Saddest day of the year

[4everwarriors]

Y'all just need to man up. It ain't an entitlement program. Ya get what ya earn, hey?

[ChicosBailBonds]

Changes none of what I said. We did make the Elite 8, virtually every pundit had is as a top 10 team -- I looked at another 6-7 rankings, all but one had us top 10. We were absolutely a Final Four contender in the eyes of most every national outlet and expert.

Those same experts had us winning the Big East last year.

[brewcity77]

Those same experts had us winning the Big East last year.

That's my point 

Are you trying to disagree just to be contrarian?

[ChicosBailBonds]

That's my point  

Are you trying to disagree just to be contrarian?

I'm not sure it proves your point...those experts picked MU to win the Big East last year AFTER Vander left. 

"experts" make lots of predictions in the preseason or after the postseason for next year.  Aside from a handful of teams that a blind woman in Nova Scotia could also identify, the experts are wildly wrong.  Half the preseason top 25 doesn't finish there, while some don't even make the tournament.

I absolutely agree that Vander coming back would have been huge for the program, but he listened to a lot of the wrong people and made an incredibly stupid decision.   It is what it is.

[brewcity77]

Many times this year, I thought "what the hell are we doing out there?" I feel the same about your, umm, argument (?) right now. Has no bearing on what I'm saying. Color me confused.

[kryza]

Yup. Blue would have slid to the 1 like Buycks did when Junior wasn't ready. Jake would have transferred, giving us a primary backcourt of Van and Mayo. In a perfect world, Jamil, Otule, and McKay start with Davante, Duane, and Derrick off the bench.

It all ended up a disaster, but on March 30, 2012, we had the look of a contender.

Dare I say...Hiroshima?

[wadesworld]

"experts" make lots of predictions in the preseason or after the postseason for next year.  Aside from a handful of teams that a blind woman in Nova Scotia could also identify, the experts are wildly wrong.  Half the preseason top 25 doesn't finish there, while some don't even make the tournament.

I absolutely agree that Vander coming back would have been huge for the program, but he listened to a lot of the wrong people and made an incredibly stupid decision.   It is what it is.

Stupid decision for...who?

Given that Vander still hasn't made it to the NBA and his profession is to literally play basketball rather than having to also spend time in the classroom, in study halls, etc., I'm guessing Vander wouldn't have been drafted after his senior season, either.  In fact, pay attention to how many seniors get drafted in the NBA Draft.  It isn't many.  So he started earning money 1 year earlier than he would've had he come back.  "Incredibly stupid decision?"  Glad you know the details of his personal life and all that led to him making that decision.

[wadesworld]

We were 1 second away from being 1 and done as well and Davidson crapped the bed.  Crapshoot.  It is a very thin line.

If you consider scoring 7 points in 4 possessions (1.75 points per possession) on 3-4 from the line, 1-1 from the field, and 1 turnover over the last 1:10 of the game (when Marquette came back from 6 down) to be "crapping the bed" then you're right.  If they scored at that rate throughout the entire game they would've scored 240 points.  So, yeah, I guess they crapped the bed.

It's okay to admit that Marquette stepped up and took the game.  We all know you don't like Bert.  A lot of us here don't.  But it's cool to give his teams credit when they deserve it.  Davidson played extremely well down the stretch of that game.  Marquette simply played better.  But you know that already.  Just don't want to publicly admit it.

[brewcity77]

Show me one credible expert who was saying MU was a Final Four contender. Otherwise, shut up.

Found one other guy that thought Marquette was returning a top-10 team at the time. Not sure if you consider him credible or not...

Buzz is going to walk away from a preseason top 10 team—with a top 10 recruiting class coming in??? All for the honor of dealing with the insane expectations and pressure at UCLA?

Sorry, just not seeing it.

[Tums Festival]

Yup. Blue would have slid to the 1 like Buycks did when Junior wasn't ready. Jake would have transferred, giving us a primary backcourt of Van and Mayo. In a perfect world, Jamil, Otule, and McKay start with Davante, Duane, and Derrick off the bench.

It all ended up a disaster, but on March 30, 2012, we had the look of a contender.

+1,000

And, arguably, at that time we were the better program compared to Becky. Especially because no one knew Kaminsky was going to blow up the way he has.

[dgies9156]

What makes today tolerable is the notion that brighter days are ahead.

We have a great class coming in. Wojo isn't done and our holdovers have promise.

We can contend next year for an NCAA spot.

T Minus 365 days and counting.

[wadesworld]

What makes today tolerable is the notion that brighter days are ahead.

We have a great class coming in. Wojo isn't done and our holdovers have promise.

We can contend next year for an NCAA spot.

T Minus 365 days and counting.

+1.  (Although it won't be exactly 365 days, because March 15, 2016 won't be a Sunday  )

[ChicosBailBonds]

Stupid decision for...who?

Given that Vander still hasn't made it to the NBA and his profession is to literally play basketball rather than having to also spend time in the classroom, in study halls, etc., I'm guessing Vander wouldn't have been drafted after his senior season, either.  In fact, pay attention to how many seniors get drafted in the NBA Draft.  It isn't many.  So he started earning money 1 year earlier than he would've had he come back.  "Incredibly stupid decision?"  Glad you know the details of his personal life and all that led to him making that decision.

If he would have stayed, he would have been drafted and likely given a contract.  I hope it works out for him, but the GM's were right, Draft Express was right....he listened to the wrong people.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Many times this year, I thought "what the hell are we doing out there?" I feel the same about your, umm, argument (?) right now. Has no bearing on what I'm saying. Color me confused.

My point was the experts that said we were a top 10 team and Final Four contender are the same experts that said MU would win the Big East even after Blue left.  The experts aren't that good at figuring this stuff out.

[brewcity77]

My point was the experts that said we were a top 10 team and Final Four contender are the same experts that said MU would win the Big East even after Blue left.  The experts aren't that good at figuring this stuff out.

Which has nothing at all to do with the discussion at hand.

[wadesworld]

If he would have stayed, he would have been drafted and likely given a contract.  I hope it works out for him, but the GM's were right, Draft Express was right....he listened to the wrong people.

Disagreed.  I would be shocked if Vander developed more by staying in school and being required to spend time in classrooms and study halls than he did playing professional basketball and focusing solely on basketball and developing as a basketball player.  Vander may have been drafted in the 2nd round, which means no guaranteed contract, and he would've been 1 year behind in being paid to play the sport he plays.  Seniors aren't typically drooled about by NBA GMs, especially guards who can't shoot.  That's what Vander would've been, as he still is a guard who can't shoot.

[ChicosBailBonds]

If you consider scoring 7 points in 4 possessions (1.75 points per possession) on 3-4 from the line, 1-1 from the field, and 1 turnover over the last 1:10 of the game (when Marquette came back from 6 down) to be "crapping the bed" then you're right.  If they scored at that rate throughout the entire game they would've scored 240 points.  So, yeah, I guess they crapped the bed.

It's okay to admit that Marquette stepped up and took the game.  We all know you don't like Bert.  A lot of us here don't.  But it's cool to give his teams credit when they deserve it.  Davidson played extremely well down the stretch of that game.  Marquette simply played better.  But you know that already.  Just don't want to publicly admit it.

"we're lucky to still be standing" - Buzz Williams

Davidson crapped the bed.  Type the word choke Davidson Marquette into Google.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Disagreed.  I would be shocked if Vander developed more by staying in school and being required to spend time in classrooms and study halls than he did playing professional basketball and focusing solely on basketball and developing as a basketball player.  Vander may have been drafted in the 2nd round, which means no guaranteed contract, and he would've been 1 year behind in being paid to play the sport he plays.  Seniors aren't typically drooled about by NBA GMs, especially guards who can't shoot.  That's what Vander would've been, as he still is a guard who can't shoot.

He would have had to stay in the classroom for one more semester and could have totally blown off the second semester.

There is a reason why every GM but one said stay in school.  He would have been the key cog on a quality team (assuming Buzz didn't unnatural carnal knowledge it up) and that alone would have put way more GMs on his side for consideration.

He could have shown his PG traits as well.   It was a dumb decision, and the people in the know....those pesky GMs....said stay in school.  He didn't listen.

[brewcity77]

SMH

How many times do we have to have the "tourney is a crapshoot" and "Davidson choked" discussion? CBB, we know where you stand on this because you've posted it about 400 times. Unless you changed where you stand on either of those, no need to rehash either again.

[GGGG]

SMH

How many times do we have to have the "tourney is a crapshoot" and "Davidson choked" discussion? CBB, we know where you stand on this because you've posted it about 400 times. Unless you changed where you stand on either of those, no need to rehash either again.

Right.  And he changes the subject to make the same points repeatedly. 

[GGGG]

Stupid decision for...who?

Given that Vander still hasn't made it to the NBA and his profession is to literally play basketball rather than having to also spend time in the classroom, in study halls, etc., I'm guessing Vander wouldn't have been drafted after his senior season, either.  In fact, pay attention to how many seniors get drafted in the NBA Draft.  It isn't many.  So he started earning money 1 year earlier than he would've had he come back.  "Incredibly stupid decision?"  Glad you know the details of his personal life and all that led to him making that decision.

Vander made the NBA.

[muwarrior69]

A lot of people are making a $h!tload of money on the road to the National Crapshoot.

[Nukem2]

Vander made the NBA.

10 day contract = cup of coffee.

[GGGG]

10 day contract = cup of coffee.

Yes, but it is still factually correct to say he made the NBA.

Staying in college another year would not have changed anything IMO.  (Outside of being closer to his degree.)

[Nukem2]

Yes, but it is still factually correct to say he made the NBA.

Staying in college another year would not have changed anything IMO.  (Outside of being closer to his degree.)

Yes.  So are his 5 points and 3 rebounds in 3 games.