Who Does MU Compete With For Students?

[dgies9156]

If a student can do Marquette work, has the grades and ACT/SAT to get into Marquette, they may be considering at least one other Catholic school, but I'll bet my last dollar, they're also looking at one or more state schools.

Pool MU's incoming class and I promise Rodentland, Herky the Turkey, Goldie and/or The Chief all were substantial options. Administration can delude itself into believing they don't compete against large state schools, but they do.

If the Northeast decline is true, then the basketball team better accelerate its ascent into the cream of college basketball. I'll bet anything there's a strong correlation between a good basketball program and interest from students in New England and the Mid-Atlantic states.

The fact that admissions is thinking of Marquette's appeal as a regional, close to home option is sad.

[warriorchick]

The fact that admissions is thinking of Marquette's appeal as a regional, close to home option is sad.

Who said that? 

[The Lens]

I think it's hilarious that for the past 10 years we've started to pretend that MU is this great academic school and then "bigwigs" claim our closest competition is Dayton.  Next to Iowa, that's America's safety school.  Dayton.  OMG. Dayton.  Adding Lacrosse, joining the Big East, all the new construction and what do we get...Dayton.

[warriorchick]

I think it's hilarious that for the past 10 years we've started to pretend that MU is this great academic school and then "bigwigs" claim our closest competition is Dayton.  Next to Iowa, that's America's safety school.  Dayton.  OMG. Dayton.  Adding Lacrosse, joining the Big East, all the new construction and what do we get...Dayton.

I am sure I have been in way more meetings with Marquette administrators where admissions was discussed than Yukon, and Dayton was never mentioned in terms of competition.  Just because he struck up a conversation with a couple of fundraising people at a party doesn't mean he has accurate facts.

[Tugg Speedman]

I am sure I have been in way more meetings with Marquette administrators where admissions was discussed than Yukon, and Dayton was never mentioned in terms of competition.  Just because he struck up a conversation with a couple of fundraising people at a party doesn't mean he has accurate facts.

That's why I asked if these stats were surprising.  Frankly Dayton surprised me too.

So who is MUs competition for students?

And do you agree with the geographical breakdown inthe first post?

And do you agree that kids self-select themselves into state schools or catholic/Jesuit schools meaning their is largely two different pools of kids?

[The Lens]

I'm guessing Admissions will say Georgetown, BC, SLU, maybe Holy Cross or Fairleigh Dickinson.

I also think MU kids consider big state schools because those schools , like Marquette, represent a certain physical / emotional / financial investment in education rather than just running off to the nearest extension school. 

[Coleman]

University of Oregon, OSU, University of Portland, and MU. MU it was and never regretted my decision, although a football team would have been nice. Also had never experienced private/Catholic education up to that point. Am indebted to the Jesuits - Zeps, Leahy and Donnelly, in particular.

You were a history major too eh?

[Tugg Speedman]

I'm guessing Admissions will say Georgetown, BC, SLU, maybe Holy Cross or Fairleigh Dickinson.

I also think MU kids consider big state schools because those schools represent a certain physic / emotional / financial investment in education rather than just running off to the nearest extension school.

If 60% of MU students are from WI or the Chicago area, I don't the majority could name the town or even the state where FDU or HC is located.

Georgetown is academically i the range of ND and Northwestern, that makes MU a safety school.

BC is one of the most expensive schools in the country, if you have to ask the price of tuition, don't bother with BC.

I don't think these schools are are MUs biggest competition for Students.

[Tugg Speedman]

I think it's hilarious that for the past 10 years we've started to pretend that MU is this great academic school and then "bigwigs" claim our closest competition is Dayton.  Next to Iowa, that's America's safety school.  Dayton.  OMG. Dayton.  Adding Lacrosse, joining the Big East, all the new construction and what do we get...Dayton.

The United States has 4200 colleges and Universities. They have 18 million students mening they are graduating over 4 million a year.

USNWR has MU in the top 80, or the top 2% of all colleges/universities.  That ranks MU in the to 2% of the 4+ million that graduated every year.

So yes, MU is an elite institution. In a county of 320 million it has a few hundred elite institutions.

[jsglow]

If a student can do Marquette work, has the grades and ACT/SAT to get into Marquette, they may be considering at least one other Catholic school, but I'll bet my last dollar, they're also looking at one or more state schools.

Pool MU's incoming class and I promise Rodentland, Herky the Turkey, Goldie and/or The Chief all were substantial options. Administration can delude itself into believing they don't compete against large state schools, but they do.

If the Northeast decline is true, then the basketball team better accelerate its ascent into the cream of college basketball. I'll bet anything there's a strong correlation between a good basketball program and interest from students in New England and the Mid-Atlantic states.

The fact that admissions is thinking of Marquette's appeal as a regional, close to home option is sad.

I've served for years in various capacities and am pretty sure I've not heard that once.  Candidly, the truth is that Admissions believes they've mined the local area as effectively as they can (although one year of the new targeted applications model has seemingly helped) and recognize that a declining midwest population base now forces them to recruit move heavily at a distance.  While not exclusive, I can assure you that many resources are now pointed west.  Our competition; Creighton, among many others.

[jsglow]

And if any of you don't think it's tough out there.......

http://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/post-tribune/news/ct-saint-josephs-college-temporary-closing-20170203-story.html

Temporary my arse.

[Herman Cain]

I've served for years in various capacities and am pretty sure I've not heard that once.  Candidly, the truth is that Admissions believes they've mined the local area as effectively as they can (although one year of the new targeted applications model has seemingly helped) and recognize that a declining midwest population base now forces them to recruit move heavily at a distance.  While not exclusive, I can assure you that many resources are now pointed west.  Our competition; Creighton, among many others.

The big strategic mistake MU is making in the northeast is not showing up at the respected public high schools. I have written on this in the super bar. There are lots of good candidates , who will actually attend,if we just make ourselves known in the guidance counselor offices year after year. if we can get one family we can get multiple families over time.

[jsglow]

The big strategic mistake MU is making in the northeast is not showing up at the respected public high schools. I have written on this in the super bar. There are lots of good candidates , who will actually attend,if we just make ourselves known in the guidance counselor offices year after year. if we can get one family we can get multiple families over time.

I think earlier in this thread someone mentioned the somewhat similar schools (let's use Nova for example) that one must pass by on the way from those eastern public schools you describe.  I'm certainly no expert and I respect your opinion on the matter but I sense MU does not see the bang for the buck in that model. 

Let me try to draw a comparison.  Say a Catholic kid in Phoenix or Vegas is making his decision and is choosing among MU, Creighton, and Gonzaga.  All are fairly long plane rides.  We've got a real shot at that candidate.  The greater the likelihood of success, the more resource dollars.

[jsglow]

The big strategic mistake MU is making in the northeast is not showing up at the respected public high schools. I have written on this in the super bar. There are lots of good candidates , who will actually attend,if we just make ourselves known in the guidance counselor offices year after year. if we can get one family we can get multiple families over time.

I do agree with this wholeheartedly.

[drewm88]

I came from a Catholic school in Wisconsin (not near Milwaukee). City size was the most important factor to me, so I only applied to MU, Minnesota, and Loyola. Legitimate athletics was probably factor #2.

[Tugg Speedman]

The big strategic mistake MU is making in the northeast is not showing up at the respected public high schools. I have written on this in the super bar. There are lots of good candidates , who will actually attend,if we just make ourselves known in the guidance counselor offices year after year. if we can get one family we can get multiple families over time.

To apply with glow said before,  the northeast is A declining population (especially New England) and producing ever smaller pools of applicants each year.

It makes more sense if you're going to go any distance from Milwaukee to go west rather than east. And probably go south rather than north.

[🏀]

Sorry I'm late.

Anyone but Dayton.

[Marqevans]

Have to think ND is a pretty big competitor for Chicago kids

[MUBurrow]

I think there's a difference between who MU is "competing with" and the schools that have a lot of overlap with MU applicants.  I would guess that half of the MU attendees from WI (especially from public high schools) also apply to UW-Madison. Same with Chicago kids and Iowa/U of I. But I don't think that means MU is necessarily "competing" with UW-Madison, Iowa, or Illinois. 

If applicants are drawn to the large, big ten state college, there's only so much MU can do to try and convince them to attend MU instead.  I think that to "compete" with other schools, they have to be similar enough in profile that discrete changes in policy, offerings, profile can make a real difference. When you look at the growth MU is envisioning in its master planning, maybe they want to expand to the point where there is real competition with public U's in the future, but I don't think we're there now.

[jsglow]

I think there's a difference between who MU is "competing with" and the schools that have a lot of overlap with MU applicants.  I would guess that half of the MU attendees from WI (especially from public high schools) also apply to UW-Madison. Same with Chicago kids and Iowa/U of I. But I don't think that means MU is necessarily "competing" with UW-Madison, Iowa, or Illinois. 

If applicants are drawn to the large, big ten state college, there's only so much MU can do to try and convince them to attend MU instead.  I think that to "compete" with other schools, they have to be similar enough in profile that discrete changes in policy, offerings, profile can make a real difference. When you look at the growth MU is envisioning in its master planning, maybe they want to expand to the point where there is real competition with public U's in the future, but I don't think we're there now.

Well put. Agreed.

[buckchuckler]

In my case, obviously my choice was MU, but my runner up was DePaul, followed by Dayton.  I did apply to some big state colleges  (UofI, Purdue), but they really didn't really appeal to me.  I guess I am pretty much a case study. 

[muwarrior69]

And my guess is that most of your school mates went to Catholic high schools...

Can't say for my school mates, but I actually went to public school here in New Jersey.

[GGGG]

To apply with glow said before,  the northeast is A declining population (especially New England) and producing ever smaller pools of applicants each year.

It makes more sense if you're going to go any distance from Milwaukee to go west rather than east. And probably go south rather than north.

New England has 14 million people and isn't declining in population. 

[warriorchick]

New England has 14 million people and isn't declining in population.

We don't want anyone from there.

[shoothoops]

Interesting topic. Two cents:

I had a good MU experience. MU was more of a fall back choice only because my preference was on the coasts for a different experience as I was from the Midwest. But unexpected family situation changed that.

I had some smaller division athletic opportunities but only had D-1 on mind at the time.  It worked out ok & I was able to get to the coasts after MU. 

For some reason I had medium sized school in my head when choosing & MU fit that. I had an older sibling attend MU so I had some familiarity, yet I like to do my own thing. In hindsight 8k students was a little small for my personality type/temperament. Maybe mid teens would have been better for me. But I was never interested in the big state school thing, smaller towns, Greek life, just not me. 

Dayton at the time was comparable to MU but less favorably for academics, equally to more for partying.  Interestingly enough SLU's current few year President was a 24yr academic at Dayton. 

I had some ND friends, some liked it and some did not. A few recruited for sports turned them down.  One of my brother's chose Vanderbilt over Boston College. He did not get into ND, and he likely would have gone.  He had a good experience at Vandy. Vandy's Chancellor Nick Zeppos is from Milwaukee, he went to both undergrad and law school at Madison. He is good.

A few mentioned Washington University in St. Louis, or Wash U as its known.  That school is similar to U of Chicago a little bit from a culture standpoint and academically, with a location more like Northwestern. They even compete in same conference with U Chicago in d-3 sports.

I would also add that I hope MU continues to diversify its student body geographically, racially, religiously, etc...It is too heavy from just a few geographies and I would like to see double digit percentages of several other races too. Just my opinion.