Are we better than last year?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Id agree with others who say that this team is better but not that much better than last years team. Think about that. Despite last years team being filled with seniors and experience, Wojo is getting more out of a team with zero seniors and five freshmen. That is exciting! Imagine what they could do next year or the year after. Hell, if this team makes the NIT, then Wojo did more than Buzz could with the like of Todd Mayo, Jamil Wilson, and Davnte Gardner.

Why people think a team this young wont improve is beyond me.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Clearly the team is better than last year.  We all realize this isn't much an achievement.  The better question is whether MU is improving.  To answer that question, it comes down to whether HE stays another year.  If he does, then next year's team will continue the arc of progress over a 3-year period.  If he leaves, then the team likely takes another significant step back and this season was another waste.  Therefore, if HE leaves after this year, it will have stunted MU's team growth as his minutes could have gone to someone who will help be competitive in the 2016-17 season.  In that case, it may have been better off without his signing.

I do think HE stays another year, and next year's team will be significantly better.

I think this team is top 25 if Henry returns.
I think this team is bubblicious if he doesnt.
I think this team is top 25 if he doesnt and we get a quality grad transfer PF.

Add Markus Howard to any of those and hot damn

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

Experience is overrated. Henry is far and away out best player and I'd probably put Cheatham 2nd right now. The high school team my dad coaches starts 2 sophomores and a freshman and a senior who only played half a year of competetive basketball and I think they're something like 15-4.

[bilsu]

No, we are not better off. There was much higher expectations for this year. Last year we under achieved based on preseason expectations. However, our best player missed 4 games with a concussion.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

No, we are not better off. There was much higher expectations for this year. Last year we under achieved based on preseason expectations. However, our best player missed 4 games with a concussion.

We're gonna finish with a better record than last year. Despite last season having what? 4x the experience that this team does? That's pretty amazing when you think about it. Give em another year? Watch out!

[mu03eng]

The question isn't are they better than last year, the question should be are they better than the last year of Buzz. The other question should be are they getting better in season

Last year doesn't count against anyone because the cupboard was bare and there was a coaching transition. This year is more talent but less experienced than the '13-'14 team, and so far I have to say we aren't better than that year. Finished 17-15, 9-9 against the 68th(226 non-con) toughest schedule that year and we are on track to finish this year 16-15, 5-13 against the 175th(325 non-con) toughest schedule.* That's not improvement.

We'll see what the rest of the season holds, but we aren't going to make the dance this year....the concern is do we have the pieces(coaching and players) to make it next season?  If we go 4 years in a row without making the dance, I may have to officially check out for a bit to adjust my sanity.


*According to KenPom

[mu03eng]

We're gonna finish with a better record than last year. Despite last season having what? 4x the experience that this team does? That's pretty amazing when you think about it. Give em another year? Watch out!

Which matters more talent or experience? You are correct about the experience gap, but the talent gap between last year and this year has to be close to 4x in favor of this year.

[LAZER]

Experience is overrated. Henry is far and away out best player and I'd probably put Cheatham 2nd right now. The high school team my dad coaches starts 2 sophomores and a freshman and a senior who only played half a year of competetive basketball and I think they're something like 15-4.

Your dad's high school team? Seriously?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Which matters more talent or experience? You are correct about the experience gap, but the talent gap between last year and this year has to be close to 4x in favor of this year.

What matters is that this is year 1 for this class. I dont care how they are doing in this season. What Im excited about is what they will do next season and the season after and the season after that.

[HoopsterBC]

Experience is overrated. Henry is far and away out best player and I'd probably put Cheatham 2nd right now. The high school team my dad coaches starts 2 sophomores and a freshman and a senior who only played half a year of competetive basketball and I think they're something like 15-4.

The team is still flawed next year even if they all comeback.  Unless they learn to shot the ball, how can they be better.  Is Duane Wilson better this year than last?  I
would say this year he is worse.  Is Sandy Cohen going to find his shot against Big East talent, maybe, maybe night.  All of a sudden Luke and Henry going to find some
quick twitch muscle to rebound better, doubt it.  Cheatham going to become a jump shooter?  Lots of flawed players,  maybe .500 if they all comeback in the Big East.
Now if Wojo can recruit a rebounder for next year then maybe, and Rowsey is better than most people think, then maybe

[MU82]

Id agree with others who say that this team is better but not that much better than last years team. Think about that. Despite last years team being filled with seniors and experience, Wojo is getting more out of a team with zero seniors and five freshmen. That is exciting! Imagine what they could do next year or the year after. Hell, if this team makes the NIT, then Wojo did more than Buzz could with the like of Todd Mayo, Jamil Wilson, and Davnte Gardner.

Why people think a team this young wont improve is beyond me.

TAMU, please stop using logic and common sense.

We lost at home to DePaul, so this board is filled with anger and spite from commenters who were nowhere to be seen when we were beating Providence and Wisconsin.

These are people who seem to believe that freshmen and sophomores NEVER get better.

You might as well go to the Politics board and try to convince Heisy that every baby shouldn't receive a gun at birth.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

TAMU, please stop using logic and common sense.

We lost at home to DePaul, so this board is filled with anger and spite from commenters who were nowhere to be seen when we were beating Providence and Wisconsin.

These are people who seem to believe that freshmen and sophomores NEVER get better.

You might as well go to the Politics board and try to convince Heisy that every baby shouldn't receive a gun at birth.

Damn your practicality 82! I will reach them!

[ChicosBailBonds]

Experience is overrated. Henry is far and away out best player and I'd probably put Cheatham 2nd right now. The high school team my dad coaches starts 2 sophomores and a freshman and a senior who only played half a year of competetive basketball and I think they're something like 15-4.

Playing in front of 500 people vs 10,000 in the college environment, being on TV, knowing NBA scouts are in the building, dealing with opponents and talents never faced before, hopping on airplanes to go to games, media interviews, college academics, etc.......I would say experience helps and very difficult for me to get my head around how the high school world comes close to making a comparable statement.  I would guess in high school, experience is also important, but not nearly as much.

In college, where so many players are good because they are pretty much all on scholarship (not the case in high school where there are some really bad players out there game to game), that the different in talent at the college level is smaller.  So experience, guile, etc, are an edge.  Even how one carry's oneself off the court.

My two cents of course.

[MerrittsMustache]

Experience is overrated. Henry is far and away out best player and I'd probably put Cheatham 2nd right now. The high school team my dad coaches starts 2 sophomores and a freshman and a senior who only played half a year of competetive basketball and I think they're something like 15-4.

In that case, MU should hire your dad. After all, it's not like there's much of a difference between HS basketball and big-time college basketball 

[Lennys Tap]

I'm not defending Crean, my animus at Buzz comes from other things I know.  "You also don't get that I genuinely liked Crean".....I have NEVER said that and continuously said what a prick he was, so honestly if you have been paying attention ever I don't know how you could say that I said that.  NEVER have said it.  I can't count the number of times I said he is a prick to deal with, etc...way too many to count.  Where I would "defend" him is when I would correct people saying complete falsehoods.  I also would laugh at the number of times he has been "fired" here on this board because our fans are either stupid or just so emotionally vacant they couldn't process things properly.

Admitting he's a prick to deal with would be like me admitting Buzz is eccentric. Big effing deal. Everyone already knows that. Crean's nickname among the students who worked in he athletic offices at MU was "Osama", for god's sakes (totally true). It's a flat out lie that you only defend him here to "correct people saying complete falsehoods". When someone would say he's a prick (which you now acknowledge as true) you would routinely defend him with some fawning remark about him being like a father to D Wade or a mentor to Steve Novak. You've spent 17 years and thousands of posts here on on multiple boards defending the guy. You are (by miles) his most vocal supporter in the entire universe. But you don't like him. Right.

[🏀]

Admitting he's a prick to deal with would be like me admitting Buzz is eccentric. Big effing deal. Everyone already knows that. Crean's nickname among the students who worked in he athletic offices at MU was "Osama", for god's sakes (totally true). It's a flat out lie that you only defend him here to "correct people saying complete falsehoods". When someone would say he's a prick (which you now acknowledge as true) you would routinely defend him with some fawning remark about him being like a father to D Wade or a mentor to Steve Novak. You've spent 17 years and thousands of posts here on on multiple boards defending the guy. You are (by miles) his most vocal supporter in the entire universe. But you don't like him. Right.

Interesting, never heard that nickname in The Al.

[Lennys Tap]

Id put Kentucky, Louisville, and North Carolina in the 1 to 3 level and Duke in the 8 to 10....so every team not named Connecticut who has won a national championship in the last 7 years

Duke takes kids to play basketball who would have trouble getting into Northern Illinois (let alone a Holy Cross or an Army) as a regular student. That's hardly an 8-10 in my book.

[muwarrior69]

Right now I don't see it. We keep making the same mistakes over and over again. Can't shoot, can't win the rebound war.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Duke takes kids to play basketball who would have trouble getting into Northern Illinois (let alone a Holy Cross or an Army) as a regular student. That's hardly an 8-10 in my book.

Well so does marquette and every other school...so by that standard were all in that range. If that's the only transgression, I would put a school at a 9

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Crean's nickname among the students who worked in he athletic offices at MU was "Osama", for god's sakes (totally true).

Funny. I worked in the athletic offices as a freshmen during the crean era and never heard anything like that. We thought he was odd and made fun of the tan but we're generally ok with the guy. I was only there for the last year however. Maybe it was an earlier nickname

[TallTitan34]

I was around for the last two years of Crean and first year of Buzz.  I know Buzz was seen as a welcome change by many but never once did I hear Crean called Osama.

[Lennys Tap]

Funny. I worked in the athletic offices as a freshmen during the crean era and never heard anything like that. We thought he was odd and made fun of the tan but we're generally ok with the guy. I was only there for the last year however. Maybe it was an earlier nickname

My source is the Father of a kid who worked there. Not sure what year, but since he couldn't care less about Tom Crean I don't think he made it up.

What was your experience like working there in the Buzz era?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

My source is the Father of a kid who worked there. Not sure what year, but since he couldn't care less about Tom Crean I don't think he made it up.

What was your experience like working there in the Buzz era?

Well he never made me flush the toilet for him

[willie warrior]

Well he never made me flush the toilet for him

And that was a full time job with all the phony cow chips he threw around!

[mu_hilltopper]

Whether the "program is better" is somewhat subjective, after you look at hard stats like wins and losses.

One item that's overlooked is .. the passion-ometer.  It's way, way, way way down.  Season ticket sales are down -2500 (-2800?) over the past two seasons, and I'll bet will fall another 1000 next season.    Any business that's lost a third of their customers is in trouble.   It's quite possible an entire 4-year class of students will have no recollection of MU ever dancing in March.

The New Big East, coupled with three losing seasons is a gut punch and wipes away years of building up the customer base.   It's hard to see MU recovering for quite some time, if ever, with ticket costs increasing, and a new stadium adding to higher prices.  Need multiple years of top 25 finishes and decent March runs.