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Author Topic: A win is a win is a win is a win  (Read 20093 times)

Silent Verbal

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #225 on: November 26, 2019, 07:21:07 PM »
Then all of you that feel this way, come back in March so we can enjoy the team now....he cannot have post season success until the post season, so the constant whining by some of you isn’t needed until then. Thanks

I also don’t like much of what I’ve seen the first four games of this season, but apparently the sample size is far too small to critique.  So at this point, it looks like Wojo is above criticism.

Shooter McGavin

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #226 on: November 26, 2019, 07:28:48 PM »
And you need to embrace the reality that Wojo will continue to be criticized until he has some post season success.  As he should be.  Don’t like it?  Root for another team.

You sound like a “never Wojo-er”😄
« Last Edit: November 26, 2019, 07:47:25 PM by Shooter McGavin »

Cheeks

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #227 on: November 26, 2019, 07:33:11 PM »
I also don’t like much of what I’ve seen the first four games of this season, but apparently the sample size is far too small to critique.  So at this point, it looks like Wojo is above criticism.

We are 3-1, supposed to be 3-1.  No one is above criticism, but you are now changing the goalposts and Mike & Scott Baio are not going to be happy. 

More to the point, when the team plays well and it would seem you would be “happy” with what you see, you guys are almost never here...gone...dust...only to return when you “don’t like what you see”.  In my opinion.
"I hate everything about this job except the games, Everything. I don't even get affected anymore by the winning, by the ratings, those things. The trouble is, it will sound like an excuse because we've never won the national championship, but winning just isn't all that important to me.” Al McGuire

Silent Verbal

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #228 on: November 26, 2019, 08:01:17 PM »
You sound like a “never Wojo-er”😄

Not true.  He wasn’t my first choice to take over the program.  Howland was, though I understand why he wasn’t hired.  Think he would’ve done great here, but that’s water under the bridge.

I was willing to roll with the punches when Wojo came aboard.  First red flag was when he missed the postseason entirely with Henry on the team.  Then came the blowout loss to South Carolina.  Then we missed the tournament again in year four despite having maybe the three best 3 point shooters in the country on the same team.  And then came last season’s collapse, followed by Hausershima.

Just more negatives than positives for me so far, especially when you factor in that Crean had a Final Four under his belt and Buzz had 8 NCAAT wins by the time they’d been here five years.  Hopefully Wojo can achieve a similar level of success soon.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2019, 08:12:44 PM by Silent Verbal »

Mike Deane's Seat Belt

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #229 on: November 26, 2019, 08:11:26 PM »
Not true.  He wasn’t my first choice to take over the program.  Howland was, though I understand why he wasn’t hired.  Think he would’ve done great here, but that’s water under the bridge.

I was willing to roll with the punches when Wojo came aboard.  First red flag was when he missed the postseason entirely with Henry on the team.  Then came the blowout loss to South Carolina.  Then we missed the tournament again in year four despite having maybe the three best 3 point shooters in the country on the same team.  And then came last season’s collapse, followed by Hausershima.

Just more negatives than positives for me so far, especially when you factor in that Crean had a Final Four under his belt and Buzz had 8 NCAAT wins by the time they’d been here five years.  Wojo has a lot of work to do to get where his predecessors were at.  Maybe he can start making up that ground this year.

Great take fully agree

Cheeks

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #230 on: November 26, 2019, 08:19:19 PM »
Not true.  He wasn’t my first choice to take over the program.  Howland was, though I understand why he wasn’t hired.  Think he would’ve done great here, but that’s water under the bridge.

I was willing to roll with the punches when Wojo came aboard.  First red flag was when he missed the postseason entirely with Henry on the team.  Then came the blowout loss to South Carolina.  Then we missed the tournament again in year four despite having maybe the three best 3 point shooters in the country on the same team.  And then came last season’s collapse, followed by Hausershima.

Just more negatives than positives for me so far, especially when you factor in that Crean had a Final Four under his belt and Buzz had 8 NCAAT wins by the time they’d been here five years.  Hopefully Wojo can achieve a similar level of success soon.

You realize Howland has only taken MSU to one tournament thus far and lost in the first round?  They also have much lower recruiting academic standards than MU which should make his job down there easier.
"I hate everything about this job except the games, Everything. I don't even get affected anymore by the winning, by the ratings, those things. The trouble is, it will sound like an excuse because we've never won the national championship, but winning just isn't all that important to me.” Al McGuire

Jay Bee

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #231 on: November 26, 2019, 08:22:46 PM »
You realize Howland has only taken MSU to one tournament thus far and lost in the first round? 

#crapshoot

Silent Verbal

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #232 on: November 26, 2019, 08:27:56 PM »
You realize Howland has only taken MSU to one tournament thus far and lost in the first round?  They also have much lower recruiting academic standards than MU which should make his job down there easier.

Howland’s in his fifth year at MSU.  Through four years, Wojo only had one first round NCAA tournament loss, too.  This year, MSU is 6-1.  Seems like he has them on a good trajectory.

Fluffy Blue Monster

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #233 on: November 26, 2019, 08:30:31 PM »
Howland’s in his fifth year at MSU.  Through four years, Wojo only had one first round NCAA tournament loss, too.  This year, MSU is 6-1.  Seems like he has them on a good trajectory.


LOL, yeah.  The loss was to the only P6 team they've played so far.
“True patriotism hates injustice in its own land more than anywhere else.”  -Clarence Darrow

Cheeks

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #234 on: November 26, 2019, 08:33:54 PM »
Howland’s in his fifth year at MSU.  Through four years, Wojo only had one first round NCAA tournament loss, too.  This year, MSU is 6-1.  Seems like he has them on a good trajectory.

Well, they do have wins over Sam Houston State, Tulane, Coastal, New Orleans, FIU and Louisiana Monroe.  They lost to Villanova. 

They should be pretty good this year, as should Marquette.
"I hate everything about this job except the games, Everything. I don't even get affected anymore by the winning, by the ratings, those things. The trouble is, it will sound like an excuse because we've never won the national championship, but winning just isn't all that important to me.” Al McGuire

Cheeks

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #235 on: November 26, 2019, 08:34:10 PM »
"I hate everything about this job except the games, Everything. I don't even get affected anymore by the winning, by the ratings, those things. The trouble is, it will sound like an excuse because we've never won the national championship, but winning just isn't all that important to me.” Al McGuire

jonny09

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #236 on: November 26, 2019, 08:36:02 PM »
Well, they do have wins over Sam Houston State, Tulane, Coastal, New Orleans, FIU and Louisiana Monroe.  They lost to Villanova. 

They should be pretty good this year, as should Marquette.

As should Marquette?   Bookmark this one

Cheeks

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #237 on: November 26, 2019, 08:43:28 PM »
As should Marquette?   Bookmark this one

We all know where you stand...I know when to find Johnny when MU loses, otherwise he’s watching PAC 12 Network or on a hot date.  Bundle up, cold front coming into California this week.
"I hate everything about this job except the games, Everything. I don't even get affected anymore by the winning, by the ratings, those things. The trouble is, it will sound like an excuse because we've never won the national championship, but winning just isn't all that important to me.” Al McGuire

skianth16

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #238 on: November 26, 2019, 11:26:18 PM »
This is a great point. If the gripe is "he has no March success" any such criticisms are useless for the next 4 months.

So criticisms of Wojo are now limited to only certain months? That's only fair game to bring up in March and maybe April? Come on, this is silly.


skianth16

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #239 on: November 26, 2019, 11:33:10 PM »
I think that is a very similar story to the RM game.  Wojo sent his players out there with one arm tied behind their back so that they could practice and be ready for the future.  That is coaching and guess what MU didn't lose.  No one will care about the RM game in March but it forced the team to figure out how to score, how to play without Markus, and how Markus needs to incorporate passing into his game.  It wasn't going to be pretty but in the end it didn't matter.

I think there's a pretty significant difference between practicing on a weakness in order to improve and just surviving while playing with half the playbook. The gameplan and intention are the same, but the results aren't.

I'm not convinced that MU improved, as a team, from the Robert Morris game. It was nice to see some offensive improvement from Sacar and Brendan, but I don't think those pros outweigh the cons that led to a 19 point first half effort. The initial gameplan made sense, but when things weren't going well, I would have liked to have seen a plan B that gave our guys some confidence and built some momentum going into Orlando.

Jay Bee

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #240 on: November 26, 2019, 11:49:12 PM »
I think there's a pretty significant difference between practicing on a weakness in order to improve and just surviving while playing with half the playbook. The gameplan and intention are the same, but the results aren't.

I'm not convinced that MU improved, as a team, from the Robert Morris game. It was nice to see some offensive improvement from Sacar and Brendan, but I don't think those pros outweigh the cons that led to a 19 point first half effort. The initial gameplan made sense, but when things weren't going well, I would have liked to have seen a plan B that gave our guys some confidence and built some momentum going into Orlando.

Winning by X in game 1 = momentum advantage in game 2? Seems so easy coach, thanks!

brewcity77

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #241 on: November 27, 2019, 12:23:40 AM »
So criticisms of Wojo are now limited to only certain months? That's only fair game to bring up in March and maybe April? Come on, this is silly.

That particular complaint? Yes. It's a straw man any other time.
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NorthernDancerColt

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #242 on: November 27, 2019, 01:38:31 AM »
Winning by X in game 1 = momentum advantage in game 2? Seems so easy coach, thanks!

Exactly. When you have the best horse in a lesser race, and you are pointing towards a much bigger race, why would you whip and scrub your mount to build a 20 lg lead? Skillful trainers and coaches find the better part of the racetrack and avoid it in the prep races. Ever hear of “against the grain”?  You can bet they will find it in the race that matters. Not only that, they end up wound like a spring from closing 10-wide last time on an inside-biased speed track. Or conversely, they are wound up to win after trying last race to maintain their speed on a deep, heavy rail, while the track was favoring wide closers. AGAINST THE GRAIN, folks.

I can tell you one thing. A good railbird wouldn’t miss what happened in the PURDUE game. The Equibase CHARTs would read something like this...

MARQUETTE stumbled to his knees at the break. Took up in traffic at the half mile mark. Languished in the back of the pack, far off of a slow early pace. After mild encouragement from rider, MARQUETTE began picking off horses one by one, mounting a furious wide rally, steadied slightly off heels of a rival, then dug in and continued his wide marauding move to win going away at the wire. As rider pleased.

We surely got something out of that Purdue race. The Wisconsin game was a Thorograph regression (bounce race) against a heated rival at their home track. There is no easy racing analogy to the RM game because our trainer seemed to purposely add weight, remove the rider’s crop, and run with no race day meds. You can bet he was pointing to an upcoming race series.

See you at the windows, punters.
Zenyatta has a lot....a lot... of ground to make up. She gets there from here she’d be a super horse......what’s this.....Zenyatta hooked to the grandstand side....Zenyatta flying on the outside....this....is...un-belieeeeeevable!...looked impossible at the top of the stretch...

HowardsWorld

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #243 on: November 27, 2019, 07:02:30 AM »
I mean you could be Wisconsin who lost to two mid majors in the last 2 days.

skianth16

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #244 on: November 27, 2019, 08:21:21 AM »
That particular complaint? Yes. It's a straw man any other time.

If Al had 2 fewer losses in March of '77 there's a real chance we don't have his name on our jerseys, our court, or our on-campus arena (including a nice statue!). Winning in March absolutely matters, and coaches who can't get it done will draw criticism from the fanbase. All year long, and even many years afterward. You obviously don't like it, but that doesn't change the reality that winning in the postseason of any sport matters to fans.

skianth16

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #245 on: November 27, 2019, 08:23:33 AM »
Winning by X in game 1 = momentum advantage in game 2? Seems so easy coach, thanks!

It's not winning by x. It's having success doing the things you set out to do in the gameplan. That's where I think the momentum builds. Hopefully we got enough of that in the second half against Robert Morris, but barely scraping by sure doesn't seem like we executed many things successfully.

Cheeks

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #246 on: November 27, 2019, 08:36:56 AM »
If Al had 2 fewer losses in March of '77 there's a real chance we don't have his name on our jerseys, our court, or our on-campus arena (including a nice statue!). Winning in March absolutely matters, and coaches who can't get it done will draw criticism from the fanbase. All year long, and even many years afterward. You obviously don't like it, but that doesn't change the reality that winning in the postseason of any sport matters to fans.

Sure it matters, but it’s not the only thing that matters, especially in college basketball.  How you win ( cheating, etc), the regular season, etc also matter.  Al also said that was nowhere close to his best team....best teams often don’t win in the NCAA tournament.  Hank said the ‘78 team was better than ‘77 and they got bounced in the first game.  If March is all that matters, why bother getting worked up until March?
"I hate everything about this job except the games, Everything. I don't even get affected anymore by the winning, by the ratings, those things. The trouble is, it will sound like an excuse because we've never won the national championship, but winning just isn't all that important to me.” Al McGuire

Pakuni

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #247 on: November 27, 2019, 09:00:34 AM »
It's not winning by x. It's having success doing the things you set out to do in the gameplan. That's where I think the momentum builds. Hopefully we got enough of that in the second half against Robert Morris, but barely scraping by sure doesn't seem like we executed many things successfully.

I very much doubt your nebulous concept of momentum - good or bad - from a game against Robert Morris a week earlier will have any impact whatsoever on what happens in Orlando.
Marquette dominated in the second half against Purdue. How did the all important momentum from that help four days later in Madison?

UWW2MU

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #248 on: November 27, 2019, 09:02:42 AM »
I dislike most of you


I dislike you for making me choke on my coffee as I read this post.   Bravo!

MU82

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Re: A win is a win is a win is a win
« Reply #249 on: November 27, 2019, 09:07:03 AM »
1. NRC: Bravo!

2. "Momentum? Momentum is the next day's starting pitcher." -- Earl Weaver
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