NIT

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Agree with your comments. What concerns me more is next season will be a real crapshoot if HE leaves. I laugh at posters who think the team will be fine without him. Wojo needs to recruit some players who can slug it out in the paint. we get manhandled in too many BE games.

Do the math.

Hank's production this season < Rowsey + Hauser + Howard (potentially) + Hank's replacement (potentially) + improvement by Fischer + improvement by Haanif + improvement by Duane + improvement by JJJ + improvement by Sandy + improvement by Traci +improvement by Wally + improvement by Sacar + improvement by Heldt + improvement by coaching staff.

Henry is a great player. He is not better than everyone else combined. Its funny because it often seems like people complain about Henry's shortcomings this season but talk about how we will never survive without him next season.

[CTWarrior]

Henry is a great player. He is not better than everyone else combined. Its funny because it often seems like people complain about Henry's shortcomings this season but talk about how we will never survive without him next season.

Because Henry rebounds and nobody else we have is any good at that.  I don't know about anyone else, but that is 90% of my concern about not having him next year.  We're a poor defensive team and a poor rebounding team now.  While Henry wasn't much of a defender, at least he ended possessions by grabbing rebounds on opponents misses.  Imagine our current shoddy defense with a lot more put backs against us.  If we find a rebounding PF I think we can be better next year.

[RushmoreAcademy]

I laugh at posters who think the team will be fine without him.

And I laugh at those who think we won't. So here we are, just laughing at each other. People who pass by are going to think we're having a really good time.

[keefe]

Meaning what, Crash?

Seriously, I'm not sure what you mean by this. That Wojo should be in trouble already, just months after getting an extension from the very administration that should be taking stock?

Mike

I am not suggesting that Wojo get fired. Far from it. But Marquette needs to take stock of the performance of its most valuable asset. Like it or not, Marquette's national reputation is largely predicated on the performance of its men's basketball team.

A lack of success on the hardwood is a very real issue for the strategic aims of the institution.

If this was GE Capital Indonesia the Country Director wouldn't get fired straight away but he also wouldn't last through 8 quarters of subpar performance.

Marquette invests heavily in the Men's Basketball Program because it has paid significant returns. Everyone accepts cyclical dips but I think it is fair to ask if we are witnessing an aberration or a trend.

If we take a hard look at where we are at as a program the future portends more of the same:

- We lose our best player
- We likely lose upper classman talent this off season
- We continue to have a roster with gaping skills deficits
- We remain inexperienced
- Our fan base is defecting in droves
- We can't even get on FS1 consistently


If this was a strategic business unit of GE Capital I guarantee that CT would be asking some tough questions because the shareholders have expectations of performance. I see no reason why Marquette should not have the same standards of excellence.

Personally, I don't see things getting better. Next year could be even worse. I think it is fair for the University to ask current management to stop at the Six Sigma Tollgate.   

[frozena pizza]

Do the math.

Hank's production this season < Rowsey + Hauser + Howard (potentially) + Hank's replacement (potentially) + improvement by Fischer + improvement by Haanif + improvement by Duane + improvement by JJJ + improvement by Sandy + improvement by Traci +improvement by Wally + improvement by Sacar + improvement by Heldt + improvement by coaching staff.

Henry is a great player. He is not better than everyone else combined. Its funny because it often seems like people complain about Henry's shortcomings this season but talk about how we will never survive without him next season.

You can pretty easily quantify Henry's impact and see how much we will miss him.  Sure, others will step up but we have no idea how much those players will improve, if at all.  Did Duane, Sandy and Luke take a huge step forward this year?  If anything they stayed about the same or regressed.  Not to mention that none of those players have anywhere near the same skill set Henry.

[keefe]

I'm praying for teal.

Aggie

No teal intended (a convention I have never understood, by the way)

Marquette relies heavily on its basketball program far more than TAMU does its football. It is fair for the University to level set.

Personally, I am not optimistic for next year - in fact, I predict that we have an even more difficult season.

Marquette alums expect to eat at Morton's. For three years now we have been taken to Outback. Outback calls itself a steak house but we know what Morton's calls steak.

[Big Papi]

Its so sad that we are hoping to make the NIT.  And the number of posts with excuses that we are ok, getting better and blind hope that it will get significantly better is just as sad. 


Can we add St. Louis to the Big East so we can hopefully get 2 more wins per year and feel better about making the NIT?  Just kidding but right now we are closer to becoming DePaul and St. Johns than Villanova and Xavier and I don't see it being much different next year.

[Atticus]

"The only thing worse than going to the NIT is going to the NIT and actually trying to win games." - a group of UK fans I was sitting close to at a bar a few years ago. The funny thing was that UL fans were in agreement. First and last time fans from those schools ever agreed on something.

[keefe]

Do the math.

Hank's production this season < Rowsey + Hauser + Howard (potentially) + Hank's replacement (potentially) + improvement by Fischer + improvement by Haanif + improvement by Duane + improvement by JJJ + improvement by Sandy + improvement by Traci +improvement by Wally + improvement by Sacar + improvement by Heldt + improvement by coaching staff.

Henry is a great player. He is not better than everyone else combined. Its funny because it often seems like people complain about Henry's shortcomings this season but talk about how we will never survive without him next season.

I'm praying for teal.

Because your syllogism would make Fr Davitt wince.

We are losing Henry Ellenson. We will likely lose more. We are already in a deep deficit. IF everything you posit comes true we MIGHT be better but you can't believe that all of those things will happen.

Fact is, Henry is better than everyone else combined. And he is leaving.

Next year will be worse than this one. People can dream for better but they need to be realistic. 

Marquette has gone from being a ranked team that, as Vander Blue opined, made opponents wince when looking at the schedule to a mediocre sub-.500 program.

A man used to Morton's should not ever be satisfied with Outback.

[Galway Eagle]

Mike

I am not suggesting that Wojo get fired. Far from it. But Marquette needs to take stock of the performance of its most valuable asset. Like it or not, Marquette's national reputation is largely predicated on the performance of its men's basketball team.

A lack of success on the hardwood is a very real issue for the strategic aims of the institution.

If this was GE Capital Indonesia the Country Director wouldn't get fired straight away but he also wouldn't last through 8 quarters of subpar performance.

Marquette invests heavily in the Men's Basketball Program because it has paid significant returns. Everyone accepts cyclical dips but I think it is fair to ask if we are witnessing an aberration or a trend.

If we take a hard look at where we are at as a program the future portends more of the same:

- We lose our best player
- We likely lose upper classman talent this off season
- We continue to have a roster with gaping skills deficits
- We remain inexperienced
- Our fan base is defecting in droves
- We can't even get on FS1 consistently


If this was a strategic business unit of GE Capital I guarantee that CT would be asking some tough questions because the shareholders have expectations of performance. I see no reason why Marquette should not have the same standards of excellence.

Personally, I don't see things getting better. Next year could be even worse. I think it is fair for the University to ask current management to stop at the Six Sigma Tollgate.   

What upper classmen talent might we be losing?

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

Mike

I am not suggesting that Wojo get fired. Far from it. But Marquette needs to take stock of the performance of its most valuable asset. Like it or not, Marquette's national reputation is largely predicated on the performance of its men's basketball team.

A lack of success on the hardwood is a very real issue for the strategic aims of the institution.

If this was GE Capital Indonesia the Country Director wouldn't get fired straight away but he also wouldn't last through 8 quarters of subpar performance.

Marquette invests heavily in the Men's Basketball Program because it has paid significant returns. Everyone accepts cyclical dips but I think it is fair to ask if we are witnessing an aberration or a trend.

If we take a hard look at where we are at as a program the future portends more of the same:

- We lose our best player
- We likely lose upper classman talent this off season
- We continue to have a roster with gaping skills deficits
- We remain inexperienced
- Our fan base is defecting in droves
- We can't even get on FS1 consistently


If this was a strategic business unit of GE Capital I guarantee that CT would be asking some tough questions because the shareholders have expectations of performance. I see no reason why Marquette should not have the same standards of excellence.

Personally, I don't see things getting better. Next year could be even worse. I think it is fair for the University to ask current management to stop at the Six Sigma Tollgate.   

I won't comment on the comps to GE. Just silly.

I will comment on you stating that we'll lose upperclassmen experience. That narrows down to JJ and Luke. Luke already sat out a year - highly doubt he is going anywhere, and I would be beyond shocked to see JJ leave just as he's hitting his stride. So what exactly are you getting at here? Only logical transfer would be Sandy or Anim, and while I hope neither leaves, we're not exactly taking a step back if they do.

[jsglow]

I'm fairly certain that not even Tanned Tommy would want to hang that banner from the rafters...

NIT is the lowest we should sink.

It is depressing to think how we are rationalizing what three years ago would have triggered Scoop Armageddon.

I hope the Administration is taking stock because this program is not meeting the mark.

keefe, we won't actually hang anything but tell me that there wasn't ANY pride in winning Brooklyn this year.  Our kids need to learn how to win.

And stop talking to me about 3 years ago.  That was then and this is now.

[keefe]

keefe, we won't actually hang anything but tell me that there wasn't ANY pride in winning Brooklyn this year.  Our kids need to learn how to win.

And stop talking to me about 3 years ago.  That was then and this is now.

I love the fact that we won Brooklyn. That was a great moment which, unfortunately, we were not able leverage into continued, consistent success throughout the year.

As for participating in either the CBI or the Vegas Dirty Dozen I think we need to remain above these for reasons of brand equity.

Let's go home, lick our wounds, and see what happens with our roster. We are probably losing a lot of talent. The key will be in how Wojo replaces whatever it is we lose.

Frankly, I am not happy with where this program is at.     

[79Warrior]

Do the math.

Hank's production this season < Rowsey + Hauser + Howard (potentially) + Hank's replacement (potentially) + improvement by Fischer + improvement by Haanif + improvement by Duane + improvement by JJJ + improvement by Sandy + improvement by Traci +improvement by Wally + improvement by Sacar + improvement by Heldt + improvement by coaching staff.

Henry is a great player. He is not better than everyone else combined. Its funny because it often seems like people complain about Henry's shortcomings this season but talk about how we will never survive without him next season.

Good luck with your logic. You sound like Donald Trump telling us everything is going to be great again as soon as he gets elected. How much did SC improve from last year? How much did Duane improve from last year? JJJ did improve. So, if were are fortunate, maybe half of the guys you mention improve. Rowsey has yet to play a game for us so I have no idea how to quantify him and Hauser is a freshman. Still not going to be enough and we will be much smaller and get just as abused by the other BE teams under the basket.

[drewm88]

Pretty sure Oregon State won the CBI last year.

OSU won it in 2009. They declined a bid last year, and Loyola Chicago won it.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

This is really depressing. People here truly believe that one player makes this entire program and he is unreplaceable. Hank is damn good. Best player we have. He is not unreplaceable.

[1SE]

It's all about the optics of trajectory.  Yes, who cares about the NIT, but it's a heck of a lot better than where we were last year at this time.  Miss the NIT and the step forward doesn't look nearly as big. 

The only reason to be optimistic for next year is if you think the coaching will get better.  This year's talent should have been NCAA bubble, full stop.  When all is said and done three or four of this year's team will probably have laced up in the association.  To not be sweating in out on selection Sunday (at worst) with that talent means the coaching underperformed.  NIT is just a little bit of underperformance from NCAA bubble (i.e. my B- grade), but missing the NIT is a major underperformance from potential. 

[CTWarrior]

This is really depressing. People here truly believe that one player makes this entire program and he is unreplaceable. Hank is damn good. Best player we have. He is not unreplaceable.

Agree he is not unreplaceable.  But we don't have a replacement.  A mish-mash of shooting guards trying to play the 4 is not a replacement.

[brandx]

In the latest NIT bracketology, Marquette is barely hanging on.  And that was before the UAB loss.  Simply put, MU needs the #1 seeds to win their tournaments and hope that the selection committee wants the marquee value that a guy like Henry can bring.

Then they will put us on the road to a place like Valpo because they'd draw the crowd.

I think you hit on a good reason why we probably make it - they want all of the "star power" they can get.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

We are probably losing a lot of talent. The key will be in how Wojo replaces whatever it is we lose.

You have said this a few times in addition to someone referencing a grad transfer.  Is there a thought that we lose Luke, DU or JJJ?

[brandx]

You have said this a few times in addition to someone referencing a grad transfer.  Is there a thought that we lose Luke, DU or JJJ?

Luke won't transfer.

Duane won't transfer down to a mid-major.

JJJ has worked hard to be in a position to be one of the go-to-guys next year.

[BM1090]

Its so sad that we are hoping to make the NIT.  And the number of posts with excuses that we are ok, getting better and blind hope that it will get significantly better is just as sad. 


Can we add St. Louis to the Big East so we can hopefully get 2 more wins per year and feel better about making the NIT?  Just kidding but right now we are closer to becoming DePaul and St. Johns than Villanova and Xavier and I don't see it being much different next year.

I don't think anyone is happy with this season but take a step back and look at the progress. Wojo inherited a crap roster that was a last place team in a power conference. Four of the seven scholarship players on that roster from last year are gone. We had FOUR SCHOLARSHIP PLAYERS RETURNING FROM A TERRIBLE TEAM. Enter one of the youngest teams in the country. What did they do? Added 7 wins overall and 4 conference wins. We went from one of the worst power conference teams in the country to a possible NIT team in one year. We were 4-14 in the Big East last year. The Big East got better. We went 8-10. In one year. With 6 new players on the roster.

The entitlement on this board is unbelievable. Is it frustrating to maybe miss any postseason play for the 3rd consecutive year? Hell yeah it's frustrating. But we went from terrible to average in one year. The only other team to do that, oddly, was Virginia Tech. It's irritating given that we were an E8 team 4 seasons ago and coming off of a run of sustained success, but we're clearly back on the upswing. Maybe Wojo ends up not working out in the end but the program is obviously trending back in the right direction. It doesn't happen overnight.

For fucks sake

[Big Papi]

Luke won't transfer.

Duane won't transfer down to a mid-major.

JJJ has worked hard to be in a position to be one of the go-to-guys next year.

Sandy, Wally and Anim could all leave. 
For all the bashing that Sandy receives on here, he had a good start to the year and was our best 3 point shooter until his game became completely unglued and now has no confidence whatsoever.  Losing any or all 3 will only allow for more "we are young/lack of experience" excuses to be used when we struggle next year as we bring in more freshmen.

[GGGG]

Sandy, Wally and Anim could all leave. 
For all the bashing that Sandy receives on here, he had a good start to the year and was our best 3 point shooter until his game became completely unglued and now has no confidence whatsoever.  Losing any or all 3 will only allow for more "we are young/lack of experience" excuses to be used when we struggle next year as we bring in more freshmen.

First, we aren't going to lose all three.  I would be surprised if we lose more than one.

Second, next year we will be more experienced.  Luke and JJJ will be seniors.  Duane, Sandy and Rowsey will be juniors.  Haanif and Carter will be sophomores.

And really stop with the "experience is just an excuse" mantra.  It is a fact.  It is important.

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

OSU won it in 2009. They declined a bid last year, and Loyola Chicago won it.

Ahh shows how much I pay attention to the CBI. Thanks for the correction.