ESPN Has Lost Its Mind

[Tugg Speedman]

Why is it stupid to apologize to offended customers?

Ok, going political and probably get this thread locked but it needs to be said ... why do you think Trump's approval rating went up after Charlottesville.  Yes, it went up.  And a majority of the public agreed with him on statues, even African Americans.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-pershing-and-persuasion-1503091778?mod=djemBestOfTheWeb
For example, an NPR/PBS NewsHour/Marist Poll finds that even a survey sample that gives Mr. Trump his standard lousy approval rating overwhelmingly agrees with the President that statues of Confederate leaders should not be torn down. Even a plurality of African-Americans agrees that the statues should remain in place as symbols of our history.

These findings suggest that most Americans realize, as a Journal editorial noted, that tearing down statues does nothing to address their daily economic or educational challenges. Or perhaps they have a healthy instinctual opposition to making rapid societal changes at the behest of a shouting crowd. This column thinks that some of the Confederate statues should come down, but in a deliberative democratic process.

Point is the public has had it with this extreme PC culture where they have to constantly apologize to the aggrieved as they perceived every action as a slight and get offended. 

None of the things noted above we meant as insults.  So don't act like they were and apologize.

There is nothing wrong with Robert Lee doing the UVa game, nothing wrong with noting that Venus Williams was using Guerilla tactics and nothing wrong with a fantasy football draft/action.  So stop acting like it was.

[GGGG]

And another level of stupidity from the worldwide leader in sports ... just last week.

ESPN apologizes for fantasy football segment compared to slave auction
Tue August 15, 2017
http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/15/us/espn-fantasy-football-auction/index.html

ESPN apologized on Tuesday for a fantasy football segment of an auction draft where black players were sold to mostly white male bidders.

"Auction drafts are a common part of fantasy football, and ESPN's segments replicated an auction draft with a diverse slate of top professional football players," the network statement said.

"Without that context, we understand the optics could be portrayed as offensive, and we apologize."

On social media, reaction to the segment that was part of the 28-hour fantasy marathon was mixed, with many comparing the outdoor scene to a modern-day slave auction.

New York journalist Shaun King tweeted video of the auction with the message, "Apologize now for doing a sketch where you auctioned a black man off to the highest bidder."

Watch black players auctioned to rich white guys on ESPN.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4asglSLdWRU
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/4asglSLdWRU" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/4asglSLdWRU</a>

Yes.  It was stupid for them to have an auction like this.

[Pakuni]

Ok, going political and probably get this thread locked but it needs to be said ... why do you think Trump's approval rating went up after Charlottesville.  Yes, it went up.

What if I were to tell you your entire premise is wrong. Three separate polls show Trump's approval hit new lows after Charlottesville.

President Donald Trump’s approval rating has hit a new low following a week in which a majority of voters believe he did more to divide the country than unite it, a new POLITICO/Morning Consult poll shows.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/08/23/trump-charlottesville-polls-241917

Even before Bannon bounced, the data suggest his hardcore support was starting to erode. According to polling done by Rasmussen Reports, 42 percent of Americans “strongly approved” of Trump shortly after Inauguration Day. By the beginning of June, that figure had come down to 30 percent, while 43 percent strongly disapproved. Today, only 24 percent of respondents to the same survey support him unreservedly.
http://www.newsweek.com/trump-base-shrinking-polls-kelly-charlottesville-bannon-racism-652182

http://www.gallup.com/opinion/polling-matters/216125/trump-job-approval-rating-new-low.aspx

President Donald Trump's job approval rating in Gallup Daily tracking is at 34% for the three-day period from Friday through Sunday -- by one point the lowest of his administration so far.
http://www.gallup.com/opinion/polling-matters/216125/trump-job-approval-rating-new-low.aspx

[Tugg Speedman]

What if I were to tell you your entire premise is wrong. Three separate polls show Trump's approval hit new lows after Charlottesville.

President Donald Trump’s approval rating has hit a new low following a week in which a majority of voters believe he did more to divide the country than unite it, a new POLITICO/Morning Consult poll shows.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/08/23/trump-charlottesville-polls-241917

Even before Bannon bounced, the data suggest his hardcore support was starting to erode. According to polling done by Rasmussen Reports, 42 percent of Americans “strongly approved” of Trump shortly after Inauguration Day. By the beginning of June, that figure had come down to 30 percent, while 43 percent strongly disapproved. Today, only 24 percent of respondents to the same survey support him unreservedly.
http://www.newsweek.com/trump-base-shrinking-polls-kelly-charlottesville-bannon-racism-652182

http://www.gallup.com/opinion/polling-matters/216125/trump-job-approval-rating-new-low.aspx

President Donald Trump's job approval rating in Gallup Daily tracking is at 34% for the three-day period from Friday through Sunday -- by one point the lowest of his administration so far.
http://www.gallup.com/opinion/polling-matters/216125/trump-job-approval-rating-new-low.aspx

Those polls measured his rating BEFORE Charlottesville.

See his rating at the end of last week, it was higher than the week before.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

First, approval ratings are delayed. Taking an approval rating for today is actually a reflection of actions from a few days to a week ago. If you look at the most recent ratings from Gallup (August 21), Trump has tied his all time low. What happened a few days to a week ago from August 21st? Trump's third response to Charlottesville in which he went back on his second response and reaffirmed his first response.

Second, you were tripping all over yourself a few months ago trying to get the NFL to do the PC thing and do whatever it took to silence Kaepernick because of "a shouting crowd." So which is it?

Finally, intent doesn't matter. It never matters. You could have the best of intentions but your impact  on someone could still be negative. Best course of action for a business is to apologize for offending, explain what the intent was, and move on.

The real question becomes why does the fact that Robert Lee is going to do the Virginia Tech game instead of the Virginia game (a game that no one was going to watch anyway) bother so many people? Why does ESPN issuing a two second apology for offending bother so many people? The firing one, that one I understand, a man lost his job (though you wanted Kaepernick to lose his job because the masses demanded it).

The answer to the real question?:

[mu03eng]

It is stupid what ESPN did, full stop. What makes it galatically stupid is that they made it an issue and then in their statement complained about doing something because it was made an issue. It's a real circular firing squad on this one.

And how far have we fallen as a society that we are making decisions based on whether something gets meme'd or not?

SMOD2017

[Pakuni]

Those polls measured his rating BEFORE Charlottesville.

No, they didn't. You would know this if you took the time to actually read the links.

Link #1
Only 39 percent of voters approve of the job Trump is doing in this week’s poll — conducted entirely following the president’s various scripted and impromptu reactions to the violence in Charlottesville, Virginia — down from 44 percent just a week ago.

Link #2
Published Aug. 14, tracking rating over Aug. 12-13. The Charlottesville rally occurred Aug. 11-12.

Link #3
Published Aug. 18.
Today, only 24 percent of respondents to the same survey support him unreservedly.

See his rating at the end of last week, it was higher than the week before.

Source?

[Tugg Speedman]

April 17, 2015
Why do so many ESPN personalities get suspended?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/why-do-so-many-espn-personalities-get-suspended/2015/04/17/aa9beb70-e483-11e4-905f-cc896d379a32_story.html?utm_term=.d27ddbbff88a

ESPN, the self-styled “Worldwide Leader” in sports broadcasting, may also lead the news media in another category: the number of employees suspended or fired for doing or saying something boneheaded.

The cable network has a long and storied history of sending its reporters, hosts and producers to the sidelines after embarrassing episodes that grabbed headlines. The list includes some of ESPN’s best-known personalities, including Bill Simmons, Dan Le Batard, Stephen A. Smith and Keith Olbermann. And that’s just in the past year or so.

At ESPN, you apparently haven’t arrived until your boss tells you to stay home.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

It is stupid what ESPN did, full stop. What makes it galatically stupid is that they made it an issue and then in their statement complained about doing something because it was made an issue. It's a real circular firing squad on this one.

And how far have we fallen as a society that we are making decisions based on whether something gets meme'd or not?

SMOD2017

It was dumb. I understand the thought process. If it doesn't get leaked, nobody notices and no potential issue. But in today's world it was going to get leaked and they should have known that. I will join in others who want to laugh at ESPN for this. But those get genuinely angry about it? That  doesn't make sense to me.

[GGGG]

It is stupid what ESPN did, full stop. What makes it galatically stupid is that they made it an issue and then in their statement complained about doing something because it was made an issue. It's a real circular firing squad on this one.

And how far have we fallen as a society that we are making decisions based on whether something gets meme'd or not?

SMOD2017

http://deadspin.com/welp-espn-shot-itself-in-the-dick-1798338890

"Which is ironic in its way, because this decision is as apolitical as decisions get. ESPN is not liberal, and it’s not conservative; it’s a massive company with no political beliefs beyond damage control. Someone had the idea of switching Lee off the UVa game not because they thought it would be offensive, but because of the prospect of some hypothetical viewer being offended by seeing an Asian-American broadcaster with a hyper-common name similar to that of the Confederate general. Whether this hypothetical viewer exists or not (they don’t) is almost beside the point; true corporate cowardice requires a bland, compulsive aversion to controversy so strong that it loses touch with reality. And as so often happens, the blowback winds up being much, much worse than the nonexistent scenario ESPN hoped to avoid."

[Pakuni]

It is stupid what ESPN did, full stop. What makes it galatically stupid is that they made it an issue and then in their statement complained about doing something because it was made an issue. It's a real circular firing squad on this one.

And how far have we fallen as a society that we are making decisions based on whether something gets meme'd or not?

SMOD2017

I agree this is remarkably stupid of them.
That said, in all  fairness to ESPN, they didn't make this an issue. They didn't announce the change, to the best of my knowledge. They didn't publicize it in any way. Heck, I'm not even sure if they had ever announced that Lee would call the game in the first place.

[mu03eng]

Finally, intent doesn't matter. It never matters. You could have the best of intentions but your impact  on someone could still be negative. Best course of action for a business is to apologize for offending, explain what the intent was, and move on.

Time out, intent does matter if we expect to have productive conversations that allow all sides to engage. If I say something unknowingly that offends the person I'm talking to, yes I need to apologize but the receiver of that information needs to recognize the intent and educate as well. To say intent doesn't matter is a bridge too far IMO

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

April 17, 2015
Why do so many ESPN personalities get suspended?

Easy, they are the most watched and cared about new source in America (sad I know). With the title comes the most scrutiny and the highest expectations.

[mu03eng]

I agree this is remarkably stupid of them.
That said, in all  fairness to ESPN, they didn't make this an issue. They didn't announce the change. They didn't publicize it in any way. Heck, I'm not even sure if they had ever announced that Lee would call the game in the first place.

No, ESPN absolutely announced the change, they put out a PR statement which is what started this in  the first place.

(full willing to walk back my statement here if I have the story wrong, but the first time I became aware of it was seeing the PR statement from ESPN on twitter last night)

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Time out, intent does matter if we expect to have productive conversations that allow all sides to engage. If I say something unknowingly that offends the person I'm talking to, yes I need to apologize but the receiver of that information needs to recognize the intent and educate as well. To say intent doesn't matter is a bridge too far IMO

I might have phrased it poorly. But your good intent doesn't change or minimize the negative impact it had on someone else. Basic communications theory, SMCR. If there is a fault with the message, it is always the sender's fault, not the receiver's.

PS, I'm talking about big business and media here. Not one to one conversations.

[Tugg Speedman]

Finally, intent doesn't matter. It never matters. You could have the best of intentions but your impact on someone could still be negative. Best course of action for a business is to apologize for offending, explain what the intent was, and move on.

So my words no longer have meaning.  All that matters is what other perceive them to be.  And the most offended is the meaning that matters the most ... no matter how contrived it may be.


This is exactly the problem and what many are rebelling against.  This viewpoint is wrong.

[Pakuni]

No, ESPN absolutely announced the change, they put out a PR statement which is what started this in  the first place.

(full willing to walk back my statement here if I have the story wrong, but the first time I became aware of it was seeing the PR statement from ESPN on twitter last night)

I believe ESPN put out the statement only after news of the change was published on Outkick the Coverage (and perhaps elsewhere).

As you can see on the Outkick the Coverage story, the ESPN statement was added on as an "update" after the initial story was posted. The initial story cites as its source "multiple Outkick fans inside ESPN MSESPN."
https://www.outkickthecoverage.com/msespn-pulls-asian-announcer-named-robert-lee-off-uva-game-avoid-offending-idiots/

[GGGG]

So my words no longer have meaning.

We have been trying to tell you that for awhile now.

[Tugg Speedman]

No, ESPN absolutely announced the change, they put out a PR statement which is what started this in  the first place.

(full willing to walk back my statement here if I have the story wrong, but the first time I became aware of it was seeing the PR statement from ESPN on twitter last night)

Correct

ESPN started this by announcing the change and the reason for the change.  ESPN could have just made the change with saying anything and no one would have noticed.  No one was asking or thinking about this.

Instead, they put out a release announcing the change so they can make a statement about themself and how they care and are morally superior to everyone else.

[GGGG]

Correct

ESPN started this by announcing the change and the reason for the change.  ESPN could have just made the change with saying anything and no one would have noticed.  No one was asking or thinking about this.

Instead, they put out a release announcing the change so they can make a statement about themself and how they care and are morally superior to everyone else.

That's simply not true.  Here is the story from Outkick the Coverage...first original paragraph.

"n a story that seems made for The Onion, but is actually true, according to multiple Outkick fans inside ESPN MSESPN decided to pull an Asian college football announcer named Robert Lee off the William and Mary at University of Virginia college football game because they were concerned that having an ASIAN FOOTBALL ANNOUNCER NAMED ROBERT LEE would be offensive to some viewers."

[Pakuni]

Correct

ESPN started this by announcing the change and the reason for the change.  ESPN could have just made the change with saying anything and no one would have noticed.  No one was asking or thinking about this.

Instead, they put out a release announcing the change so they can make a statement about themself and how they care and are morally superior to everyone else.

No, wrong.
Outkick the Coverage reported it at 3:14 p.m. Tuesday afternoon, according to its Twitter feed.
ESPN issued its statement Tuesday night.

[Tugg Speedman]

Easy, they are the most watched and cared about new source in America (sad I know). With the title comes the most scrutiny and the highest expectations.

You mean it's not the Russians posting fake news on Facebook?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

So my words no longer have meaning.  All that matters is what other perceive them to be.  And the most offended is the meaning that matters the most ... no matter how contrived it may be.


This is exactly the problem and what many are rebelling against.  This viewpoint is wrong.

No your words matter.  You are a consumer of ESPN.

I'm not talking about person to person communication.  I'm talking about business/media to consumer communication.  If the consumer doesn't like or doesn't understand the message you put out,  they aren't bad consumers.  You (the business) sent out a bad or unclear message. Public Relations 101.

[mu03eng]

I believe ESPN put out the statement only after news of the change was published on Outkick the Coverage (and perhaps elsewhere).

As you can see on the Outkick the Coverage story, the ESPN statement was added on as an "update" after the initial story was posted. The initial story cites as its source "multiple Outkick fans inside ESPN MSESPN."
https://www.outkickthecoverage.com/msespn-pulls-asian-announcer-named-robert-lee-off-uva-game-avoid-offending-idiots/

OK fair, so it was dumb to make the change....the rest was reactionary so I get it. I thought they announced the change which was the galatically stupid part to me....moving on.

[jsglow]