Hydroxychloroquinine updates (and other potential treatments)

[shoothoops]

In his own words...sigh...

https://twitter.com/Acyn/status/1272624866366119936?s=19

[Jockey]

In his own words...sigh...

https://twitter.com/Acyn/status/1272624866366119936?s=19

Stunningly ignorant.

[GooooMarquette]

Science has always been a weakness of mine but the fact that two different organizations are testing it would seem to be a great sign?

Yes – the fact that different organizations are studying these particular antibodies seems to indicate that they are a promising lead for testing and therapy.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Gooooo, forgetful, would love to hear your thoughts on this:

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-53061281
Coronavirus: Dexamethasone proves first life-saving drug

The low-dose steroid treatment dexamethasone is a major breakthrough in the fight against the deadly virus, UK experts say.

The drug is part of the world's biggest trial testing existing treatments to see if they also work for coronavirus. It cut the risk of death by a third for patients on ventilators. For those on oxygen, it cut deaths by a fifth.

[tower912]

I'm not surprised.   Stopping or minimizing the cytokine storm is a very important step in lowering the death totals.  That a common steroid can do it occasionally is a bonus.   Keep sciencing.

[forgetful]

Gooooo, forgetful, would love to hear your thoughts on this:

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-53061281
Coronavirus: Dexamethasone proves first life-saving drug

The low-dose steroid treatment dexamethasone is a major breakthrough in the fight against the deadly virus, UK experts say.

The drug is part of the world's biggest trial testing existing treatments to see if they also work for coronavirus. It cut the risk of death by a third for patients on ventilators. For those on oxygen, it cut deaths by a fifth.

I saw this earlier today, and was hoping I could see some of the raw data and methods associated with the study. The results that they report are fantastic, and this is exactly the type of thing we need for severe cases. We need to look at what happens now in combination treatments e.g. remdesivir + dex ; or remdesivir + dex + plasma.

Ideally combination therapies would amplify each treatments main effects, which are different in all 3 cases for known treatments.

Dex was on my radar as a possible beneficial treatment for a couple reasons, including its anti-inflammatory activity, beneficial use in respiratory distress syndrome, and its lack of effects on sodium retention that may minimize the benefit of other corticosteroids, so I'm optimistic (always cautious though).

[GooooMarquette]

Ditto on what forgetful said. I hadn't read much about steroid use in covid patients up until now (but assumed docs were using them for their strong anti-inflammatory properties). The report looks very promising; I just hope it can be replicated in more widespread studies.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Science: Its a Deep State Conspiracy

Trump Administration Stuck With 66 Million Doses of Near-Unusable Chloroquine and Hydroxychloroquine
https://www.thedailybeast.com/donald-trumps-administration-stuck-with-66-million-doses-of-near-unusable-chloroquine-and-hydroxychloroquine?ref=home

The Food and Drug Administration rescinded its “emergency use authorization” for chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine as a treatment for COVID-19 on Monday. The decision left President Donald Trump —who had touted the malaria drugs as potential coronavirus cures and even said he had taken one—and his administration with 66 million doses of chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine without an evident use. The White House had mobilized the federal government to stockpile the drugs for use against the virus before medical experts were sure of its efficacy. Peter Navarro, the president’s trade adviser, raged against the decision Monday and mustered a familiar conspiracy theory in defense of Trump: “This is a Deep State blindside by bureaucrats who hate the administration they work for more than they’re concerned about saving American lives.”

So how many taxpayer dollars were wasted on this?

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I wonder what rocket thinks of this now?

[MU82]

I wonder what rocket thinks of this now?

Do you really wonder?

I'd be pretty surprised if he doesn't also think it's a conspiracy against his emperor.

[forgetful]

Science: Its a Deep State Conspiracy

Trump Administration Stuck With 66 Million Doses of Near-Unusable Chloroquine and Hydroxychloroquine
https://www.thedailybeast.com/donald-trumps-administration-stuck-with-66-million-doses-of-near-unusable-chloroquine-and-hydroxychloroquine?ref=home

The Food and Drug Administration rescinded its “emergency use authorization” for chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine as a treatment for COVID-19 on Monday. The decision left President Donald Trump —who had touted the malaria drugs as potential coronavirus cures and even said he had taken one—and his administration with 66 million doses of chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine without an evident use. The White House had mobilized the federal government to stockpile the drugs for use against the virus before medical experts were sure of its efficacy. Peter Navarro, the president’s trade adviser, raged against the decision Monday and mustered a familiar conspiracy theory in defense of Trump: “This is a Deep State blindside by bureaucrats who hate the administration they work for more than they’re concerned about saving American lives.”

So how many taxpayer dollars were wasted on this?

I'm not really upset about the stockpile of this medication. If it had worked, we were well supplied, if it didn't, it wasn't that much cost to the average taxpayer. Better to be prepared in case things were needed.

What bothered me from the very beginning was the political push to prioritize one treatment over others, when others looked far more promising from the scientific perspective. The politicization of a prospective treatment damaged our ability to focus on simply doing science and preparing. As an example, no push was made to stockpile remdesivir. We are facing a shortage now, because the president for political purposes pushed one treatment that was unlikely to prove beneficial.

That is the problem. Pushing one treatment at the expense of others. All reasonably plausible treatments should have been identified and stockpiles made, or plans to stock them put into place.

[MU82]

I'm not really upset about the stockpile of this medication. If it had worked, we were well supplied, if it didn't, it wasn't that much cost to the average taxpayer. Better to be prepared in case things were needed.

What bothered me from the very beginning was the political push to prioritize one treatment over others, when others looked far more promising from the scientific perspective. The politicization of a prospective treatment damaged our ability to focus on simply doing science and preparing. As an example, no push was made to stockpile remdesivir. We are facing a shortage now, because the president for political purposes pushed one treatment that was unlikely to prove beneficial.

That is the problem. Pushing one treatment at the expense of others. All reasonably plausible treatments should have been identified and stockpiles made, or plans to stock them put into place.

Reasonable comment. Thanks for posting.

[tower912]

It means that a potential cure was stockpiled and then found wanting.     Hopefully it is now doled out to those who need it.    I have nothing against hydroxychloroquinine.     It would have been nice if it had been more effective.    The problem was/is that it became politicized.    It is a drug that has shown effectiveness in other uses.    It was experimented with early.    Like many others, it showed little to no real magic.    Not a crime.   An experiment that didn't pan out.   

Touting it as a panacea or wonder drug was unfair and dumb. 

[Hards Alumni]

Science: Its a Deep State Conspiracy

Trump Administration Stuck With 66 Million Doses of Near-Unusable Chloroquine and Hydroxychloroquine
https://www.thedailybeast.com/donald-trumps-administration-stuck-with-66-million-doses-of-near-unusable-chloroquine-and-hydroxychloroquine?ref=home

The Food and Drug Administration rescinded its “emergency use authorization” for chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine as a treatment for COVID-19 on Monday. The decision left President Donald Trump —who had touted the malaria drugs as potential coronavirus cures and even said he had taken one—and his administration with 66 million doses of chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine without an evident use. The White House had mobilized the federal government to stockpile the drugs for use against the virus before medical experts were sure of its efficacy. Peter Navarro, the president’s trade adviser, raged against the decision Monday and mustered a familiar conspiracy theory in defense of Trump: “This is a Deep State blindside by bureaucrats who hate the administration they work for more than they’re concerned about saving American lives.”

So how many taxpayer dollars were wasted on this?

Luckily it is an inexpensive medication.

[GooooMarquette]

I'm not really upset about the stockpile of this medication. If it had worked, we were well supplied, if it didn't, it wasn't that much cost to the average taxpayer. Better to be prepared in case things were needed.

What bothered me from the very beginning was the political push to prioritize one treatment over others, when others looked far more promising from the scientific perspective. The politicization of a prospective treatment damaged our ability to focus on simply doing science and preparing. As an example, no push was made to stockpile remdesivir. We are facing a shortage now, because the president for political purposes pushed one treatment that was unlikely to prove beneficial.

That is the problem. Pushing one treatment at the expense of others. All reasonably plausible treatments should have been identified and stockpiles made, or plans to stock them put into place.

Agreed - it was reasonable to stockpile a drug that could have been a game changer in the fight against Covid.

The only question I have is how long they continued to stockpile. If they stopped stockpiling the drug a few weeks back when the data became clear, then I think the move was fine. But if they continued to do it until FDA’s announcement on Monday, well....

[Jockey]

Since they have massive quantities available, it might be a good idea to provide the medication for free to patients who really need it, specifically those with Lupus.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Agreed - it was reasonable to stockpile a drug that could have been a game changer in the fight against Covid.

Except as far as I can see, there was no scientifically valid reason to assume this was a game changer.

This all started from an extremely sketchy trial by an extremely sketchy French doctor. Then Dr. "Miracle Cure" Oz started promoting this, because that is what he does these days, seemingly without the least bit of investigation. Because Oz is a frequent guest on Fox, the entire Fox crew began touting it, and so of course Trump latched on to it like a drowning man. And so we got the "game changer".

Dr. Rick Bright was fired from Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority  because he resisted dumping money into unproven (in terms of COVID) drugs. Telling the Emperor he has no clothes is verboten. So both the Federal government and a number of state governments wasted a lot of money on this and likely killed a number of people they tried it on because a non-scientist, non-doctor with "a very good brain" had a hunch.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Multiple governments started trials. 

[rocket surgeon]

I wonder what rocket thinks of this now?

i hope this answers your question sully

dr stephen m. smith and a host of doctors at his infectious disease clinic have been treating hundreds of patients with success that may not have had an alternative at the time.  it probably saved some lives while other treatments were being developed.  i don't give a schnit if uncle joe touted it.  if it has worked as it has for the smith center, to deny it's use would be denying a sick patient the chance to live

https://www.risingms.com/covid-19-treatment-updates/


The people that say hydroxychloroquine is not proven to work are looking for a traditional double-blind study. The good news is that such a study coming. The University of Pennsylvania has a new trial to evaluate whether the drug hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) can benefit people infected with COVID-19, as well as whether taking the drug preventatively may help people avoid infection altogether. The study, called Prevention and Treatment of COVID-19 with HCQ (PATCH), is currently enrolling patients in three separate sub-studies (NCT04329923).

[Jockey]

Multiple governments started trials.

I agree with TSmith.

Multiple gov't's started trials because they were reaching for anything - not because there was a good reason to believe it would work.

[Hards Alumni]

i hope this answers your question sully

dr stephen m. smith and a host of doctors at his infectious disease clinic have been treating hundreds of patients with success that may not have had an alternative at the time.  it probably saved some lives while other treatments were being developed.  i don't give a schnit if uncle joe touted it.  if it has worked as it has for the smith center, to deny it's use would be denying a sick patient the chance to live

https://www.risingms.com/covid-19-treatment-updates/


The people that say hydroxychloroquine is not proven to work are looking for a traditional double-blind study. The good news is that such a study coming. The University of Pennsylvania has a new trial to evaluate whether the drug hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) can benefit people infected with COVID-19, as well as whether taking the drug preventatively may help people avoid infection altogether. The study, called Prevention and Treatment of COVID-19 with HCQ (PATCH), is currently enrolling patients in three separate sub-studies (NCT04329923).

Clicked your link, checked the date, April 12, 2020.  Laughed to myself about how you're so dead set on something rather than just following what science says.


Then I just shrugged because I know, no matter what comes of all of this, you will never be convinced.  And that is your weakness.

[withoutbias]

Clicked your link, checked the date, April 12, 2020.  Laughed to myself about how you're so dead set on something rather than just following what science says.


Then I just shrugged because I know, no matter what comes of all of this, you will never be convinced.  And that is your weakness.

MAGA

[Uncle Rico]

Clicked your link, checked the date, April 12, 2020.  Laughed to myself about how you're so dead set on something rather than just following what science says.


Then I just shrugged because I know, no matter what comes of all of this, you will never be convinced.  And that is your weakness.

One day, it’ll just disappear

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

i hope this answers your question sully

dr stephen m. smith and a host of doctors at his infectious disease clinic have been treating hundreds of patients with success that may not have had an alternative at the time.  it probably saved some lives while other treatments were being developed.  i don't give a schnit if uncle joe touted it.  if it has worked as it has for the smith center, to deny it's use would be denying a sick patient the chance to live

https://www.risingms.com/covid-19-treatment-updates/


The people that say hydroxychloroquine is not proven to work are looking for a traditional double-blind study. The good news is that such a study coming. The University of Pennsylvania has a new trial to evaluate whether the drug hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) can benefit people infected with COVID-19, as well as whether taking the drug preventatively may help people avoid infection altogether. The study, called Prevention and Treatment of COVID-19 with HCQ (PATCH), is currently enrolling patients in three separate sub-studies (NCT04329923).

Oh. So you’re still on the quackery train.

Got it.

[GooooMarquette]

I agree with TSmith.

Multiple gov't's started trials because they were reaching for anything - not because there was a good reason to believe it would work.

I agree that it was a longshot, and I was as skeptical as anyone that it would work. That said, It was a potentially cheap cure, so the cost was a relative drop in the bucket. And the medication can still be used by people with lupus and such, so it isn’t like we spent money on nothing.

I am more concerned about the selection process for vaccines we’re backing. The last I saw, we were investing in five vaccines that don’t seem to be the best potential candidates. I think it is noteworthy that the two most promising candidates that we aren’t investing in happen to be from Chinese companies.

I hope I am proven wrong, but I think that choice will cost us a ton of money and put us further back in the vaccine line.