Thank God for Crean's Donation!

[MUSF]

Interesting that you were able to find three quality dick statues so quickly.

[keefe]

Interesting that you were able to find three quality dick statues so quickly.

Interesting. You see dicks. I see Creans.

[MUSF]

Interesting. You see dicks. I see Creans.

Touche

[keefe]

Touche

It's all good fun

[4everwarriors]

Interesting. You see dicks. I see Creans.

Same thing happened to me when I Googled "Coach Tom Crean."

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Same thing happened to me when I Googled "Coach Tom Crean."

I used bong and it returned a bunch of hairy boxes.

[ChicosBailBonds]

You're right, the 40% number was those who liked him.  I will say, my sample is alums who live in Chicago - some who because of family, friends or proximity know about him from MU. 

Additional I have a very good friend who went to IU and is from Louisville and now lives in MKE.  He has a 2 MU 5 packs to make sure he catches the Cards.  He was not happy at all when IU got Crean. 

The facts are Crean is a pretty good coach for MU.  He's a very average coach for Indiana.

Those aren't facts, those are opinions. Outright  Big Ten championship hasn't been won in 23 years at IU and this year's Big Ten was as tough a league as they have seen in several decades. 

I think going back to 2009 and 2010 here and reading what I said about Crean, Fred Glass, etc would be pretty theraputic for many here (not you Lens).   

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=21887.msg239135#msg239135

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=17568.msg176246#msg176246

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=21528.msg233387#msg233387

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=21880.msg239141#msg239141

They had a 5 year plan, for which I was mocked here for telling you what it was based on what I was hearing from the very to of the athletic department there.  Right on schedule they hit that 5 year plan.  By year 4 they were in the Sweet 16 and huge win over #1 Kentucky which could be regular season game of the decade... by year 5 they were ranked #1 for a spell and won the Big Ten regular season title and another Sweet 16.  That's about as on plan as you can get, especially seeing how many here said he should be fired in year 3.

They are getting in-state kids now.  They are graduating players at rates the IU faithful expect with near perfect ARP scores now.  Even the kids leaving early like Oladipo graduated in 3 years, Zeller is two semesters away from graduating.   They're highly competitive, fun to watch, off court issues mostly gone (good grades, All Big Ten Academic honorees, massive drug issues done away with, etc).

It won't be perfect, life never is, but many IU fans are thrilled with what happened in the first 5 years.  That's why Glass extended him another two years. 

What the future holds, nobody knows. 

[keefe]

Those aren't facts, those are opinions. Outright  Big Ten championship hasn't been won in 23 years at IU and this year's Big Ten was as tough a league as they have seen in several decades. 

I think going back to 2009 and 2010 here and reading what I said about Crean, Fred Glass, etc would be pretty theraputic for many here (not you Lens).   

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=21887.msg239135#msg239135

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=17568.msg176246#msg176246

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=21528.msg233387#msg233387

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=21880.msg239141#msg239141

They had a 5 year plan, for which I was mocked here for telling you what it was based on what I was hearing from the very to of the athletic department there.  Right on schedule they hit that 5 year plan.  By year 4 they were in the Sweet 16 and huge win over #1 Kentucky which could be regular season game of the decade... by year 5 they were ranked #1 for a spell and won the Big Ten regular season title and another Sweet 16.  That's about as on plan as you can get, especially seeing how many here said he should be fired in year 3.

They are getting in-state kids now.  They are graduating players at rates the IU faithful expect with near perfect ARP scores now.  Even the kids leaving early like Oladipo graduated in 3 years, Zeller is two semesters away from graduating.   They're highly competitive, fun to watch, off court issues mostly gone (good grades, All Big Ten Academic honorees, massive drug issues done away with, etc).

It won't be perfect, life never is, but many IU fans are thrilled with what happened in the first 5 years.  That's why Glass extended him another two years. 

What the future holds, nobody knows. 

Chico

I have no insight but you have to admit that there must be some disappointment in Bloomington with how the season ended for IIII. If Al took a preseason #1 and laid a Sweet Sixteen sized egg the natives would have been bitter. The jury is still out in the matter of The Bronzed Beast. The only banners that will do from here on out are national championships. The real question is whether the Bronzed Beast can deliver. 

[ChicosBailBonds]

Keefe....side note....ow is it that little IU is tied with Meatchicken for the Capital One standings?  With IU making the College World Series yesterday (first Big Ten team in 29 years), they will pass Michigan and still have an outside shot to be the number one overall athletic program in the country this year using Capital One methodology.

http://www.capitalonecup.com/assets/standings/complete-capital-one-cup-standings.pdf

[keefe]

Keefe....side note....ow is it that little IU is tied with Meatchicken for the Capital One standings?  With IU making the College World Series yesterday (first Big Ten team in 29 years), they will pass Michigan and still have an outside shot to be the number one overall athletic program in the country this year using Capital One methodology.

http://www.capitalonecup.com/assets/standings/complete-capital-one-cup-standings.pdf

Chico

Impressive. But let's face it - IIII has some ridiculously great sports programs. People forget Spitz swam for Doc Councilman back in the day. How does a Midwestern school convince a nice Chewish boy to leave SoCal for the frozen tundra? And to schwim no less! Oy!

[ChicosBailBonds]

You're both a little bit right and a little bit wrong. Indiana was the favorite to win the NC entering (and for most of) the season. Louisville became the ever so slight favorite entering the tournament with their strong play down the stretch. IU was not, however, in a cluster of teams at 7-1 or 8-1 behind Louisville. They were clearly the 2nd favorite at 5-1 (behind the Cards at 9-2). Nate Silver also gave a slight edge to 'Ville, but it was close to a statistical tie. With both Vegas and Silver, the gap between Louisville and Indiana was much smaller that the one between Indiana and whoever was #3.

The favorite to enter the season before one game is played, one injury happens, etc, etc?   That sounds like something out of a preseason poll.

And no, they weren't 5-1, they were a betting line consensus of 7-1 with four other teams at 8-1.  Of the five teams that were 7-1 or 8-1....NONE of them made the Final Four, let alone win it all.  Damn, all those coaches just suck.   

[ChicosBailBonds]

I don't think anyone would suggest it's not possible to attend UCLA and USC, IU and Purdue, USC and Notre Dame (I have a friend with that profile) or any other combination of schools. It's the idea of rooting for both teams in a heated rivalry that's downright odd.

Not really....many people who are graduates of both schools do it all the time.  Some don't.  To each their own.

[wadesworld]

The favorite to enter the season before one game is played, one injury happens, etc, etc?   That sounds like something out of a preseason poll.

And no, they weren't 5-1, they were a betting line consensus of 7-1 with four other teams at 8-1.  Of the five teams that were 7-1 or 8-1....NONE of them made the Final Four, let alone win it all.  Damn, all those coaches just suck.   

Did I miss a significant injury that altered the outcome of Indiana's season? Their odds should've gone up considering they didn't have one and other teams may have.

But anyways no we have to wait not only 5 years to make judgments about the hiring of a coach, but until the start of the NCAA Tournament to determine who had a chance to win it all? Considering Indiana had the 2nd highest odds to win it all at that point and ended up bowing out in the S16, do we have to twist the numbers to "Who has the best odds to win the National Championship following the National Championship game" or what? This is ridiculous. It's plain and simple. Indiana went into the season favored to win the National Championship by both Vegas odds and experts (many of whom discussed the possibility of an undefeated year). They were the favorites to win it all. They lost in the Sweet 16. Pretty simple.

With Marquette being predicted to finish first in the preseason polls in the New Big East, should we be OK if Marquette finishes 10th because what do odds and predictions mean before a game is played or an injury occurs?

You're grasping at air. Expectations were very high. Crean didn't deliver. Not surprising.

[keefe]

USC and Notre Dame (I have a friend with that profile)

Lenny

So when is your friend going to get an education?

[Lennys Tap]

Lenny

So when is your friend going to get an education?

As you'd expect, he confused about many things, though he is sure that he loves the Trojans and hates the Irish.

[jmayer1]

Crean hit a glass ceiling because he simply is not an especially good coach. A very good arguement can be made that he's the 5th best coach in MU history and, had DWade had better grades in high school, he would have been fired at MU after missing the tourney each of
his first 6 seasons.

[Lennys Tap]

The favorite to enter the season before one game is played, one injury happens, etc, etc?   That sounds like something out of a preseason poll.

And no, they weren't 5-1, they were a betting line consensus of 7-1 with four other teams at 8-1.  Of the five teams that were 7-1 or 8-1....NONE of them made the Final Four, let alone win it all.  Damn, all those coaches just suck.  

One casino (Las Vegas Hotel and Sports Book) had Louisville 9-2, IU 7-1 and 3 teams at 8-1. The Bovada Sports Book (largest in the world) had IU and Louisville co favorites at 5-1. Most had Louisville 19-4, IU 5-1, Florida at 7-1 and Gonzaga and Kansas at 10-1. The best oddsmaker around (Nate Silver) had Louisville 4.41-1, IU 5.08 -1, Florida 7.87 -1, followed by Kansas (13.33-1) and Gonzaga at 16.67-1. So your "consensus" line is anything but.

And Indiana wasn't just the preseason favorite. I don't know the exact date, but very late in the season, when IU had a 24-5 record, bettorsworld.com had IU at 9-2, Duke at 6-1 and Louisville and Florida at 7-1.

Summary: Louisville and Indiana were thought to be head and shoulders above the rest of the field. One proved they were, one proved (remember it took an incredibly bad shooting game by Temple for IU to even play - and be routed by - Syracuse) they weren't.

[swoopem]

I can't believe this is even an argument. We all know Crean is terrible in the tournament and that he can't make mid-game adjustments, he has proven this time and time again. Also every sports fan in America knows that IU was one of the favorites to win it all, hence the number 1 seed.

[keefe]

Crean hit a glass ceiling because he simply is not an especially good coach. A very good arguement can be made that he's the 5th best coach in MU history and, had DWade had better grades in high school, he would have been fired at MU after missing the tourney each of
his first 6 seasons.

Perhaps fifth best on the hardwood but no other coach managed sartorial splendor with such aplomb. Could Al have carried off this Euro Trash sunglass look as effortlessly?

[Coleman]

Crean hit a glass ceiling because he simply is not an especially good coach. A very good arguement can be made that he's the 5th best coach in MU history and, had DWade had better grades in high school, he would have been fired at MU after missing the tourney each of
his first 6 seasons.

I'd say 4th. Al, Buzz, and Hank (in that order). You aren't saying Kevin O'Neill ranks higher, are you?

[The Lens]

Crean hit a glass ceiling because he simply is not an especially good coach. A very good arguement can be made that he's the 5th best coach in MU history and, had DWade had better grades in high school, he would have been fired at MU after missing the tourney each of
his first 6 seasons.

I think this is a stretch.  Even without Wade players like ODB, Travis, Steve, Merritt and Robert Jackson would have found a way into the NCAAs.  We would not have gone very far but TC was not going to go NIT forever.  Tom can recruit when he has PT, and he can prepare very well.  He's a solid coach.  You could argue that he and Mike Deane are equal in degrees of a skill but Tom's skill (recruiting) is so much more important than Mike's (X's & O's).    I'm thankful we have a guy like Buzz who has a nice combo of skills.

[keefe]

I'm thankful we have a guy like Buzz who has a nice combo of skills.

Isn't this what defines a great coach? Deficiencies in either skill set engenders mediocrity.

[Lennys Tap]

I think this is a stretch.  Even without Wade players like ODB, Travis, Steve, Merritt and Robert Jackson would have found a way into the NCAAs.  We would not have gone very far but TC was not going to go NIT forever.  Tom can recruit when he has PT, and he can prepare very well.  He's a solid coach.  You could argue that he and Mike Deane are equal in degrees of a skill but Tom's skill (recruiting) is so much more important than Mike's (X's & O's).    I'm thankful we have a guy like Buzz who has a nice combo of skills.

Three of the 5 guys you cite did play together without Wade. Results weren't good. Crean may or may not have been gone before the Amigos arrived had Wade not been here, but one could certainly make that argument. No one can argue that Crean gets a look from Indiana if not for Wade.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Those aren't facts, those are opinions. Outright  Big Ten championship hasn't been won in 23 years at IU and this year's Big Ten was as tough a league as they have seen in several decades. 

I think going back to 2009 and 2010 here and reading what I said about Crean, Fred Glass, etc would be pretty theraputic for many here (not you Lens).   

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=21887.msg239135#msg239135

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=17568.msg176246#msg176246

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=21528.msg233387#msg233387

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=21880.msg239141#msg239141

They had a 5 year plan, for which I was mocked here for telling you what it was based on what I was hearing from the very to of the athletic department there.  Right on schedule they hit that 5 year plan.  By year 4 they were in the Sweet 16 and huge win over #1 Kentucky which could be regular season game of the decade... by year 5 they were ranked #1 for a spell and won the Big Ten regular season title and another Sweet 16.  That's about as on plan as you can get, especially seeing how many here said he should be fired in year 3.

They are getting in-state kids now.  They are graduating players at rates the IU faithful expect with near perfect ARP scores now.  Even the kids leaving early like Oladipo graduated in 3 years, Zeller is two semesters away from graduating.   They're highly competitive, fun to watch, off court issues mostly gone (good grades, All Big Ten Academic honorees, massive drug issues done away with, etc).

It won't be perfect, life never is, but many IU fans are thrilled with what happened in the first 5 years.  That's why Glass extended him another two years. 

What the future holds, nobody knows. 

www.peegs.com.  go there.  thanks.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Did I miss a significant injury that altered the outcome of Indiana's season? Their odds should've gone up considering they didn't have one and other teams may have.

But anyways no we have to wait not only 5 years to make judgments about the hiring of a coach, but until the start of the NCAA Tournament to determine who had a chance to win it all? Considering Indiana had the 2nd highest odds to win it all at that point and ended up bowing out in the S16, do we have to twist the numbers to "Who has the best odds to win the National Championship following the National Championship game" or what? This is ridiculous. It's plain and simple. Indiana went into the season favored to win the National Championship by both Vegas odds and experts (many of whom discussed the possibility of an undefeated year). They were the favorites to win it all. They lost in the Sweet 16. Pretty simple.

With Marquette being predicted to finish first in the preseason polls in the New Big East, should we be OK if Marquette finishes 10th because what do odds and predictions mean before a game is played or an injury occurs?

You're grasping at air. Expectations were very high. Crean didn't deliver. Not surprising.

Uhm, no...they didn't.  I don't know why you keep getting these things wrong.  You claim 6 years, it was 5.  You claim overwhelming favorite, they weren't even the favorite with some oddsmakers, let alone the favorite. Did some experts pick them to win it before one single game was played, of course.  Did some odds makers, yup....overwhelming?  Laughable.  6-1 odds by one Vegas casino with the next team at 7-1...overwhelming I tell ya.  I'll remind you they had the fewest points for a preseason #1 in many years because there were so many "experts" that felt there were other teams that deserved that ranking.  I'd also remind you these same "EXPERTS" at the end of the season said Gonzaga was the number one team in the country.  LOL.  The same Vegas experts that had Kentucky 3rd best odds to win it all.  LOL.  

You said Crean would be fired by year 4, instead anything but.   Look, we get it, but your hatred is clouding your judgment by a ton.  It is what it is, but you got caught saying a bunch of stuff that was wrong and you don't like being called out on it.  Sorry, too bad.