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Marquette
Marquette

Madness

Date/Time: Oct 4, 2019
TV: ???
Schedule for 2018-19
24-10

Author Topic: Sam's 3pt shot!  (Read 6082 times)

VegasWarrior77

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #25 on: January 09, 2019, 11:24:00 PM »
Glad you agree with me.
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wadesworld

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #26 on: January 09, 2019, 11:28:01 PM »
Glad you agree with me.

Yeah I don't.  There is nothing conclusive one way or another in that picture.

barfolomew

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #27 on: January 09, 2019, 11:33:02 PM »
I was a little surprised Marcus was inbounding, but I wasn't at all surprised the pass went to Sam, nor would I have been surprised it went to Joey. You needed to throw it out there to a tall guy who could also hit a 3. MU only has 2 of those. Would have been much more difficult getting Markus open. But even then, maybe have JCS throw the inbound pass with Markus as a decoy.

But hey, it worked out, and it's a results business. Nice win for Wojo and our heroes.

I may be wrong, but Wojo may have called that in his little sugar huddle as the boys were going past the bench to inbound. For a second when the ref slammed the ball on the ground I thought he was going to start counting.
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AirPunch

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #28 on: January 09, 2019, 11:37:46 PM »
I may be wrong, but Wojo may have called that in his little sugar huddle as the boys were going past the bench to inbound. For a second when the ref slammed the ball on the ground I thought he was going to start counting.

I noticed that too. That was...weird lol

Class71

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #29 on: January 09, 2019, 11:40:43 PM »
Rule is simple. If the replay is not definitive the call on the floor stands. The call on the floor was the shot counted.
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brewcity77

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #30 on: January 09, 2019, 11:55:26 PM »
Rule is simple. If the replay is not definitive the call on the floor stands. The call on the floor was the shot counted.

+1

Going frame by frame as they did on the broadcast, the ball was on his fingertips at 0:00.01 and off at 0:00.00. There was no 0:00.005 frame to differentiate, so you have to go with the call on the floor. Lucky? Probably, but I'll take it.

Cheeks

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #31 on: January 09, 2019, 11:58:02 PM »
There is absolutely no way someone can catch a ball at the top of their jump, come down from that jump to the ground, jump again and release a shot in .8 seconds. It's impossible. Timekeeper had to be a second slow. My head thinks Creighton was jobbed and feels a little sorry for them. My heart, however, is filled with joy. I've watched well over 1000 MU games and this game (down 3, .8 seconds left, the opponent with possession - are you kidding me?) was easily the most improbable win I've ever witnessed. Awesome!!!

Not impossible. In fact one camera angle seems to show that's exactly what happened.  Another camera angle suggests it would take .81 seconds.  It's been done before.
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Farls

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #32 on: January 09, 2019, 11:59:29 PM »

Also curious to know why the one ref kept putting on the headphones.

I think he was listening for the buzzer.
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MU82

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #33 on: January 10, 2019, 12:00:39 AM »
Not impossible. In fact one camera angle seems to show that's exactly what happened.  Another camera angle suggests it would take .81 seconds.  It's been done before.

Well, what we don't know is if the clock operator hit the go button at the exact right moment.

Catching the ball in the air, coming down to the floor, jumping up again and releasing the shot ... all in .8 of a second? Wow!

Methinks we got home cookin' from a road clock operator. Love it!
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MU82

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #34 on: January 10, 2019, 12:37:44 AM »
I just watched the replay 10 times, and it sure seemed the clock didn't start ticking until well after Sam caught the ball and was on his way down from his leap. He then went up and shot.

Clock operators are human, too! Great win!!!
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rocket surgeon

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #35 on: January 10, 2019, 04:57:47 AM »
i kept watching the creighton kid with the blue sweater on, facing the refs at the replay monitor.  his facial expressions never changed.  i've got to think if the refs were truly leaning toward "no good" the kid would have had a more positive look, (unless he was an undercover nebraska fan) even as the refs backed away the 1st time, his expression was like oh fu#k, they are going to call it good.  the black ref looked back at his buddies and said(read his lips) do you have enough to over turn it?   if anyone has that footage(i don't) i recall it seeming to take 1/2 an hour

Goose

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #36 on: January 10, 2019, 04:58:45 AM »
Lenny
I agree with your post. I will take this improbable victory all day long. While I think they stole one, actually know they stole one, this is win to enjoy. Hope it is building block to bigger things ahead. This is the kind of win that can change the trajectory of the whole season.

WarriorFan

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #37 on: January 10, 2019, 05:56:51 AM »
#1 Play of the day on sports center

tower912

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #38 on: January 10, 2019, 06:15:02 AM »
I may be wrong, but Wojo may have called that in his little sugar huddle as the boys were going past the bench to inbound. For a second when the ref slammed the ball on the ground I thought he was going to start counting.
So, great move by Wojo then?
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goinUptown

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #39 on: January 10, 2019, 06:19:00 AM »
Beyond just the huge road win what I dig about that 3-pointer with 0.8 left on clock; in all my years of watching college Hoops, the rule-of-thumb I've heard is that it takes a minimum of 0.8 seconds to get a shot off.  So we now have at least one sample of that happening to include a successful shot.  For our team. On the road. It sorta proves the rule.

And, I've seen it mentioned the powers-that-be might create a rule change perhaps formalizing that rule-of-thumb (although I doubt it will happen).  Were it to happen, it would be yet another instance of a rule shaped by Marquette to include rules like the no-bumble-bee-uniforms rule (sometime in the early 70s, right?), the cannot-swap-free-throw-shooter rule (Marquette vs Missouri in NCAA tourney), and others, I'm sure, but for which I'm currently unaware.

So, just more of Marquette University being that much more a main thread which, throughout decades, shapes the sport of college Hoops.  Pretty cool, huh?

goinUptown (aka/AlsDisciple)

CTWarrior

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #40 on: January 10, 2019, 07:04:49 AM »
Not impossible. In fact one camera angle seems to show that's exactly what happened.  Another camera angle suggests it would take .81 seconds.  It's been done before.
I don't think it is possible.  Whatever fraction of a second it took the clock operator to start it up (maybe 0.2 seconds?) makes all the difference.
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Sponge Ruiner!

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #41 on: January 10, 2019, 07:20:06 AM »
I believe the officials control the start of the clock using the timing belt packs that they wear.

See: https://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/20/sports/ncaabasketball/shrill-to-ncaa-tournament-referees-its-symphonic.html

barfolomew

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #42 on: January 10, 2019, 08:42:19 AM »
So, great move by Wojo then?

Hellz yeah!
Take advantage of having the visitor bench on the offensive end in the 2H. Regardless of whether he told Markus to inbound, it got the guys on the same page.

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Lennys Tap

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #43 on: January 10, 2019, 08:43:37 AM »
I just watched the replay 10 times, and it sure seemed the clock didn't start ticking until well after Sam caught the ball and was on his way down from his leap. He then went up and shot.

Clock operators are human, too! Great win!!!

Exactly, Mike.

MU82

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #44 on: January 10, 2019, 09:25:55 AM »
I believe the officials control the start of the clock using the timing belt packs that they wear.

See: https://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/20/sports/ncaabasketball/shrill-to-ncaa-tournament-referees-its-symphonic.html

Super-interesting article, and I learned something today. I like that.

This is what we reporters used to refer to as the "nut graf:"

It is the Precision Time System, invented in the 1990s by the former N.B.A. referee Mike Costabile. Each time the referee blows the whistle, the game clock, if it is running, stops. To start the clock, the referee reaches to the box on the belt and pushes a button.

The whistle stops the clock, but a human -- in this case the ref, rather than the clock operator like in the olden days -- has to physically start the clock by pushing a button with his finger.

So I sit corrected in crediting the clock operator with giving Sam another fraction of a second to complete that play. But I sit by my assertion that Sam was the beneficiary of an extra couple tenths of a second thanks to a human being responsible for starting the clock.

Catching the basketball at the top of his leap, coming to the ground, jumping back up and launching a shot, with the ball leaving his hands on time ... I'm still pretty sure that's impossible to do in .8 of a second. But I'm downright giddy that it happened!!!
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drewm88

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #45 on: January 10, 2019, 09:26:46 AM »
Beyond just the huge road win what I dig about that 3-pointer with 0.8 left on clock; in all my years of watching college Hoops, the rule-of-thumb I've heard is that it takes a minimum of 0.8 seconds to get a shot off.  So we now have at least one sample of that happening to include a successful shot.  For our team. On the road. It sorta proves the rule.

And, I've seen it mentioned the powers-that-be might create a rule change perhaps formalizing that rule-of-thumb (although I doubt it will happen).  Were it to happen, it would be yet another instance of a rule shaped by Marquette to include rules like the no-bumble-bee-uniforms rule (sometime in the early 70s, right?), the cannot-swap-free-throw-shooter rule (Marquette vs Missouri in NCAA tourney), and others, I'm sure, but for which I'm currently unaware.

So, just more of Marquette University being that much more a main thread which, throughout decades, shapes the sport of college Hoops.  Pretty cool, huh?

goinUptown (aka/AlsDisciple)

.3 to get a shot off.

Cheeks

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #46 on: January 10, 2019, 10:34:44 AM »
I don't think it is possible.  Whatever fraction of a second it took the clock operator to start it up (maybe 0.2 seconds?) makes all the difference.

But that's what MAKES it possible.  The clock is operated by a human being (the ref) and that human being determines within reason when the ball is touched by a player, he then starts the clock.  There is no sensor in the ball and every player to fire off in a nanosecond when it is touched.  There was nothing unreasonable about when the clock started.  We've all seen instances where it starts slow. I've seen it where it has started before ball was touched, and they have to it again. 

In a case like this, what is possible is the dynamics setup in the process.  Respect the process.   ;)
"It's a crapshoot.  You have to be lucky."
Head Coach Roy Williams

CTWarrior

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #47 on: January 10, 2019, 10:39:30 AM »
But that's what MAKES it possible.  The clock is operated by a human being and that human being determines within reason when the ball is touched by a player, he/she then starts the clock.  There is no sensor in the ball and every player to fire off in a nanosecond when it is touched.  There was nothing unreasonable about when the clock started.  We've all seen instances where it starts slow. I've seen it where it has started before ball was touched, and they have to it again. 

In a case like this, what is possible is the dynamics setup in the process.  Respect the process.   ;)

I agree with all of this.  But a human being can't catch a basketball in the air, land, jump and shoot in 0.8 seconds of real time.  The ability of other human beings being involved to start the clock in a timely manner and then judge whether the ball was released in time make it possible, so I agree with you that it can be done in 0.8 seconds of basketball time.
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Calvin:  Nobody thinks I'm a genius.

Cheeks

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #48 on: January 10, 2019, 10:47:58 AM »
I agree with all of this.  But a human being can't catch a basketball in the air, land, jump and shoot in 0.8 seconds of real time.  The ability of other human beings being involved to start the clock in a timely manner and then judge whether the ball was released in time make it possible, so I agree with you that it can be done in 0.8 seconds of basketball time.

Fair enough, but I would also disagree on the suggestion that no human being can do this.  We know what is possible with all the billions of people on this planet?  Maybe 99.9% of humans can't, but by all means someone can do what you just described.  Can they in .3...no.  .5...maybe.  .8, sure. 

Read old articles of SCIENTISTS  (we must believe science) that said a sub 4 minute mile by a human being was impossible. Not only impossible, but would be dangerous.  Until it happened.  That running under 10 seconds in the 100 meters...impossible for a human being. Until it happened. 

https://impossiblehq.com/impossible-case-study-sir-roger-bannister/

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Loose Cannon

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Re: Sam's 3pt shot!
« Reply #49 on: January 10, 2019, 10:57:50 AM »
I agree with all of this.  But a human being can't catch a basketball in the air, land, jump and shoot in 0.8 seconds of real time.  The ability of other human beings being involved to start the clock in a timely manner and then judge whether the ball was released in time make it possible, so I agree with you that it can be done in 0.8 seconds of basketball time.

Well it's seem reasonable that it's not possible and most here seem to agree.  But has it actually been proven or is another case of breaking the 4 minute mile?
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is NOT ignorance, it's the Illusion of knowledge."....Stephen Hawking