SJU thoughts

[The Lens]

Two certainties:

Henry is gone
I will be hoping like hell the Bucks don't take him (I want Dunn).

[Herman Cain]

not trying to start anything but am i the only one that's starting to doubt Henry as a sure fire NBA talent? I haven't seen him have one dominate game all year.. Sure quiet double doubles, but he has yet to show any sort of elite ability in beating college defenders.. It's easy to grab lots of rebounds when you're that tall.. he has at best above avg post play.. Shoots loads of shots at a mediocre fg %. Lastly he seems awfully slow and just not as athletic as some may have thought.. No doubt he'll be a great college player and will see some time In an nba uniform but I'm not sure if he will be in the league more than a year or so.. might just be like buckys, DJO Lazar Etc with some small contracts here and there.. Idk am I only one seeing this ?

Lots of other people are seeing it.  There is an excellent scouting report on him at http://www.nbadraft.net/players/henry-ellenson     where his current ranking is 23.  By the way these projections are all very flimsy. Very example Ben Bentil of Providence, who is having a monster year, is nowhere on these charts. So take them with a grain of salt. Go with what your eyes tell you.

All that said, Henry is a very good college freshman and I think he will realize his elite projection by the time he is a senior.  Also I do do believe there is talent in his rebounds. He has a very good idea where the ball is going to go. MU will benefit greatly from his presence here.

Of course if he is offered a decent enough contract he will likely take it. 

[brandx]

And this is (unsurprisingly) downright silly.

Typical BC

[wadesworld]

Lots of other people are seeing it.  There is an excellent scouting report on him at http://www.nbadraft.net/players/henry-ellenson     where his current ranking is 23.  By the way these projections are all very flimsy. Very example Ben Bentil of Providence, who is having a monster year, is nowhere on these charts. So take them with a grain of salt. Go with what your eyes tell you.

All that said, Henry is a very good college freshman and I think he will realize his elite projection by the time he is a senior.  Also I do do believe there is talent in his rebounds. He has a very good idea where the ball is going to go. MU will benefit greatly from his presence here.

Of course if he is offered a decent enough contract he will likely take it.

 

Two certainties:

Henry is gone
I will be hoping like hell the Bucks don't take him (I want Dunn).

Better hope the Bucks don't win another game then.

[HoopsterBC]

Typical BC

Do you really think Henry is good enough to start next year in the NBA??  If he was my son, take the money and run, but has along way to becoming a starter

[wadesworld]

Do you really think Henry is good enough to start next year in the NBA??  If he was my son, take the money and run, but has along way to becoming a starter

How many rookies in the NBA are starting?

[WarriorPride68]

All that said, Henry is a very good college freshman and I think he will realize his elite projection by the time he is a senior. 

I missed this gem until World just pointed it out. Wowzers

[dgies9156]

Good Lord, you would think in here we lost again based on the attitude. I watched the game on tape delay and saw the following:

1) From the time we were up 20 until the end of the game reminded me of one thing -- most of the guys on the court were freshmen. Upper classmen don't give up those kinds of leads. Freshmen frequently do. We need to learn to kill when we can and to close out games. We saw that big lead and simply got sloppy.

2) Will we ever learn to defend solidly against the "3" ball? St. John's got back in the game because of the three-pointer and the looks were too often wide open. We just don't seem top pick up shooters very well from far outside. And when we foul on a three, make it sting so they think twice about taking the shot.

3) Everybody has pointed out the turnovers. More than anything else, they were sloppy play and illustrated a problem we've had all season -- we get flustered and out of our game. Simple rule: We play OUR game, we win. We play hurried, scared or unsure and we lose. It's that simple.

4) We showed enough poise to hang on at the end. Hopefully, this is something we can build on.

[wadesworld]

Good Lord, you would think in here we lost again based on the attitude. I watched the game on tape delay and saw the following:

1) From the time we were up 20 until the end of the game reminded me of one thing -- most of the guys on the court were freshmen. Upper classmen don't give up those kinds of leads. Freshmen frequently do. We need to learn to kill when we can and to close out games. We saw that big lead and simply got sloppy.

2) Will we ever learn to defend solidly against the "3" ball? St. John's got back in the game because of the three-pointer and the looks were too often wide open. We just don't seem top pick up shooters very well from far outside. And when we foul on a three, make it sting so they think twice about taking the shot.

3) Everybody has pointed out the turnovers. More than anything else, they were sloppy play and illustrated a problem we've had all season -- we get flustered and out of our game. Simple rule: We play OUR game, we win. We play hurried, scared or unsure and we lose. It's that simple.

4) We showed enough poise to hang on at the end. Hopefully, this is something we can build on.

Well, actually, to 5 team and not-so-young Xavier was up 15 at St. John's and up 12 with 6 minutes to play before St. John's had cut the lead to 1 with 2:05 to play, after which the Johnnies got called for a questionable foul and then T'd up for slamming the ball into the floor.

But yeah, only Marquette could possibly let St. John's play them tough.

 

[Herman Cain]

I missed this gem until World just pointed it out. Wowzers

That has been my consistent position for a long time.

[WarriorPride68]

That has been my consistent position for a long time.

You think Henry will play 4 years at Marquette?

[Marcus92]

From the time we were up 20 until the end of the game reminded me of one thing -- most of the guys on the court were freshmen. Upper classmen don't give up those kinds of leads.

Just a reminder: we didn't give up the lead. We kept the lead the entire time, and we won the game.

Granted, the margin was closer than you'd expect being up 20. But learning how to seal the deal is an important lesson for a young team to learn. Marquette did that. They bent, but they didn't break. They kept the lead and earned the win.

What you're referring to is the next lesson this team has to learn: how to maintain focus, effort and intensity for 40 minutes and not let the opponent back into the game when you have them on the ropes.

[Herman Cain]

You think Henry will play 4 years at Marquette?

Yes. I think he will stay want to stay at least  two with his brother. Then because he is enjoying the college experience, with a lot of good friends, he will stay for two more. His game will continue to improve each season. He comes from a stable family situation and money may not be that big a priority. Lots of good guys stay 4 years. Draymond Green, Doug McDermott, etc.

All that said, Yes ,it is very likely he could be high draft material this year. NBA drafts on projected talent and You can't teach size as they say. So if the projected draft pick is high enough he will likely go.  I just don't think it will be as high as others on this message board think.

[martyconlonontherun]

Yes. I think he will stay want to stay at least  two with his brother. Then because he is enjoying the college experience, with a lot of good friends, he will stay for two more. His game will continue to improve each season. He comes from a stable family situation and money may not be that big a priority. Lots of good guys stay 4 years. Draymond Green, Doug McDermott, etc.

All that said, Yes ,it is very likely he could be high draft material this year. NBA drafts on projected talent and You can't teach size as they say. So if the projected draft pick is high enough he will likely go.  I just don't think it will be as high as others on this message board think.

Lots of people go to college for seven years....
Look up greens college stats. Why even make the comparison?

Worst case scenario is he is a first rounder with a guaranteed three year contract. He's gone.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

not trying to start anything but am i the only one that's starting to doubt Henry as a sure fire NBA talent? I haven't seen him have one dominate game all year.. Sure quiet double doubles, but he has yet to show any sort of elite ability in beating college defenders.. It's easy to grab lots of rebounds when you're that tall.. he has at best above avg post play.. Shoots loads of shots at a mediocre fg %. Lastly he seems awfully slow and just not as athletic as some may have thought.. No doubt he'll be a great college player and will see some time In an nba uniform but I'm not sure if he will be in the league more than a year or so.. might just be like buckys, DJO Lazar Etc with some small contracts here and there.. Idk am I only one seeing this ?

Funny, I had the opposite reaction. There were some moves that he made today that made me think "wow, that was a NBA move" the two he finished with his left hand were the two plays that made me think that

[rocky_warrior]

All that said, Yes ,it is very likely he could be high draft material this year. NBA drafts on projected talent and You can't teach size as they say. So if the projected draft pick is high enough he will likely go.  I just don't think it will be as high as others on this message board think.

While prior to Scoop, I remember these same type of conversations about Wade. 

Henry *might* stick around, but he'll have a great opportunity to go pro.

[Herman Cain]

Lots of people go to college for seven years....
Look up greens college stats. Why even make the comparison?

Worst case scenario is he is a first rounder with a guaranteed three year contract. He's gone.

Green was National Player of the Year as a Senior. Izzo says he is one of the greatest Spartans ever. Other than that ,Your right, there is no comparison.

Green was drafted in the 2nd Round number 35

Your worst case scenario for Henry may be indeed be true. All it takes is one GM to believe he is next Dirk.

 I am just saying there may be other considerations that come into play.  Look at Tyler Hansbrough. He stayed all 4 years. I am sure he is glad he did. NBA turned out to be a lot less fun than winning championship at Carolina.

Here are quotes from Henry Per Matty V http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/366368851.html

This is clearly a kid enjoying college:

Henry Ellenson added some more details from the players' perspective about the experience following Sunday's win.

"I think if we're playing in Wisconsin or up in Rice Lake the game still would've gone on," he said with a laugh. "That was something else, just walking outside in Times Square when the streets were all closed down and there's just everyone in the street was something else. It's an experience I'm going to remember for the rest of my life."

Ellenson lauded his teammates for staying professional and still treating the situation like a business trip, but admitted it was fun, too.

When the team wasn't walking around Times Square, it was holed up in its hotel just off the busy intersection in midtown Manhattan. There, they watched the movie "Straight Outta Compton" together in a ballroom and played cards between meals and other team meetings.

"It was just being around your teammates, all your best friends, so I had a lot of fun with them," he said.

[wadesworld]

While prior to Scoop, I remember these same type of conversations about Wade. 

Henry *might* stick around, but he'll have a great opportunity to go pro.

While people were chanting, "One more year!" at the Kentucky game in Minneapolis, I was chanting "Two more years!"  Man, I hilarious even as an 8th grader!

[dgies9156]

Do you really think Henry is good enough to start next year in the NBA??  If he was my son, take the money and run, but has along way to becoming a starter

I had a friend of mine whose son had that choice. Take a cool half million from a major league baseball team and run or play college baseball. The school offering him was a good school and good baseball power, versus a cool half million signing bonus.

Kid went to college -- and stayed in college.

The message is that if Henry is THAT good, the money will be there. I've had this debate ad nauseum, but I see Henry and I see the one-and-dones at Kentucky or Duke. Henry's good, but he's not Jabari Parker or Jamil Okafur (and don't hold me to the spelling). I think Henry will be a great NBA player someday but he would be a wise young man to stay at least another year or two in college.

[wadesworld]

I had a friend of mine whose son had that choice. Take a cool half million from a major league baseball team and run or play college baseball. The school offering him was a good school and good baseball power, versus a cool half million signing bonus.

Kid went to college -- and stayed in college.

The message is that if Henry is THAT good, the money will be there. I've had this debate ad nauseum, but I see Henry and I see the one-and-dones at Kentucky or Duke. Henry's good, but he's not Jabari Parker or Jamil Okafur (and don't hold me to the spelling). I think Henry will be a great NBA player someday but he would be a wise young man to stay at least another year or two in college.

The good thing for Henry is that A) He doesn't have to move up through the ranks of 4 different levels before he reaches the big leagues and the big payday and B) He doesn't have to be Jahlil Okafor or Jabari Parker to guarantee himself multiple millions of dollars over the 3 years following this year.

[Marcus92]

Based on what he's shown so far, Henry is a top 10-15 prospect. That doesn't make him a lock. It doesn't mean all scouts agree. But they've have had lots of opportunities to see him in action against top competition — including AAU ball, as part of the U.S. world championship team, and against other top prospects like Ben Simmons here at Marquette.

Henry possesses a combination of size and skill (ball-handling, face-up shooting) that's rare. His strengths: rebounding, passing, shot-blocking instincts, work ethic, team orientation and level-headed attitude. His weaknesses: post offense, outside shooting and overall quickness (both in isolation offense and defense).

Whether he starts in the NBA is irrelevant. There have been #1 draft picks who washed out almost immediately. What matters is whether GMs think he has the potential to be an impact player. At just 19 years old, Ellenson has a lot to offer — including tremendous potential to improve his overall game.

As for what happens after this season, anybody who says they know what Henry's going to do is flat-out lying. For many players, the lure of the NBA draft (and NBA money) is too strong to resist. But every year, highly regarded players decide to forego entering the NBA draft early, for a wide range of reasons.

I'm trying to simply enjoy watching one of the most talented players to ever wear a Marquette uniform.

[dgies9156]

Now back to the game. In reviewing the stat sheet, St. John's was 9 of 23 from three-land. That's way too many points from beyond the arc. I know Wojo said he liked our defense today, but this one is glaring and someone needs to think about it.

[MU82]

IMO Wojo needs to try and develop either Haanif or Duane at PG before next year because while I believe TC will be a great PG   eventually it just doesn't seem to be in the cards for the near future.  A back court of Wilson, HC, and Rowsey getting the bulk of the minutes next year should be solid.  Give Carter 10-15 minutes a game and hand him the keys starting in 2017-18 season. 

In game adjustments from this coaching staff continue to concern me.  As mentioned in previous threads an OG could be a calming influence on the bench next year.

You don't think Wojo and the 11 other ex-PGs on his staff are working with these guys? It's not magic. It takes time.

As for the in-game adjustments ... it took a little longer than it should have, but having Henry inbound the ball -- running the baseline if necessary -- immediately ended the turnovers vs. the press. It was a good move and Wojo (and/or assistants) deserve credit for making the adjustment -- just as they would deserve blame for not making it.

Finally, as those who have read my crapola for awhile will attest, I just about never get on the refs ... but they let St. John's get away with some serious hacks while pressing. Thankfully, it ended up not costing the game.

[brandx]

Look up greens college stats. Why even make the comparison?

.

Exactly.

A 6' 5 1/2" power forward who averaged 3 points a game as a freshman does not go to the NBA

[wildbillsb]

22 Turnovers!?!?  Against St. John's!!!!!  Sorry, fellow scoopers, but you gots to take off the blue and gold glasses.  And don't bring up that these are just freshmen.  This team (players AND coach) never faced a full court press in their earlier basketball lives?  C'mon, it only takes one timeout to change inbounders, doesn't it, Coach?  Do you know how close we came to losing this game?  Whewww.

Now, on to a funner topic.  Dick Enberg's MCGUIRE is playing for just two nights (this Mon and Tues) in Solana Beach, CA.  It got a glowing preview in today's San Diego Union-Tribune sports page.  I'm going. Maybe see one of two of you there?