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Author Topic: Wojo's Dirty End of Game  (Read 5437 times)

Cheeks

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #100 on: February 23, 2020, 08:44:13 PM »
Nice, fair portrait of Buzz. Shows his weirdness and also his goodness and loyalty. But (maybe I missed something?) he didn’t say anything the least bit disparaging about the Marquette fan base - only that he had set the bar high (Big East title, 7 NCAA wins in 4 years, S16, S16, E 8 back to hack to back) and that level of success would be hard to sustain. The facts say he was prescient.

Which is why I said "off the record".  No coach is going to grill a fanbase on the record...though Al said a few things in the biography about his and Rick did My Life on a Napkin.   We have a reputation as a fanbase, and it is deserved.  It's a blessing and a curse.  Everyone wants to win, but we have an inability to separate what happened decades ago. UCLA has suffered this for decades as well.  Indiana is in full mode of this the last few decades.

"I hate everything about this job except the games, Everything. I don't even get affected anymore by the winning, by the ratings, those things. The trouble is, it will sound like an excuse because we've never won the national championship, but winning just isn't all that important to me.” Al McGuire

Lennys Tap

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #101 on: February 23, 2020, 09:19:50 PM »
Which is why I said "off the record".  No coach is going to grill a fanbase on the record...though Al said a few things in the biography about his and Rick did My Life on a Napkin.   We have a reputation as a fanbase, and it is deserved.  It's a blessing and a curse.  Everyone wants to win, but we have an inability to separate what happened decades ago. UCLA has suffered this for decades as well.  Indiana is in full mode of this the last few decades.

Look, talk all you want about your “connections” and BS off the record conversations - nobody is impressed. You were here for Dean and he got fired. Crean stayed 9 years and left for a bigger job. So, nobody you were remotely connected to left because of unrealistic demands by fans. Period. Neither did Buzz. Neither has Wojo, who 6 years in has had the benefit of an incredibly patient administration and fan base. KO maybe, but in retrospect admitted it was an immature move on his part. This “reputation” you talk about exists only in your (and your co conspiracy freak’s) heads.

Dr. Blackheart

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #102 on: February 23, 2020, 09:24:35 PM »
Which is why I said "off the record".  No coach is going to grill a fanbase on the record...though Al said a few things in the biography about his and Rick did My Life on a Napkin.   We have a reputation as a fanbase, and it is deserved.  It's a blessing and a curse.  Everyone wants to win, but we have an inability to separate what happened decades ago. UCLA has suffered this for decades as well.  Indiana is in full mode of this the last few decades.

Wait, Buzz and Crean left because the fan expectations were too heavy?  You keep spinning in the mud, Cheeken Little.  MU kept giving them both raise after raise...just like with Wojo.

Buzz left because of the administration. Period. Crean left because of his ego. Period.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2020, 09:42:11 PM by Dr. Blackheart »

We R Final Four

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #103 on: February 23, 2020, 09:28:17 PM »
Which is why I said "off the record".  No coach is going to grill a fanbase on the record...though Al said a few things in the biography about his and Rick did My Life on a Napkin.   We have a reputation as a fanbase, and it is deserved.  It's a blessing and a curse.  Everyone wants to win, but we have an inability to separate what happened decades ago. UCLA has suffered this for decades as well.  Indiana is in full mode of this the last few decades.
Classic.

Lennys Tap

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #104 on: February 23, 2020, 09:30:02 PM »
Wait, Buzz and Crean left because of the fan expectations were too heavy?  You keep spinning in the mud, Cheeken Little.  MU kept giving them both raise after raise...just like with Wojo.

Buzz left because of the administration. Period. Crean left because of his ego. Period.

But, but, Doc....we have a...wait for it....reputation. The under assistant West Coast promo man clued Chico in...this is real!

Goose

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #105 on: February 23, 2020, 09:34:08 PM »
Dr. B

Spot on. Cheeks is off base, once again.

MUfan12

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #106 on: February 23, 2020, 10:50:51 PM »
Wait, Buzz and Crean left because the fan expectations were too heavy?  You keep spinning in the mud, Cheeken Little.  MU kept giving them both raise after raise...just like with Wojo.

Buzz left because of the administration. Period. Crean left because of his ego. Period.

Yuuup.

79Warrior

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #107 on: February 24, 2020, 05:12:32 AM »
Tower

What he said he can be said by every coach at every university. That is the same stuff Al would say back in the day. Smart stuff to say, but nothing of substance.
Still wish Cheeks would give the reasons why TC and Buzz left.

It can be said about any coach in any sport at any level. We certainly do not need whoever this cheeks person is to lecture the fan base about  how folks react.

Cheeks

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #108 on: February 24, 2020, 09:05:08 AM »
Wait, Buzz and Crean left because the fan expectations were too heavy?  You keep spinning in the mud, Cheeken Little.  MU kept giving them both raise after raise...just like with Wojo.

Buzz left because of the administration. Period. Crean left because of his ego. Period.

It’s funny how reading comprehension is so difficult here....go back and read AGAIN what I said.
"I hate everything about this job except the games, Everything. I don't even get affected anymore by the winning, by the ratings, those things. The trouble is, it will sound like an excuse because we've never won the national championship, but winning just isn't all that important to me.” Al McGuire

Cheeks

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #109 on: February 24, 2020, 09:16:57 AM »
Tower

What he said he can be said by every coach at every university. That is the same stuff Al would say back in the day. Smart stuff to say, but nothing of substance.
Still wish Cheeks would give the reasons why TC and Buzz left.

Lots of reasons, as I said ONE of the reasons is because our fans get stuck in the past the same as other fans at SOME other programs do.  Coaches are damned if they do and damned if they don’t.  They succeed, and then it isn’t success enough to the past.  They don’t succeed and the screams of tradition and we are entitled to a specific level.

I disagree STRONGLY that every coach at every university can say...that’s a cop out.  There are some programs without a history or the history was set by the current guy that do not do the things of fan bases that once touched gold eons  ago.   That’s the main difference. 

I’ve had the pleasure in my career to work directly for two MU head basketball coaches for 5 years and deal with four more at various levels, including being Al’s executive producer for two years on tv broadcasts.  To a man they would say how energetic and supportive the fan base is, they would also say how unrealistic SOME are for a school like MU, location, academics, etc.  Some of the stories of the insanity of some fans and the turn off the provide would make your stomach churn.  And yes, some schools are even worse.  Some coaches have thick skins, and some are less thick.  The guys that were no longer coaching said they didn’t miss the fan part at all...who can blame them.  You guys are ignoring human nature.

"I hate everything about this job except the games, Everything. I don't even get affected anymore by the winning, by the ratings, those things. The trouble is, it will sound like an excuse because we've never won the national championship, but winning just isn't all that important to me.” Al McGuire

Dr. Blackheart

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #110 on: February 24, 2020, 09:41:42 AM »
It’s funny how reading comprehension is so difficult here....go back and read AGAIN what I said.

I hope your bottle of scotch yesterday was worth it this AM.

keefe

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #111 on: February 24, 2020, 10:27:34 AM »
I hope your bottle of scotch yesterday was worth it this AM.

"Gawdamn Lenny...that mother f#cker really pisses me off..."



From The Chico Basement Tapes


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Cheeks

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #112 on: February 24, 2020, 10:36:11 AM »
But, but, Doc....we have a...wait for it....reputation. The under assistant West Coast promo man clued Chico in...this is real!

Your snark aside, I still get together with some of the coaches on an annual basis.  I spent time with one of the former assistants over Christmas break.  This Summer I will be with another. 

I realize you never spent a second of your life working with these people day in and day out....I realize some people got to glad hand them at a fund raiser, which is totally different.

But yes, even being on the west coast the advances in technology like airplane travel, phones, emails, texts have really made it possible to stay connected.   :o
"I hate everything about this job except the games, Everything. I don't even get affected anymore by the winning, by the ratings, those things. The trouble is, it will sound like an excuse because we've never won the national championship, but winning just isn't all that important to me.” Al McGuire

Goose

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #113 on: February 24, 2020, 10:41:22 AM »
Cheeks

Al also said Hank the brains the operation and should be HC after his retirement.

Benny B

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #114 on: February 24, 2020, 11:18:09 AM »
News

The last minute was embarrassing. You can jerk off over computer rankings all night long, but that was a bush league move by our HC.

I'm not normally one to beat a dead horse, but I'm also not one to let a Jerry Springer metaphor get away...


First off, if there is anyone here who has never seen the Jerry Springer Show - #1 you're a damn liar - but #2, go pull up an old YouTube video and just watch the first five minutes of an episode (just long enough to see the first of many brawls).  Or in lieu, allow me to explain the plot, because it is essentially the same for every damn show:

1. Girl is sitting by herself on the stage. 
2. Girl tells some BS story to Jerry how she's in love with her long-time boyfriend, Boy A, but has been sleeping with Boy B on the side. 
3. Boy A enters stage right and Girl confesses. 
4. Before Boy A can even react to the confession, Boy B enters stage left. 
5. Boy A bum rushes Boy B, each exchange a few blows.  Stage muscle jumps up and breaks up the fight. 
6. Girl says she has another confession to make to A and B... she is engaged to Boy C, now entering stage right. 
7. Boys A and B go after Boy C and now there's a three-way that you never wanted to see rolling around on the floor.

Why is this relevant?  Because nobody ever blames the Girl.  A and B and C (and sometimes D, E, F, or all the way to triple-Q) always fight with each other... nobody ever turns to the Girl and says "to hell with you, you f@kin' slut."


Goose --- You're Boy A in this scenario, Wojo's end-of-game is Boy B, and the NCAA is your Girl.  If you were being honest with yourself (and everyone else), you would be blaming the NCAA.  But I get it... it's so much easier to blame Wojo, but he's not the one screwing everyone... if Wojo is guilty of anything, it's of being another poor sap who got duped by the slut that is the NCAA.
Wow, I'm very concerned for Benny.  Being able to mimic Myron Medcalf's writing so closely implies an oncoming case of dementia.

brewcity77

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #115 on: February 24, 2020, 11:22:23 AM »
I'm just creating this post so Brew has a dedicated place to go on record over and over for several posts about how Wojo is just as dirty as LaVall Jordan because of how the Providence game ended (continuing to press and foul until the final buzzer even though the game was out of reach).  We could have injured one of the Friars after all.
On topic, I didn't like the end of the game, but it's different when you have a history of doing it (Jordan has done this multiple times against multiple opponents) and doing it once.

That said...I'm not sure why we were fouling. Chasing a sub-10 point deficit for NET purposes makes some sense but isn't something Wojo has done in the past. I found it interesting that Howard has now broken the Big East league play scoring record (Lawrence Moten) and Big East career scoring record (Troy Bell) in losing efforts when the games were already decided.

keefe

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #116 on: February 24, 2020, 11:23:06 AM »
I have honestly never watched the Jerry Springer Show.



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Goose

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #117 on: February 24, 2020, 11:25:27 AM »
Benny B

That put a smile on my face. Well done.

Elonsmusk

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #118 on: February 24, 2020, 12:02:04 PM »
Cheeks is either a) trollling or b) a massive chicken little.

The ridiculous narrative that Milwaukee sucks and has little appeal to prospective coaches is absurd.

Let’s thinks about some real gem college towns:

West Lafayette, IN
Champaign, IL
Lincoln, NE
Lawrence, KS
Tallahassee, FL
East Lansing, MI

Could go on and on. MKE gets cold but it has big city amenities, without big city hassle. MKE/MU have a state of the art arena. Great restaurants. Great theater. Great festivals. And if you want a world class city?  Hop on the Amtrak and ride 90 minutes to downtown Chicago.

The notion MKE is an armpit compared to many high Major college towns is absolutely f’in absurd. Then again, consider the source. 
« Last Edit: February 24, 2020, 12:38:36 PM by Elonsmusk »
No doubt there are cultural differences, but sports is important for many Asians.

CTWarrior

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #119 on: February 24, 2020, 12:08:36 PM »
I'm not normally one to beat a dead horse, but I'm also not one to let a Jerry Springer metaphor get away...


First off, if there is anyone here who has never seen the Jerry Springer Show - #1 you're a damn liar - but #2, go pull up an old YouTube video and just watch the first five minutes of an episode (just long enough to see the first of many brawls).  Or in lieu, allow me to explain the plot, because it is essentially the same for every damn show:

1. Girl is sitting by herself on the stage. 
2. Girl tells some BS story to Jerry how she's in love with her long-time boyfriend, Boy A, but has been sleeping with Boy B on the side. 
3. Boy A enters stage right and Girl confesses. 
4. Before Boy A can even react to the confession, Boy B enters stage left. 
5. Boy A bum rushes Boy B, each exchange a few blows.  Stage muscle jumps up and breaks up the fight. 
6. Girl says she has another confession to make to A and B... she is engaged to Boy C, now entering stage right. 
7. Boys A and B go after Boy C and now there's a three-way that you never wanted to see rolling around on the floor.

Why is this relevant?  Because nobody ever blames the Girl.  A and B and C (and sometimes D, E, F, or all the way to triple-Q) always fight with each other... nobody ever turns to the Girl and says "to hell with you, you f@kin' slut."


Goose --- You're Boy A in this scenario, Wojo's end-of-game is Boy B, and the NCAA is your Girl.  If you were being honest with yourself (and everyone else), you would be blaming the NCAA.  But I get it... it's so much easier to blame Wojo, but he's not the one screwing everyone... if Wojo is guilty of anything, it's of being another poor sap who got duped by the slut that is the NCAA.
This is very clever, and amazingly makes a lot of sense.  Good job!
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Hobbes:  What's misunderstood about you?
Calvin:  Nobody thinks I'm a genius.

CreightonWarrior

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #120 on: February 24, 2020, 12:17:16 PM »
I'm not normally one to beat a dead horse, but I'm also not one to let a Jerry Springer metaphor get away...


First off, if there is anyone here who has never seen the Jerry Springer Show - #1 you're a damn liar - but #2, go pull up an old YouTube video and just watch the first five minutes of an episode (just long enough to see the first of many brawls).  Or in lieu, allow me to explain the plot, because it is essentially the same for every damn show:

1. Girl is sitting by herself on the stage. 
2. Girl tells some BS story to Jerry how she's in love with her long-time boyfriend, Boy A, but has been sleeping with Boy B on the side. 
3. Boy A enters stage right and Girl confesses. 
4. Before Boy A can even react to the confession, Boy B enters stage left. 
5. Boy A bum rushes Boy B, each exchange a few blows.  Stage muscle jumps up and breaks up the fight. 
6. Girl says she has another confession to make to A and B... she is engaged to Boy C, now entering stage right. 
7. Boys A and B go after Boy C and now there's a three-way that you never wanted to see rolling around on the floor.

Why is this relevant?  Because nobody ever blames the Girl.  A and B and C (and sometimes D, E, F, or all the way to triple-Q) always fight with each other... nobody ever turns to the Girl and says "to hell with you, you f@kin' slut."


Goose --- You're Boy A in this scenario, Wojo's end-of-game is Boy B, and the NCAA is your Girl.  If you were being honest with yourself (and everyone else), you would be blaming the NCAA.  But I get it... it's so much easier to blame Wojo, but he's not the one screwing everyone... if Wojo is guilty of anything, it's of being another poor sap who got duped by the slut that is the NCAA.
You forgot to mention that one of those boys is usually not actually a boy.

BCHoopster

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #121 on: February 24, 2020, 12:24:58 PM »
MU is in much better shape then Harvey Weinstein, he might meet boy 1 or 2 in jail.

Goose

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #122 on: February 24, 2020, 12:40:24 PM »
BCHoopster

Harvey might have his hand's full moving forward:)

Cheeks

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #123 on: February 24, 2020, 09:56:48 PM »
Cheeks

Al also said Hank the brains the operation and should be HC after his retirement.

And he was wrong
"I hate everything about this job except the games, Everything. I don't even get affected anymore by the winning, by the ratings, those things. The trouble is, it will sound like an excuse because we've never won the national championship, but winning just isn't all that important to me.” Al McGuire

Cheeks

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Re: Wojo's Dirty End of Game
« Reply #124 on: February 24, 2020, 10:02:10 PM »
Cheeks is either a) trollling or b) a massive chicken little.

The ridiculous narrative that Milwaukee sucks and has little appeal to prospective coaches is absurd.

Let’s thinks about some real gem college towns:

West Lafayette, IN
Champaign, IL
Lincoln, NE
Lawrence, KS
Tallahassee, FL
East Lansing, MI

Could go on and on. MKE gets cold but it has big city amenities, without big city hassle. MKE/MU have a state of the art arena. Great restaurants. Great theater. Great festivals. And if you want a world class city?  Hop on the Amtrak and ride 90 minutes to downtown Chicago.

The notion MKE is an armpit compared to many high Major college towns is absolutely f’in absurd. Then again, consider the source.

Again, I love Milwaukee.  Never called it an armpit.  Again, love the city.  Sure wish people would take the time to read.  It isn’t for a lot of people long term, which is what I said.  Find someone that is willing to stick it out....not a bunch of those folks around that will do it long term. 

I hope we find one some day.
"I hate everything about this job except the games, Everything. I don't even get affected anymore by the winning, by the ratings, those things. The trouble is, it will sound like an excuse because we've never won the national championship, but winning just isn't all that important to me.” Al McGuire