Keystone Pipeline Spill

[Hards Alumni]

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/11/16/564705368/keystone-pipeline-oil-spill-reported-in-south-dakota

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/16/us/keystone-pipeline-leak/index.html

Who could have predicted such a thing?

[jsglow]

"The section of pipe along a right-of-way approximately 35 miles (56 kilometres) south of the Ludden pump station in Marshall County, South Dakota was completely isolated with 15 minutes and emergency procedures were activated."

Pipeline failures happen but everything I have read tells me that they are still the safest way to transport petroleum products.  The Alaska pipeline, for example, has operated safely for longer than many on Scoop have been alive so there's that for a little perspective.  Now having pipelines across the Straits of Mackinac adjacent to the world's largest freshwater supply sounds potentially too risky to me but I'll venture to say none of us have ever been to this particular spot of land outside Amherst, SD, 200 miles north of Sioux Falls.  It'll get cleaned up.  And the farmer will be compensated for his lost crop of winter wheat.

And unless you rode a horse and buggy to work today.........

[Lennys Tap]

"The section of pipe along a right-of-way approximately 35 miles (56 kilometres) south of the Ludden pump station in Marshall County, South Dakota was completely isolated with 15 minutes and emergency procedures were activated."

Pipeline failures happen but everything I have read tells me that they are still the safest way to transport petroleum products.  The Alaska pipeline, for example, has operated safely for longer than many on Scoop have been alive so there's that for a little perspective.  Now having pipelines across the Straits of Mackinac adjacent to the world's largest freshwater supply sounds potentially too risky to me but I'll venture to say none of us have ever been to this particular spot of land outside Amherst, SD, 200 miles north of Sioux Falls.  It'll get cleaned up.  And the farmer will be compensated for his lost crop of winter wheat.

And unless you rode a horse and buggy to work today.........

Well said.

[Tugg Speedman]

"The section of pipe along a right-of-way approximately 35 miles (56 kilometres) south of the Ludden pump station in Marshall County, South Dakota was completely isolated with 15 minutes and emergency procedures were activated."

Pipeline failures happen but everything I have read tells me that they are still the safest way to transport petroleum products.  The Alaska pipeline, for example, has operated safely for longer than many on Scoop have been alive so there's that for a little perspective.  Now having pipelines across the Straits of Mackinac adjacent to the world's largest freshwater supply sounds potentially too risky to me but I'll venture to say none of us have ever been to this particular spot of land outside Amherst, SD, 200 miles north of Sioux Falls.  It'll get cleaned up.  And the farmer will be compensated for his lost crop of winter wheat.

And unless you rode a horse and buggy to work today.........

Here is the damage, a couple of hundred yards of oil on the ground.

It leaked for 15 minutes before it was shut down.  It will be cleaned up in a few weeks.  No lasting damage.

No story here, the system work as it should.



The alternative, as glow suggested, is to go back to horse and buggy or ship by rail.  Here is the problem with shipping by rail.

April 30, 2017, train derailment shipping crude in Money, Mississippi.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hz9LDNjMjGQ&feature=youtu.be
http://www.youtube.com/v/Hz9LDNjMjGQ&

I'll take pipeline spills any day of the week.

[jsglow]

I'm old enough to remember the protests over the Alaska pipeline.  One of the arguments at the time was that the elk would be afraid of it and wouldn't migrate.  Turned out they actually really, really like it because the oil is transported warm and it warms the micro-climate right around it so they follow the route at times and hang by it for grazing. 

[MUBurrow]

Reports have the spill in the same county as the Lake Traverse Reservation, but not directly on Sioux land. One of the biggest legal hurdles with pipeline approvals has been the interplay between with Native American sovereignty. For all parties involved, I really hope that all effects of the spill are isolated to non-tribal land.

From an environmental perspective, I understand that pipeline development and expansion remains a necessary evil to meet energy needs, but I'd like to see a condition attached to the approval of any fossil fuel expansion projects requiring substantial investment toward R&D in renewables.

[forgetful]

Here is the damage, a couple of hundred yards of oil on the ground.

It leaked for 15 minutes before it was shut down.  It will be cleaned up in a few weeks.  No lasting damage.

No story here, the system work as it should.



The alternative, as glow suggested, is to go back to horse and buggy or ship by rail.  Here is the problem with shipping by rail.

April 30, 2017, train derailment shipping crude in Money, Mississippi.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hz9LDNjMjGQ&feature=youtu.be
http://www.youtube.com/v/Hz9LDNjMjGQ&

I'll take pipeline spills any day of the week.

They haven't been able to look at if the oil has contaminated ground water.  If it did, they can't clean it up.  It will be contaminated and unusable for decades/centuries.  The people affected by it will have to move.  The property values in these sites is not permanently ruined. 

[Tugg Speedman]

They haven't been able to look at if the oil has contaminated ground water.  If it did, they can't clean it up.  It will be contaminated and unusable for decades/centuries.  The people affected by it will have to move.  The property values in these sites is not permanently ruined.

This is so over-the-top that it's laughable.  But it is not surprising coming from you because you think the criminal immoral activity is spelled 'Corporation."  This is why you cannot be taken seriously. 

The Latest: Company: Spill controlled and no public threat
http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/latest-federal-experts-south-dakota-oil-spill-51223228


Regarding

The people affected by it will have to move.  The property values in these sites is not permanently ruined.

Please look at the picture again ... who are these people that have to be moved?  The nearest town of Amherst SD is three miles away and has a population of ... 88!



Worst case, at $4,000 acre for farmland, they might have to pay maybe $100k for the ruined property that will take a century to clean up.

Wait, this just in we went from a century to weeks ....


TransCanada: Oil leak clean up will take several weeks
http://www.omaha.com/news/nebraska/crews-respond-to--gallon-oil-spill-from-keystone-pipeline/article_2894e16e-cb1b-11e7-86a9-e3a7396d2c8c.html

The 210,000-gallon spill — about one-third of the volume of an Olympic swimming pool — occurred on private agricultural land in Marshall County, northeast of Aberdeen. It was detected about 6 a.m. when an operator for TransCanada Corp. noticed a drop in pressure.

...

No streams or rivers have been contaminated

[forgetful]

This is so over-the-top that it's laughable.  But it is not surprising coming from you because you think the criminal immoral activity is spelled 'Corporation."  This is why you cannot be taken seriously. 

The Latest: Company: Spill controlled and no public threat
http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/latest-federal-experts-south-dakota-oil-spill-51223228


Regarding

The people affected by it will have to move.  The property values in these sites is not permanently ruined.

Please look at the picture again ... who are these people that have to be moved?  The nearest town of Amherst SD is three miles away and has a population of ... 88!



Worst case, at $4,000 acre for farmland, they might have to pay maybe $100k for the ruined property that will take a century to clean up.

Wait, this just in we went from a century to weeks ....


TransCanada: Oil leak clean up will take several weeks
http://www.omaha.com/news/nebraska/crews-respond-to--gallon-oil-spill-from-keystone-pipeline/article_2894e16e-cb1b-11e7-86a9-e3a7396d2c8c.html

The 210,000-gallon spill — about one-third of the volume of an Olympic swimming pool — occurred on private agricultural land in Marshall County, northeast of Aberdeen. It was detected about 6 a.m. when an operator for TransCanada Corp. noticed a drop in pressure.

...

No streams or rivers have been contaminated

You repeatedly make unjustified claims like me believing "criminal immoral activity is spelled corporation".  I've said before that at no time have I ever made such statements, nor is their anything that suggests I believe that.  But you very rarely have anything logical to say, so instead attack the poster. 

Now, lets talk property values.  The owners of this land now have to disclose that the land had an oil leak from a underground pipeline.  That must be disclosed to any potential buyer.  If you know anything about property values, that essentially makes the land unsellable, as the owner is liable for any problems associated with the leak moving forward.

Yes, no lakes or streams were affected...yet.  But that is drastically different from ground water contamination.  They do not know if ground water was affected.  If so, that can spread a long ways and render ground water nearly permanently undrinkable.  That is a problem.

You ignore it.

[Tugg Speedman]

You repeatedly make unjustified claims like me believing "criminal immoral activity is spelled corporation".  I've said before that at no time have I ever made such statements, nor is their anything that suggests I believe that.  But you very rarely have anything logical to say, so instead attack the poster. 

Now, lets talk property values.  The owners of this land now have to disclose that the land had an oil leak from a underground pipeline.  That must be disclosed to any potential buyer.  If you know anything about property values, that essentially makes the land unsellable, as the owner is liable for any problems associated with the leak moving forward.

Yes, no lakes or streams were affected...yet.  But that is drastically different from ground water contamination.  They do not know if ground water was affected.  If so, that can spread a long ways and render ground water nearly permanently undrinkable.  That is a problem.

You ignore it.

It is private farmland and the owner will be compensated.  He owns thousands of acres and this is a tiny percentage.  The pipeline easement also has to be disclosed as well. Not sure your point here.

Yes, the groundwater was contaminated, what that means is to be determined.  But for now assume, not much.

And in every debate here, from healthcare to minimum wage, to this debate you have made your views that businesses are criminal organizations has been painfully clear.

[rocket surgeon]

Reports have the spill in the same county as the Lake Traverse Reservation, but not directly on Sioux land. One of the biggest legal hurdles with pipeline approvals has been the interplay between with Native American sovereignty. For all parties involved, I really hope that all effects of the spill are isolated to non-tribal land.

From an environmental perspective, I understand that pipeline development and expansion remains a necessary evil to meet energy needs, but I'd like to see a condition attached to the approval of any fossil fuel expansion projects requiring substantial investment toward R&D in renewables.

i hope the spill and it's affects are isolated, from all lands including tribal land.  from an environmental perspective, this pipeline has been studied for 5 years by the state department and they have come to the conclusion that it is safe.  is it perfect?  as glow stated above, it certainly is more safe than other modes of transportation.  let's be honest, our fossil fuels need a form a transport.  it is being carried out far more than most people realize-

http://www.pipeline101.com/Where-Are-Pipelines-Located


investments already have been and continue to be made into R & D.  guys like jeff bezos, paul allen, richard branson, etc could take this to the next level if there were money to be made.  as we saw over the last 8 years, our tax money that went toward many solar companies (solyndra, sungevity, beamrich, to name a few)  that eventually went bankrupt.  in my opinion, that was our tax payer money laundered to political cronies which accomplished nothing except to make some well connected people very rich without consequences

yes to R & D, but with very very limited government involvement AND hold those who do get subsidies accountable

[Hards Alumni]

i hope the spill and it's affects are isolated, from all lands including tribal land.  from an environmental perspective, this pipeline has been studied for 5 years by the state department and they have come to the conclusion that it is safe.  is it perfect?  as glow stated above, it certainly is more safe than other modes of transportation.  let's be honest, our fossil fuels need a form a transport.  it is being carried out far more than most people realize-

http://www.pipeline101.com/Where-Are-Pipelines-Located


investments already have been and continue to be made into R & D.  guys like jeff bezos, paul allen, richard branson, etc could take this to the next level if there were money to be made.  as we saw over the last 8 years, our tax money that went toward many solar companies (solyndra, sungevity, beamrich, to name a few)  that eventually went bankrupt.  in my opinion, that was our tax payer money laundered to political cronies which accomplished nothing except to make some well connected people very rich without consequences

yes to R & D, but with very very limited government involvement AND hold those who do get subsidies accountable

you were so close man.  so close.

[rocket surgeon]

you were so close man.  so close.

That made me laugh, but thank you.  Dang it though. I thought I had ya. What if I took out the last 8 years part ? 

[Hards Alumni]

That made me laugh, but thank you.  Dang it though. I thought I had ya. What if I took out the last 8 years part ? 

I meant, it just gets silly at that point.  There are giveaways all over government.  Focusing on solar is silly.  Especially considering the strides that were made in the last decade.