COVID-19 (f/k/a "the Coronavirus")

[GooooMarquette]

Telling people not to travel at Christmas might not have much of an impact though.  Tons of people ignored advisories about travel and gatherings at Thanksgiving and I expect the same thing at Christmas unfortunately.

I suspect you are right...but I credit Fauci for at least trying. Not many in Washington are even doing that....

[MU82]

An average of 1,462 daily COVID-19 deaths in America during the two weeks before Thanksgiving, which means the death toll has been one American dying every minute of every day.

And most epidemiologists and other virus experts think the toll will only rise after all the ill-advised holiday super-spreader gatherings.

What a nightmare, much of it self-inflicted.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Actually their response to the true second wave has been ok.  Not great but better than round one.  The French model for response to the second wave should be something we study (they kept the schools open)

Further to this, an article hit my morning news feed on this topic.  France is now rolling back the restrictions after 3-weeks because they were successful in checking the surge in cases.  While they are bound to deal with this 'more open'/'more closed' toggling until broad vaccinations come, its been proven again that some restrictions can check an epidemic surge in a relatively short period of time.  Also this is great because they didn't go full lockdown and kept the younger children in school.

https://www.axios.com/covid-france-lockdown-end-d930d5a0-78e3-4144-9b44-5e648f12c309.html

[wadesworld]

I've been told nothing anyone does can change the outcome of this virus.  It has to be fake news.  This is all a hoax to get 45 out of office, and even that didn't work, as 45 won the election in a runaway, there is just massive voter fraud everywhere.

The best president of our lifetime has handled this thing perfectly.  China's fault.

[SERocks]

I've been told nothing anyone does can change the outcome of this virus.  It has to be fake news.  This is all a hoax to get 45 out of office, and even that didn't work, as 45 won the election in a runaway, there is just massive voter fraud everywhere.

The best president of our lifetime has handled this thing perfectly.  China's fault.

It is scary to me that people who are fellow citizens that I live with (USA) actually think this way.  But then again, average intelligence is not a high bar and remember 50% of the people are below average.  Scary.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

This is a good and optimistic message from Fauci.  All the Govs should be out replicating this. 

https://twitter.com/nowthisnews/status/1333146966985908224?s=21

[Johnny B]

"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that"
-George Carlin

[GooooMarquette]

Further to this, an article hit my morning news feed on this topic.  France is now rolling back the restrictions after 3-weeks because they were successful in checking the surge in cases.  While they are bound to deal with this 'more open'/'more closed' toggling until broad vaccinations come, its been proven again that some restrictions can check an epidemic surge in a relatively short period of time.  Also this is great because they didn't go full lockdown and kept the younger children in school.

https://www.axios.com/covid-france-lockdown-end-d930d5a0-78e3-4144-9b44-5e648f12c309.html

France (like most other countries) has done a much better job than the US at tamping down surges. From the article, a couple of the strategies for reopening caught my eye:

*The first stage out of lockdown will begin on Nov. 28, when nonessential businesses such as toy stores and bookshops will be allowed to reopen under strict health rules.

*Outdoor after-school activities will resume, while places of worship will reopen with no more than 30 people.

*Bars and restaurants are likely to remain closed until mid-January.

_________________________

So they are allowing some nonessential businesses to reopen under strict health rules...but they are keeping bars and restaurants closed for several more weeks. This recognizes the basic reality that you can require people to wear masks (and keep them on) at toy stores, book shops and such, but it isn't feasible to do so at bars and restaurants. The US needs to wake up to this reality, and make bars and restaurants take-out and delivery only.

And secondly, they are imposing a 30-person limit on houses of worship...much lower than most restrictions in the US. We need to impose strict limits on all gatherings, including those at churches.

[Galway Eagle]

France (like most other countries) has done a much better job than the US at tamping down surges. From the article, a couple of the strategies for reopening caught my eye:

*The first stage out of lockdown will begin on Nov. 28, when nonessential businesses such as toy stores and bookshops will be allowed to reopen under strict health rules.

*Outdoor after-school activities will resume, while places of worship will reopen with no more than 30 people.

*Bars and restaurants are likely to remain closed until mid-January.

_________________________

So they are allowing some nonessential businesses to reopen under strict health rules...but they are keeping bars and restaurants closed for several more weeks. This recognizes the basic reality that you can require people to wear masks (and keep them on) at toy stores, book shops and such, but it isn't feasible to do so at bars and restaurants. The US needs to wake up to this reality, and make bars and restaurants take-out and delivery only.

And secondly, they are imposing a 30-person limit on houses of worship...much lower than most restrictions in the US. We need to impose strict limits on all gatherings, including those at churches.

I disagree re Restaurants and bars. Those with patios and such should be fine. Correct? I mean I've been to three breweries this weekend here in PHX and I was at least 8 feet away from anyone and outside 100% of the time. I don't think you can lump places like that in with packed dive bars.

[GooooMarquette]

I disagree re Restaurants and bars. Those with patios and such should be fine. Correct? I mean I've been to three breweries this weekend here in PHX and I was at least 8 feet away from anyone and outside 100% of the time. I don't think you can lump places like that in with packed dive bars.

Perhaps theoretically. Were you required to wear a mask anytime you walked to or from your table (when you might come very close to others)?

[Galway Eagle]

Perhaps theoretically. Were you required to wear a mask anytime you walked to or from your table (when you might come very close to others)?

Yes masks were required when walking to your table.

[shoothoops]

US coronavirus cases by month in 2020:

March: 186,200
April: 883,199
May: 723,166
June: 845,736
July: 1,926,970
August: 1,479,756
September: 1,215,901
October: 1,940,522
November: 4,252,822

(As of early this morning)

[jesmu84]

  jesmu, as this virus was so new in many different ways coupled with the fact that the chinese did not play nice and it was an election year, no one really knew how to go about attacking this virus.  there was NO CONTAINING this virus.   

    what we did with this pandemic is monumental.  the speed at which our bio sciences are coming up with antidotes, vaccines, anti-virals, antibodies, etc. is a testament to our dedicated research.  in the past, the average time to get a vaccine out was multiples of years, not months.  but you are wrong about "containing" it.   this virus is not going to go away until most everyone gets it in some form or another, herd immunity is developed and/or the vaccines are effective and distributed in an efficient way.  everyone's body handles it differently, but very few (if any) were immune to it.

I'm sure you agree then that Cuomo did as good a job as could be expected in NY?

[GooooMarquette]

Yes masks were required when walking to your table.

I think a well-enforced outdoor situation like that would pose minimal risk. Indoors would still be a problem because we know what ventilation systems can do with airborne particles and unmasked diners.

[forgetful]

Steps to stop the virus:

1. Restaurants and Bars, delivery or takeout only. Allow outdoor dining for parties of 6 or less, with social distancing of tables.

2. Those that can work from home should be strictly WFH.

3. With vaccines online, prioritize health care workers with patient contact first (no need to prioritize all heal care workers as many, (e.g. people working in billing) should be WFH (see item 2).

4. Next priority of vaccines should go to essential workers that must work in person.

There are 20-25M vaccines that can be administered in Dec. or early Jan. That is enough doses to cover all health care workers with patient contact, all nursing home staff or in home workers, with leftover to start vaccinate essential workers (e.g. food supply).

[jesmu84]

Steps to stop the virus:

1. Restaurants and Bars, delivery or takeout only. Allow outdoor dining for parties of 6 or less, with social distancing of tables.

2. Those that can work from home should be strictly WFH.

3. With vaccines online, prioritize health care workers with patient contact first (no need to prioritize all heal care workers as many, (e.g. people working in billing) should be WFH (see item 2).

4. Next priority of vaccines should go to essential workers that must work in person.

There are 20-25M vaccines that can be administered in Dec. or early Jan. That is enough doses to cover all health care workers with patient contact, all nursing home staff or in home workers, with leftover to start vaccinate essential workers (e.g. food supply).

Take your commie thinking and get outta here. Not in this wonderful country will any of that be used.

[GooooMarquette]

Steps to stop the virus:

1. Restaurants and Bars, delivery or takeout only. Allow outdoor dining for parties of 6 or less, with social distancing of tables.

2. Those that can work from home should be strictly WFH.

3. With vaccines online, prioritize health care workers with patient contact first (no need to prioritize all heal care workers as many, (e.g. people working in billing) should be WFH (see item 2).

4. Next priority of vaccines should go to essential workers that must work in person.

There are 20-25M vaccines that can be administered in Dec. or early Jan. That is enough doses to cover all health care workers with patient contact, all nursing home staff or in home workers, with leftover to start vaccinate essential workers (e.g. food supply).

Much of this is, or will be, happening. Unfortunately, the first one seems to be an impossible sell in most places. It has proven to work in France and other countries, but only a handful of states seem willing to do takeout/delivery/minimal outdoor restaurants and bars for more than a couple weeks here and there.

[wadesworld]

US coronavirus cases by month in 2020:

March: 186,200
April: 883,199
May: 723,166
June: 845,736
July: 1,926,970
August: 1,479,756
September: 1,215,901
October: 1,940,522
November: 4,252,822

(As of early this morning)

Rounding the corner.

I think a well-enforced outdoor situation like that would pose minimal risk. Indoors would still be a problem because we know what ventilation systems can do with airborne particles and unmasked diners.

If people were responsible, outdoor dining with social distancing would be fine.  The problem is we know damn well people are not responsible enough to keep things safe.

It would be nice of the government would get working on a stimulus package.  Then some of these restaurants would have a chance at survival if their business suffered until mid 2021 when people could get vaccinated.  Instead, the government pretends there are no issues here and everyone suffers.

But hey, China's fault.

[jesmu84]

Rounding the corner.

If people were responsible, outdoor dining with social distancing would be fine.  The problem is we know damn well people are not responsible enough to keep things safe.

It would be nice of the government would get working on a stimulus package.  Then some of these restaurants would have a chance at survival if their business suffered until mid 2021 when people could get vaccinated.  Instead, the government pretends there are no issues here and everyone suffers.

But hey, China's fault.

We should be locking down social gathering/in person businesses. Government should be giving checks to those effected. Keep schools open.

[Warriors4ever]

https://denver.cbslocal.com/video/4904068-longmont-leadership-weld-county-leadership-at-odds-over-covid-health-orders/

Colorado. Weld County refuses  to enforce the state’s code red restrictions barring things like indoor dining, arguing that people can be relied on to act responsibly ( as their cases and positivity rate keep going up). They have three ICU beds left, as of three days ago. Neighboring town wants to bar their residents from being transferred to hospitals in their town.
Report does make note that federal law prohibits this, but the mayor is irate at the prospect.

[Marquette Fan]

https://denver.cbslocal.com/video/4904068-longmont-leadership-weld-county-leadership-at-odds-over-covid-health-orders/

Colorado. Weld County refuses  to enforce the state’s code red restrictions barring things like indoor dining, arguing that people can be relied on to act responsibly ( as their cases and positivity rate keep going up). They have three ICU beds left, as of three days ago. Neighboring town wants to bar their residents from being transferred to hospitals in their town.
Report does make note that federal law prohibits this, but the mayor is irate at the prospect.

Yeah I didn't think people could be counted on to act responsibly before the pandemic started and Covid has proven that to be very true unfortunately.

[Marquette Fan]

I suspect you are right...but I credit Fauci for at least trying. Not many in Washington are even doing that....

Yes I see your point.  I'm just getting so down about the scary Covid numbers and the people who think Covid is no big deal.  Oh how I wish we could count on people to listen to advisories about travel and large gatherings at Christmas.  I won't be seeing my parents for Christmas in the first time ever in my many years on this Earth and haven't seen them in person since last Christmas but need to do this to try to keep them safe as my family poses too much of a risk to their health...

[pbiflyer]

Florida (governor) man!
DeSantis dismisses lockdowns, mask mandates as coronavirus cases spread
https://www.palmbeachpost.com/story/news/2020/11/30/gov-ron-desantis-mocks-lockdowns-mask-mandates-coronavirus-cases-spread/6467204002/


With Florida poised to notch its 1 millionth coronavirus case, Gov. Ron DeSantis held his first press conference in four weeks on Monday to declare that mask mandates and business closures in other states are wrong-headed and he alone has plotted the right course to combat the pandemic.

Offering blistering criticism of actions by governors in other states, epidemiologists and even the White House Coronavirus Task Force, DeSantis doubled-down on his long-held insistence that he won’t implement any measures to slow the spread of the virus among the general population.

[rocky_warrior]

https://denver.cbslocal.com/video/4904068-longmont-leadership-weld-county-leadership-at-odds-over-covid-health-orders/

Colorado. Weld County refuses  to enforce the state’s code red restrictions barring things like indoor dining, arguing that people can be relied on to act responsibly ( as their cases and positivity rate keep going up). They have three ICU beds left, as of three days ago. Neighboring town wants to bar their residents from being transferred to hospitals in their town.
Report does make note that federal law prohibits this, but the mayor is irate at the prospect.

It's important to note that weld county sits right beside boulder county.  That's like Idaho vs California, and Idaho residents needing to get sent to CA for healthcare.  So I get the ideological differences, but we all need to take care of each other.

[GooooMarquette]

Yes I see your point.  I'm just getting so down about the scary Covid numbers and the people who think Covid is no big deal.  Oh how I wish we could count on people to listen to advisories about travel and large gatherings at Christmas.  I won't be seeing my parents for Christmas in the first time ever in my many years on this Earth and haven't seen them in person since last Christmas but need to do this to try to keep them safe as my family poses too much of a risk to their health...

I hear you. The American public has really disappointed me too. I always knew there was a lot of ignorance and a pervasive ‘me first’ attitude, but the last several months have been just appalling.