of God!
Im excited for next season when ND and Louisville paint the new conference name on the court only to replace it the following year.
Quote from: Groin_pull on February 28, 2013, 06:01:07 PM
Why? I'm under the impression that Fox always knows exactly what they're doing and will give ESPN serious competition.
Fox has a HUGE challenge in front of them. Incumbancy means a lot. Can they get the content to compete and how fast can they get it? All I know is television rates are going to go up even more because it is a sellers market and ESPN and FOX are going to spend a lot of money, with NBC also doing it, to buy up rights. They will pass on those costs to distributors (Uverse, Fios, Directv, Dish, Time Warner, etc) who will pass on some of those costs to their customers.
It's going to be wild.
Thoughts on keeping the logo? I'm not a huge fan of how it looks currently and I don't think it has as much brand importance as the name itself.
Quote from: LittleMurs on February 28, 2013, 06:24:00 PM
A quote from this article:
"If unable to join the ACC in 2013-14, the Fighting Irish would consider spending one season in the Catholic 7 league before moving to the ACC in 2014, a source said."
They would consider spending one season in the Catholic 7 league. Wow, how nice of them. I forget; what was the reason that UConn and Cincy's inquiries about joining the C7 went nowhere fast? And ND thinks that it'll be different for them. That's hubris.
I think the Irish can spend the year playing with themselves in the corner.
Can someone educate me on why teams like UConn and Cincy especially don't drop football? I don't really understand, do they hold out and pray they make it to a bigger conference? I heard on stubhub they're tickets are pretty cheap next year.
What's the breaking point for them before they just say "Fk it" and drop football, or is that just dumb thinking on my part?
Quote from: LittleMurs on February 28, 2013, 06:24:00 PM
"If unable to join the ACC in 2013-14, the Fighting Irish would consider spending one season in the Catholic 7 league before moving to the ACC in 2014, a source said."
Smart. ACC may evaporate in the next 12 months, ND is going to park it in the C7 and then lean on us for admission if the B1G can kill the ACC.
Quote from: AWegrzyn17 on February 28, 2013, 06:45:20 PM
Thoughts on keeping the logo? I'm not a huge fan of how it looks currently and I don't think it has as much brand importance as the name itself.
In my opinion, I would like to see us keep the logo, at least for the first couple of years. That way, we're not implicitly saying 'yea we're the big east, but a newer version'. I like the 'we're still the old big east that you are familiar with--no changes, still bball first' message.
Quote from: JDuquaine on February 28, 2013, 06:57:10 PM
Can someone educate me on why teams like UConn and Cincy especially don't drop football? I don't really understand, do they hold out and pray they make it to a bigger conference? I heard on stubhub they're tickets are pretty cheap next year.
What's the breaking point for them before they just say "Fk it" and drop football, or is that just dumb thinking on my part?
Not saying it's "dumb thinking," but football is potentially way more lucrative.
Quote from: Hamostradamus on February 28, 2013, 07:05:41 PM
Smart. ACC may evaporate in the next 12 months, ND is going to park it in the C7 and then lean on us for admission if the B1G can kill the ACC.
The ACC isn't going anywhere. Please stop believing this is the case. It may lose no one...it may lose two, three or up to five schools, but it isn't going away.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on February 28, 2013, 07:15:55 PM
The ACC isn't going anywhere. Please stop believing this is the case. It may lose no one...it may lose two, three or up to five schools, but it isn't going away.
No, but the Big East may ultimatley turn out to be a better option for them, as the ACC is going to see changes. If the Big East can accommodate them on a potenially short-term basis, it would seem to be a fairly low risk, possibly high reward move. It's a door I would certainly recommend keeping open.
Quote from: AWegrzyn17 on February 28, 2013, 06:45:20 PM
Thoughts on keeping the logo? I'm not a huge fan of how it looks currently and I don't think it has as much brand importance as the name itself.
Research has shown that the shape of the Coke bottle exceeds in value the formal name of the company, Coca Cola. My hunch is that the Big East logo has intrinsic value that is worth keeping.
So MSG seems to be the big remaining question. Anyone know if the current Big East is still locked in for next year (and beyond)?
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 28, 2013, 07:20:15 PM
No, but the Big East may ultimatley turn out to be a better option for them, as the ACC is going to see changes. If the Big East can accommodate them on a potenially short-term basis, it would seem to be a fairly low risk, possibly high reward move. It's a door I would certainly recommend keeping open.
The ACC is only a better deal if it stays in tact. If there are more defections next year and they have to replace top-tier defections with second-rate schools, the existing tv deal is probably renegotiated and ND may decide we can pay more money.
ESPN updated their article and it now says this:
Creighton has emerged as the favorite to become the 10th team, and would also join next season, according to sources.
Hopefully we can join you guys next year in the Big East!
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9000502/catholic-7-schools-keep-big-east-name-new-league-next-season-according-sources (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9000502/catholic-7-schools-keep-big-east-name-new-league-next-season-according-sources)
Quote from: JDuquaine on February 28, 2013, 06:57:10 PM
Can someone educate me on why teams like UConn and Cincy especially don't drop football? I don't really understand, do they hold out and pray they make it to a bigger conference? I heard on stubhub they're tickets are pretty cheap next year.
What's the breaking point for them before they just say "Fk it" and drop football, or is that just dumb thinking on my part?
Cincy especially? ND got its current football coach, Brian Kelly from Cincy. In his last year at Cincy, 2009, Kelly had Ciny ranked third in the country.
NEW YORK (AP) -- The breakup of the Big East's football and basketball schools appears to be on the fast track.
The major college football members will meet in Atlanta on Friday to discuss the departure of the seven basketball schools that are planning to leave the conference and create a new league.
According to media reports, the basketball schools plan to have their new conference up and running for the 2013-14 school year and will pay the football schools to keep the Big East name and play its conference tournament at Madison Square Garden in New York.
Big East Commissioner Mike Aresco says no deal has been completed between the two groups but ''some of this stuff is clearly coming down to the wire.''
Quote from: TVDirector on February 28, 2013, 07:42:02 PM
NEW YORK (AP) -- The breakup of the Big East's football and basketball schools appears to be on the fast track.
The major college football members will meet in Atlanta on Friday to discuss the departure of the seven basketball schools that are planning to leave the conference and create a new league.
According to media reports, the basketball schools plan to have their new conference up and running for the 2013-14 school year and will pay the football schools to keep the Big East name and play its conference tournament at Madison Square Garden in New York.
Big East Commissioner Mike Aresco says no deal has been completed between the two groups but ''some of this stuff is clearly coming down to the wire.''
Keeping the name and MSG game is vital. Great win for us.
As a TV Director, can you shed light on the veracity of the various reports?
Quote from: JDuquaine on February 28, 2013, 06:57:10 PM
Can someone educate me on why teams like UConn and Cincy especially don't drop football? I don't really understand, do they hold out and pray they make it to a bigger conference? I heard on stubhub they're tickets are pretty cheap next year.
What's the breaking point for them before they just say "Fk it" and drop football, or is that just dumb thinking on my part?
Pride. Money. Exposure. Etc.
All the money UCONN spent on going up to their level in football now in the last 10 years...they aren't going to go backward....even if they are losing money. The politicos in CT want the prestige.
http://www.ct.com/news/advocates/latest-news/brief-20111208,0,54104.story
Same for UC
Short of everything remaining as it was a year ago, assuming all of this comes to fruition, could this have worked out any better for MU? Solid, old school conference, Big East, MSG...and moving to Fox who easily delivers the highest quality sports production is an added bonus.
I don't know if anyone has posted this link yet but ESPN has an article on it too. As long as we have the Garden and the name we will be just fine. Xavier, Butler, and/or Creighton are definitely a bonus.
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9000502/catholic-7-schools-keep-big-east-name-new-league-next-season-according-sources (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9000502/catholic-7-schools-keep-big-east-name-new-league-next-season-according-sources)
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 28, 2013, 07:49:07 PM
Short of everything remaining as it was a year ago, assuming all of this comes to fruition, could this have worked out any better for MU? Solid, old school conference, Big East, MSG...and moving to Fox who easily produces the highest quality sports production is an added bonus.
No, not really, it does seem ideal. Well, maybe if Gonzaga moved its campus to Cleveland.
Quote from: Jet915 on February 28, 2013, 07:37:15 PM
ESPN updated their article and it now says this:
Creighton has emerged as the favorite to become the 10th team, and would also join next season, according to sources.
Hopefully we can join you guys next year in the Big East!
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9000502/catholic-7-schools-keep-big-east-name-new-league-next-season-according-sources (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9000502/catholic-7-schools-keep-big-east-name-new-league-next-season-according-sources)
No MVC exit fee has to give you guys a definite edge.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 28, 2013, 07:49:07 PM
Short of everything remaining as it was a year ago, assuming all of this comes to fruition, could this have worked out any better for MU? Solid, old school conference, Big East, MSG...and moving to Fox who easily delivers the highest quality sports production is an added bonus.
I blame Larry Williams for this debacle
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 28, 2013, 07:46:13 PM
Pride. Money. Exposure. Etc.
All the money UCONN spent on going up to their level in football now in the last 10 years...they aren't going to go backward....even if they are losing money. The politicos in CT want the prestige.
http://www.ct.com/news/advocates/latest-news/brief-20111208,0,54104.story
Same for UC
Pride goeth before the fall
Proverbs 16:18
Quote from: AWegrzyn17 on February 28, 2013, 06:45:20 PM
Thoughts on keeping the logo? I'm not a huge fan of how it looks currently and I don't think it has as much brand importance as the name itself.
Easy answer. Go back to the original Big East logo when it was a basketball only conference.
Shows continuity and reestablishes the brand as a strong bball conference.
Quote from: Victor McCormick on February 28, 2013, 08:02:16 PM
Easy answer. Go back to the original Big East logo when it was a basketball only conference.
Shows continuity and reestablishes the brand as a strong bball conference.
This one?
(http://media.scout.com/Media/College_Mens_Basketball/70_BigEastLogo.JPG)
I have a feeling that they'll do what most marketers do, put their stamp on it and create a new one.
Yup Chicos, thats the one.
Youre probably right, theyll make a new one. But I think this would be better.
That looks a little too 80s-ish for my taste.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on February 28, 2013, 07:15:55 PM
The ACC isn't going anywhere. Please stop believing this is the case. It may lose no one...it may lose two, three or up to five schools, but it isn't going away.
Of course it is not going away.
Remember ND football agreed to play 5 acc games a year. If the conference implodes and the new ACC becomes a BE CUSA, Duke/Wake/NS ST hybrid, ND may want 40% of their football schedule to be these schools.
It would leave to free football.
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on February 28, 2013, 08:17:33 PM
Of course it is not going away.
Remember ND football agreed to play 5 acc games a year. If the conference implodes and the new ACC becomes a BE CUSA, Duke/Wake/NS ST hybrid, ND may want 40% of their football schedule to be these schools.
It would leave to free football.
I've been reading this whole post and finally someone brings up the 5 ACC games the ND football team has agreed to in its schedule. Contrary to AnotherMU84, I believe this holds ND to the ACC. With all the other big football conferences like the Big Ten adding more conference games it becomes harder for ND to schedule with other teams. They've already halted series with Michigan among others to accommodate the ACC deal. Just not seeing ND leaving the ACC. Not sure I see the ACC blowing up like everyone else thinks it will either.
Quote from: GoldenEagle2002 on February 28, 2013, 08:34:13 PM
I've been reading this whole post and finally someone brings up the 5 ACC games the ND football team has agreed to in its schedule. Contrary to AnotherMU84, I believe this holds ND to the ACC. With all the other big football conferences like the Big Ten adding more conference games it becomes harder for ND to schedule with other teams. They've already halted series with Michigan among others to accommodate the ACC deal. Just not seeing ND leaving the ACC. Not sure I see the ACC blowing up like everyone else thinks it will either.
In a future years this is ND schedule
* 5 ACC games against schools like BC/Wake/Uconn/Duke/Cuse
* Navy (they said they will schedule them every year forever)
* Purdue (who they have play more than any other schools and will not drop)
* The two west coast schools of Stanford and USC of alternating home/away schedules
That leaves them three at-large games to schedule. Unless those final three games are with the top of the SEC (which it will not be), this might not be a good enough schedule to get them into the National Championship game with a 12 - 0 or 11 - 1 record (since they made the NC game last year and have the #2 or #1 recruiting class coming in, that is now a realistic goal every year). This is why they may have to exit, to free the football schedule.
And again, if the ACC stays intact (which may of you say and you could be right) then that 5 game ACC schedule can be UNC/Miami/UVA/Clemson and GT which fits ND's NC goal. That is a world different than what the ACC might be if their is a mass exodus.
Quote from: LittleMurs on February 28, 2013, 07:52:34 PM
No, not really, it does seem ideal. Well, maybe if Gonzaga moved its campus to Cleveland.
My biggest reservation about this new conference is the competition. Let's be honest here...it's not all that strong. Specifically with the lower end schools...SH, DePaul, Providence etc. In the Big East, there were enough top level teams, that no one really noticed the bad teams per say. In this league, there's not that luxury. The bottom echelon teams will stand out more because there aren't any UL's or Syracuse's to cover those warts. I wouldn't mind it as much of they added Creighton, Xavier and Butler and stayed at 10, but when you start going to 12 and the conversations involve SLU,, Dayton etc..you're starting to walk a slippery slope and perception may be that of a "mid major" conference.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 28, 2013, 07:56:06 PM
I blame Larry Williams for this debacle
Well, sure, he's done a great job steering MU through this, but did you see his hat?!?!?
More seriously, those who ripped LW as a small-timer incapable of handling this situation ought to be dining on crow tonight.
Quote from: GoldenEagle2002 on February 28, 2013, 08:34:13 PM
I've been reading this whole post and finally someone brings up the 5 ACC games the ND football team has agreed to in its schedule. Contrary to AnotherMU84, I believe this holds ND to the ACC. With all the other big football conferences like the Big Ten adding more conference games it becomes harder for ND to schedule with other teams. They've already halted series with Michigan among others to accommodate the ACC deal. Just not seeing ND leaving the ACC. Not sure I see the ACC blowing up like everyone else thinks it will either.
I tried to make this argument once and Bennie jumped all over me.
Quote from: muguru on February 28, 2013, 08:53:47 PM
My biggest reservation about this new conference is the competition. Let's be honest here...it's not all that strong. Specifically with the lower end schools...SH, DePaul, Providence etc.
Add St. Johns to this list and bingo! This is the key to the new conference. If any three of these four can be "bubble teams" yearly, this can be a great conference. Otherwise half our new schedule is against schools that would be the middle of the Horizon league and the entire operation starts smelling like a mid-major.
The key is raising the bottom, not expanding the top.
Quote from: muguru on February 28, 2013, 08:53:47 PM
My biggest reservation about this new conference is the competition. Let's be honest here...it's not all that strong. Specifically with the lower end schools...SH, DePaul, Providence etc. In the Big East, there were enough top level teams, that no one really noticed the bad teams per say. In this league, there's not that luxury. The bottom echelon teams will stand out more because there aren't any UL's or Syracuse's to cover those warts. I wouldn't mind it as much of they added Creighton, Xavier and Butler and stayed at 10, but when you start going to 12 and the conversations involve SLU,, Dayton etc..you're starting to walk a slippery slope and perception may be that of a "mid major" conference.
Completely get what you are saying. Though I don't think any conference that includes Georgetown will be considered a mid major. They are one of the biggest national brands in NCAA hoops.
This does put a premium on the non conference schedule. We are losing 5 top 50 RPI teams off the schedule, and two of those are in the top 15. It would be great to see some long term home and homes announced with some big time programs. UL and ND would be a good start. The Zags would be fun,another Big 10 school (MSU?), maybe a premium PAC 12 team (Arizona? UCLA?). I don't know how realistic any of those teams are, and obviously I'm just making stuff up, but MU needs to add some big time pop to the non conference schedule.
Quote from: GoldenEagle2002 on February 28, 2013, 08:34:13 PM
With all the other big football conferences like the Big Ten adding more conference games it becomes harder for ND to schedule with other teams. They've already halted series with Michigan among others to accommodate the ACC deal.
I realize their is irrational hatred for ND on this board so this will fall on deaf ears.
Yes scheduling will get harder, but not for ND. Everyone wants them. Other top football schools will throw schools off their schedule to make room for them. Michigan is upset that ND dropped them (not the other way around).
ND is the exception to every rule which is why everyone hates them. And that is why football made $42 million last year versus $25 million for the typical B1G schools (and $15 to $17 for the typical ACC school).
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2013, 08:59:52 PM
Well, sure, he's done a great job steering MU through this, but did you see his hat?!?!?
More seriously, those who ripped LW as a small-timer incapable of handling this situation ought to be dining on crow tonight.
Hell, yeah! What kind of a rube wears a
sweat stained cap to his school's big exposure game?
Oh, wait, it actually was a camo hat designed to match the team's camo uniforms. Never mind.
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on February 28, 2013, 09:00:28 PM
Add St. Johns to this list and bingo! This is the key to the new conference. If any three of these four can be "bubble teams" yearly, this can be a great conference. Otherwise half our new schedule is against schools that would be the middle of the Horizon league and the entire operation starts smelling like a mid-major.
The key is raising the bottom, not expanding the top.
Agree with raising the bottom but let's recall that the new BEast would be sending 50% of its teams to the NCAA if the invitations hit the mail today in either the 10 or 12 team configuration. That's pretty darn good.
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on February 28, 2013, 09:00:28 PM
Add St. Johns to this list and bingo! This is the key to the new conference. If any three of these four can be "bubble teams" yearly, this can be a great conference. Otherwise half our new schedule is against schools that would be the middle of the Horizon league and the entire operation starts smelling like a mid-major.
The key is raising the bottom, not expanding the top.
St. John's could be dynamite the next couple of seasons. Their roster has no seniors and only one junior. If they continue to mature and improve, they could be very dangerous.
Quote from: muguru on February 28, 2013, 08:53:47 PM
My biggest reservation about this new conference is the competition. Let's be honest here...it's not all that strong. Specifically with the lower end schools...SH, DePaul, Providence etc. In the Big East, there were enough top level teams, that no one really noticed the bad teams per say. In this league, there's not that luxury. The bottom echelon teams will stand out more because there aren't any UL's or Syracuse's to cover those warts. I wouldn't mind it as much of they added Creighton, Xavier and Butler and stayed at 10, but when you start going to 12 and the conversations involve SLU,, Dayton etc..you're starting to walk a slippery slope and perception may be that of a "mid major" conference.
I don't think many will judge a conference on its three worst teams, but since that's what you want to do here let's see how the new BE's bottom three stack up in terms of current RPI:
Big East - Providence (85), Seton Hall (115), DePaul (183)
ACC - Wake Forest (151), Clemson (154), VaTech (166)
Big 10 - Purdue (131), Northwestern (144), Penn State (184)
Big 12 - Texas (126), Texas Tech (222), TCU (228)
PAC 10 - Utah (179), Oregon State (188), Washington St. (190)
SEC - S. Carolina (201), Auburn (219), Miss. State (237)
In perspective, our dregs aren't all that bad, are they?
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2013, 09:22:16 PM
I don't think many will judge a conference on its three worst teams, but since that's what you want to do here let's see how the new BE's bottom three stack up in terms of current RPI:
Big East - Providence (85), Seton Hall (115), DePaul (183)
ACC - Wake Forest (151), Clemson (154), VaTech (166)
Big 10 - Purdue (131), Northwestern (144), Penn State (184)
Big 12 - Texas (126), Texas Tech (222), TCU (228)
PAC 10 - Utah (179), Oregon State (188), Washington St. (190)
SEC - S. Carolina (201), Auburn (219), Miss. State (237)
In perspective, our dregs aren't all that bad, are they?
OH NO A LOT OF TEXAS TEAMS
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2013, 09:22:16 PM
I don't think many will judge a conference on its three worst teams, but since that's what you want to do here let's see how the new BE's bottom three stack up in terms of current RPI:
Big East - Providence (85), Seton Hall (115), DePaul (183)
ACC - Wake Forest (151), Clemson (154), VaTech (166)
Big 10 - Purdue (131), Northwestern (144), Penn State (184)
Big 12 - Texas (126), Texas Tech (222), TCU (228)
PAC 10 - Utah (179), Oregon State (188), Washington St. (190)
SEC - S. Carolina (201), Auburn (219), Miss. State (237)
In perspective, our dregs aren't all that bad, are they?
Wow, Virginia Tech fires its coach, loses its best player to Florida, and loses its best recruit to Louisville, and they are still better than DePaul. Yikes! This doesn't take away from your overall point, though.
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2013, 09:22:16 PM
I don't think many will judge a conference on its three worst teams, but since that's what you want to do here let's see how the new BE's bottom three stack up in terms of current RPI:
Big East - Providence (85), Seton Hall (115), DePaul (183)
ACC - Wake Forest (151), Clemson (154), VaTech (166)
Big 10 - Purdue (131), Northwestern (144), Penn State (184)
Big 12 - Texas (126), Texas Tech (222), TCU (228)
PAC 10 - Utah (179), Oregon State (188), Washington St. (190)
SEC - S. Carolina (201), Auburn (219), Miss. State (237)
In perspective, our dregs aren't all that bad, are they?
I like the positive thoughts, but weren't the RPIs of our bottom 3 helped immensely by games against the likes of Syracuse, Louisville, Pitt and UConn -- teams they won't get to play in the new league?
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on February 28, 2013, 07:49:07 PM
Short of everything remaining as it was a year ago, assuming all of this comes to fruition, could this have worked out any better for MU? Solid, old school conference, Big East, MSG...and moving to Fox who easily delivers the highest quality sports production is an added bonus.
Yep ... sub ND and Gonzaga for Dayton and St. Louis.
MU82 the bottom teams in those conferences also play the top dogs....it's not just Prov, SH, and DePaul. Clemson plays Duke and Miami, Penn State plays Indiana, Michigan, Mich. St., TCU plays Kansas and K. State, etc.
Quote from: muguru on February 28, 2013, 08:53:47 PM
My biggest reservation about this new conference is the competition. Let's be honest here...it's not all that strong. Specifically with the lower end schools...SH, DePaul, Providence etc. In the Big East, there were enough top level teams, that no one really noticed the bad teams per say. In this league, there's not that luxury. The bottom echelon teams will stand out more because there aren't any UL's or Syracuse's to cover those warts. I wouldn't mind it as much of they added Creighton, Xavier and Butler and stayed at 10, but when you start going to 12 and the conversations involve SLU,, Dayton etc..you're starting to walk a slippery slope and perception may be that of a "mid major" conference.
DePaul, Seton Hall and Providence have been good teams in the past. In fact, during some of their recent successful times, Marquette was lousy and fans of those schools could have bitched about having to carry a crappy Marquette team. Sports is cyclical. I like the comments about bringing the bottom of the league up. It won't be easy, but it can happen. The right coaches, the right commitment from the schools, a few recruits who turn out better than expected, and it can happen. It happened at Marquette, didn't it?
Quote from: Stronghold on February 28, 2013, 09:41:57 PM
MU82 the bottom teams in those conferences also play the top dogs....it's not just Prov, SH, and DePaul. Clemson plays Duke and Miami, Penn State plays Indiana, Michigan, Mich. St., TCU plays Kansas and K. State, etc.
I understand that. I'm just saying that playing those teams helps the Prov, SH and DeP numbers whereas next season that won't be the case. Those three teams could have the exact same records they have right now and have RPIs 50 or more points lower. Not to be a bummer, just making sure we're comparing apples to apples.
Don't have to pay now to repaint the Bradley Center floor, aina?
Quote from: LittleMurs on February 28, 2013, 09:00:22 PM
I tried to make this argument once and Bennie jumped all over me.
Not sure who this Bennie guy is, but he was right to do so.
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on February 28, 2013, 09:05:20 PM
Yes scheduling will get harder, but not for ND. Everyone wants them. Other top football schools will throw schools off their schedule to make room for them. Michigan is upset that ND dropped them (not the other way around).
ND is the exception to every rule which is why everyone hates them. And that is why football made $42 million last year versus $25 million for the typical B1G schools (and $15 to $17 for the typical ACC school).
Bingo was his name-o.
If anyone has any question as to why ND made the ACC decision, just ask an ND booster. I understand that most of us would rather have a lobotomy than to do that, but that little tidbit of knowledge might be worth the price of admission.
Quote from: MU82 on February 28, 2013, 09:45:47 PM
I understand that. I'm just saying that playing those teams helps the Prov, SH and DeP numbers whereas next season that won't be the case. Those three teams could have the exact same records they have right now and have RPIs 50 or more points lower. Not to be a bummer, just making sure we're comparing apples to apples.
But they'll be playing G'Town twice (current RPI = 10), MU twice (current RPI = 13), Butler twice (current RPI = 29), etc. And while they'll be losing SU, Louisville, etc. from their skeds, they'll also be losing Rutgers and South Florida.
Syracuse and Louisville are no doubt better than Xavier and Butler, but on the other side, Creighton and St. Louis are better than Rutgers and USF.
The highs may not be as high, but the lows won't be as low.
In no way am I suggesting that this league will be as good as the 2005-12 Big East, but it'll be respectable and certainly well above the rank of mid major.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 28, 2013, 08:05:56 PM
This one?
(http://media.scout.com/Media/College_Mens_Basketball/70_BigEastLogo.JPG)
I have a feeling that they'll do what most marketers do, put their stamp on it and create a new one.
Always liked the original logo better. Wonder if the the "new" Big East would go retro as a sign of getting back to the conference's basketball roots.
Quote from: Heavy Gear on February 28, 2013, 11:06:52 PM
Always liked the original logo better. Wonder if the the "new" Big East would go retro as a sign of getting back to the conference's basketball roots.
Yea, sure.
(https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcROMhElAKID8vhnz-c_w1cjHr_MOUXikVNsz5IjFneCs5O-j0v2)
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on February 28, 2013, 09:05:20 PM
I realize their is irrational hatred for ND on this board so this will fall on deaf ears.
Yes scheduling will get harder, but not for ND. Everyone wants them. Other top football schools will throw schools off their schedule to make room for them. Michigan is upset that ND dropped them (not the other way around).
ND is the exception to every rule which is why everyone hates them. And that is why football made $42 million last year versus $25 million for the typical B1G schools (and $15 to $17 for the typical ACC school).
Where did you get the figure that Notre Dame made $42M off their television deal last year?
And ND also wants access to bowl tie ins in non BCS years. If they don't get access to decent bowl games, they lose money as well.
Quote from: MU82 on February 28, 2013, 09:40:18 PM
Yep ... sub ND and Gonzaga for Dayton and St. Louis.
Gonzaga was never an option. Keefe was wrong about that.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 01, 2013, 05:09:26 AM
Where did you get the figure that Notre Dame made $42M off their television deal last year?
And ND also wants access to bowl tie ins in non BCS years. If they don't get access to decent bowl games, they lose money as well.
Actually it is $43 million
http://espn.go.com/blog/playbook/dollars/post/_/id/2556/texas-tops-in-football-profit-revenue
School Rev. Exp. Profit
Texas $103.8 $25.9 $77.9
Michigan $85.2 $23.6 $61.6
Georgia $75.0 $22.7 $52.3
Florida $74.1 $23.1 $51.1
Alabama $82.0 $36.9 $45.1
LSU $68.8 $24.1 $44.8
Auburn $77.2 $33.3 $43.8
Notre Dame $69.0 $25.8 $43.2
Arkansas $64.2 $24.3 $39.9
Nebraska $55.1 $18.7 $36.4
See no. 9 just below ND, that is why you leave UW without thinking twice. Also note 6 of the top 10 are SEC schools ... Maybe this is why only SEC schools wins the national Championship (7 straight and counting)
You are not comparing apples and oranges. The 43 M is all revenue. Not just television. The 20 M you attribute to big ten is only television and exceeds what NBC pays Nd.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 01, 2013, 05:09:26 AM
Where did you get the figure that Notre Dame made $42M off their television deal last year?
And ND also wants access to bowl tie ins in non BCS years. If they don't get access to decent bowl games, they lose money as well.
How much do teams actually make from playing in a second tier bowl?
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 01, 2013, 05:09:26 AM
And ND also wants access to bowl tie ins in non BCS years. If they don't get access to decent bowl games, they lose money as well.
Correct. That was the thinking when they jumped to the ACC last September. They did not jump to the B1G because the B1G is too strong from a revenue standpoint. The B1G would take ND in a heartbeat but only as a full football member. ND did not want that as the revenue sharing with a conference would reduce their overall take of $43 million. The ACC is weak enough from a football standpoint that they "sold" one of their bowl spots to ND in exchange for 5 conference games. ACC is prestigious enough with its current makeup that ND did not feel these five games cheapened its football product.
Again that was September's thinking. Since then ND played in the NC game, Kelly stayed and they have the nation's top recruiting class (or no. 2 depending on who you listen too). All of a sudden that ACC bowl tie-in is not as important as ND is now in a position to earn it year after after.
The ACC is good enough to continue with the five game deal. BUT if UNC leaves this year and that starts a mass exodus, yes the ACC survives by picking up Cincy, uconn and whatever CUSA teams they need too. Problem is this new look conference is too crappy for ND to commit 40% of its football schedule in exchange for a spot in the outback bowl in a down year.
So, ND stays in the ACC until they have an exodus. When they do either the ACC let's ND out of the football commitment and let's them stay as non-football or ND leaves. If they leave the C7 is where they will land. That is why they are playing in the C7 next year ... Consider it a test drive of their backup plan.
Final word ... Football drives everything. Every decision is made with football in mind. So, a new look ACC does not let ND out of its football commitment. The most valuable property the ACC now owns is its 5 games with ND. They force that on ND to the point that ND leaves.
Or, to turn it around ... If the ACC excepts ND as a non-football member, that is devastating news for the C7. Then Georgetown and Villanova beg their way into the ACC as non football members with the hope of upgrading their FCS teams to ACC football.
Quote from: Benny B on March 01, 2013, 06:35:38 AM
How much do teams actually make from playing in a second tier bowl?
Moneywise, not that much. Prestige-wise it is very important to play in a January bowl, any bowl game. For recruiting, for alumni (lots of them plan Christmas vacations around bowl game) and to stay relevant.
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2013, 09:22:16 PM
I don't think many will judge a conference on its three worst teams, but since that's what you want to do here let's see how the new BE's bottom three stack up in terms of current RPI:
Big East - Providence (85), Seton Hall (115), DePaul (183)
ACC - Wake Forest (151), Clemson (154), VaTech (166)
Big 10 - Purdue (131), Northwestern (144), Penn State (184)
Big 12 - Texas (126), Texas Tech (222), TCU (228)
PAC 10 - Utah (179), Oregon State (188), Washington St. (190)
SEC - S. Carolina (201), Auburn (219), Miss. State (237)
In perspective, our dregs aren't all that bad, are they?
It's also worth mentioning that our current conference won't exist at this time next year. People need to stop comparing the "new" Big East that we're going to, with a non-existent conference that isn't an option. To that end, here are the three worst teams that would be in the conference next year if Marquette (and the others) had done nothing:
DePaul (183), Houston (205), SMU (218)
This is a
great move by Marquette and the rest of the teams, and is far, far better than if they'd just stayed in the "old" Big East.
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on March 01, 2013, 05:54:16 AM
Actually it is $43 million
http://espn.go.com/blog/playbook/dollars/post/_/id/2556/texas-tops-in-football-profit-revenue
School Rev. Exp. Profit
Texas $103.8 $25.9 $77.9
Michigan $85.2 $23.6 $61.6
Georgia $75.0 $22.7 $52.3
Florida $74.1 $23.1 $51.1
Alabama $82.0 $36.9 $45.1
LSU $68.8 $24.1 $44.8
Auburn $77.2 $33.3 $43.8
Notre Dame $69.0 $25.8 $43.2
Arkansas $64.2 $24.3 $39.9
Nebraska $55.1 $18.7 $36.4
See no. 9 just below ND, that is why you leave UW without thinking twice. Also note 6 of the top 10 are SEC schools ... Maybe this is why only SEC schools wins the national Championship (7 straight and counting)
My goodness, it is amazing what a cash cow these programs have, all excluded from taxation. Let's end the charade that these are amateur programs focused on education and start taxing them like we would any other profit-seeking enterprise.
Quote from: MU82 on February 28, 2013, 09:45:47 PM
I understand that. I'm just saying that playing those teams helps the Prov, SH and DeP numbers whereas next season that won't be the case. Those three teams could have the exact same records they have right now and have RPIs 50 or more points lower. Not to be a bummer, just making sure we're comparing apples to apples.
Cuse, Pitt, Louisville and ND were leaving anyway. We're basically trading uconn, cincy, Memphis and temple for butler, creighton Xavier... And avoiding playing usf, Tulane, UFC, sum and Houston. At the end of the day a smaller league with a round robin will help the dregs of the league win more, which will improve records, ratings etc...
Quote from: MU82 on February 28, 2013, 09:38:27 PM
I like the positive thoughts, but weren't the RPIs of our bottom 3 helped immensely by games against the likes of Syracuse, Louisville, Pitt and UConn -- teams they won't get to play in the new league?
Doing my best Carnac the Magnificent impression...
Syracuse. Louisville. Pitt.
Question: Name three teams they wouldn't get to play in the old league, either.
I'd like to refocus the discussion here, this is what has been accomplished/announced/implied/reported in the last 24 hours:
-C7 to form a 10 team league starting in the fall with C7+Butler+Xavier+Creighton
-No dead period where we have to play Tulane or SMU
-League to go to 12 teams in 2014 by adding two out of these four (SLU, Dayton, VCU, Richmond) with SLU and Dayton the primary
-League to be paid $40 million a year($4mil per school in first year, $3.3mil per school there after)
-Retain Big East name(and hopefully going to a refreshed version of the original BE logo)
-Conference tourney at MSG(most implied/least information of all items on this list)
-Get some funds out of the retained BE exit pool, but not full share as part of getting the name and early exit
Editted to add -Fox Sports contract presumably putting all Big East games on one of three stations, Fox, Fox Sports 1 or Fox Sports 2
Editted to add - Likely no longer having this god forsaken Time Warner partnership for those folks in Milwaukee
Anything I overlooked? We could argue all day about Dayton, but if that is the worst thing about this whole deal I feel like we are upset about a dent on the golden egg we just shat out.
I think you've got it. As I said last night, short of everything staying as it was before all this movement started, I don't think this cold have worked out any better for MU. Yo did forget that games will be broadcast on Fox, which is the best in the business as far as production goes.
From a Deadspin article: The Big East Just Got Good Again (http://deadspin.com/5987813/the-big-east-just-got-good-again)
No, the sad-sack Big East didn't find a miraculous way to stop hemorrhaging schools, nor re-negotiate its TV deal with ESPN that will pay six times less than what it was offered just two years ago. The Big East, one of the most storied basketball conferences in the country, wasn't able to swing a last-minute agreement to retain Syracuse or Pitt or Louisville or Notre Dame. But they have sold the name "Big East" to the departing Catholic 7 schools. So the New Big East will have the name and MSG and a TV deal with Fox and a solid top-to-bottom membership. The Old Big East will be a wastleland, but at least we don't have to call it the Big East anymore.
Also...
SI reports that it's expected the New Big East will finalize a deal to play its conference tournament at MSG. The Old Big East will probably hold theirs at the Elks Lodge off Route 17 in Paramus.
Quote from: mu03eng on March 01, 2013, 08:29:46 AM
-C7 to form a 10 team league starting in the fall with C7+Butler+Xavier+Creighton
Where has Creighton for next year been reported?
Quote from: mu03eng on March 01, 2013, 08:29:46 AM
-Retain Big East name(and hopefully going to a refreshed version of the original BE logo)
Just my opinion, but we should keep the current logo, at least for now. I think we should be branding this as the same great Big East conference everyone knows and focus on continuity. The C7 should be spinning this as the true Big East returning to it's roots.
Quote from: Pakuni on February 28, 2013, 10:36:08 PM
But they'll be playing G'Town twice (current RPI = 10), MU twice (current RPI = 13), Butler twice (current RPI = 29), etc. And while they'll be losing SU, Louisville, etc. from their skeds, they'll also be losing Rutgers and South Florida.
Syracuse and Louisville are no doubt better than Xavier and Butler, but on the other side, Creighton and St. Louis are better than Rutgers and USF.
The highs may not be as high, but the lows won't be as low.
In no way am I suggesting that this league will be as good as the 2005-12 Big East, but it'll be respectable and certainly well above the rank of mid major.
Good point about getting to play Butler and Xavier vs. Rutgers and USF.
Quote from: Litehouse on March 01, 2013, 08:47:13 AM
Where has Creighton for next year been reported?
Dana Oneil's article for ESPN was updated to include Creighton likely joining this fall as well. They don't have an exit fee out of the MWC so makes perfect sense. I'd post the link but I refuse to give the four letter network page views, you'll just have to take my word for it. ;D
Quote from: Litehouse on March 01, 2013, 08:47:13 AM
The C7 should be spinning this as the true Big East returning to it's roots.
Youre right, and I suspect that's what they will end up,doing. Definitely should be playing up the old school theme.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/de/2/23/Back-to-the-future-logo.svg)
Quote from: Litehouse on March 01, 2013, 08:47:13 AM
Just my opinion, but we should keep the current logo, at least for now. I think we should be branding this as the same great Big East conference everyone knows and focus on continuity. The C7 should be spinning this as the true Big East returning to it's roots.
I don't know about the logo. Maybe we should keep it for the first year, so there is enough time to vet a new logo with enough people to make sure its good.
I love the idea of keeping the name, but i think with all the hoopla the last 3 years about conference realignment, the Big East was dragged through the mud. With keeping the name, something else needs a fresh start, and it may be a good opportunity to incorporate it into the "new" re-branding of the Big East to going back to focus on Basketball.
Still kinda want Richmond over Dayton (mostly because it guarantees at least one nearby MU game for me once a year), but I can't complain too much.
And this is exactly what everyone originally thought was going to happen.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 01, 2013, 05:10:32 AM
Gonzaga was never an option. Keefe was wrong about that.
I understand that, Sultan. I was just saying that, in my mind, it could have been better.
Huey Lewis' "Back In Time" keeps running through my head since I started reading this thread. Which is good, because that was a totally underrated band IMO.
One thing I haven't seen, though, is whether the original C7 will still receive more of the Fox money for X years until its investment is recouped. Haven't read the articles but does anyone have any scuttlebutt about that?