Definitive guide to the goold old days

[Lennys Tap]

Makes me think you have little regard for your peers Lenny.  As if they are not capable of using their wisdom, their intellect, their experience to be able to fundamentally compare eras....eras, I'd remind you, that they have lived in both.   I'll have to remember that next time you opine about something as your age group apparently isn't capable of such measurement.   

On the contrary, Chicos, I have a great deal of regard for my peers and their (our) wisdom. And in applying that wisdom, it's apparent to them (us) that the normal order of things is to think that in the times when one is young and has the energy that they (of course) would find it easier to raise children than in an era that is past their (our) time. Perhaps when you're older and wiser you'll be able to grasp that this is the normal nature of things and that any poll that tells us that things are as they've always been and should always be isn't worth making much of a deal over.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Just because we have lowered or moral guard and said it's cool to allow this stuff doesn't mean it's a good thing.

Right. In 1960, some people thought Elvis was ruining the moral fiber of the country.

You see what I mean?

How you feel isn't new. There are always people that are scared of what the teens are listening to. Let's not pretend like this is new.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

For every cars are safer today I can come up with just as many if not more problematic scenarios.  So yes, different and in some cases more problematic.

Saw an interesting story yesterday on television about sex and young folks today.  It was with a number of psychologists and sex therapy types and the premise was that with the easy access of porn today on the internet, etc, that kids no longer no how to make love.  It was kind of funny, but it rang true.  They were talking about the long term effects this will have on marriage, relationships, etc, as you have generations of kids now getting out there that basically copying what they see in 10 minute videos.  Especially interesting to note what young women are being taught by this.

Different?  Certainly.  More challenging and problematic...I think so and so did those experts.  Chicken little...maybe.

Well, this is where the rubber meets the road for me.

Do you think all of those people who said raising a child is harder today sat down and made a list of things that are better and things that are worse? I have a feeling emotions & nostalgia are coloring how everybody feels. It's just not a scientific answer.

This is why I think it's impossible to say that it's "harder" today. It's just different. Different set of problems and challenges.

As far as the porn/sex stuff, your point is absolutely valid. I do that that is a very real concern for teens and ultimately parents. It'll be interesting to see how things evolve over the next 10-20 years.

Also, given your opinions are about how difficult it is today, have you ever thought about moving to a smaller community and home schooling your kids? I don't say this to be a smart ass, but, as a parent, you have a lot of control over how your kids are influenced. Keep them off of the internet. Limit television. Home school them. Live in a small/rural community. I imagine that would eliminate a lot of today's challenges.

[MU82]

Hey you kids ... get out of my yard!

[Jay Bee]

Never said they weren't....I think you are missing the point...I was comparing it to 1950's, 1960's....fare earlier than Ice T or NWA or whatever.  And yes, I'm aware of what was going on....I even got to go to Public Enemy's Rock and Rock Hall of Fame induction a few months ago (well, they were inducted along with Rush, Randy Newman, Heart, etc). 

If you can honestly tell me that glorifying rape, saying it's cool to shoot cops, etc is the same as the lyrics of the 1950's and 1960's, then have at it.   

Oh, I see. I was bringing up "nasty rap lyrics" of 20-25 years ago because of your comments to Sultan (i.e., gangsta rap was big 15-20 years ago.. and your "15 to 20 years ago? Hmm, interesting" reply) and your comments that "I don't remember my parents having to tell me to pull my pants up because the crack of my ass was showing. I don't remember my parents having to tell me I shouldn't be listening to certain music because the music back then wasn't saying it was cool to kill cops, start riots, rape girls, etc."

But, if you're going to now backtrack and claim that you mistook your childhood to be in the 50's and 60's instead of the 70's and 80's.. then we're good. You must have temporarily forgotten when you grew up when you made those comments. Glad to see you have changed your "tune" on this.

Because I agree things have gone downhill. I just was simply calling you out on your inaccuracies re: hiphop music.

[mu-rara]

Gangsta rap isn't the "lyrics of today."  They are the lyrics of 15-20 years ago.  And the lyrics of some of the 60s and 70s stuff was bad.  Most of the lyrics of today is pretty tame stuff.

Honestly I think you must be a 80 year old woman.

Terror, man, I cannot disagree with you more.  We (Wife, Daughter, myself) were at a family party a couple of weeks ago.  Long story short, daughter wanted to go out with mom and dad (wanted mom and dad to pay for some drinks, she is a broke 21 year old) went to dance joint.  Lyrics and dance were beyond graphic.  I was a teen in the mid and late 70's.  Music insinuated sexual acts, but it was subtle.  (Mama's got a squeezebox she wears on her chest and when Daddy comes home he never gets no rest)...No that is probably not the most graphic of the era, but 1st that came to mind. 

21 year old daughter is a joy.  Teenage years, not so much.  Nothing more than a typical teen, trying to assert her independence.  I was no angel, nor was I a big trouble maker.  Anyone who thinks that raising a teenager now is easier than 40 years ago is naive or hasn't raised a teenager in the last 10 years.  If I had time, I'd write a book.

[GGGG]

21 year old daughter is a joy.  Teenage years, not so much.  Nothing more than a typical teen, trying to assert her independence.  I was no angel, nor was I a big trouble maker.  Anyone who thinks that raising a teenager now is easier than 40 years ago is naive or hasn't raised a teenager in the last 10 years.  If I had time, I'd write a book.

I've raised two of them...well one is still a teenager.

[GGGG]

More likely because society felt that certain things are needed with warnings for parents, kids, etc.  I mean, using your logic, why not just put porn on CBS because there really shouldn't be anything to worry about except for those chicken littles.  Or where is it that the line is drawn?  Porn = out.  Song glorifying killing cops = ok.  Song glorifying rape = ok.  I guess I'd like to see where you draw the line.

I don't have a problem with ratings for music...I never paid attention to them as a parent but if that's what society wants...

[real chili 83]

Terror, man, I cannot disagree with you more.  We (Wife, Daughter, myself) were at a family party a couple of weeks ago.  Long story short, daughter wanted to go out with mom and dad (wanted mom and dad to pay for some drinks, she is a broke 21 year old) went to dance joint.  Lyrics and dance were beyond graphic.  I was a teen in the mid and late 70's.  Music insinuated sexual acts, but it was subtle.  (Mama's got a squeezebox she wears on her chest and when Daddy comes home he never gets no rest)...No that is probably not the most graphic of the era, but 1st that came to mind. 

21 year old daughter is a joy.  Teenage years, not so much.  Nothing more than a typical teen, trying to assert her independence.  I was no angel, nor was I a big trouble maker.  Anyone who thinks that raising a teenager now is easier than 40 years ago is naive or hasn't raised a teenager in the last 10 years.  If I had time, I'd write a book.

Speaking of more subtle lyrics from our day, anyone remember the song that that had this lyric "it ain't the meat, it's the motion"?

[Hards Alumni]

News flash CBB, naughty music doesn't make people do naughty things.

Just like violent video games don't make people commit violent crimes.

get real.

[keefe]

Music insinuated sexual acts, but it was subtle.  (Mama's got a squeezebox she wears on her chest and when Daddy comes home he never gets no rest)...No that is probably not the most graphic of the era, but 1st that came to mind. 

Nothin' subtle 'bout Otis Day & the Knights




Shama Lama Ding Dong

[Spotcheck Billy]

Hide your daughters! The Coasters in 1951 - possibly the 1st use of the term "rock & roll"


Well listen here girls, I'm telling you now.
They call me lovin' Dan.
I'll rock 'em, roll 'em all night long
I'm a 60 minute man.
And if you don't believe I'm all I say,
Come up and take my hand.
As soon as I leave you go you'll cry
"Oh Yeah, he's a sixty Minute Man!"
* There'll be 15 minutes of kissin',
And then you holler "Oh please don't stop!"
There'll be 15 minutes of teasin'
And 15 minutes of pleasin'
And 15 minutes of blowin' my top! MOP MOP MOP!
Well if your man ain't treatin' you right
Come up and see your Dan.
I'll rock 'em, roll 'em all night long
I'm a 60 minute man.
** 60 (Minute Man)
Well they call me (lovin' Dan)
I'll rock 'em, roll 'em all night long
I'm a 60 minute man.
** Repeat
* Repeat
Well if your man ain't treatin' you right
Come up and see your Dan.
I'll rock 'em, roll 'em all night long
I'm a 60 minute man.
Oh yeah! 60 Minute,
Rock'em, roll'em, rammin', jammin' all night long
I'm a 60 Minute Man.

[tower912]

I was actually pleasantly surprised at how easy (other than financially) it was to raise my daughter into a bright, lovely, involved, civic-minded, motivated college freshman-to-be.   She has opportunities that I never had in my youth.     Thanks to her singing voice and my checkbook, she has performed with her high school choir at the Vatican, at Ground Zero, at venues all over our state, in regional competitions in Chicago and at Notre Dame.    Even if I could have sung that well, my high school offered nothing like that.    Choir just wasn't a priority at my catholic high school.   We taught her to never define herself by her boyfriend.   Because of her own intellect, she quickly figured out that high school jocks simply weren't worth her time.   Thanks to the miracle-mid-life crisis, now-6 1/2-year old-brother, 'the talk' was the easiest thing.    "Sex makes babies.   You see that?  (pointing at her little brother wrecking something)  When you want one of those, go for it.   If you don't, don't"     Also thanks to her baby brother and conversations she, by default, had to be part of, she knows that there can be life and death challenges for women who have babies in their late 30's and that even though the Catholic church will never endorse abortion, sometimes it has to be discussed.    Thankfully, it never came to that. 
    The 'problem' with modern society is that our generation (and by that, I approximately mean the 30-50 year olds ) is narcissistic, lazy,  and greedy.   We have been given so much that we whine when it is even a little bit difficult or even the slightest sacrifice is called for.   Now is the time for us to take the lead and instead of leading in a positive direction, we are leading the whining.   Some have embraced Randian concepts and turned their back on any spirit of community and then wondered why the communities are suffering.     It is trite, but be the change you want to see in the world.    Love your God above all things and treat your neighbor as yourself.    Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.    Ask not what your community can do for you but what you can do for your community.   Clearly, these are not new principles.    Get involved and for God's sake quit whining.     There are a thousand opportunities out there every day to make the world a better place.   Embrace them and you will be amazed at how fast your attitude changes.    The world does not revolve around you, nor was it meant to.    Because it doesn't live up to some utopian fantasy is no reason to whine and disengage. 

[keefe]

Frank Zappa and the Mothers of Invention

Dinah Moe Humm

[ChicosBailBonds]

Right. In 1960, some people thought Elvis was ruining the moral fiber of the country.

You see what I mean?

How you feel isn't new. There are always people that are scared of what the teens are listening to. Let's not pretend like this is new.

What I'm saying is those same people that said that in the 1960's are alive today and saying it's not even close to being the same.  They are able to compare, quite easily I might add.

[ChicosBailBonds]

    The 'problem' with modern society is that our generation (and by that, I approximately mean the 30-50 year olds ) is narcissistic, lazy,  and greedy.   We have been given so much that we whine when it is even a little bit difficult or even the slightest sacrifice is called for.   Now is the time for us to take the lead and instead of leading in a positive direction, we are leading the whining.   Some have embraced Randian concepts and turned their back on any spirit of community and then wondered why the communities are suffering.     It is trite, but be the change you want to see in the world.    Love your God above all things and treat your neighbor as yourself.    Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.    Ask not what your community can do for you but what you can do for your community.   Clearly, these are not new principles.    Get involved and for God's sake quit whining.     There are a thousand opportunities out there every day to make the world a better place.   Embrace them and you will be amazed at how fast your attitude changes.    The world does not revolve around you, nor was it meant to.    Because it doesn't live up to some utopian fantasy is no reason to whine and disengage. 

Well stated....I agree with much of this.  It's the people that aren't living by the golden rule that I worry about.   

[GGGG]

nm

[GGGG]

    The 'problem' with modern society is that our generation (and by that, I approximately mean the 30-50 year olds ) is narcissistic, lazy,  and greedy.   We have been given so much that we whine when it is even a little bit difficult or even the slightest sacrifice is called for.   Now is the time for us to take the lead and instead of leading in a positive direction, we are leading the whining.   Some have embraced Randian concepts and turned their back on any spirit of community and then wondered why the communities are suffering.     It is trite, but be the change you want to see in the world.    Love your God above all things and treat your neighbor as yourself.    Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.    Ask not what your community can do for you but what you can do for your community.   Clearly, these are not new principles.    Get involved and for God's sake quit whining.     There are a thousand opportunities out there every day to make the world a better place.   Embrace them and you will be amazed at how fast your attitude changes.    The world does not revolve around you, nor was it meant to.    Because it doesn't live up to some utopian fantasy is no reason to whine and disengage. 

Amen brother.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Oh, I see. I was bringing up "nasty rap lyrics" of 20-25 years ago because of your comments to Sultan (i.e., gangsta rap was big 15-20 years ago.. and your "15 to 20 years ago? Hmm, interesting" reply) and your comments that "I don't remember my parents having to tell me to pull my pants up because the crack of my ass was showing. I don't remember my parents having to tell me I shouldn't be listening to certain music because the music back then wasn't saying it was cool to kill cops, start riots, rape girls, etc."

But, if you're going to now backtrack and claim that you mistook your childhood to be in the 50's and 60's instead of the 70's and 80's.. then we're good. You must have temporarily forgotten when you grew up when you made those comments. Glad to see you have changed your "tune" on this.

Because I agree things have gone downhill. I just was simply calling you out on your inaccuracies re: hiphop music.

I think you need to read the post or two before that.

[LloydMooresLegs]

Things are difficult today in a different way than they were difficult 20 years ago or 40 years ago or 60 years ago and so on.  Things are easier today in a different way than they were 20, 40 and 60 years ago.

Get to go with kids next week to work on houses for ASP in Kentucky. Will be a bit worried about all the things we can't control the week after that.  

Nature, nurture and "outside" environment.  All age old truths.  Nature is nature; we do the best we can with nurture; and we try not to agonize too much about those external forces.

Next.

[ChicosBailBonds]

News flash CBB, naughty music doesn't make people do naughty things.

Just like violent video games don't make people commit violent crimes.

get real.

Don't know.  I let my kids play M games, they are well adjusted, aren't out killing people.  I don't think there is a causal relationship.  Do I think it can lead to anger outbursts, some unhealthy addictions, etc?  Yes.  Does it cause violence, don't know...some say yes, some say no.  Then again, lots of research over the years has been wrong....what's the latest from the last week or so, Omega 3 Fish Oils may cause cancer after being told for two decades we should take them.  So who knows.  I'll bet we could find research that says if you practice free throws more often you will make more in games and probably find other research that says it doesn't matter.  Just as we can find some research that says states with concealed gun laws have less violent crime while other research shows no difference.  A subject for another day I'm sure.

Music...again, direct causality...tough to prove.  Can it help to promote a certain image and get a kid that is on the edge to go further?  You bet...saw it in my family growing up and she will admit it to this day.  Lyrics, how they dressed, what drugs they were using were "cool" and she wanted to be cool.  Was it the reason?  Probably not.  Did it help?  Let's put it this way, it certainly didn't hurt.

Personally, I like the ratings.  I like having a guidance, if for simply the reason to have a pause. Whether I act on it, that's a case by case situation.  My kids are straight A students, lots of friends, very good athletes, etc, etc....they want to play those games, listen to that music....as long as I don't see negative impacts, ok. 

Now, take it a step further, should kids have access to porn? (I'm not naive to think they don't get it, I'm just asking since these things don't lead to anything in your mind, one would think unfettered porn to kids at ? age wouldn't do anything, not "make them" do things.)  Do you agree?

[Lennys Tap]

Well stated....I agree with much of this.  It's the people that aren't living by the golden rule that I worry about.   

Worry about yourself. Then worry about your family. Do a good enough job of it and there won't be any time left to worry about others.

[keefe]

Worry about yourself. Then worry about your family. Do a good enough job of it and there won't be any time left to worry about others.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

What I'm saying is those same people that said that in the 1960's are alive today and saying it's not even close to being the same.  They are able to compare, quite easily I might add.

Wait, the people that thought Elvis was going to corrupt America's youth are the people that should evaluate modern music?

[Coleman]

Do you have a database of these cartoons than you can query whatever keyword was in the last post?