No shows

[Golden Avalanche]

The BE is watered down and nowhere near the excitement level with new BE. I'll take playing UConn and Syracuse over Creighton and Butler any day of the week.

Conference has the National Champions and four teams currently considered amongst the 15 best in the country.

As I wrote a month ago about all the teeth gnashing around the MU program, the flames are fanned by those who will die soon and feel they are entitled to the program on their own terms rather then the terms of reality.

[Newsdreams]

Can both of you put each other on ignore and be done with the bickering?

+ infinity

[wadesworld]

I know you two are talking about AP rankings at the time of the game but it got me thinking so I did some research on Kenpom. This is based off year end rankings and the last two columns are how many HOME games we played against top 10 and top 25 teams each season. Obviously the 2017 numbers are projections at this point.

Year	Conf	Rank	Rating	Top 10	Top 25
2002	CUSA	7	8.12	1	1
2003	CUSA	7	7.65	1	3
2004	CUSA	8	7.02	0	2
2005	CUSA	9	6.94	1	3
2006	BE	1	13.94	1	3
2007	BE	5	13.55	1	4
2008	BE	4	13.21	2	4
2009	BE	2	15.25	1	4
2010	BE	3	15.01	0	2
2011	BE	2	16.44	2	6
2012	BE	3	12.72	0	3
2013	BE	2	13.77	1	4
2014	BE	5	12.24	0	3
2015	BE	2	14.23	2	5
2016	BE	3	13.92	1	3
2017	BE	3	14.75	2	5

2010 was quite the anomaly because we only played the top teams in the Big East (Syracuse, West Virginia) on the road that year. The conference had an amazing three year run culminating with 2011 and it really struggled the first year after realignment (2014) but overall we're pretty lucky to still be in such a great conference. I know some of the schools that left have bigger fan bases so it added to the excitement of those home games but in terms of the quality of the teams coming to Milwaukee, we're doing pretty well.

Great research.  Thanks for providing this.

The current Big East is just fine.  And the bottom half of the BE is much stronger than it was in its former alignment.

[naginiF]

Conference has the National Champions and four teams currently considered amongst the 15 best in the country.

As I wrote a month ago about all the teeth gnashing around the MU program, the flames are fanned by those who will die soon and feel they are entitled to the program on their own terms rather then the terms of reality.

You are absolutely correct though i don't think you should make it a generational thing.  There are just as many late Crean era and Buzz era entitled Scoopers as there are Al era - unless, that is, you are marking them for early demises.

[Coleman]

You are absolutely correct though i don't think you should make it a generational thing.  There are just as many late Crean era and Buzz era entitled Scoopers as there are Al era - unless, that is, you are marking them for early demises.

Count me as one of the people spoiled by Crean-Buzz era successes.

I have never expected Al McGuire levels of success. But Crean and Buzz both established a baseline of making the NCAA tournament on a consistent basis, and having a deep postseason run every few years. More years than not, MU was a ranked team. It is disappointing that we couldn't maintain it. I am still holding out hope for Wojo, but to say it has not been a disappointment thus far would be a lie.

[RJax55]

I have never expected Al McGuire levels of success. But Crean and Buzz both established a baseline of making the NCAA tournament on a consistent basis, and having a deep run once or twice a decade. It is disappointing that we couldn't maintain it. I am still holding out hope for Wojo, but to say it has not been a disappointment thus far would be a lie.

Agree, if that's not the baseline for program expectations, then what is?

[GGGG]

Agree, if that's not the baseline for program expectations, then what is?

Well of course those should be the baseline.  I guess people just disagree how far away we were from achieving those expectations when Wojo took over.

[brewcity77]

Well of course those should be the baseline.  I guess people just disagree how far away we were from achieving those expectations when Wojo took over.

I just really wonder what people thought Buzz would've done with the roster he left. No power in the 'verse was turning that 2015 bunch into a tourney squad.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I just really wonder what people thought Buzz would've done with the roster he left. No power in the 'verse was turning that 2015 bunch into a tourney squad.

Well for starters, JJJ and Teve would have been gowne had Buzz stayed. Burton probably still leaves but that's a guess. I think Dawson probably still leaves too. Mayo is for sure still gone. Noskowiak would have still been a non-starter. You do have Shayok, Hill, Cohen, and Pierce in the fold. So the lineup would have probably looked like:

PG: Derrick Wilson
SG: Duane Wilson, Ahmed Hill
SF: Marial Shayok, Sandy Cohen
PF: Juan Anderson
C: Luke Fischer, Satchel Pierce

That lineup isn't doing jack. Impossible to know what grad transfers he might have nabbed if any.  Too many variables to project beyond that first season.

[Coleman]

I just really wonder what people thought Buzz would've done with the roster he left. No power in the 'verse was turning that 2015 bunch into a tourney squad.

You're right, but he would have rebuilt faster than this. We would have been a tournament team again by 2016-2017. Look at where Virginia Tech is now.

If Wojo can rally this team and make the tournament, I'll be happy. But if Buzz's VT team makes it before we do, that is super depressing.

[Galway Eagle]

You're right, but he would have rebuilt faster than this. We would have been back in the tourney by 2016. Look at where Virginia Tech is now.

Really? Highly doubt that, he was no longer able to use the quick fixes he's able to at VT and on top of that the amount of transfers he always caused would've left him scrambling even more

[Coleman]

Really? Highly doubt that, he was no longer able to use the quick fixes he's able to at VT and on top of that the amount of transfers he always caused would've left him scrambling even more

Buzz has always been all about quick fixes and transfers. He built most of MU's success on it. You can hate his tactics, but they translated into successful basketball teams. It seemed like a scramble but we always did well.

2014-2015 would have been a down year no matter the coach, but we would have bounced back very quickly under Buzz.

[GGGG]

You're right, but he would have rebuilt faster than this. We would have been a tournament team again by 2016-2017. Look at where Virginia Tech is now.

If Wojo can rally this team and make the tournament, I'll be happy. But if Buzz's VT team makes it before we do, that is super depressing.

Why?  He's a better coach.  He left on his own.  Marquette didn't fire him.

[Coleman]

Why?  He's a better coach.  He left on his own.  Marquette didn't fire him.

MU didn't fire him but it is disingenuous to say he left on his own. We all know there were plenty of politics and power struggles between Buzz and the administration, starting at the very top with Pilarz.

[Galway Eagle]

Buzz has always been all about quick fixes and transfers. He built most of MU's success on it. You can hate his tactics, but they translated into successful basketball teams. It seemed like a scramble but we always did well.

2014-2015 would have been a down year no matter the coach, but we would have bounced back very quickly under Buzz.

Except loads of players he would've been trying to get would not be allowed in anymore so his get good quick schemes wouldn't be remotely as effective. Also I don't hate Buzz or his tactics, I'm apathetic towards him/them. I hate Calipari's tactics and he's pretty much the only one. 

[naginiF]

Except loads of players he would've been trying to get would not be allowed in anymore so his get good quick schemes wouldn't be remotely as effective. Also I don't hate Buzz or his tactics, I'm apathetic towards him/them. I hate Calipari's tactics and he's pretty much the only one.

Ya gotta add Scott Drew to that short list!

(totally agree on everything else - how we get basketball success speaks much more to the institutions appeal to students than a rowdy crowd during Holiday break)

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

MU didn't fire him but it is disingenuous to say he left on his own. We all know there were plenty of politics and power struggles between Buzz and the administration, starting at the very top with Pilarz.

It takes two to tango. Yes there power struggles. Definite fault on the administration's side. Also fault on Buzz' side. The changes the administration wanted weren't necessarily the best but they weren't unreasonable either. A good employee makes his thoughts known and then accepts the decision of the boss.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

You're right, but he would have rebuilt faster than this. We would have been a tournament team again by 2016-2017. Look at where Virginia Tech is now.

Impossible to know. But I won't argue with anyone claiming that Buzz is a better coach right now.

[rocket surgeon]

i thought buzz had a little more humility than what he showed-at least he talked the talk