Title speaks for itself..
Very bad game for him.
Many many bad games for him
I've been saying all along that all we are missing is a decent point guard! screw a big man!!
just a bad night. But it certainly wasn't ALL his fault. 22 turnovers and allowing 45 rebounds is a recipe for a loss.
This whole team is flat embarassing with the way they just dont show up some games.
This may be out best team record wise under buzz but at least in the past we didnt get absolutly pasted multiple times.
Quote from: GOMU85 on March 08, 2012, 08:03:30 PM
I've been saying all along that all we are missing is a decent point guard! screw a big man!!
Well if we had a big man we might have grabbed the occasional defensive rebound. Cadougan was beyond awful, but this stinkbomb was a total team effort.
Can we still run the table?
Quote from: HaywardsHeroes32 on March 08, 2012, 08:04:37 PM
This whole team is flat embarassing with the way they just dont show up some games.
This may be out best team record wise under buzz but at least in the past we didnt get absolutly pasted multiple times.
Oh how quickly people forget. We seem to have a habit of just not showing up for about 50% of the big games we play. MSU in the tourney a few years ago, UNC last year.
They look like a different team tonite. No consistent effort. No boxouts, No hustle, a total wipeout
Seriously, don't know what Buzz saw in Jr's game that screamed to him that he's gotta have him?
I'm going to put as much effort into this post as junior did into his game, so I'm copying and pasting my previous post...
How f**king embarassing!
JC is the most useless player on this team all year! Please junior go f#ck up again so I don't have to look at your a$$ the rest of the year. Out of all the people you should be going to practice early instead of late!
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 08, 2012, 08:15:35 PM
I'm going to put as much effort into this post as junior did into his game, so I'm copying and pasting my previous post...
How f**king embarassing!
JC is the most useless player on this team all year! Please junior go f#ck up again so I don't have to look at your a$$ the rest of the year. Out of all the people you should be going to practice early instead of late!
It sucked the first time I read it, why copy and paste this piece of crap? It is beneath dignity.
Quote from: MUMac on March 08, 2012, 08:18:42 PM
It sucked the first time I read it, why copy and paste this piece of crap? It is beneath dignity.
Amen
Junior had no help tonight. Calm down.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 08, 2012, 08:12:05 PM
Seriously, don't know what Buzz saw in Jr's game that screamed to him that he's gotta have him?
Really? Think before you post. Always. All of your posts are retarded.
To be fair, someone told Junior that they were taking photos for next year's poster. He just wanted to look cool throwing the ball in every direction.
(http://i.imgur.com/3fljh.jpg)
holy balls that is a huge photo. Sorry.
I know he's Buzz's "guy", but he's not an upper echelon Big East point guard. Maybe too good to be a backup on any team but the very best, but as far as a starter he's a Providence or DePaul player. It worries me he's our senior leader next year and we still haven't found a point guard for 2012 or 2013. It's a far cry from Dominic James. It's a far cry from Maurice Acker.
the stupidity of this thread is appalling.
sky is falling - we are 25-7
Just got back from the Peyton Siva game. We allowed him to do what he wanted the whole game. Blue should have been guarding him the whole game. We were outplayed, outhustled and outCOACHED!
It's because Peyton Siva actually has the athleticism of a Big East point guard
Cadougan needs to realize two things, when he crosses half court he doesn't have to drive to the basket or take a pull up shot when its 1 v. 5, and he needs to learn to dribble with his left. Smith was picking the ball out of his pocket every time he tried to go left. Louisville didn't play well tonight either but you have to give it to Pitino for some good coaching with the pick n' roll against Gardner and seeing something in Cadougan's dribbling style.
Junior has really had some terrible games this year . Usually terrible for a half but tonight he was even worse n for the whole game. Fir a point guard he is really a terrible dribbler has the handle of a high school player. I like his size n i think he is a good passer but simple man pressure simply takes him out of the game.
Its a pg's game and hes not any good.
Cadougan is a good point guard who had a poor game. Marquette is having an epic year and yet no one can accept that college basketball is a game where you cannot bring it every night. If MU won the posters would have us in the final four. Let's see how it plays out and I for one have had more than enough enjoyment from this wonderful team.
he will be senior so it will be hard to recruit over him.. maybe if we had crean still....
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 08, 2012, 08:12:05 PM
Seriously, don't know what Buzz saw in Jr's game that screamed to him that he's gotta have him?
There's a reason Mo Acker was welcomed back.
There's also a reason why they let him burn his redshirt.
Just surprised they didn't recruit over him more.
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 08, 2012, 08:15:35 PM
I'm going to put as much effort into this post as junior did into his game, so I'm copying and pasting my previous post...
How f**king embarassing!
JC is the most useless player on this team all year! Please junior go f#ck up again so I don't have to look at your a$$ the rest of the year. Out of all the people you should be going to practice early instead of late!
You are embarrassing. Please find a different team to root for.
Criticism is one thing. Personal attacks are ridiculous. What next, Rush, calling him a slut?
Quote from: LightBlueJerseys on March 08, 2012, 08:43:34 PM
It's because Peyton Siva actually has the athleticism of a Big East point guard
As bad as JC played, lets give Buzz some of the blame as Siva was in total control against JC. MU should have tried to slow the game down, JC tried to speed it up even more. He easily
split the pick and roll and MU had no idea how to stop it, does Buzz no the word zone. When Siva split the zone then another MU player came over to help, bad shot by Louy but had great
position for a rebound, 26 offensive rebounds, are you kidding me. JC was out of control, but blame Buzz. Not prepared on the D end, and offensively a mess. 26 turnovers, are you kidding
me, might have been the worst game since the Northern Michigan or Eastern, the first night of the NIT. That game MU had no point guard, tonight was about the same. My other point, is that you can see if Crowder has an off game, trouble. Jae, had at 2 fouls that were very amateur for a senior. He misses a layup then loves to hound the rebounder, get back and play D young man.
Quote from: MU82 on March 08, 2012, 09:44:37 PM
You are embarrassing. Please find a different team to root for.
Criticism is one thing. Personal attacks are ridiculous. What next, Rush, calling him a slut?
Yes, that is embarrassing. Please don't root for MU next week, go find a team from the WAC or something. Don't need your negative chi taking away from the positive chi.
JC, had probably the worse game of his life and lost a lot of confidence a long the way. He has shown the ability to bounce back and have nice games after some stinkers. Just so people understand how important he is to our team:
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/stats/roland_avg?season=2011-2012&conf=big-east
#1 Roland Avg in the Big East - Roland Average is the difference in plus/minus between when a player is on the court versus off the court. Granted it is skewed towards teams that win and the players on those teams, but that's the thing... it's skewed toward teams that WIN.
He makes the team go... stats back it up. He has a bad game, so does the rest of the team. It is not a coincidence Jae struggled outside of the fouls tonight.
Where are all the bozos who called me out when I said Junior is not a high major point guard? He's servicable, but as a Big East guard on a big stage he's just plain out manned. I've been saying all year he's the least athletic player on our team and maybe the least athletic starter in the entire Big East. Sorry, but Louisville smelled blood in the water with him tonight. I still have high hopes for the tournament, depending on match ups.
Great game by DJO. And I thought Blue had a nice game, too.
Junior turned it over what, 8 times? And his poor boxing out was responsible for...hmm...probably none of the offensive boards? So what about the other 18 turnovers and 26 offensive rebounds? Those numbers alone would have sank us without Junior's poor performance.
Yes, he had a bad game, but this was a team loss. Trying to pin it all on one guy is staggeringly myopic.
PRN- I won't disagree with you about Cadougan but MU does not have any other options. Cadougan needs to play within himself for this team to succeed.
Also, DJO and Blue each had 6 TO's to go with Jr's 8.
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on March 08, 2012, 10:44:32 PM
Where are all the bozos who called me out when I said Junior is not a high major point guard? He's servicable, but as a Big East guard on a big stage he's just plain out manned. I've been saying all year he's the least athletic player on our team and maybe the least athletic starter in the entire Big East. Sorry, but Louisville smelled blood in the water with him tonight. I still have high hopes for the tournament, depending on match ups.
Great game by DJO. And I thought Blue had a nice game, too.
I've been next to you on that argument all year as well. Perhaps i should take your approach next time and not attack junior personally. The simple and concise fact is that he should NOT be a starting pg in the Big East. (maybe for DePaul)
It's frustrating to know that 80% of the posters on here, would condemn Vander if he played like JC tonight, however if JC does it in one of the biggest games it's alright? I recall countless times hearing how Vander is a high prospect so we should expect more out of him, soooo Junior wasn't? Is everybody going to be sipping the Kool-Aid on how MU is a possible Elite 8-FF team if we lost to WV because of Junior couldn't make 1 of his 2 free throws at the end of the game? I'm sorry but your pg is suppose to be clutch when it comes to FT and i just assume Buzz take Junior out when the game is on the line with 3 minutes or less to play. Tonight was another game that our pg directly contributed the most in our loss. (Yes i know about the rebounding numbers as well, this is relating to individual performance)
Extremely disappointing to say the least, and when you add in his (extra circular activities) of being benched for multiple games it makes it that much worse.
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on March 08, 2012, 10:44:32 PM
Where are all the bozos who called me out when I said Junior is not a high major point guard? He's servicable, but as a Big East guard on a big stage he's just plain out manned. I've been saying all year he's the least athletic player on our team and maybe the least athletic starter in the entire Big East. Sorry, but Louisville smelled blood in the water with him tonight. I still have high hopes for the tournament, depending on match ups.
Great game by DJO. And I thought Blue had a nice game, too.
DJO and Blue each had 6 TOs according to ESPN, compared to the 8 Junior had handling the ball more. This was a team loss. Junior didn't play well but this isn't on him, it's on everyone.
Least athletic starter in the big east? Maybe a tad bit of an exageration.
By the way, Siva had 28 more turnovers than Junior this year for a 1.5 A/TO ratio. Junior's was 2.1.
I agree Junior is a good sometimes great point guard at distributing the ball, and sometimes scoring. I am very happy with him leading the ship
Today, however, he was beyond terrible. One of the worst performances I have seen as a Marquette fan. I would say that he was personally responsible for the loss today. He had 8 turnovers, TERRIBLE shot selection, and did a terrible job of distributing. It was because he was doing so poorly that everyone else struggled, as normally Juniors passes set the rest of the team up for great looks. This forced everyone else out of their comfort zone. If Junior doesn't have his worst game ever, the overall team looks a whole lot better.
That is the point though, Junior isn't terrible, We NEED Junior.
Quote from: Danny Noonan on March 08, 2012, 10:55:10 PM
PRN- I won't disagree with you about Cadougan but MU does not have any other options. Cadougan needs to play within himself for this team to succeed.
Also, DJO and Blue each had 6 TO's to go with Jr's 8.
MU guards and zone not a good combo. Fix it
I can accept turnovers if you're contributing in other areas. Blue made a couple plays that were head scratchers, but give me a break, that's going to happen. He at least looks like he belongs on the court. That was a putrid performance by a point guard that is leading a top ten team in the country. We have two potential NBA players, for chissakes! I'm not giving up on the season by any means. But can somebody please explain to me why Junior just plays that bad every four games? It's because he's targeted by teams! He cannot compete with teams with quickness.
PRN,
I would agree that he is the least talented of our starters, but I don't think that is a condemnation of him. I think two of our starters will be drafted this year, Blue is still projected to be drafted (for what that's worth) and I think Wilson has the length and athleticism to end up in the show. That doesn't mean Jr's not a BE caliber PG.
Quote from: brewcity77 on March 08, 2012, 10:50:52 PM
Junior turned it over what, 8 times? And his poor boxing out was responsible for...hmm...probably none of the offensive boards? So what about the other 18 turnovers and 26 offensive rebounds? Those numbers alone would have sank us without Junior's poor performance.
Yes, he had a bad game, but this was a team loss. Trying to pin it all on one guy is staggeringly myopic.
Not true, re: the offensive boards. Because Junior couldn't stay within a ZIP code of Siva, the other defenders were left scrambling to help when Siva got into the lane. And that left our rebounders in poor position to grab boards.
The concern with the TOs isn't just that he had 8, but that SEVEN of them came in the first half, when he ran us out of the game with self-inflicted turnovers and poor shot selection. Combined with his awful defense, I think it's fair to say he deserves the lion's share of the blame tonight. And I think he'd tell you the same.
Okay, I wasn't able to watch the game. Sounds like I was very fortunate... However this is inexcusible. Sounds like Junior had a very bad game... but to rip him apart and say that he shouldn't be on our team and basically throwing him under the bus is sad. We win as a team and lose as a team. You cannot blame the whole entire game on Junior, no matter how bad of a game that he had. We lost by 13 and had 26 turnovers. I have yet to check the stat line, but I find it hard to believe that Junior committed 26 out of 26 turnovers. A point guard can only do so much when the team doesn't show up to play. Junior has helped us get this far and to hate on him now? To hate on any player like this thread is is embarrassing.
Those hating so harshly on him should find a new team to root for.
While I've never been particularly impressed by JR's game, he's still better than Niv Berkowitz and always will be.
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 08, 2012, 10:57:31 PM
I've been next to you on that argument all year as well. Perhaps i should take your approach next time and not attack junior personally. The simple and concise fact is that he should NOT be a starting pg in the Big East. (maybe for DePaul)
It's frustrating to know that 80% of the posters on here, would condemn Vander if he played like JC tonight, however if JC does it in one of the biggest games it's alright? I recall countless times hearing how Vander is a high prospect so we should expect more out of him, soooo Junior wasn't? Is everybody going to be sipping the Kool-Aid on how MU is a possible Elite 8-FF team if we lost to WV because of Junior couldn't make 1 of his 2 free throws at the end of the game? I'm sorry but your pg is suppose to be clutch when it comes to FT and i just assume Buzz take Junior out when the game is on the line with 3 minutes or less to play. Tonight was another game that our pg directly contributed the most in our loss. (Yes i know about the rebounding numbers as well, this is relating to individual performance)
Extremely disappointing to say the least, and when you add in his (extra circular activities) of being benched for multiple games it makes it that much worse.
The problem is you are making sweeping generalizations based on one game.
He is who he is, your emotional suggestion that he is not a starting Big East Pg is comical though. Your sounding like those WV fans who think all there is to basketball is scoring and rebounding.
I would like you to name 14 better point guards in the Big East. I will get you started. Here are the top 10 league assist leaders.
Assists Per Game
Rank Player Team GP FG% 3P% FT% RPG APG PPG SPG
1 V. Council Providence 31 .391 .293 .674 4.1 7.5 15.9 1.3
2 J. Theodore Seton Hall 32 .385 .323 .827 3.1 6.7 16.0 1.8
3 S. Napier Conn 32 .391 .349 .754 3.7 5.9 12.6 1.7
4 J. Cadougan Marquette 30 .395 .242 .700 2.1 5.5 6.4 1.1
5 P. Siva Louisville 30 .395 .228 .720 3.0 5.3 8.6 1.8
6 A. Collins Sflor 27 .497 .300 .849 1.9 5.3 8.3 1.6
7t S. Jardine Syracuse 31 .477 .341 .491 2.3 4.9 8.6 1.5
7t J. Grant Notre Dame 31 .390 .354 .815 2.9 4.9 12.5 1.2
9 B. Young DePaul 31 .423 .281 .765 2.6 4.7 14.5 1.6
10 M. Wayns Villanova 29 .414 .298 .892 3.8 4.6 17.6 1.0
Newsflash, every single one of those guys will make you pull your hair out if you watch them enough. Louisville fans blame Siva for everything that went wrong this season up to tonight. Scoop got benched for the entire second half he was so horrible. Wayns hasn't been able to lead Villanova to even the NIT, with burger boys all around him.
Bottom line, Junior played horrible tonight, but he is the guy this season (top 10 ranking, 25 wins) and next, gotta get behind him or give up your fan card.
Quote from: dw3dw3dw3 on March 08, 2012, 10:31:57 PM
Yes, that is embarrassing. Please don't root for MU next week, go find a team from the WAC or something. Don't need your negative chi taking away from the positive chi.
JC, had probably the worse game of his life and lost a lot of confidence a long the way. He has shown the ability to bounce back and have nice games after some stinkers. Just so people understand how important he is to our team:
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/stats/roland_avg?season=2011-2012&conf=big-east
#1 Roland Avg in the Big East - Roland Average is the difference in plus/minus between when a player is on the court versus off the court. Granted it is skewed towards teams that win and the players on those teams, but that's the thing... it's skewed toward teams that WIN.
He makes the team go... stats back it up. He has a bad game, so does the rest of the team. It is not a coincidence Jae struggled outside of the fouls tonight.
Good post.
Junior had an epically bad game tonight and he struggles with consistency overall, but people shouldn't go overboard based on his worst game since joining the program. He's a solid college college PG.
One flaw i see in that stat though is that Wilson is Cadougan's backup and Wilson is very challenged offensively at this point in his career. Given that he can't score at all and isn't ready yet to create good shots for others via dribble drives, the offense tends to stagnate noticeably when Wilson is in at PG. Thus, that can inflate Junior's plus/minus numbers.
Wow, I guess its been a frustrating year for critics - only having 7 losses to complain about in 32 games, but this strand really is silly. More than 74 starting BCS guards, and Junior is in the top 17 in the two most important categories for point guards.
Feel free to rip him for a TERRIBLE game today - 7 turnovers in the first half was awful - but to then claim that he shouldn't be starting when there are almost 3/4rds of the BCS starting guards are not as good as Junior is more than silly. The two key stats - to start with assists to turnovers but expand to all BCS guards, has Junior as the 15 best point guard from 74 teams:
Player School Asst TO Ratio
Kendall Marshall North Carolina 281 78 3.6
Sam Grooms Oklahoma 171 56 3.05
Dave Sobolewski Northwestern 101 35 2.89
Jerian Grant Notre Dame 143 50 2.86
Jeremiah Kelly DePaul 101 36 2.81
Andre Young Clemson 91 35 2.6
Jordan Taylor Wisconsin 122 47 2.6
Lewis Jackson Purdue 122 47 2.6
Phl Pressey Missouri 179 72 2.49
Justin Cobbs California 149 60 2.48
Jordan Theodore Seton Hall 197 81 2.43
Erving Walker Florida 139 59 2.36
Scoop Jardine Syracuse 150 65 2.31
Dash Harris Texas A&M 89 39 2.28
Junior Cadougan Marquette 155 68 2.28
The other stat is how many of our points is he setting up. When Junior is on the court, 32% of our baskets scored come from a junior assist, meaning he is the 17th best point guard in any BCS conference at setting his teammates up for points:
Player Team ARate
Tim Frazier Penn St. 45.4
Kendall Marshall North Carolina 43.2
Jordan Theodore Seton Hall 39.7
Tray Woodall Pittsburgh 38.2
Pierre Jackson Baylor 36.8
Anthony Collins South Florida 36.7
Scoop Jardine Syracuse 36.4
Royce White Iowa St. 35.9
Lorenzo Brown North Carolina St. 35.1
Bryce Cartwright Iowa 35.1
Chris Colvin Arizona St. 34.3
Reggie Moore Washington St. 33.9
Myck Kabongo Texas 33.9
Sam Grooms Oklahoma 33.5
Peyton Siva Louisville 33.3
Junior Cadougan Marquette 32.8
Don't worry, you will get one more chance to go hysterical. The season will end on a loss for 344 of 345 teams including MU, but whenever that happens, it won't be "proof" that you were right and MU can't win big games. It will mean we lost the last game we played - like all the other teams but one.
Thanks bama. Good stuff. Junior is a good PG who had a terrible game.
The Junior we know will be back. Last night was tough. He did force some bad shots, however, what I like about him is that he does not back down. He'll be back.
Stats don't tell the entire story. Cadougan is a defensive liability, has a loose handle, is slow, has questionable decision making abiltiy, is an erratic passer, and is a poor shooter from anywhere outside of 6 feet. Again, I can't see what Buzz saw in this guy.
He had a bad game. End of story. He's had more good than bad in my
Opinion and nobody was attacking junior last time
We played Louisville because he did a tremendous job guarding Siiva. Siva and Louisville had our number and stepped on our throat tonight. It might be just what we need to get some edge back heading into the tourney.
I hate how everytime we lose....it's all this team blows, we will basically get beat by a 14 seed. And everyone sucks and how did this person not get recruited over, why is this person even a d-1 player, and this player has been awful all year long, and buzz sucks.
Calm down people. It's pretty tough to beat a team twice in the same
Year and yes I thought it was an atrocious showing but get off the effing ledge and get a grip. It's pathetic. This team will be ready to play come
Next week. Hopefully we can still hang onto a 3 seed.
Junior was horrible last night. Absolutely atrocious how many times did he literally theow the ball to no one? MU has been blessed with having good to great point guard play since tony miller showed up on campus in 1991.
Unfortunately Junior does not match up with any of the stating PGs we have had since then and i would say that even before last night. He is a good passer but sub par everything else.
Lastly, to be fair to vander and Djo most of their TOs occurred when they were forced to play PG because Junior was so horrible Buzz could not play him
Maybe he was going for a triple double last night. Almost a third of the way there with turnovers.
Many of DJO's and Vander's TO's came late when they were pressing. Vander had two on charges and one on the travel with a difficult, and long, outlet on the break. Caught it in traffic and travelled.
Watching Junior this season has reminded me of the Good Rex/Bad Rex days for the Bears. When he's "on" he can be very impressive and incredibly effective. When he's "off"...well, he can be WAY off. Sometimes he plays a huge part in winning and sometimes the team wins in spite of him.
He'll bounce back.
Junior is our point guard and he needs to be accountable to his teammates. We all know his limitations and after last night he better know them as well. He needs to be crisp the ball and play within himself.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 08, 2012, 08:12:05 PM
Seriously, don't know what Buzz saw in Jr's game that screamed to him that he's gotta have him?
top 50 to 60 recruit
Quote from: Goose on March 09, 2012, 08:30:22 AM
Junior is our point guard and he needs to be accountable to his teammates. We all know his limitations and after last night he better know them as well. He needs to be crisp the ball and play within himself.
I think he is good when he does that. When he forces the issue he hurts us.
Yes, Junior was a disaster last night. Can't remember him playing any worse even though it wasn't his first clunker.
Still, I do seem to remember "the worst point guard in the Big East," as some here are calling him, coming through huge in the must-win BET game against West Virginia last year. He then played pretty darn well in the two NCAA tourney wins. Has played well many, many times this season, too.
He is not a star and he has a few too many games like last night for my liking, but he is capable of playing quite well, as my first paragraph noted.
We start 3 guards. They combined for 20 turnovers. Bilas repeatedly asked why our guards kept trying to dribble through traffic, and I asked the same thing. If Junior, Vander and DJO only commit 10 turnovers -- still too many, but at least not catastrophic -- we probably win that game.
Junior needs to play better. But the bottom line is that he is the point guard and he is going to continue to be the point guard. If that causes you too much consternation, I recommend rooting for superstars like Wayns and Siva instead.
Vander had 6 TOs. Two on charges. One on the aforementioned travel. One on when he slipped on the stupid Dave Gavitt logo. And two others.
I did notice that when Vander was guarding Siva, he did a much better job keeping him out of the lane than Junior did. Junior might as well have been holding a red cape out there.
Anyone else more worried about Wilson than Cadougan? Cadougan is solid and will be fine, maybe just playing in MSG got in his head. But Cadougan will be a senior next year, and we have no incoming PGs in 2012 0r 2013 as of right now. Meaning all we'll have is Wilson. And as much as you can rip on Cadougan last night - it sure says something that Buzz didn't really pull him for Wilson after any of his out-of-this-world dumb plays.
Here's hoping Vander or TJ Taylor can figure out how to become pgs, because we're seriously going to AT LEAST need some depth soon.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 09, 2012, 08:53:16 AM
Vander had 6 TOs. Two on charges. One on the aforementioned travel. One on when he slipped on the stupid Dave Gavitt logo. And two others.
I did notice that when Vander was guarding Siva, he did a much better job keeping him out of the lane than Junior did. Junior might as well have been holding a red cape out there.
Forgot about the logo slip. Credit those TO's to the BE.
JC had a bad half, not a bag game. he came back pretty strong in the second and showed confidence, that's impressive given his horrible 1st.
he's a fighter and he/we will be fine.
Quote from: Aughnanure on March 09, 2012, 08:55:54 AMHere's hoping Vander or TJ Taylor can figure out how to become pgs, because we're seriously going to AT LEAST need some depth soon.
I feel fine about Vander taking over the point as a senior. He may not be a perfect point yet, but he didn't have to play that role this year. He averaged 2.8 apg and had a 1.3 A/T ratio. Give him another year to prep for the role and he'll be fine. And remember, Wilson is a freshman. A freshman who has averaged more assists, more points, and more minutes than Junior did as a freshman. I realize there was the injury, but Derrick has a lot of time before he has to take that role. I wouldn't worry about him just yet, especially since we have a number of schollies open for 2014 before he'd ever have to start.
Quote from: MUMac on March 09, 2012, 08:22:13 AM
Many of DJO's and Vander's TO's came late when they were pressing. Vander had two on charges and one on the travel with a difficult, and long, outlet on the break. Caught it in traffic and travelled.
He also slipped on a decal once and had his other two turnovers when he was forced to play point because our coach could not play junior. How many times did vander throw the ball into the seats??? Compared to jr.?
Quote from: Aughnanure on March 09, 2012, 08:55:54 AM
Anyone else more worried about Wilson than Cadougan? Cadougan is solid and will be fine, maybe just playing in MSG got in his head. But Cadougan will be a senior next year, and we have no incoming PGs in 2012 0r 2013 as of right now. Meaning all we'll have is Wilson. And as much as you can rip on Cadougan last night - it sure says something that Buzz didn't really pull him for Wilson after any of his out-of-this-world dumb plays.
Here's hoping Vander or TJ Taylor can figure out how to become pgs, because we're seriously going to AT LEAST need some depth soon.
I'm not worried about Wilson...yet. He's a freshman. We have a thread where everyone is excited over Juan's minutes, but Wilson played better..and has been better most of the year. We will see what happens next year.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 09, 2012, 09:15:35 AM
I'm not worried about Wilson...yet. He's a freshman. We have a thread where everyone is excited over Juan's minutes, but Wilson played better..and has been better most of the year. We will see what happens next year.
Defensively I'm not worried. But just watching this team on offense lately when he's in the game (especially the WVU game when he was in for a full half) made me worried. His ball handling was specifically troublesome, but you're probably right - a freshmen getting used to the pace and physicality of the big east, probably a little timid in his play which gets him trapped a lot..
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 09, 2012, 06:06:32 AM
Stats don't tell the entire story. Cadougan is a defensive liability, has a loose handle, is slow, has questionable decision making abiltiy, is an erratic passer, and is a poor shooter from anywhere outside of 6 feet. Again, I can't see what Buzz saw in this guy.
But he's got an incredible story and Buzz will roll with that cat any day. Even rolling right out of the postseason.
I have calmed down, but I still hate all the ragging on Jr. Junior is our facilitator, and without him, we're not nearly as good, as yesterday clearly showcased. He had an awful game, for whatever reason. But I am ready to move on, as should all of you. Junior is our PG, and he's a damn good one. He just got caught up in the bright lights of NYC. I expect him to have a huge couple games next weekend and bring the boys back to the Sweet 16. In the end, that's all that matters. Only 6 teams (power conferences) don't end their conference season on loses. We were likely a 3 seed whether we took home the Big East trophy or not. Huge bummer of a loss, but hardly catastrophic.
Now Junior, figure your sh!t out. And Davante, keep working on that knee. We're going to need you to be significantly more mobile than you were last night.
Jr. was outplayed by a more athletic point guard. He looked a step slow with slow passes and high dribbles. He was simply off. Buzz should have sat Jr. down more. Agree that we do need a more athletic point guard. No question.
I'm worried about present and future point guard play. Junior is our starting 5's weak link and D. Wilson hasn't shown any vision with his passes or ability to break down a D and get into the lane. Let's face it. He's a caretaker point guard. That's it. The offense stagnates with him in the game. We desperately need a PG in the class of '13.
It's funny when a player's first 31 games go right out the window when analyzing his play.
He has had less than four assists TWICE in Big East play, and over the last three weeks his defense had been very solid. Think Maalik Wayns, Vincent Council and Jordan Theodore.
He had a game to forget. That's it.
Quote from: JTBMU7 on March 09, 2012, 09:04:32 AM
JC had a bad half, not a bag game. he came back pretty strong in the second and showed confidence, that's impressive given his horrible 1st.
he's a fighter and he/we will be fine.
NO JUnior had a terrible game. Just less terrible in the second half. I will guess u have forgotten the down 4 and we get a steal and Junior proceeds to throw the out let pass to Pitino? How about the fast break late where he fired a95 mph fast ball to Jmail from 3 feet away.
Just becuase he was not as horrible lets not get carried away and say he had a good half.
Bottom line is Junior has been very bad a lot this year, he has been a big part of the cause of many of our poor starts. More often than not he has at least one terrible half a game. When Junior is terrible it makes our ability to win that much harder.
he is a big liablilty at a really importnat position. We have been able to over come him this year. Worst MU PG in 20 years. Very concerned about next year when we need senior leadership and a steady hand at the PG
Quote from: Canadian Dimes on March 09, 2012, 09:51:25 AM
he is a big liablilty at a really importnat position. We have been able to over come him this year. Worst MU PG in 20 years. Very concerned about next year when we need senior leadership and a steady hand at the PG
+100000
Quote from: AlienWarrior on March 08, 2012, 08:42:34 PM
Just got back from the Peyton Siva game. We allowed him to do what he wanted the whole game. Blue should have been guarding him the whole game. We were outplayed, outhustled and outCOACHED!
Buzz admitted that as well. A lot of blame here with the players, almost none on the coach which is not all surprising. Not Buzz's best day either, but we have a week to regroup.
Quote from: Canadian Dimes on March 09, 2012, 09:51:25 AM
he is a big liablilty at a really importnat position. We have been able to over come him this year. Worst MU PG in 20 years. Very concerned about next year when we need senior leadership and a steady hand at the PG
Without question. Maybe you should change your name to get him motivated. :P
Quote from: MUfan12 on March 09, 2012, 09:19:52 AM
But he's got an incredible story and Buzz will roll with that cat any day. Even rolling right out of the postseason.
You've been very negative and cynical lately. Must be a Marquette hater. ;)
Quote from: The Golden Avalanche on March 09, 2012, 10:03:31 AM
You've been very negative and cynical lately. Must be a Marquette hater. ;)
Clearly a hater. Been hating since 1988... haha.
I just don't like Junior's game, and that's been the case all year. He can be really good, but then lose his mind like last night. I just want a steadier hand at PG.
Part of this ends up on Buzz, too. He's not using him the right way defensively. Having him pressure the ball 30 feet out is setting him, and the defense, up to fail. When he gets beat off the dribble, everyone has to help. Which can leave the offensive glass open like we saw last night.
Quote from: MUfan12 on March 09, 2012, 10:09:19 AM
Clearly a hater. Been hating since 1988... haha.
I just don't like Junior's game, and that's been the case all year. He can be really good, but then lose his mind like last night. I just want a steadier hand at PG.
Part of this ends up on Buzz, too. He's not using him the right way defensively. Having him pressure the ball 30 feet out is setting him, and the defense, up to fail. When he gets beat off the dribble, everyone has to help. Which can leave the offensive glass open like we saw last night.
The defensive end has always been the question. I understand the philosophy and I understand the belief in a system but you are right that Junior can just get abused when you put him in that bad spot.
MU had that shaky patch in late December/early January when this problem was exposed and they seemed to adjust well and find a better way of applying that pressure. Seemed last night they decided it didn't matter anymore, which is goofy considering Siva may be the most athletically gifted 1 they've played recently.
Junior's spotty play started before last nite. Since the schedule turned to meaningful opponents (i.e. beginning with the Vanderbilt game), his A/T ratio is a poor 1.89:1 and he's shooting an abysmal 36.6%.
he is the worst pg in d1. awful.
Quote from: MUfan12 on March 09, 2012, 10:09:19 AM
Clearly a hater. Been hating since 1988... haha.
I just don't like Junior's game, and that's been the case all year. He can be really good, but then lose his mind like last night. I just want a steadier hand at PG.
Part of this ends up on Buzz, too. He's not using him the right way defensively. Having him pressure the ball 30 feet out is setting him, and the defense, up to fail. When he gets beat off the dribble, everyone has to help. Which can leave the offensive glass open like we saw last night.
i dont think this is accurate.
Jr has been one of the better PG's in the BEAST as far as taking care of the ball and creating for others all year. He's had 2-3 bad games, not much different that most players in the league. On Defense, we've been pressuring all year and he is quicker than most so he's been effective. our stats on D are telling to that point.
last night was an abberation. Jr is fine.
Quote from: MUfan12 on March 09, 2012, 10:09:19 AM
Clearly a hater. Been hating since 1988... haha.
I just don't like Junior's game, and that's been the case all year. He can be really good, but then lose his mind like last night. I just want a steadier hand at PG.
Part of this ends up on Buzz, too. He's not using him the right way defensively. Having him pressure the ball 30 feet out is setting him, and the defense, up to fail. When he gets beat off the dribble, everyone has to help. Which can leave the offensive glass open like we saw last night.
+10000
Why not blame the coach for putting JC in that position. JC was not the only player who did not kick the ball around, they all did. I think DJO had like 4 in a row at the end. They all got there pockets picked. The sad thing is that MU must play against there full court zone in practice, that is disappointing. There are very few teams that press like MU and louey so you will probably not see that next week, so that is good.
Quote from: mugoose on March 09, 2012, 10:16:29 AM
he is the worst pg in d1. awful.
Ha! Now this is a dumb post. Seriously, can we all stop with the overly-grand generalizations of everything. This is sports - you are never as good as your last big win and never as bad as your last embarrassing loss.
This thread is the reason why I hate coming to this site after a loss. I swear some of you people are an embarrassment to MU Nation. You a$$holes need to turn in your fan card. The kid had a bad game...get over it.
Sincerely,
A Real Fan
Quote from: hairyworthen on March 09, 2012, 08:30:41 AM
top 50 to 60 recruit
Last time I checked, Buzz had 2 eyes and seems to possess a decent amount of intelligence. Unless Jr's Achilles injury has changed his complete game, I don't get it.
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on March 08, 2012, 10:44:32 PM
Where are all the bozos who called me out when I said Junior is not a high major point guard? He's servicable, but as a Big East guard on a big stage he's just plain out manned. I've been saying all year he's the least athletic player on our team and maybe the least athletic starter in the entire Big East. Sorry, but Louisville smelled blood in the water with him tonight. I still have high hopes for the tournament, depending on match ups.
Great game by DJO. And I thought Blue had a nice game, too.
Blue turned it over more often per touch than Cadougan did. He had some bad momentum killing charges on breaks. DJO had a bunch of TOs, too. Crowder shot terribly and sealed his own fate with dumb fouls including a dumb reach in foul after missing an uncontested layup. Cadougan may have gotten the stinkfest rolling, but the other guys all joined in.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 09, 2012, 11:39:48 AM
Last time I checked, Buzz had 2 eyes and seems to possess a decent amount of intelligence. Unless Jr's Achilles injury has changed his complete game, I don't get it.
yeah, but my point was if he was rated that highly, he had to be doing something right and other people saw it as well not just buzz.
MU always plays terrible in the BE Tournament. Some years they win a few games, but when they lose, they look very, very bad. Compared to the last few years, in this loss they actually looked pretty good.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 09, 2012, 06:06:32 AM
Stats don't tell the entire story. Cadougan is a defensive liability, has a loose handle, is slow, has questionable decision making abiltiy, is an erratic passer, and is a poor shooter from anywhere outside of 6 feet. Again, I can't see what Buzz saw in this guy.
Maybe he thought JC had the potential to be a top 20 point guard as per the stats quoted above and decided that your analysis was flawed.
Quote from: Ruby on March 09, 2012, 12:09:39 PM
MU always plays terrible in the BE Tournament. Some years they win a few games, but when they lose, they look very, very bad. Compared to the last few years, in this loss they actually looked pretty good.
I feel it was nothing L'ville really did either, we just played ourselves into the loss.
Quote from: mosarsour on March 09, 2012, 11:15:54 AM
This thread is the reason why I hate coming to this site after a loss. I swear some of you people are an embarrassment to MU Nation. You a$$holes need to turn in your fan card. The kid had a bad game...get over it.
Sincerely,
A Real Fan
+1 Yep
Quote from: wiscwarrior on March 09, 2012, 12:38:32 PM
Maybe he thought JC had the potential to be a top 20 point guard as per the stats quoted above and decided that your analysis was flawed.
A couple of stats won't convince me he's a top 20 point guard in the country. Picking two stats and closing the book is what WVU fans do. I'd need to see a lot more to convince me he's top 50.
Quote from: mosarsour on March 09, 2012, 11:15:54 AM
This thread is the reason why I hate coming to this site after a loss. I swear some of you people are an embarrassment to MU Nation. You a$$holes need to turn in your fan card. The kid had a bad game...get over it.
Sincerely,
A Real Fan
This.
Quote from: mosarsour on March 09, 2012, 11:15:54 AM
This thread is the reason why I hate coming to this site after a loss. I swear some of you people are an embarrassment to MU Nation. You a$$holes need to turn in your fan card. The kid had a bad game...get over it.
Sincerely,
A Real Fan
Hey Real Fan,
Do you know where I can turn in my real fan card for a fake fan card? I also think Junior had a horrible game, and I thought it'd be ok to discuss that on this message board, but I guess that's just the a$$hole in me.
Signed,
Imposter Real Fan
Quote from: murespect on March 09, 2012, 02:28:48 PM
Hey Real Fan,
Do you know where I can turn in my real fan card for a fake fan card? I also think Junior had a horrible game, and I thought it'd be ok to discuss that on this message board, but I guess that's just the a$$hole in me.
Signed,
Imposter Real Fan
A discussion is fine. But to bash the kid after a bad game is simply not the Marquette way.
This ranks right up there with the Bash Jae Crowder thread from 8 or 9 short weeks ago as some of the most embarrassing stuff ever posted on this board.
Junior had a bad game. So did the entire rest of the team. He seems to be the linchpin, as MU's record seems to be directly tied to whether or not he has 6 or more assists. He had a bad night against a high pressure team and the team spiraled downward. 25-7
Quote from: Jamailman on March 10, 2012, 10:43:48 AM
This ranks right up there with the Bash Jae Crowder thread from 8 or 9 short weeks ago as some of the most embarrassing stuff ever posted on this board.
As a "Real Fan" I have a right to be disgusted by a particular player's play. Once again, I never liked Junior Cadougan and I don't know what Buzz see in him.
Quote from: GOMU85 on March 10, 2012, 10:52:05 AM
As a "Real Fan" I have a right to be disgusted by a particular player's play. Once again, I never liked Junior Cadougan and I don't know what Buzz see in him.
You'd be wise to read the post from tower912 directly above this one before you head out to restock your Massengill supplies. Players have bad individual games. No one outside of DJO had what could be considered an average game. The whole team sucked Thursday night. Junior was 4th in the Big East in assist to turnover ratio. I guess that qualifies as a sh*tty point guard. Good god.
I just want to point out that the last two teams we lost to are playing for the Big East championship. We did not look good in those last two losses, but part of it is that those two teams are hot now. The question is will they still be hot next week. I know I am tired of picking Louisville to win games in my NCAA pool only to see them lose right away when it matters most. The way they are playing now, I will have to pick them, but I think it is a sucker job again.
Junior is fine. He had a rough game. But it kinda shows how important he is to our team. If Junior plays well, we win. If not, it's a bumpy ride.
If Junior Cadougan play like he did today. Murray State will beat us!!
Quote from: GOMU85 on March 15, 2012, 06:08:53 PM
If Junior Cadougan play like he did today. Murray State will beat us!!
It's scary to say, but I thought we were at our best in the second half when Mayo was running the point in the second half.
Quote from: AWegrzyn17 on March 15, 2012, 06:18:13 PM
It's scary to say, but I thought we were at our best in the second half when Mayo was running the point in the second half.
I just don't know what Buzz see in Junior Cadougon. I seriously dislike his game. SERIOUSLY
I look at today's game and see the important early 3, the end to end dash at the end of the half and a couple of mindless turnovers. Take out the 90 seconds of brain dead in the second half and he had a solid game.
Quote from: tower912 on March 15, 2012, 06:46:18 PM
I look at today's game and see the important early 3, the end to end dash at the end of the half and a couple of mindless turnovers. Take out the 90 seconds of brain dead in the second half and he had a solid game.
Come on. You must be grading on a curve.
Quote from: GOMU85 on March 15, 2012, 06:40:26 PM
I just don't know what Buzz see in Junior Cadougon. I seriously dislike his game. SERIOUSLY
This is the Dwight Buycks whining all over again.
And I predicted that this junior hate will turn out to be misguided As the Vander hate last year.
+1
When Junior's going north and south he's explosive and has great vision. He's a liability going east and west - his high dribble, lack of height and lack of lateral quickness lead to too many turnovers.
Good point LT. Junior is fine and Buzz knows when to sub him. Dance with the guy that brung you and let's stay together...
Quote from: Lennys Tap on March 15, 2012, 06:58:31 PM
When Junior's going north and south he's explosive and has great vision. He's a liability going east and west - his high dribble, lack of height and lack of lateral quickness lead to too many turnovers.
Explosive? That's hardly a word I'd use to describe Cadougan.
Junior had a bad stretch in the second half... He seemsvto have one in every game.
Regardless, our offense, especially versus a zone is 10000000x's better when he is in the game.
We stagnate when he is out . Buzz usually pulls him then we are even wirse iffensively n he has to hope junior can come out of his mental lock n has to put him back in
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on March 15, 2012, 07:03:02 PM
Explosive? That's hardly a word I'd use to describe Cadougan.
So you didn't see him blow past all 5 of their defenders at the end of the 2nd half?
Quote from: Skatastrophy on March 15, 2012, 07:15:39 PM
So you didn't see him blow past all 5 of their defenders at the end of the 2nd half?
I sure did. I've also watched him the last two seasons.
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on March 15, 2012, 06:47:56 PM
Come on. You must be grading on a curve.
Serious as a heart attack. He had 90 seconds of brain dead in the second half. The rest of the game, he was solid. I don't know what you were watching.
Quote from: tower912 on March 15, 2012, 07:31:59 PM
Serious as a heart attack. He had 90 seconds of brain dead in the second half. The rest of the game, he was solid. I don't know what you were watching.
Hahaha, please tell me you're joking.
+1 Really, what game where the JC haters watching...?
I really don't understand this talk this late in the season. What are people proposing? That Derrick Wilson gets the bulk of the playing time? Mayo plays point for 30+ minutes?
Cadougan, with all his flaws, is our point. And given our recruiting class next year he will be our main point guard next year as well.
If you feel better complaining about the guy I guess it is your prerogative but nothing is going to change. Let's hope he improves on his weaknesses for next season.
Quote from: MarquetteDano on March 15, 2012, 07:46:47 PM
I really don't understand this talk this late in the season. What are people proposing? That Derrick Wilson gets the bulk of the playing time? Mayo plays point for 30+ minutes?
Cadougan, with all his flaws, is our point. And given our recruiting class next year he will be our main point guard next year as well.
If you feel better complaining about the guy I guess it is your prerogative but nothing is going to change. Let's hope he improves so weaknesses for next season.
Thats nice of you to stick up for him. However, he still sucks.
I'm still a real Marquette fan tho so don't be mad at me.
p.s. I've been saying for three years that he sucks.
Quote from: GOMU85 on March 15, 2012, 07:49:37 PM
Thtas nice of you to stick up for him. However, he still sucks.
I'm still a real Marquette fan tho so don't be mad at me.
p.s. I've been saying for three years that he sucks.
So we have a time stamp on your stupidity now?
Quote from: GOMU85 on March 15, 2012, 07:49:37 PM
Thats nice of you to stick up for him. However, he still sucks.
I'm still a real Marquette fan tho so don't be mad at me.
p.s. I've been saying for three years that he sucks.
Our sucky point guard has helped this team to a top 10 ranking and 3 seed in the NCAA Tournament.
He's not perfect, and neither is anybody else on this team. Neither is any other guy on any other team or any future PG recruit we might land.
I would think that a genius such as yourself would have figured this out by now.
'12-'13 Prediction: Mayo > Cadougan
Quote from: GOMU85 on March 15, 2012, 07:39:21 PM
Hahaha, please tell me you're joking.
Note the lack of teal.
Quote from: Jamailman on March 15, 2012, 07:50:47 PM
So we have a time stamp on your stupidity now?
Post of the month.
wahwahwahwahwahwahwahwah.
Didn't we win? I thought we did this when we lost.
Quote from: GOMU85 on March 15, 2012, 07:49:37 PM
Thats nice of you to stick up for him. However, he still sucks.
I'm still a real Marquette fan tho so don't be mad at me.
p.s. I've been saying for three years that he sucks.
I admire your mis-placed self confidence, bragging about being wrong for a long time without learning.
Junior played like a dumbass for about 90 seconds. Other than that, he was solid today. I'm a Junior fan...haters gonna hate.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on March 15, 2012, 06:58:31 PM
When Junior's going north and south he's explosive and has great vision. He's a liability going east and west - his high dribble, lack of height and lack of lateral quickness lead to too many turnovers.
Lenny, this comment sums up nicely how I feel as well.
For those saying it was only 90 seconds, we watched a different game. At this level, you cannot try throwing skip passes through 4 other players when you don't get the ball high enough. Twice he drove in and got stuck and then tried a cross court skip pass that was intercepted. Makes me want to pull what little hair I have left out of my head.
it was byu. junior did good.
that said. .duane wilson would be welcome.
Quote from: Hoopaloop on March 15, 2012, 08:26:43 PM
Makes me want to pull what little hair I have left out of my head.
OK, I wasn't certain until now. You are CBB.
Quote from: Sir Lawrence on March 15, 2012, 08:54:31 PM
OK, I wasn't certain until now. You are CBB.
He has a full head of hair unless he lost it after this Summer. I'm sure those here that are Facebook friends of his can concur based on the pictures posted on his account.
Quote from: Hoopaloop on March 15, 2012, 08:59:56 PM
He has a full head of hair unless he lost it after this Summer. I'm sure those here that are Facebook friends of his can concur based on the pictures posted on his account.
I don't use teal.
;D I need the teal handicapper sometimes.
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on March 15, 2012, 06:54:30 PM
This is the Dwight Buycks whining all over again.
And I predicted that this junior hate will turn out to be misguided As the Vander hate last year.
I wholeheartedly agree with this. I think that people that hate on Junior really don't understand what he brings to this team. Yes the first half at Louisville was bad, yes he had a bad 90 seconds today. But without him the team is pretty much lost.
If we replayed the Louisville game without Junior we would have lost by 30. Junior makes sure everyone else knows what they are doing and that they are in the right place. Most of his turnovers result from his teammates not doing what they were supposed to and not being in the right place.
Playing PG at MU is the most thankless place in college basketball, we have become way too spoiled.
I'm loving this. Keep em coming guys
I swear to God, if I ever end up the head coach of a D-I ball team, I am going to lobby my ass off trying to get the lot of you coaching jobs... for opposing teams.
Junior will never be a super-star but you can go far with him as your point guard. I don't think he had a great game but he most certainly didn't have a poor one.
(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j293/Homebrew101/cdf97848.gif)
Some of this is the comparison of guards. We are so used to having fantastic point guards at MU that when we have one that is good, but not great, it becomes noticeable. Secondly, he was rated very highly as a recruit, so the expectations are high. He has his terrific moments. The three he hit today was a big shot. It's the 3 to 5 minutes a game with the turnovers, the mental breakdowns, the bad decisions or the lack of defense that make one go crazy.
Love the little guy eating popcorn...very cool. What a 6 page thread of nothing. Ok, the time stamp on stupidity remark was spot on.
Geez Louise....expectations are SOOO high.
BTW..Marq did win today, right? Whaaa?...WON by 20?!? This thread makes it sound like Junior LOST the game by 20.
wow.... :-X
*Sits back and waits to get called an A**HOLE*
Quote from: GOMU85 on March 15, 2012, 10:04:47 PM
*Sits back and waits to get called an A**HOLE*
You're trying too hard.
Not an a-hole. You just don't know what you are talking about. So stop playing the victim card.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 15, 2012, 10:19:34 PMNot an a-hole. You just don't know what you are talking about. So stop playing the victim card.
+1,000,000,000,000
That was masterfully said. Absolute online gold.
I had barely gotten a compliment about Junior out of my mouth when he imploded for a couple of minutes. Buzz wisely took him out, coached him up for a minute on the sideline, let him sit for a short spell and then put him back in. Junior then played fine the rest of the way. Very nice coaching job.
Let's be fair. Everyone on the team has had a short sucky spell. Even Jae, about whom we now wax poetic.
Sure, it would be nice if Junior didn't have those implosions. We need a steadier hand from out PG. But he still makes the O go better than anyone else, so wishing for someone else -- for the next 5 games we'll play, anyway -- is counterproductive.
We need our PG to play less DB.
(http://l.yimg.com/j/assets/p/sp/getty/53/fullj.160290e92bd5819b04853f8faca3ab79/160290e92bd5819b04853f8faca3ab79-getty-141389815.jpg)
Can we put this sh*t to bed now??? Great game by Junior.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 17, 2012, 11:14:31 PM
Can we put this sh*t to bed now??? Great game by Junior.
You just bumped it, Champ. Time to lock her up.
seriously. delete/remove this thread please.
Quote from: JamilJaeJamailJrJuan on March 17, 2012, 11:15:37 PM
You just bumped it, Champ. Time to lock her up.
I bumped it to show how absurd the OP was. Junior ran this team today. Fantastic game.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 17, 2012, 11:25:49 PM
I bumped it to show how absurd the OP was. Junior ran this team today. Fantastic game.
He was very solid today. The OP was not absurd. We lost against Louisville because of our PG play. It is not one of the strengths of this team, but he played well today.
Listening to the press conference .. it's obvious that Buzz/the staff has read some of this thread.
Summarizing .. COACH BUZZ WILLIAMS and DJO delivered a middle finger directed at the original poster and others who tried throwing Junior under the bus, arguing against the tenacity and ability of Junior Cadougan, who had a bad BET game, but has been integral to why MU is where they are, getting 2nd in the BE, and now heading to a 2nd S16.
It's threads like this, watching that press conference .. pains me personally, hosting the minority poisons that can be spewed here.
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on March 18, 2012, 01:28:01 AM
Listening to the press conference .. it's obvious that Buzz/the staff has read some of this thread.
Summarizing .. COACH BUZZ WILLIAMS and DJO delivered a middle finger directed at the original poster and others who tried throwing Junior under the bus, arguing against the tenacity and ability of Junior Cadougan, who had a bad BET game, but has been integral to why MU is where they are, getting 2nd in the BE, and now heading to a 2nd S16.
It's threads like this, watching that press conference .. pains me personally, hosting the minority poisons that can be spewed here.
+1000. He played too well all year to have a have a bad showing in NY and be thrown under the bus. I've been on the Junior bandwagon all along and I'm not patting myself on the back when I say that. It just makes me sick to see how our own team has to use its fans as motivation. I remember last year Buzz said it was hard to see everyone want to show up in Newark after people doubted us after we had some bad losses near the end of the season. I'm sure he has a similar feeling today. Go MU.. and our PG!
Quote from: Hoopaloop on March 18, 2012, 12:08:11 AM
He was very solid today. The OP was not absurd. We lost against Louisville because of our PG play. It is not one of the strengths of this team, but he played well today.
It was absurd. Travis Diener shot 1-11 and had 11 turnovers in the Final Four game against Kansas. Did we need a new point guard then?
Junior had a horrible game against Louisville. Every player has horrible games in their lives. Even the best in the world. It happens. A horrible game doesn't mean you can't get the job done.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 17, 2012, 11:25:49 PM
I bumped it to show how absurd the OP was. Junior ran this team today. Fantastic game.
+1
Junior has been great...glad to see him play so well.
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on March 18, 2012, 01:28:01 AM
Listening to the press conference .. it's obvious that Buzz/the staff has read some of this thread.
Summarizing .. COACH BUZZ WILLIAMS and DJO delivered a middle finger directed at the original poster and others who tried throwing Junior under the bus, arguing against the tenacity and ability of Junior Cadougan, who had a bad BET game, but has been integral to why MU is where they are, getting 2nd in the BE, and now heading to a 2nd S16.
It's threads like this, watching that press conference .. pains me personally, hosting the minority poisons that can be spewed here.
Post of the year.
Quote from: Hoopaloop on March 18, 2012, 12:08:11 AM
He was very solid today. The OP was not absurd. We lost against Louisville because of our PG play. It is not one of the strengths of this team, but he played well today.
The OP was absurd, and now you are joining him. We don't "need" a point guard. We have a point guard. One who played poorly against Louisville, but who rebounded to have a very nice game yesterday.
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on March 18, 2012, 01:28:01 AMListening to the press conference .. it's obvious that Buzz/the staff has read some of this thread.
Summarizing .. COACH BUZZ WILLIAMS and DJO delivered a middle finger directed at the original poster and others who tried throwing Junior under the bus, arguing against the tenacity and ability of Junior Cadougan, who had a bad BET game, but has been integral to why MU is where they are, getting 2nd in the BE, and now heading to a 2nd S16.
It's threads like this, watching that press conference .. pains me personally, hosting the minority poisons that can be spewed here.
All this. No doubt in my mind they're on this site.
Quote from: Hoopaloop on March 18, 2012, 12:08:11 AM
He was very solid today. The OP was not absurd. We lost against Louisville because of our PG play. It is not one of the strengths of this team, but he played well today.
Maybe you should go back and take a look at all of our losses and figure out why we lost...who to blame it on. I'm sure you will find other positions where we are lacking as well don't you think?
As I said very early on when this thread was started, THE STUPIDITY OF THIS THREAD IS APPALLING.
Bottom line, Louisville was a team loss. Junior had 8 turnovers not just because he had a bad game, but because we had a bad gameplan. He wasn't the only one trying to dribble through traffic, and he wasn't the one not giving himself an outlet to pass to. Cat has a 2.1 A/T ratio, that's not indicative of a bad PG. Did he have a bad game? Sure. But who didn't?
Buzz said it in the post game. It's not about one guy, it's not about him, it's about them. It's the team. They win as a team, they lose as a team. LSU didn't beat DJO, they beat Marquette. Vandy clearly kicked the crap out of Marquette. Georgetown didn't beat Todd, they beat Marquette. Syracuse ran all over all of us in the first half en route to beating Marquette. Notre Dame kicked the entire team's collective ass. Cincy? Who's that pinned on? I'd say the entire team. And Louisville, DEFINITELY a team loss.
These guys win together, they lose together. And when one guy, especially the point guard, makes a bad play it's often because the other four guys didn't do their jobs to help make him look good. If you don't get open for a pass, if you can't break free under the hoop, if you're late setting a pick, all of these things often make one guy look bad.
Bottom line, Junior's the quarterback of this team. When we lose, he's an easy target. But there's four other guys on the floor not blocking for him, dropping passes, and not looking back as they run their routes. You can pin it all on him, but it isn't fair, because everyone else is probably just as culpable.
We have to remember most players do have off games. Also, generally we will never know if a player is sick. Remember there was a game early this year were Cadougan was throwing up and still playing.
*Sits back and waits for my name to be mentioned*
judging players off of one performance is irrational. Even the best NBA players throw a clunker every now and again.
Quote from: GOMU85 on March 18, 2012, 09:43:49 AM
*Sits back and waits for my name to be mentioned*
and your name would be....
Quote from: GOMU85 on March 18, 2012, 09:43:49 AM
*Sits back and waits for my name to be mentioned*
GOMU85 is the worst poster on this board, clearly knows nothing about basketball, and this thread is an embarrassment to the entire Marquette fanbase.
Happy?
Junior had a great game and was a major reason we're in the sweet 16. Just admit you were wrong about him. Or stop posting altogether.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 18, 2012, 07:00:12 AM
The OP was absurd, and now you are joining him. We don't "need" a point guard. We have a point guard. One who played poorly against Louisville, but who rebounded to have a very nice game yesterday.
OK, I get it. I'm not advocating in the harsh terms the OP stated. I do think that PG is our weakest area in comparison to what PGs we've had in the past 20 years at MU. Point guards have been our staple. He played a wonderful game yesterday. We need that to continue.
Quote from: brewcity77 on March 18, 2012, 07:01:00 AM
All this. No doubt in my mind they're on this site.
Probably. From what I Milwaukee bros tell me, the subject of PG play has been talk on sports radio out there, too so its not limited to this site.
Quote from: ATL MU Warrior on March 18, 2012, 07:34:50 AM
Maybe you should go back and take a look at all of our losses and figure out why we lost...who to blame it on. I'm sure you will find other positions where we are lacking as well don't you think?
As I said very early on when this thread was started, THE STUPIDITY OF THIS THREAD IS APPALLING.
Then the mods should have deleted it a long time ago.
fair weather fans who all posted with their vageena heads here. wow. it was a terrible game, but whoever posted meanmouth comments here should be embarassed. yes it's o.k. to be critical, but these guys want to win more than you. they are the ones working their asses off basicly year round and oh yeah, they are humans...any one of yous guyses ever f-up a test err something??
Quote from: GOMU85 on March 18, 2012, 09:43:49 AM
*Sits back and waits for my name to be mentioned*
More like hopes. Craves attention.