How much slack does Buzz get next year?

[MUSF]

We all have strong opinions on the Buzz hire and the process used to make it.

We all seem to agree that, on paper, we have a pretty solid team returning. Three amigos stay, Mbakwe stays, Lazar a junior, a couple solid recruits, and only real losses are Fitz and Ouze.

What if we take a step back next year? What should we realisticly expect from Buzz? Same as last year? Better? New head coaches usually have some leeway and a fairly sizable learning curve. Does Buzz have the same luxury?

[Tugg Speedman]

No.

Buzz will get killed on the recruiting trail because he is inexperienced (Hurley's stated complaint).  Buzz is fortunate to have a loaded team next year.  This means he can put to rest his coaching ability by winning next year.  At a minimum he should progress as far as this year team, top 25 all year and at least one tourney win.

If, on the other hand, next year's team under performs, he will be pounded on the recruiting trail as someone that cannot coach.

Good news, next year's team allows Buzz to quick put to rest questions about his coaching ability.  Bad news, Buzz has to deliver now.

[bilsu]

Maybe some players will shy away from Buzz, because of his inexperience. However, recruiting has much to do with relationships. Buzz has established good realtionships in Texas. He did not have a relationship with Hurly. What I really like about Buzz is that I think he has the ability to be a national recruiter. You would not think Texas as a place for MU to be recruiting from. My guess is that by meeting with Hurly, he did not save Taylor, but hopefully he has now started a relationship with Hurly.

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

No.

Buzz will get killed on the recruiting trail because he is inexperienced (Hurley's stated complaint).  Buzz is fortunate to have a loaded team next year.  This means he can put to rest his coaching ability by winning next year.  At a minimum he should progress as far as this year team, top 25 all year and at least one tourney win.

If, on the other hand, next year's team under performs, he will be pounded on the recruiting trail as someone that cannot coach.

Good news, next year's team allows Buzz to quick put to rest questions about his coaching ability.  Bad news, Buzz has to deliver now.

AnotherMU84 nails it. If we bomb next year, his chances on the recruiting trail are nil.

Our hugely experienced team is the biggest reason why an experienced coach would have been a much better choice.

[ecompt]

Maybe. But we would have not have had a hugely experienced team had we hired that experienced coach. We could have wound up with six scholarship players and no freshmen. 

[Rockmic87]

This situation is similar to when Bruce Pearl left a stacked UWM team for Tennessee and Rob Jeter inherited a stacked team...however, he is now suffering after Pearls players left theteam due to recruiting the wrong players for the program...lets hope that Buzz can get a strong 2009 class!

[Coobeys Oil Depot]

Buzz gets no slack at all.

He has Dominic James, Jerel McNeal, Wesley Matthews, Lazar Hayward, Dwight Burke, Trevor Mbake, Maurice Acker, David Cubillan, and his band of merry Texans.

If he doesn't win at least 25 games (there has to be improvement by Senior year, right?) it will be a disappointment*

*Unless McNeal breaks his leg on November 28th.

[ChicosBailBonds]

We all have strong opinions on the Buzz hire and the process used to make it.

We all seem to agree that, on paper, we have a pretty solid team returning. Three amigos stay, Mbakwe stays, Lazar a junior, a couple solid recruits, and only real losses are Fitz and Ouze.

What if we take a step back next year? What should we realisticly expect from Buzz? Same as last year? Better? New head coaches usually have some leeway and a fairly sizable learning curve. Does Buzz have the same luxury?

I don't see how he would get much slack at all, honestly.  Four starters returning from a top 25 team, including three that were named to all-conference teams.....this is setup for Barry Switzer to do well.

As far as recruiting goes, the signing period is in November, long before anyone will know how well he's done.

I suspect this team will do quite well next year, but the flip side of that is we probably won't know really how qualified of a coach he is because the quality of the players on the court will mask any of those issues (if there are any).  The test will be the year after most likely.

[RawdogDX]

based on what andy katz thinks of us, i expect buzz to lead us to about 19 wins and a one sead in the nit.

he doesn't get MUCH slack, he had a year to work with the players already, if he's making changes in the offence he may start off a little weak and that's ok.  

Rather than go by total wins i'll say that i would think badly at the season if we end up worse than a 6 seed. (assuming we didn't get screwed over)

[Niv Berkowitz]

PRN and I agree again. Strange.

MU84 is dead on. Buzz has very little wiggle room next year for error. He has what most consider a loaded, senior-laden team coming back. Many competitors in the Big East have lost their best players. The chance to succeed is now. Buzz may have walked into a firestorm by taking the job, but like 84 says, he could not have walked into a better position if he tried.

He has all the tools to succeed and win next year. If he does that, it will make all of our lives much better as that will give him something to build off of.

Also, what if they make the tourney and get into the sweet 16? Then, he could go and show recruits that he took MU further with this class than Crean ever did. That would go over well on the recruiting trail.

[NYWarrior]

Buzz has very little wiggle room next year for error. He has what most consider a loaded, senior-laden team coming back. Many competitors in the Big East have lost their best players. The chance to succeed is now. Buzz may have walked into a firestorm by taking the job, but like 84 says, he could not have walked into a better position if he tried.

This is exactly the situation Mark Turgeon walked into at A&M this year.......and it really wore on him to the point where he publicly said that if he wins, its because Billy G left the cupboard full -- he could only fail.  And this was at A&M -- where folks don't care about hoops.

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

Buzz has very little wiggle room next year for error. He has what most consider a loaded, senior-laden team coming back. Many competitors in the Big East have lost their best players. The chance to succeed is now. Buzz may have walked into a firestorm by taking the job, but like 84 says, he could not have walked into a better position if he tried.

This is exactly the situation Mark Turgeon walked into at A&M this year.......and it really wore on him to the point where he publicly said that if he wins, its because Billy G left the cupboard full -- he could only fail.  And this was at A&M -- where folks don't care about hoops.

That's a good comparison, HOWEVER, what Williams has on this side is the growing recognition that Crean was always a complete tool. IT seems to me that the fanbase, the administration and, it would seem, the players themselves are beginning to acknowledge that. People will be anxious to credit Williams for any success.

I don't recall much controversy over Gillespie's move to Kentuckey -- other than the fact that I don't think he's signed a contract yet.

[NYWarrior]

here is the Turgeon info ....

http://getbeeznered.blogspot.com/2008/01/shadow-of-billy-gillispie-continues-to.html

[tower912]

He will have a talented, experienced team with something to prove to its former coach.   As long as he keeps the Amigos focused and away from senioritis, no injuries, and the the new guys have some skill, this could be a truly dangerous team.    It will never be easier.

[TallTitan34]

With the team Buzz has next year he needs to at the least match what happened last year unless a key injury occurs.

As long as Buzz can do that he will be fine recruiting.  He has proven in the past he can get some big recruits to come to non-dominate programs with little history, so Marquette should be a little easier to sell. 

If he can't match last year, then yes he will have problems recruiting.

[Coobeys Oil Depot]

The Turgeon-Buzz comparison is invalid simply because Buzz was a part of the program prior to his hiring as head coach. The reason he was hired was due to continuity of recruiting and familiarity with the players. This alone separates the issue from Turgeon as he came in as a complete stranger to the players and system.

[MUSF]

So we agree tha Buzz has to do as well or better next year. The real question is, what does MU do if he under achieves? As many have mentioned, under achieving next year could lead to a drop off in recruiting and an overall program decline.

What should MU do? What would MU do?

[MUinCO]

No.

Buzz will get killed on the recruiting trail because he is inexperienced (Hurley's stated complaint).  Buzz is fortunate to have a loaded team next year.  This means he can put to rest his coaching ability by winning next year.  At a minimum he should progress as far as this year team, top 25 all year and at least one tourney win.

If, on the other hand, next year's team under performs, he will be pounded on the recruiting trail as someone that cannot coach.

Good news, next year's team allows Buzz to quick put to rest questions about his coaching ability.  Bad news, Buzz has to deliver now.

Yep, exactly.  This is not a "rebuild" job (like you see with multiple down years, NCAA sanctions, etc)...that means he gets zero slack period.  

If the program happens to under perform next season then Buzz "proves" to his detractors he was not qualified for this particular job, which will impact recruiting the following year, and by year three the downward slide will be the end of Buzz.  Fair or not, the '80-'09 season will be critical for Buzz.

[MUinCO]

So we agree tha Buzz has to do as well or better next year. The real question is, what does MU do if he under achieves? As many have mentioned, under achieving next year could lead to a drop off in recruiting and an overall program decline.

What should MU do? What would MU do?

From what I have observed in college basketball/football over the years is that if you have a program performing average to better than average, a new coach is hired to bring it to the "next level" and then things go bad...fired at the end of year 3.  By then everyone can pretty much tell if things are going to get better or all that is self evident is a downward slide the current coach is powerless to stop.

[Avenue Commons]

He gets no slack. My impression of why he was hired was because it would be a "continuation" of the previous season and that's why they wanted an insider to take over control. Given that, I expected a Sweet 16 appearance. I'm serious. We have one of the best backcourts in the nation and Burke is turning into a stud. There's no reason we can't make some noise next year.

After that, who know? We'll all just have to strap in and enjoy the ride.

[NYWarrior]

He gets no slack. My impression of why he was hired was because it would be a "continuation" of the previous season and that's why they wanted an insider to take over control. Given that, I expected a Sweet 16 appearance. I'm serious. We have one of the best backcourts in the nation and Burke is turning into a stud. There's no reason we can't make some noise next year.

After that, who know? We'll all just have to strap in and enjoy the ride.

Generally agree.........but Burke is not a stud, far from it.  Maybe as far from that description as anybody starting at the same position in the Big East.

[Niv Berkowitz]

I wouldn't go so far to say Judas, PRN, but I will say this....

Even the Crean supporters (like myself) will turn sides quickly to make ourselves feel better if Buzz wins next year. How will we do this?

Well, say Buzz takes MU to the sweet 16. Even the Crean supporters will quickly say, 'wow, he took us further than Crean ever did with these guys. Maybe Buzz is the real deal?!' and everyone will be feeling good about each other. This will keep the fan base off Buzz' back (at least short term), and it will definitely help him in recruiting. If McNeal, James, Matthews and Hayward all continue to improve and McNeal and James make the NBA or at least, continue to stand behind Buzz and the program, that will go even further I think.

But with Buzz, I've always said that we won't know whether this was a failed hire until two-four years down the road. Short term, however, Buzz has little wiggle room.

[MarquetteDano]

I know Niv mentioned that the Big East lost a lot of players.  If you look at though, the Big East returned a LOT of good players, and some teams have ridiculous recruits coming in.

I think the Big East will be EVEN BETTER next year than this year.  And that is scary.  I think if we go 11-7 again we will have actually improved.

That said, assuming we are relatively injury free, we must go at least 10-8 in the Big East and win one game in the NCAA's or I will consider it a bad coaching year for Buzz.

[77ncaachamps]

No slack.

I think the Amigos will bail him out of a few games because of their experience, but he gets ZILCH slack when it comes to recruiting as this is the lifeblood of ANY D-I program.

[downtown85]

So we agree tha Buzz has to do as well or better next year. The real question is, what does MU do if he under achieves? As many have mentioned, under achieving next year could lead to a drop off in recruiting and an overall program decline.

What should MU do? What would MU do?

My prediction would be that if Buzz underachieves next year, midway through the following season Cottingham would fire Buzz and hire himself as interim coach despite he himself having no coaching experience.  He would then conduct an extensive search for a new coach for about 1 year and when he cannot find a new coach he would appoint himself as the new coach since he already had 1 year of coaching experience.