Big Ten Tournament at MSG

[TallTitan34]

Quite the crowd in game 1.

[robmufan]

U of I with a better crowd than I would expect. But maybe because it is so cheap!

(as seen on twitter)

[TallTitan34]

Some long distances on here.  When everything points the same direction, you are too far away.

[MomofMUltiples]

Yes, seems like a nice, central place to hold the B1G tournament   

[Mr. Nielsen]

In fairness, it's over 5 days. Let's see what attendance is on Thursday. That said, the bottom four teams last year at the Big East Tournament played infront of 15,000.

[Boozemon Barro]

Hope it fails beyond their wildest nightmares.

[Mr. Nielsen]

Hope it fails beyond their wildest nightmares.

You mean when the Big Ten Tournament was in Washington, DC last year.

[GGGG]

They will have plenty of people there. 

[Boozemon Barro]

You mean when the Big Ten Tournament was in Washington, DC last year.

They can play in DC every year. They're obviously trying to sell MSG on the Big Ten being a better fit than the Big East for a conference tournament.

[Boozemon Barro]

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/columnists/gregg-doyel/2018/02/27/big-ten-tournament-madison-square-garden-greedy-stupid-doyel/373103002

Doyel: Big Ten Tournament in New York City is stupid and everyone knows it
by Gregg Doyel, Indianapolis Star

INDIANAPOLIS - There goes the Big Ten, shamelessly chasing the money again, this time all the way to New York City. It appears to be instinctual, something the Big Ten was born to do, like a dog chasing a squirrel even if the squirrel runs into traffic because SQUIRREL!

Here goes the Big Ten this week into Madison Square Garden, playing its men's basketball tournament in the wrong place at the wrong time because MONEY!

On the bright side, nobody's paying attention. No, wait, that's the downside. And it's not the only downside. It's not even the biggest downside. But let's not ignore how badly the Big Ten devalued its basketball tournament, even if the city hosting the damn thing will in fact be ignoring its basketball tournament.

To shoehorn this traditional Midwest conference into Madison Square Garden, the league had to schedule its conference tourney a week ahead of schedule, alongside the Atlantic Sun and Big South and Ohio Valley, because serious basketball leagues play their conference tournament the week before the NCAA Tournament -- and the Big East has dibs on Madison Square Garden that week through 2026.

Well, Big Ten commissioner Jim Delany wasn't going to wait that long because MONEY!

So he -- and let's be clear here: this is Jim Delany's fault -- agreed to a bastardized Big Ten schedule this year that has seen the league play some conference games in December, the conference tournament at a weird time and then have a layoff of almost two weeks before the NCAA tournament begins. The extended layoff seems damaging to the league's chances in the NCAA tournament, but the Big Ten didn't concern itself with that because MONEY!

To his credit, and let's not go overboard crediting the guy, Delany knows he screwed up. He told the Chicago Tribune last week that he wouldn't do this again, condensing the conference schedule -- Indiana, to name one school, played five games from Jan. 19-30, losing four of them -- to squeeze the conference tournament into New York City. He defended the original decision, though, for reasons that are intellectually dishonest:

"The objective," Delany told the Tribune of the thought process that led to the Big Ten tourney being played this week, "(was) to give the players and the teams and our fans there a chance to see the Big Ten in the Big Apple."

Wrong, wrong, wrong. The objective was to make money. In its original release in 2014 announcing the decision to play this week in Madison Square Garden, Delany said "this pairing is a natural fit for us as we continue to extend our brand and live in two regions of the country." In the statement, the league crowed about "a significant branding presence both inside and outside the building." All of that gobbledygook about "branding" is closer to the truth, a lot closer than giving players "a chance to see the Big Ten in the Big Apple," but it wasn't the primary objective, either.

The objective, if you can believe this, was to lure Rutgers to the Big Ten.

Rutgers!

That's where this whole thing started, the same place where so many stupid decisions in college sports started: conference realignment. The biggest conference tournaments staged their own hunger games, eventually devouring the Southwest Conference and devaluing the Big East, but they didn't get bigger intelligently. They got bigger stupidly because MONEY! The Big Ten wanted to extend its geographic footprint, a phrase I'm putting in italics because you need to hear it as I'm trying to write it: as an obscenity.

There's no going back, but somehow the Big Ten is stuck with Maryland and Rutgers (!), and to get those schools to leave their own conferences, the Big Ten had to make all sorts of promises, including this one: We'll bring the men's basketball tournament to you. Last season the Big Ten tournament was in Washington, D.C., where it was sparsely attended, and this year it will be in Madison Square Garden, where it will be sparsely attended. Put the Big Ten tournament in two of the four most populated areas in the country -- greater New York City is first, greater Washington, D.C., fourth -- and the league can't fill the building. Why? Because those markets don't care about the Big Ten.

Absurd that the Big Ten thought it would be otherwise, but that's what Delany and Co. did several years ago because MONEY!

Put the Big Ten tournament in Chicago, and Chicago will probably fill it. Put it in Indianapolis, and we'll definitely fill it. A city like New York, the Big Ten tournament just doesn't register.

Last time the Big Ten did something this brazenly greedy, this unthinkably damaging, it was deciding in 2016 to play football games on Friday night because MONEY! Delany saw a chance to get the league on networks other than the Big Ten, so he took it. To a man, league football coaches hated it because they know it alienates some of the most pivotal people on the recruiting trail: high school coaches. The only people who thought the decision made any sense at all were the commissioners, Delany and the IHSAA's Bobby Cox, Delany because he's greedy and Cox because half the time he has no idea what he's doing.

But again, the bright side: Delany says the Big Ten won't compress its schedule to play its conference tournament early — in other words, the league will no longer cut off its nose just to spite its own face — ever again. On the downside, he says the league will try to put its men's basketball tournament back in New York City someday, and plans to play it on a somewhat regular basis in Washington, D.C., and that Big Ten hotbed of Philadelphia (!).

Do what you do best, commissioner: Set your teams up to fail. And count your MONEY!

[wadesworld]

Superbar.

[GooooMarquette]

I just love this excerpt from Doyel's article:

Last season the Big Ten tournament was in Washington, D.C., where it was sparsely attended, and this year it will be in Madison Square Garden, where it will be sparsely attended. Put the Big Ten tournament in two of the four most populated areas in the country -- greater New York City is first, greater Washington, D.C., fourth -- and the league can't fill the building. Why? Because those markets don't care about the Big Ten.

[GGGG]

They can play in DC every year. They're obviously trying to sell MSG on the Big Ten being a better fit than the Big East for a conference tournament.

I don't think so.  This was always a one off deal.  The Big Ten knows it's too far out of their footprint.

[Oldgym]

As GoooMarquette, a very stable genius, pointed out in the other thread, the BIG Whatever is back in the midwest after this year.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Ten_Conference_Men%27s_Basketball_Tournament

[TallTitan34]

Tipoff crowd.

[MU82]

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/columnists/gregg-doyel/2018/02/27/big-ten-tournament-madison-square-garden-greedy-stupid-doyel/373103002

Doyel: Big Ten Tournament in New York City is stupid and everyone knows it
by Gregg Doyel, Indianapolis Star

INDIANAPOLIS - There goes the Big Ten, shamelessly chasing the money again, this time all the way to New York City. It appears to be instinctual, something the Big Ten was born to do, like a dog chasing a squirrel even if the squirrel runs into traffic because SQUIRREL!

Here goes the Big Ten this week into Madison Square Garden, playing its men's basketball tournament in the wrong place at the wrong time because MONEY!

On the bright side, nobody's paying attention. No, wait, that's the downside. And it's not the only downside. It's not even the biggest downside. But let's not ignore how badly the Big Ten devalued its basketball tournament, even if the city hosting the damn thing will in fact be ignoring its basketball tournament.

To shoehorn this traditional Midwest conference into Madison Square Garden, the league had to schedule its conference tourney a week ahead of schedule, alongside the Atlantic Sun and Big South and Ohio Valley, because serious basketball leagues play their conference tournament the week before the NCAA Tournament -- and the Big East has dibs on Madison Square Garden that week through 2026.

Well, Big Ten commissioner Jim Delany wasn't going to wait that long because MONEY!

So he -- and let's be clear here: this is Jim Delany's fault -- agreed to a bastardized Big Ten schedule this year that has seen the league play some conference games in December, the conference tournament at a weird time and then have a layoff of almost two weeks before the NCAA tournament begins. The extended layoff seems damaging to the league's chances in the NCAA tournament, but the Big Ten didn't concern itself with that because MONEY!

To his credit, and let's not go overboard crediting the guy, Delany knows he screwed up. He told the Chicago Tribune last week that he wouldn't do this again, condensing the conference schedule -- Indiana, to name one school, played five games from Jan. 19-30, losing four of them -- to squeeze the conference tournament into New York City. He defended the original decision, though, for reasons that are intellectually dishonest:

"The objective," Delany told the Tribune of the thought process that led to the Big Ten tourney being played this week, "(was) to give the players and the teams and our fans there a chance to see the Big Ten in the Big Apple."

Wrong, wrong, wrong. The objective was to make money. In its original release in 2014 announcing the decision to play this week in Madison Square Garden, Delany said "this pairing is a natural fit for us as we continue to extend our brand and live in two regions of the country." In the statement, the league crowed about "a significant branding presence both inside and outside the building." All of that gobbledygook about "branding" is closer to the truth, a lot closer than giving players "a chance to see the Big Ten in the Big Apple," but it wasn't the primary objective, either.

The objective, if you can believe this, was to lure Rutgers to the Big Ten.

Rutgers!

That's where this whole thing started, the same place where so many stupid decisions in college sports started: conference realignment. The biggest conference tournaments staged their own hunger games, eventually devouring the Southwest Conference and devaluing the Big East, but they didn't get bigger intelligently. They got bigger stupidly because MONEY! The Big Ten wanted to extend its geographic footprint, a phrase I'm putting in italics because you need to hear it as I'm trying to write it: as an obscenity.

There's no going back, but somehow the Big Ten is stuck with Maryland and Rutgers (!), and to get those schools to leave their own conferences, the Big Ten had to make all sorts of promises, including this one: We'll bring the men's basketball tournament to you. Last season the Big Ten tournament was in Washington, D.C., where it was sparsely attended, and this year it will be in Madison Square Garden, where it will be sparsely attended. Put the Big Ten tournament in two of the four most populated areas in the country -- greater New York City is first, greater Washington, D.C., fourth -- and the league can't fill the building. Why? Because those markets don't care about the Big Ten.

Absurd that the Big Ten thought it would be otherwise, but that's what Delany and Co. did several years ago because MONEY!

Put the Big Ten tournament in Chicago, and Chicago will probably fill it. Put it in Indianapolis, and we'll definitely fill it. A city like New York, the Big Ten tournament just doesn't register.

Last time the Big Ten did something this brazenly greedy, this unthinkably damaging, it was deciding in 2016 to play football games on Friday night because MONEY! Delany saw a chance to get the league on networks other than the Big Ten, so he took it. To a man, league football coaches hated it because they know it alienates some of the most pivotal people on the recruiting trail: high school coaches. The only people who thought the decision made any sense at all were the commissioners, Delany and the IHSAA's Bobby Cox, Delany because he's greedy and Cox because half the time he has no idea what he's doing.

But again, the bright side: Delany says the Big Ten won't compress its schedule to play its conference tournament early — in other words, the league will no longer cut off its nose just to spite its own face — ever again. On the downside, he says the league will try to put its men's basketball tournament back in New York City someday, and plans to play it on a somewhat regular basis in Washington, D.C., and that Big Ten hotbed of Philadelphia (!).

Do what you do best, commissioner: Set your teams up to fail. And count your MONEY!

That's a solid column by Doyel.

I went to the first 11 Big Ten tourneys, starting in 1998. The first 4 were at the United Center, the next 6 flip-flopped back and forth between the UC and Conseco, and then the 2008 event started a 5 year run in Indy.

Chicago did fine as host, but Indy really did a great job. You felt like you were at an "event." It was almost an Olympic Village kind of feel in downtown Indy. They made the kids and fans feel they were part of something special, a real "basketball community." (They've done well as a Final Four host and Super Bowl host, too.)

That's where they should hold the darn thing every year, or at least almost every year, IMHO.

[Newsdreams]

Thread title is wrong. It is the Rutgers' Invitational Tournament

[The Lens]

How bad of a screw up must it be to acknowledge the mistake BEFORE the tourney?

Also did you see some of the other bastardization?

SEC — St. Louis
ACC — Brooklyn
American — Orlando
Mo Valley — THIS Weekend

[GGGG]

That's a solid column by Doyel.

Not really.

Putting the blame on Delaney for making money, when it's obvious that's what every conference in the country wants to do, is dumb. 

[GooooMarquette]

How bad of a screw up must it be to acknowledge the mistake BEFORE the tourney?

Also did you see some of the other bastardization?

SEC — St. Louis
ACC — Brooklyn
American — Orlando
Mo Valley — THIS Weekend

Yeah...even though it's true, it's pretty telling that he'd actually say it out loud.

And those other lost tourneys are clearly "rewards" to teams that joined the conference:

SEC in STL - Mizzou
ACC in BKN - 'Cuse
AAC in ORL - UCF

The pics of empty seats in MSG is a familiar sight...for your typical mid-major tourney.

[GGGG]

How bad of a screw up must it be to acknowledge the mistake BEFORE the tourney?

Also did you see some of the other bastardization?

SEC — St. Louis
ACC — Brooklyn
American — Orlando
Mo Valley — THIS Weekend

I believe the Missouri Valley had to move their tournament to this weekend to preserve playing their championship game on CBS.

[frozena pizza]

Watched a little of it last night and it was honestly pathetic, and depressing.  Clearly the Rutgers fan base didn't notice the favor.  Pretty huge difference in energy flipping between that and 3 phenomenal BE games last night.

I would respect the Big Ten a lot more if they just embraced their Midwestern roots and played it in any one of about 10 cities within their footprint.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Not really.

Putting the blame on Delaney for making money, when it's obvious that's what every conference in the country wants to do, is dumb.

True, but I think his point is that the (over) expansion based on tv reach ($) obviously hasn't always translated well in its execution. This is focused on the empty seats and scheduling snafus. Not mentioned, is the stupid football divsions and scheduling. While the conference realignment obviously has been a boon financially in the near term, it has also led to an alienation of the fans and schools. 

Potential reach doesn't translate to eyeballs, which is why they are returning to their core geography. As stated, the fact that Delaney admitted his mistakes before the tournament, means seats will be empty based on ticket sales.

[i71_dawg]

The Big Ten has so many great cities/metro areas to play their tournament in...and where they could have huge crowds....they should rotate the tournament among the following:

Chicago
Indianapolis
Detroit
Cleveland

Even Pittsburgh and Milwaukee and the Twin Cities could be possibilities.

.

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

The Big Ten has so many great cities/metro areas to play their tournament in...and where they could have huge crowds....they should rotate the tournament among the following:

Chicago
Indianapolis
Detroit
Cleveland

Even Pittsburgh and Milwaukee and the Twin Cities could be possibilities.

.

Prior to last year, wasn't it a rotation between Chicago and Indy?