Which team had the best chance to win it all?

[tower912]

It came up in the NBA thread.  Which team in the last 40 years had the best chance to win it all?  Final 4 team?  KO's sweet 16 team?  Crean's last team?  Buzz's first, before DJ got hurt?  Elite 8 team, if they could have got past Syracuse?

[Bocephys]

Feels like Buzz's first team, that DJ injury was crushing.  You also have to account for the likelihood of Buzz physically exploding down the stretch which diminishes the chances.

The realistic answer is the 03 team if everyone gets hot for two more games.

[Galway Eagle]

08-09 if DJ and Otule don't get hurt. No Otule wouldn't have been huge to this team but it was painfully obvious they were tiny and having him for even small stretches would've helped.

12-13 if Otule doesn't get hurt I think was our best team but as another stated, the field was ridiculously hard that year. They weren't beating Kentucky.

02-03 I was too young but if they got pasted by KU I can't imagine they would've dominated Cuse unless Novak just shot over the zone the entire time

93-94 Sounds like a great team, and look good on the YouTube videos. but wasn't Arkansas ridiculously good that year? Like Kentucky in 11-12 good? 

12-13 I had fun watching that team and they obviously captured some magic in the tournament but did anyone on here really feel that we were that good? I just feel like that team found magic ways to win but wasn't ever great.

[RushmoreAcademy]

I know we were a 6 seed but I loved our 2008 team.  If it weren't for the Lopez brothers I think we could have gone on a run.

[GGGG]

While I think MU's 2009 (pre DJ injury) and 2012 teams were better, I think the 2013 field wasn't as good.

2009 had that elite UNC team, plus a very solid Michigan State team to face in the semis. 

2012 would have had MU facing a Louisville team that handled them a couple weeks prior in the BET, and then would have had to face by far Cal's best UK team.

If MU could have gotten past Syracuse in 2013, they had a Michigan team in the semis that I think they could have handled, and then Louisville.  (Granted that Louisville team crushed them early in the year.)

[4everwarriors]

Buzz's team dat couldn't solve SU's zone had potential ta live large. Teams from 1999-2008 didn't have a competent head coach, sew no shot der, ai na?

[MarquetteDano]

If that 2002-3 team had Odartey Blankson then they had the best chance.  We already beat the best team in the tournament in Kentucky.

Imagine having Odartey that year.  He was a really good defender,  excellent in transition and could create his own shot.  I know KU blew us out of the water but that team still had the best chance.  Blankson's rebounding and defense would have been a big difference.

[MUBurrow]

Buzz's team dat couldn't solve SU's zone had potential ta live large.

12-13 I had fun watching that team and they obviously captured some magic in the tournament but did anyone on here really feel that we were that good? I just feel like that team found magic ways to win but wasn't ever great.

I think its this team. I know the 2003 final four team only needed two more wins than it got vs three, but I think that Kansas team and Melo's Cuse is a taller ask than beating Boeheim's zone to 60, then those Michigan and L'ville teams. An all time roster to win the natty wasn't a requirement in 2013.

Man that game still bums me out if i think about it too long. That squad had a real 'team of destiny' feel to it after squeaking by Davidson then beating the hell out of Miami.  Jamil should have absolutely been able to destroy that zone receiving entry passes at the free throw line, and it just didn't happen. IIRC, Davante ended up receiving those high post entries by the time the game was over.

[Eldon]

I forgot which year it was, but I LOVED the team that lost to Florida in the S16.  I had very very high hopes for that team.  Maybe not an NC, but definitely a Final Four.  I was "this close" to putting a lot of money on that team.  (Thankfully I didn't)

While my mind is on that team, I was especially disappointed in that game.  I remember thinking to myself that nobody wanted it.  It's like the team gave up.  They were satisfied with just being in the S16.  Big Shot Todd was the only dude who put his heart out there for that game.  Very uncharacteristic of a Bazz team.

[Herman Cain]

I liked the 2011-12 team.  The Florida loss was disappointing. The two things that held the team back were O'tule injury  and also Davante was out a big part of the conference season and when he came back was not healthy.  DJO and Jae were really in prime form.

[Galway Eagle]

I forgot which year it was, but I LOVED the team that lost to Florida in the S16.  I had very very high hopes for that team.  Maybe not an NC, but definitely a Final Four.  I was "this close" to putting a lot of money on that team.  (Thankfully I didn't)

While my mind is on that team, I was especially disappointed in that game.  I remember thinking to myself that nobody wanted it.  It's like the team gave up.  They were satisfied with just being in the S16.  Big Shot Todd was the only dude who put his heart out there for that game.  Very uncharacteristic of a Bazz team.

The moment Missouri lost to Norfolk state I knew we weren't gonna get past Florida. Matchup nightmare. I was looking forward to seeing DJO go against Denmon and Crowder against Ratcliff the entire season.

[Lennys Tap]

Hank's first year (1977-78) was exactly 40 years ago so I believe it qualifies. We were ranked #2 entering the tournament and returned 3 starters (Butch, Boylan and Whitehead) and the 6th man (who played "starter's minutes" in Bernard Toone from Al's championship team. IMO this was the last MU team with a legit shot at the title.

[tower912]

The 08-09 team until Dominic got hurt.  The 13 team against Syracuse..... Buzz had thrown his best wrinkle at Boeheim in the regular season with Davante and Chris in at the same time.  Jim was ready for the rematch.

[HammerScreen]

I think its this team. I know the 2003 final four team only needed two more wins than it got vs three, but I think that Kansas team and Melo's Cuse is a taller ask than beating Boeheim's zone to 60, then those Michigan and L'ville teams. An all time roster to win the natty wasn't a requirement in 2013.

Man that game still bums me out if i think about it too long. That squad had a real 'team of destiny' feel to it after squeaking by Davidson then beating the hell out of Miami.  Jamil should have absolutely been able to destroy that zone receiving entry passes at the free throw line, and it just didn't happen. IIRC, Davante ended up receiving those high post entries by the time the game was over.

The thing was, when we beat them at the BC Davante shredded them from that spot all night. Maybe we could have adjusted but we didn't hit anything that night. We shot 22.6%

[DienerTime34]

'08-'09 if James hadn't been injured. He had morphed into a dominant on-ball defender by that point. Boy, was that fun to watch.

[Goose]

'08-'09 team was pretty good and had chance to make some nice in March. Buzz's E8 team had a chance, IMO. They played with a chip on their shoulder and knew how to win.

[dgies9156]

Hank's first year (1977-78) was exactly 40 years ago so I believe it qualifies. We were ranked #2 entering the tournament and returned 3 starters (Butch, Boylan and Whitehead) and the 6th man (who played "starter's minutes" in Bernard Toone from Al's championship team. IMO this was the last MU team with a legit shot at the title.

Guys, I don't think there has been a team since 1978 that could have gone all the way. And 1978 was more suspect than we let on.

We lost to Miami of Ohio, the pre-Bird/Johnson equivalent of a 16 seed. We had a great team that year but we lost Bo Ellis to graduation in 1977 and I do think that mattered enormously. Bernard Toone, Ulice Payne and Odell Ball didn't make up for Bo. Period. We could have and should have beaten Miami of Ohio, but Kentucky that year was really tough, as was Notre Dame and I believe Duke and UNC.

We never should have let MIami of Ohio get anywhere near us. The closest they should have been was 0-0.

The 2003 team played the game of their lives in Minneapolis. In fact, that probably was St. Al of Brookfield's first miracle on the way to sainthood. The fact that they played the game of their lives was evident a week later when they played Kansas and got manhandled. To expect that team to run the table would be the equivalent of last year's team winning the Big East after defeating Villanova in Milwaukee.

Other than these two teams, the only other team that could have and should have run the table was the 1970-1971 team, which was screwed out of their shot by a group of bigoted, biased referees in Athens, GA against Ohio State. The 1974 team got very close but notwithstanding St. Al's two technicals (he spent time in Purgatory for that one), I question whether we would have beaten North Carolina State. David Thompson was incredible.

With the exception of the 1978 and 2003 teams, nobody was even close in the post-Al era.

[DCHoopster]

Guys, I don't think there has been a team since 1978 that could have gone all the way. And 1978 was more suspect than we let on.

We lost to Miami of Ohio, the pre-Bird/Johnson equivalent of a 16 seed. We had a great team that year but we lost Bo Ellis to graduation in 1977 and I do think that mattered enormously. Bernard Toone, Ulice Payne and Odell Ball didn't make up for Bo. Period. We could have and should have beaten Miami of Ohio, but Kentucky that year was really tough, as was Notre Dame and I believe Duke and UNC.

We never should have let MIami of Ohio get anywhere near us. The closest they should have been was 0-0.

The 2003 team played the game of their lives in Minneapolis. In fact, that probably was St. Al of Brookfield's first miracle on the way to sainthood. The fact that they played the game of their lives was evident a week later when they played Kansas and got manhandled. To expect that team to run the table would be the equivalent of last year's team winning the Big East after defeating Villanova in Milwaukee.

Other than these two teams, the only other team that could have and should have run the table was the 1970-1971 team, which was screwed out of their shot by a group of bigoted, biased referees in Athens, GA against Ohio State. The 1974 team got very close but notwithstanding St. Al's two technicals (he spent time in Purgatory for that one), I question whether we would have beaten North Carolina State. David Thompson was incredible.

With the exception of the 1978 and 2003 teams, nobody was even close in the post-Al era.

I would definitely agree with your assessment.  I was there thru all that,  the NIT championship team might have been good enough to get into the Final 4, and if it
was not for Ric Cobb making one free throw, they could have gotten to the Final 4 in that year.  Would not have beaten Lew Alcindor, though.  Just need to find the
next Jim Chones in Wisconsin, and that is not that easy.  As good as the Hauser boys can be, they are not in the same caliber of Chones.  The other issue would be,
if there was another Chones, would he pick MU in this era.   Herro did not.  Not putting him in Chones class, not close, but he picked a blue blood.  The new arena will
tell us how kids feel about playing in the best facility in the country, until the next one is built.

[GooooMarquette]

1. 1978
2. 2003
3. 2009

[Galway Eagle]

I would definitely agree with your assessment.  I was there thru all that,  the NIT championship team might have been good enough to get into the Final 4, and if it
was not for Ric Cobb making one free throw, they could have gotten to the Final 4 in that year.  Would not have beaten Lew Alcindor, though.  Just need to find the
next Jim Chones in Wisconsin, and that is not that easy.  As good as the Hauser boys can be, they are not in the same caliber of Chones.  The other issue would be,
if there was another Chones, would he pick MU in this era.   Herro did not.  Not putting him in Chones class, not close, but he picked a blue blood.  The new arena will
tell us how kids feel about playing in the best facility in the country, until the next one is built.

Ellenson picked MU... your question should be whether a player of that level would stay longer than a season

[brewcity77]

Depends on what you're looking at. The best road to a title was 2013. Michigan was beatable and while Louisville had trounced us, even I think Junior would've been better the second time around (he had more turnovers than points and assists combined).

The best team was 2009 before the DJ injury. As great as the Final Four team was, they couldn't play a lick of defense and Syracuse would've been just as problematic as Kansas was. 2009 was a brilliant offensive team with four legit scoring options. They also played enough defense to stay competitive.

I still believe that if DJ doesn't get injured, we go 26-5 (15-3), get the 2-seed in the BET and a likely Big East final appearance against Villanova or UConn. Win or lose, we'd have been a 1-seed in the NCAA Tournament in either the Midwest or West with a good shot at making the final.

[SaveOD238]

Hell, if the game in Boise against Missouri had gone our way we might have been looking at a decent path to the Final Four, plus another week to get DJ a little more healthy.  Memphis, then a rematch with UConn?  That was doable.

[DCHoopster]

Ellenson picked MU... your question should be whether a player of that level would stay longer than a season

I do not think Henry is close to the best players at MU.  Considering he has spent almost his first 2 years on the bench or in the D League, he is not making a difference
in the NBA.  Chones had a nice career and if Al let him finish his junior year he would be in the rafters.  As Al said, an "aircraft carrier", not sure there has been one since
Al's era, Maurice Lucas, was second.  Rob Jackson made a difference in the Final 4 era.  That is about it.  Jae Crowder or Lazar might be next and both played out of position.

[Benny B]

Depends on what you're looking at. The best road to a title was 2013. Michigan was beatable and while Louisville had trounced us, even I think Junior would've been better the second time around (he had more turnovers than points and assists combined).

The best team was 2009 before the DJ injury. As great as the Final Four team was, they couldn't play a lick of defense and Syracuse would've been just as problematic as Kansas was. 2009 was a brilliant offensive team with four legit scoring options. They also played enough defense to stay competitive.

I still believe that if DJ doesn't get injured, we go 26-5 (15-3), get the 2-seed in the BET and a likely Big East final appearance against Villanova or UConn. Win or lose, we'd have been a 1-seed in the NCAA Tournament in either the Midwest or West with a good shot at making the final.

Even if they weren't a 1-seed, not even Myron would have been picking against a healthy MU team in 2009.

[Galway Eagle]

I do not think Henry is close to the best players at MU.  Considering he has spent almost his first 2 years on the bench or in the D League, he is not making a difference
in the NBA.  Chones had a nice career and if Al let him finish his junior year he would be in the rafters.  As Al said, an "aircraft carrier", not sure there has been one since
Al's era, Maurice Lucas, was second.  Rob Jackson made a difference in the Final 4 era.  That is about it.  Jae Crowder or Lazar might be next and both played out of position.

Ah yes you're right a freshman that averaged 17 and 9.7 can't be that good because he's sitting on the bench in the NBA...  By your own logic Lazar can't be that good.

I'm not saying that he's one of the best all time players I'm saying those huge impact guys now actually play their freshman year and won't stick around to be Chones level guys. And yes even though you're extremely biased a 17 and nearly 10 player as a freshman certainly would've been on that level two years later but they don't stick around.

For reference Chones has a year to bulk up and get acclimated with the system and, I'm assuming, play other freshman teams(?) he averaged 17.9 and 11.5 sophomore year... that's awful similar to a freshman averaging 17 and 9.7