WI Supreme Court Takes McAdams' Case

[GGGG]

Received an email from MU regarding today's decision. Continuing to portray the university as the moral superior/authority "we stood up for decency..." really angers me. I am disappointed that Lovell is reduced to empty platitudes.

Glad Lovell continues this line. Marquette does hold the moral high ground here.

[Blue Horseshoe]

Glad Lovell continues this line. Marquette does hold the moral high ground here.

It is an easier pill to swallow after one realizes the administration is more incompetent and less malicious.

[GGGG]

It is an easier pill to swallow after one realizes the administration is more incompetent and less malicious.

Nah. Lovell and co are doing great work. I'm fully supportive.

[Coleman]

The way I look at it the TA was acting as a teacher. She ran the class , assigned grades etc. . To hide behind the notion that she was a student was a stretch in my view and thankfully the court saw it the same way.

Doesn't matter whether she was acting as a teacher, a lab technician, an RA, a phonathon representative, or a LIMO driver, she was a student. That was literally her formal affiliation to the university. It doesn't change when she teaches a class.

[Eldon]

Received an email from MU regarding today's decision. Continuing to portray the university as the moral superior/authority "we stood up for decency..." really angers me. I am disappointed that Lovell is reduced to empty platitudes.

Marquette spent a lot of money to be able to say that.  They are now reaping the return on their investment.  The damages paid to McAdams will function as the cost of a PR campaign.

[Billy Hoyle]

The way I look at it the TA was acting as a teacher. She ran the class , assigned grades etc. . To hide behind the notion that she was a student was a stretch in my view and thankfully the court saw it the same way.

McAdams was not acting as a teacher, he was acting as a right wing flame thrower.  This is not "academic freedom." It's doxxing. He used his blog, which he knows appeals to a radical segment of society, to attack a colleague (if you insist on calling her a "teacher") which is not within the confines of his academic position. Now right wing organization will be lining up behind racists and bigots who have been fired for their social media posts, claiming it is outside the scope of their employment.

And here I thought the right was against "judicial activism."

[rocket surgeon]

Nah. Lovell and co are doing great work. I'm fully supportive.

if being shot down by the state supreme court is great work, i'd hate to see what bad work is in your book.    mizzou is still reeling from their "great work" and their situation didn't require the attention of a supreme court

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/09/us/university-of-missouri-enrollment-protests-fallout.html

       "It was a moment of triumph for the protesting students. But it has been a disaster for the university.

Freshman enrollment at the Columbia campus, the system's flagship, has fallen by more than 35 percent in the two years since."

[mu03eng]

if being shot down by the state supreme court is great work, i'd hate to see what bad work is in your book.    mizzou is still reeling from their "great work" and their situation didn't require the attention of a supreme court

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/09/us/university-of-missouri-enrollment-protests-fallout.html

       "It was a moment of triumph for the protesting students. But it has been a disaster for the university.

Freshman enrollment at the Columbia campus, the system's flagship, has fallen by more than 35 percent in the two years since."

Not even remotely the same issues/concerns. Trust me, Marquette will not have to worry about freshman enrollment as a result of this Wisconsin Supreme Court decision.

One thing people seem to forget is that just because other people/organizations acted in the wrong in this situation that somehow excuses McAdams for all of his bad acts. Yes, the student-teacher acted incorrectly, so did the student, so did other professors, department chairs, and the review board....but that does nothing to excuse McAdam's continued and willful flaunting of his professional standards. If he had written about the incident in question in the context of academic speech (discussing whether there can be opposition to same-sex marriage at MU) and left all parties unidentified and/or chose not to criticize the student-teacher conduct there would have been no issue, or at least I would have fully supported McAdams in his complaint against MU should he have been disciplined.....but he did not leave that out.

I expect MU to correct the issues which it and it's personnel were responsible for but I also believe they were in the right to suspend McAdams and support them in their position.

[GGGG]

if being shot down by the state supreme court is great work, i'd hate to see what bad work is in your book.    mizzou is still reeling from their "great work" and their situation didn't require the attention of a supreme court

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/09/us/university-of-missouri-enrollment-protests-fallout.html

       "It was a moment of triumph for the protesting students. But it has been a disaster for the university.

Freshman enrollment at the Columbia campus, the system's flagship, has fallen by more than 35 percent in the two years since."

The fact that you would even equate these two situations shows that you don't know WTF you are talking about.

Marquette lost to a politicized court. Sign of the times. No more, no less.

[jesmu84]

For those of you with kids...

If he/she went to Marquette and ended up student teaching a class and doing everything exactly the same:

1. How would you feel about McAdams actions?
2. How would you feel about Marquette's actions?

[Herman Cain]

For those of you with kids...

If he/she went to Marquette and ended up student teaching a class and doing everything exactly the same:

1. How would you feel about McAdams actions?
2. How would you feel about Marquette's actions?

3. How would you feel if your kid was a student in Abbates class?

[GGGG]

3. How would you feel if your kid was a student in Abbates class?

Not good. I would hope that Marquette would evaluate and discipline her in the proper manner and not have a renegade professor take things into his own hands.

[Jay Bee]

Thank you, Professor McAdams, for your strength and courage. You were improperly treated by MU. Glad the Supreme Court understood that fact.

Shame on MU!

[Coleman]

Not good. I would hope that Marquette would evaluate and discipline her in the proper manner and not have a renegade professor take things into his own hands.

+1.

[jesmu84]

3. How would you feel if your kid was a student in Abbates class?

Why didn't you answer the question?

Is it absolutely necessary to deflect?

[Galway Eagle]

3. How would you feel if your kid was a student in Abbates class?

Pretty ashamed I raised a homophobic prick who illegally records his teachers.

[murara1994]

The fact that you would even equate these two situations shows that you don't know WTF you are talking about.

Marquette lost to a politicized court. Sign of the times. No more, no less.

Hey I know this is your game. But screaming "politics" every time a legal ruling comes down just because you disagree with it is not a good look. You may not be a lawyer, but at least attempt to engage with the reasoning and explain why you disagree. It's a pretty clear violation of McAdams' employment contract, whether you like him or not.

[muwarrior69]

Pretty ashamed I raised a homophobic prick who illegally records his teachers.

Because he opposed same sex marriage he is a homophobic prick? I would hope that is not Marquette's position as a Catholic institution. We can respect the LGBTQ person/community without condoning their behavior.

https://www.americamagazine.org/faith/2018/04/06/what-official-church-teaching-homosexuality-responding-commonly-asked-question

[StillAWarrior]

Pretty ashamed I raised a homophobic prick who illegally records his teachers.

Illegally?  How so?

[Galway Eagle]

Illegally?  How so?

Is Wisconsin not a state where you have to inform someone they're being recorded? I thought most were now. My bad if it's not.

[StillAWarrior]

Is Wisconsin not a state where you have to inform someone they're being recorded? I thought most were now. My bad if it's not.

No. That's a minority position. Thirty-eight states and DC (as well as federal law) allow recording a conversation with the consent of only one participant. If you're the one recording...obviously you've consented.

[Galway Eagle]

Because he opposed same sex marriage he is a homophobic prick? I would hope that is not Marquette's position as a Catholic institution. We can respect the LGBTQ person/community without condoning their behavior.

https://www.americamagazine.org/faith/2018/04/06/what-official-church-teaching-homosexuality-responding-commonly-asked-question

All of which is relevant in your church. Even I'm against being able to force a church to marry them. But as a country that practices the separation of church and state then being against homosexual couples obtaining the legal status of marriage to ensure visitation, insurance, etc. is homophobic.

This is where my point to Rocket, regarding race a few days ago, comes into play. It would seem that to your age group as long as you don't beat them up or say they all have AIDs etc you aren't homophobic, but the line isn't there anymore, now it's about equality and rights.

In the interest of not hijacking this I won't comment further but feel free to PM me if you'd like to have a discussion further.

[Galway Eagle]

No. That's a minority position. Thirty-eight states and DC (as well as federal law) allow recording a conversation with the consent of only one participant. If you're the one recording...obviously you've consented.

Interesting. Thanks for the information, I had been curious why this student wasn't punished for ages but now it makes sense

[StillAWarrior]

Interesting. Thanks for the information, I had been curious why this student wasn't punished for ages but now it makes sense

For the record, it might very well have been a violation of some policy/rule at Marquette (in my opinion it should be), but it wasn't illegal.

[GGGG]

Hey I know this is your game. But screaming "politics" every time a legal ruling comes down just because you disagree with it is not a good look. You may not be a lawyer, but at least attempt to engage with the reasoning and explain why you disagree. It's a pretty clear violation of McAdams' employment contract, whether you like him or not.

It is in no way a clear violation of his employment contract. Politics pure and simple.