COVID Economy

[pacearrow02]

I'm not sure Pelosi is the hold up here.  McConnell is and has been.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/mitch-mcconnell-torpedoes-stimulus-package-180157058.html

McConnell is definitely the hold up to the larger package but Pelosi is holding up the counteroffer. 

With the election so close I don't understand why she doesn't just take what she can get now especially when the larger overall package appears to have 0% chance of passing the senate and then in a couple months she can go back and get the rest from a presumably dem controlled White House and senate.

The $500 billion McConnell is ready to sign today would be for stimulus checks to people desperate for financial help, airline support, schools/hospitals, and other businesses who need the support today from what I understand. 

[MU82]

I'm not sure Pelosi is the hold up here.  McConnell is and has been.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/mitch-mcconnell-torpedoes-stimulus-package-180157058.html

Generally agree. But Pelosi's House largely postured by passing a $3T+ package and then refusing to seriously negotiate for months. And Trump has been all over the place  -- saying a deal was imminent numerous times; saying that he ordered Mnuchin to stop negotiating and that there would be no deal till after the election; coming back the next day to say a deal again was possible and urging Congress to "Go Big"; saying he wanted more than the House's $2.2T package but then putting out a $1.8T package; etc.

But yes, McConnell early on said he wasn't sure new stimulus would fly with Senate Republicans, and he never really tried to get them on the same page.

[shoothoops]

The first stimulus wasn't good enough by a long shot. This one is worse.

Aren't we all taught as children that assuming makes an ass out of you and me. Pass a bad deal now and it's possible next year there may not be another one.

The current Republican deal isn't close. That's on them. Many voters know that.

[pacearrow02]

The first stimulus wasn't good enough by a long shot. This one is worse.

Aren't we all taught as children that assuming makes an ass out of you and me. Pass a bad deal now and it's possible next year there may not be another one.

The current Republican deal isn't close. That's on them. Many voters know that.

And maybe it's not, haven't seen the specifics of either deal.  If they pass the senates counter offer and once the details are released it turns out to be awful then I imagine any remaining undecided voters would hold them accountable.  When there is a $500 billion stimulus deal that could be signed today to me it's just politics being played at the expense of badly needed financial assistance.

As Wolf told Nancy this week, "don't sacrifice the good for the perfect"

[shoothoops]

And maybe it's not, haven't seen the specifics of either deal.  If they pass the senates counter offer and once the details are released it turns out to be awful then I imagine any remaining undecided voters would hold them accountable.  When there is a $500 billion stimulus deal that could be signed today to me it's just politics being played at the expense of badly needed financial assistance.

As Wolf told Nancy this week, "don't sacrifice the good for the perfect"

To name just one example, the McConnell prefers the deal to include zero money directly to people, not even the one time (not repeated over time) $1200, a number that was far too low in the first place. It isn't a good deal.

[Hards Alumni]

McConnell is definitely the hold up to the larger package but Pelosi is holding up the counteroffer. 

With the election so close I don't understand why she doesn't just take what she can get now especially when the larger overall package appears to have 0% chance of passing the senate and then in a couple months she can go back and get the rest from a presumably dem controlled White House and senate.

The $500 billion McConnell is ready to sign today would be for stimulus checks to people desperate for financial help, airline support, schools/hospitals, and other businesses who need the support today from what I understand.

*fart noises*

Pelosi and Mnuchin (Trump) have agreed.  McConnell is the hold up.  Stop being so obtuse.  McConnell shouldn't get what he wants all the time, he isn't the boss.  So MAYBE he needs to compromise for once in his miserable life.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

I'm not sure Pelosi is the hold up here.  McConnell is and has been.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/mitch-mcconnell-torpedoes-stimulus-package-180157058.html

Pelosi passed the HEROES ACT back in May and well, Mitch has done nothing with it except try to ram a Supreme Court nominee through.

[Not all scoop users are created equal apparently]

Nancy is just as bad as most of them but in what world is compromising with Mitch McConnell ever going to get you what you think you are actually compromising on? That will just further move the goal posts. It is all or nothing with him.

[jesmu84]

If you're Nancy, accept the deal with Trump. Then let him pressure the senate GOP.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

We now have data supporting the false choice paradigm that was fought over months ago.  Surprise, the experts were right —control the virus & economy fares better

https://twitter.com/ianbremmer/status/1317924980659785728?s=21

[GooooMarquette]

With Covid-19 Under Control, China's Economy Surges Ahead

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/18/business/china-economy-covid.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage

As most of the world still struggles with the coronavirus pandemic, China is showing once again that a fast economic rebound is possible when the virus is brought firmly under control.

The Chinese economy surged 4.9 percent in the July-to-September quarter compared with the same months last year, the country's National Bureau of Statistics announced on Monday. The robust performance brings China almost back up to the roughly 6 percent pace of growth that it was reporting before the pandemic.

Many of the world's major economies have climbed quickly out of the depths of a contraction last spring, when shutdowns caused output to fall steeply. But China is the first to report growth that significantly surpasses where it was at this time last year. The United States and other nations are expected to report a third-quarter surge too, but they are still behind or just catching up to pre-pandemic levels.

China's lead could widen further in the months to come. It has almost no local transmission of the virus now, while the United States and Europe face another accelerating wave of cases.

-----------------

Who would have guessed that getting the pandemic under control first is the key to getting the economy back on track?!?

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

I wish i knew how to paste an image from a morning market roundup I receive, but it has WI COVID cases as well as WI initial jobless claims plotted on a line chart.  Both 7 day moving averages and both with identical slopes.  The point is that when cases accelerate, people are self selecting out of the economy and it impacts jobs.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

McConnell still the problem. 

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/20/business/pelosi-mnuchin-stimulus.html

[Pakuni]

If you're Nancy, accept the deal with Trump. Then let him pressure the senate GOP.

It really is a win-win.
Not sure Pelosi just doesn't understand that, or if she's afraid McConnell will call the bluff and push it through.

[GooooMarquette]

McConnell still the problem. 

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/20/business/pelosi-mnuchin-stimulus.html

Throwing Trump under the bus and screwing lots of really desperate people, all because he doesn't like Pelosi. Wow.

Now is not the time to haggle over minute details to get everything perfectly the way you want - it's the time to give it your best shot like they did in the spring.

[GooooMarquette]

It really is a win-win.
Not sure Pelosi just doesn't understand that, or if she's afraid McConnell will call the bluff and push it through.

Pelosi understands. McConnell doesn't.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Throwing Trump under the bus and screwing lots of really desperate people, all because he doesn't like Pelosi. Wow.

Now is not the time to haggle over minute details to get everything perfectly the way you want - it's the time to give it your best shot like they did in the spring.

I would characterize it as Preparing for their next act of caring about budgets again. 

[Pakuni]

Pelosi understands. McConnell doesn't.

Then cut a deal and sent it to the Senate.
Make Lindsey and Cory and Susan and Joni and Thom and Steve and Martha choose between their seats and Mitch.

[jesmu84]

Throwing Trump under the bus and screwing lots of really desperate people, all because he doesn't like Pelosi. Wow.

Now is not the time to haggle over minute details to get everything perfectly the way you want - it's the time to give it your best shot like they did in the spring.

If we get a repeat of Spring - bailouts to corporations, money into the hands of the donor-class, wall street cash infusions for months, severe trickle-up, etc - that will be worse long-term than nothing.

[Jockey]

If we get a repeat of Spring - bailouts to corporations, money into the hands of the donor-class, wall street cash infusions for months, severe trickle-up, etc - that will be worse long-term than nothing.

Amen!

Stimulus, $$$ for small business, $$$ to states, & rent assistance should be the bulk of the bill.

[GooooMarquette]

If we get a repeat of Spring - bailouts to corporations, money into the hands of the donor-class, wall street cash infusions for months, severe trickle-up, etc - that will be worse long-term than nothing.

In the long term, yes it would be worse. And I can survive either way, so if it was just about me I would prefer that Pelosi hold out. But in the short term, many people are trying to figure out where their next meal is coming from.

On the plus side, Mitch is not going to have control of the Senate much longer.

[jesmu84]

In the long term, yes it would be worse. And I can survive either way, so if it was just about me I would prefer that Pelosi hold out. But in the short term, many people are trying to figure out where their next meal is coming from.

On the plus side, Mitch is not going to have control of the Senate much longer.

Im saying that any stimulus that isn't majority for individuals is a long term problem. And barely a short term fix.

Pelosi should cave. And she should cave to a plan that gets money to individuals now. Nothing for donor class. Nothing for corporations. Nothing for wall street.

[GooooMarquette]

Im saying that any stimulus that isn't majority for individuals is a long term problem. And barely a short term fix.

Pelosi should cave. And she should cave to a plan that gets money to individuals now. Nothing for donor class. Nothing for corporations. Nothing for wall street.

I don't get why you keep saying "Pelosi should cave." All the reporting seems to indicate that she has already come to an agreement with Mnuchin, but McConnell will not allow the Senate to pass it.

What is she supposed to do? She can't force McConnell to call a vote on a bill he doesn't want to bring to the floor.

[Pakuni]

I don't get why you keep saying "Pelosi should cave." All the reporting seems to indicate that she has already come to an agreement with Mnuchin, but McConnell will not allow the Senate to pass it.

What is she supposed to do? She can't force McConnell to call a vote on a bill he doesn't want to bring to the floor.

She can push a bill through the House and send it to the Senate. If Moscow Mitch is going to kill it,  he kills it. But right now she's not even forcing his hand.

[GooooMarquette]

She can push a bill through the House and send it to the Senate. If Moscow Mitch is going to kill it,  he kills it. But right now she's not even forcing his hand.

It would be an exercise in futility. Mitch has said he's not going to hold a vote. Doesn't matter whether there's a bill sitting there or not.

Unless you like political theater for the sake of political theater...