15-16 thoughts

[Galway Eagle]

And yeah that is what I've been saying. Expect Wally as a Juan Anderson of junior year variety.

Ya but you were saying it like a jerk so nobody wanted to take you seriously

[PGsHeroes32]

Ya but you were saying it like a jerk so nobody wanted to take you seriously

Giving my informed opinion on actually seeing him play is being a jerk?

Saying I would love to be wrong is being a jerk?

Saying he deserves PT is being a jerk?

Saying I'm glad he's on the team is being a jerk?

Saying I don't feel he has proven anything to be counted on is being a jerk?

How did you get this far in life? I'm truly curious now.

[brewcity77]

Giving my informed opinion on actually seeing him play is being a jerk?

Saying I would love to be wrong is being a jerk?

Saying he deserves PT is being a jerk?

Saying I'm glad he's on the team is being a jerk?

Saying I don't feel he has proven anything to be counted on is being a jerk?

How did you get this far in life? I'm truly curious now.

If this is all you were doing, no one would be saying you are acting like a jerk.

[PGsHeroes32]

If this is all you were doing, no one would be saying you are acting like a jerk.

It is all I've done though. Like its a fact. Not open to interpretation.

All I've done is give my opinion on my I don't think Wally can guard a 4 or will be counted on beyond around 5-6 PPG.

No name calling. No personal attacks. MY OPINION.

That's isn't being a jerk.

It's really a simple concept to be honest.

[brewcity77]

It is all I've done though. Like its a fact. Not open to interpretation.

All I've done is give my opinion on my I don't think Wally can guard a 4 or will be counted on beyond around 5-6 PPG.

No name calling. No personal attacks. MY OPINION.

That's isn't being a jerk.

It's really a simple concept to be honest.

No, you are wrong. And since you want to press the issue, let's review...

I have watched the kid play far more than you have. He's biggest issue was he couldn't guard me. We're going to play him at the 4? Literally zero chance.

You can argue otherwise, but no one here was born yesterday. In the above, you are being condescending. You assume that you know more and are smarter than the posters you are responding to. And the tone you take frames how you are perceived.

No it's not lol. Not even close.

You are really trying to compare what deonte did and Wally?

Condescension, again.

Dude I don't know how much more simply I can tell you this.

No matter what the rest of the post says, opening with this is being condescending and more than a bit asinine.

And that's my point. Try and keep up. Not asking a lot.

Other people state their opinion, and this is how you respond. You act superior, you act condescending, quite simply, you are acting like a jerk. None of us are new to the Internet. You can try to spin whatever you want about being misunderstood or sarcasm not being conveyed well in this environment, but the reality is you are being a jerk. Repeatedly. To pretty much everyone else in the thread.

I have kept up. You and your 15 posts are just jumping in when convenient.

For the last few months on here and scout people have been talking about JJJ and Sandy with how badly they need to improve but then talk about Wally as someone who is going to come right in an contribute.

It's simply wrong. I know your brain probably doesn't function at full capacity to know why it's wrong, but at least try.

So, you aren't name calling, you say? This is an outright attack on another poster's intellect. There's no two ways about it. You ask why someone says you are being a jerk? Uhh...pretty simple, it's because you are being a jerk.

So...back to your most recent post...

It is all I've done though. Like its a fact. Not open to interpretation.

The only thing not open to interpretation is what an utter asshat you have been in this thread. You condescend to anyone who dares try to open discourse and have an opinion that differs from your own.

All I've done is give my opinion on my I don't think Wally can guard a 4 or will be counted on beyond around 5-6 PPG.

Clearly not true. You've berated everyone with your "opinion" as though it were fact. You aren't making opinion statements, you are making fact statements, going after anyone who disagrees, and later backtracking by saying it was just your opinion. Further, you have made blanket statements and used that horribly often-misused term "literally" as though it is a fact when anyone with an iota of intellect can tell that your interpretation of "literally" is literally incorrect.

No name calling. No personal attacks. MY OPINION.

Blatant lies. You attacked mreezybreezy because of his post count and derided his intellect because he disagreed with you. And throughout the thread, your constant condescension did the work of name-calling and personal attacks for you.

That's isn't being a jerk.

Yeah, it is.

It's really a simple concept to be honest.

And this only emphasizes it. This right here is you, once again, being a jerk. Being condescending. Acting superior. Doing everything in that one phrase that you claim you haven't done at all in this thread.

I'll happily admit that I'm being condescending right back here. I'll even admit that by shoving all of your horsecrap and lies back in your face, I'm being a bit of a jerk. But I'm happy to own it. And the only reason I do so is because you spent the entire thread being a prick and then got all uppity when someone called you on it.

If you don't want to be called a jerk, don't be a jerk. It's really a simple concept, to be honest.

[PGsHeroes32]

Good lord you have taken ridiculous to a whole new level. First find a damn hobby holy sh it.

Second. Ask if a brain fucntions at full capacity isn't name calling. You CALLING me a Jerk, is however. Hypocrite. There a name for you. That poster came after me first.

I didn't berate anyones opinion. I gave my first hand opinion having actually WATCHED Wally. You know, I can objectively state it.

TAMU even tried to imply that I was just reading stats. And I stated that wasn't the case.

You tired to compare Wally to Deonte and clearly it hurt your feelings. Seriously, do you have a social life of any sort if this sets you off?

You are an ignorant and hypocritical JERK. There, I joined your world.

Good lord. If anyone disagrees with the almighty Brewcity.

No wonder Ners stirred the pot so much. So people like yourself just can't handle a differing opinion.

Also, if you are going to name call make sure you know the English definition of the word jerk. Condescending doesn't fit the bill.

[PGsHeroes32]

You called the Gophers a great team to back up Wally not playing

I am a jerk for telling you how incorrect that is as I watch EVERY game.

Talk about condescending.

Therapy may not save you.

[GGGG]

FWIW, I thought you were a little blunt in your comments and opinions about Wally.  That doesn't make you a jerk however.

[PGsHeroes32]

FWIW, I thought you were a little blunt in your comments and opinions about Wally.  That doesn't make you a jerk however.

I agree the way I worded things about Wally were a little blunt and that's why I tried to at least make it clear that I don't hate Wally like certain people have hated more recent players. Didn't mean for it to even blow up like this but people kept reply to my initial opinion.

I've seen him play albeit brief due to PT and I just don't see Wojo allowing it to get to a point where he guards a 4 because i don't see him capable. Just like I don't see Sandy or JJJ capable.

Should just leave it at this though. Assuming the name calling is left as is.

[brewcity77]

Good lord you have taken ridiculous to a whole new level. First find a damn hobby holy sh it.

Second. Ask if a brain fucntions at full capacity isn't name calling. You CALLING me a Jerk, is however. Hypocrite. There a name for you. That poster came after me first.

I didn't berate anyones opinion. I gave my first hand opinion having actually WATCHED Wally. You know, I can objectively state it.

TAMU even tried to imply that I was just reading stats. And I stated that wasn't the case.

You tired to compare Wally to Deonte and clearly it hurt your feelings. Seriously, do you have a social life of any sort if this sets you off?

You are an ignorant and hypocritical JERK. There, I joined your world.

Good lord. If anyone disagrees with the almighty Brewcity.

No wonder Ners stirred the pot so much. So people like yourself just can't handle a differing opinion.

Also, if you are going to name call make sure you know the English definition of the word jerk. Condescending doesn't fit the bill.

No, I didn't really care one way or the other. I didn't get bent out of shape. When you were condescending to me, I let it roll off my back because taking time to get bothered by the opinions of people on the internet usually isn't really worth it.

Boxer said you were acting like a jerk. You got bent out of shape. I tried to be gentle, you got bent out of shape, I explained. About as simple as that. I'm not upset. I'm not set off. Sorry if you are, but it was your own tone and response to Boxer that brought that about.

[Henry Sugar]

Back to thoughts on 15-16, I think we'll be better simply by being taller. Last year, we were the #193 team for height. This year, we should be somewhere in the range of 50-75.

There's a correlation between height and overall Pomeroy improvement, overall defensive ranking, offensive eFG%, and offensive OR%. All of these should be obvious, because height is really important in basketball.

I could see MU with a jump of roughly 30-40 spots for eFG% and 30-35 spots for OR% just by being taller.

[PGsHeroes32]

No, I didn't really care one way or the other. I didn't get bent out of shape. When you were condescending to me, I let it roll off my back because taking time to get bothered by the opinions of people on the internet usually isn't really worth it.

Boxer said you were acting like a jerk. You got bent out of shape. I tried to be gentle, you got bent out of shape, I explained. About as simple as that. I'm not upset. I'm not set off. Sorry if you are, but it was your own tone and response to Boxer that brought that about.

You got some super ability to identify tone over the Internet?

How does me list all the things I said and saying they don't qualify as bein a "jerk" mean I am bent out of shape or had a tone?

You dissected every post and twisted them how you saw fit. Clearly you were a little bent, maybe not broken but there was a bend.

Anyways. That's it. Over it.

[Galway Eagle]

Giving my informed opinion on actually seeing him play is being a jerk?

Saying I would love to be wrong is being a jerk?

Saying he deserves PT is being a jerk?

Saying I'm glad he's on the team is being a jerk?

Saying I don't feel he has proven anything to be counted on is being a jerk?

How did you get this far in life? I'm truly curious now.

No an added comment like "how did you get this far in life? I'm truly curious now" that's being a jerk

Saying "It's simply wrong. I know your brain probably doesn't function at full capacity to know why it's wrong, but at least try." that's being a jerk

I disagree with Brewcity about the condescending stuff it was blunt but not jerkish.  I saw your brain comment and called it like I saw it.  

Your defense to your comment about the brain capacity was that you were asking and that isn't insulting but A) you didn't ask anything, you said word for word "I know your brain probably doesn't function at full capacity..." so that's just lying.  B) That's an insult man even asking because of the implication that you are so baffled that a person could have a differing opinion than yours so they must function at a lower level. If you can't see that then you aren't a jerk you're just a loud mouth.  

If you'd like to meet for coffee, beer, boxing ring to say those things to my face in person I'd be happy to but until then I call them like I see them and I saw it as you trying to be an online tough guy which came off as being a jerk. Nothing wrong with it we all do it I'm a jerk to Chicos and Willie, lots of people were jerks to Ners and Texas Western, the list goes on I was just pointing it out that you were doing it

Anyhow I expect wally to be an energy guy who plays his butt off for minutes. Not a standout, but someone who can help keep momentum when our stars need a rest. Doubt he can guard the 4 but hope he can step in and do it for a couple minutes because he'll probably get called to do it at some point.  

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Second. Ask if a brain fucntions at full capacity isn't name calling.

I don't have a dog in this fight, but I love this defense. "I'm not calling you a motherf*cker. I'm just asking if you f*ck your own mother every night?"

[GGGG]

Back to thoughts on 15-16, I think we'll be better simply by being taller. Last year, we were the #193 team for height. This year, we should be somewhere in the range of 50-75.

There's a correlation between height and overall Pomeroy improvement, overall defensive ranking, offensive eFG%, and offensive OR%. All of these should be obvious, because height is really important in basketball.

I could see MU with a jump of roughly 30-40 spots for eFG% and 30-35 spots for OR% just by being taller.

Is there anyway that can be correlated into an estimate of expected wins?

[THRILLHO]

I don't have a dog in this fight, but I love this defense. "I'm not calling you a motherf*cker. I'm just asking if you f*ck your own mother every night?"

I think we need Heisenberg to start a poll about whether HaywardsHeroes32 was being a jerk or not. I would do it but my title would probably be too boring .

[Henry Sugar]

Is there anyway that can be correlated into an estimate of expected wins?

Short answer - the extra height is worth 1-3 more wins.

Long answer - this is really fuzzy math. Height is only loosely correlated with an improvement (R^2 of .25), even if it is statistically significant. The improvement in the team can be anywhere from a 30-40 pt jump in eFG/OR% to a 60 ranking jump in adj D to a 70 ranking jump in overall Pomeroy ranking. I don't much buy the overall jumps in Defense or overall Pomeroy ranking. Just the eFG%/OR% is worth around 1 win. The Defensive improvement is worth about 3 wins.

Complicating matters is that MU underperformed their Pomeroy numbers last year. Given their offensive and defensive rankings (101.5 / 97.6), MU should have finished with a record of roughly 18-19 wins and 13-14 losses. Of course, MU also lost a bunch of games because six BE teams were top 50 Pomeroy teams. Regardless, even if I put a similar improvement into the rankings for last year, it still ends up with 1-3 more wins. Last, the talent (and depth) will also clearly impact.

Having said all that, I think 1-3 more wins based on simply being taller passes the reasonable test.

[GGGG]

Short answer - the extra height is worth 1-3 more wins.

Long answer - this is really fuzzy math. Height is only loosely correlated with an improvement (R^2 of .25), even if it is statistically significant. The improvement in the team can be anywhere from a 30-40 pt jump in eFG/OR% to a 60 ranking jump in adj D to a 70 ranking jump in overall Pomeroy ranking. I don't much buy the overall jumps in Defense or overall Pomeroy ranking. Just the eFG%/OR% is worth around 1 win. The Defensive improvement is worth about 3 wins.

Complicating matters is that MU underperformed their Pomeroy numbers last year. Given their offensive and defensive rankings (101.5 / 97.6), MU should have finished with a record of roughly 18-19 wins and 13-14 losses. Of course, MU also lost a bunch of games because six BE teams were top 50 Pomeroy teams. Regardless, even if I put a similar improvement into the rankings for last year, it still ends up with 1-3 more wins. Last, the talent (and depth) will also clearly impact.

Having said all that, I think 1-3 more wins based on simply being taller passes the reasonable test.

Thanks.  One more question, does this look at the overall height on the roster, or are the playing time minutes factored in?  For instance, I don't think Heldt will be playing more than back up minutes.

[Henry Sugar]

Thanks.  One more question, does this look at the overall height on the roster, or are the playing time minutes factored in?  For instance, I don't think Heldt will be playing more than back up minutes.

Playing time minutes are factored in. Height is calculated as the sumproduct of min/player * height of that player, then divided by five (for players on the court), then divided by 40 (for minutes per game). MPG is a huge part of the team height calculation.

I used the responses from this thread for the minutes predictions.
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=46908.msg709474#msg709474

Of course, this also assumes Steve Taylor getting ~20 mpg. Using Taylor, we predict to #58 for height, which is why I used a range from 50-75 in the previous post. The three biggest contributors on minutes were Luke Fischer (height of 83), Henry Ellenson (height of 82), and Duane Wilson (height of 74). Last year we were at a team height of 76.56, and the current view is a team height of 77.54.

Specifically, the MUScoop prediction for Heldt was 8 mpg, out of 200 available. He's not a huge contributor to the overall height prediction.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I think we need Heisenberg to start a poll about whether HaywardsHeroes32 was being a jerk or not. I would do it but my title would probably be too boring .

"Are MU fans jerks?"

"Do all MU fans hate each other?"

"Why are MU fans jerks?"

"Why doesn't anybody know that Pac12 fans are jerks?"

"Do MU fans have brains that function?"

"Does Wojo know about MU fans brains?

"Did Bert leave MU because of the fans brainpower?"

"Is Wally the reason for strife at MU?"

[Henry Sugar]

Also, FWIW, both Lee (height of 78) and Miller (height of 79) would positively improve the height ranking.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

You got some super ability to identify tone over the Internet?

How does me list all the things I said and saying they don't qualify as bein a "jerk" mean I am bent out of shape or had a tone?

You dissected every post and twisted them how you saw fit. Clearly you were a little bent, maybe not broken but there was a bend.

Anyways. That's it. Over it.

Everybody cut the crap.

Haywards, everybody in this specific thread was pretty realistic about Wally's abilities.

I suspect you were carrying some baggage from previous glowing reviews you had read about Wally, and you were a little blunt with people in this specific thread.

Doesn't mean you're wrong (we agree), or you're a bad guy (I have never seen you kick a puppy), but you came in running a little hot for this specific conversation and people noticed.

Not a big deal, bros.

[bilsu]

Wally is the typical super athlete that was good in high school, because of his superior athleticism. The same athleticism allowed him to get by without developing his skill level. Wojo came in saying how he was going to improve player skills. He has had a year to work with Wally, so the two might be a perfect match. This will be the year I decide whether he can actually coach. MU will be a pretty good team if Wilson, JJJ, Fischer and Cohen's games take significant leaps.  However, so far I have not been impressed with Wojo's ability to improve players.

[Jay Bee]

Wally is the typical super athlete that was good in high school, because of his superior athleticism. The same athleticism allowed him to get by without developing his skill level.

Nonsense.

[Jay Bee]

Short answer - the extra height is worth 1-3 more wins.

Long answer - this is really fuzzy math. Height is only loosely correlated with an improvement (R^2 of .25), even if it is statistically significant. The improvement in the team can be anywhere from a 30-40 pt jump in eFG/OR% to a 60 ranking jump in adj D to a 70 ranking jump in overall Pomeroy ranking. I don't much buy the overall jumps in Defense or overall Pomeroy ranking. Just the eFG%/OR% is worth around 1 win. The Defensive improvement is worth about 3 wins.

Complicating matters is that MU underperformed their Pomeroy numbers last year. Given their offensive and defensive rankings (101.5 / 97.6), MU should have finished with a record of roughly 18-19 wins and 13-14 losses. Of course, MU also lost a bunch of games because six BE teams were top 50 Pomeroy teams. Regardless, even if I put a similar improvement into the rankings for last year, it still ends up with 1-3 more wins. Last, the talent (and depth) will also clearly impact.

Having said all that, I think 1-3 more wins based on simply being taller passes the reasonable test.

I tend to believe that the positive impact from height (on average, across the spectrum of all teams) comes mostly from the tallest players on the team, as opposed to the weighted average height (on a minutes played basis) of 5 positions.. and that it's seen more on the defensive side of the ball (block%, the related 2FG% defense.

Offense things get tricky -- breakdown of 3FGA/FGA becomes important. 

Overall, I don't see there being enough correlation to get too wild over it when modeling.

But, as to MU in 2015-16 vs. 2014-15... I think the additional height will help a lot, especially in the "4" / "PF" / "60% to 80% of tallest minutes" spot. We were -.6 off the average last season - very small for a conference such as ours. We were second only to St. John's.. as another example, the Big Ten had only one school lower than -.3.. Michigan State, but they had a 6'6" senior forward who can rebound like no other in BJ Dawson. As for St. John's, the negative impact from a lack of size after the tallest 20% of minutes was partly offset by having Obekpa - an absolutely elite shot block and very good rebounder. Our 6'11" center had an injured wing who put up poor rebounding numbers.

All depends on specifics... and the details of MU's height this coming year and the details of the 2014-15 season... together would seem to reasonable project positive things for the team on a year-over-year basis