Dwyane Wade's outdoor basketball court

[Tugg Speedman]

It also should be pounded in to some brains that .. While it *might* have been Crean who read about some altitude chamber, it was far more likely that his strength trainer / medical staff came up with the idea.  Regardless, he would have given it to them as food for thought and they pursued the idea, with plenty of "experts" advising on its use.  

If they got it wrong, it's not on Crean, besides him trusting training experts who advised MU to use it incorrectly.

Again, their is nothing wrong with coming up with the idea of using altitude chambers.  They are legitimate training tools that can be effective in improving endurance.  So, yes the training staff might have said the concept was a good idea.

The problem was the implementation.  Not only were they being used incorrectly, but incorrect in a way that reduced one's endurance. So, they were actually making things worse.  How did that happen?  Two possibilities:

1 The training staff was unqualified to use them.  They wanted the shiny new toy but neglected to figure out the proper way to implement it.  

I'm not buying  No. 1 above.  My guess is it is something closer to no. 2 below  ....

2.  The Tan One wanted the new toy because he either read or saw it at some professional training facility.  After they got it and the training staff told him the proper use, meaning you have to live it, sleep it in so you forces your body to get more efficient to compensate for being a high altitude, the Tan one rejected this use.  Since they had it, he then put a couple of exercise bikes in it and made up some loopy training exercise all for the purpose of calling some reporters so he can say "look how cool we are."

Added:

Altitude tents are so last decade.  The new toy everyone wants is Alter-G or "zero gravity" treadmills!  How many does IU basketball have?  You think they have one in their altitude chamber too?

[GGGG]

Actually I think the answer is that hypoxic training was considered all the rage a decade ago, but is falling out of favor because research has had mixed results about its effectiveness.

But don't let that get in your way when it comes to your irrational thoughts about Crean.

[brewcity77]

What is the kid, 12-13 years old? Way too early to start projections--unless a kid is athletic and 6'9" at 13. Then maybe. But wait until he is 16-17 before starting the raves and hopes. It is OK for Wade to hope--he is the Dad.

Decided to do a little research, and it looks like Zaire is either turning 13 next month, which would make him a 2019, or is a 2020 (no indication of age other than 5th grade).

http://theybf.com/2012/02/10/exclusive-pics-zaire-wades-big-fabulous-sporty-10th-birthday-hosted-by-daddy-dwyane

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/highschool-prep-rally/dwyane-wade-son-zaire-one-nation-top-fifth-101514122.html

http://www.middleschoolhoops.com/zaire-wade-2020-basketball-profile-middleschoolhoops-com/

Philip Flory was 14 when he was offered and committed to Marquette. Plenty of history of coaches offering kids that young, though eighth grade to freshman year is about as young as most schools go. Watching the video from 18 months ago, he looks really little (they all do) but it seems like he's likely in 7th grade now, so I'm sure the interest will start rolling in within the next couple years.

I suppose it's a positive that Wade has been reconnecting with the program since Wojo arrived, they have a previous relationship through USA basketball, and daddy is already dreaming of his kid wearing the blue and gold, but I'm not going to spend any more time hoping for Zaire until we have a better sense of where he's at. Maybe in a year or two, but there are a lot of recruits left between now (still have 2015 openings) and then.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Again, their is nothing wrong with coming up with the idea of using altitude chambers.  They are legitimate training tools that can be effective in improving endurance.  So, yes the training staff might have said the concept was a good idea.

The problem was the implementation.  Not only were they being used incorrectly, but incorrect in a way that reduced one's endurance. So, they were actually making things worse.  How did that happen?  Two possibilities:

1 The training staff was unqualified to use them.  They wanted the shiny new toy but neglected to figure out the proper way to implement it.  

I'm not buying  No. 1 above.  My guess is it is something closer to no. 2 below  ....

2.  The Tan One wanted the new toy because he either read or saw it at some professional training facility.  After they got it and the training staff told him the proper use, meaning you have to live it, sleep it in so you forces your body to get more efficient to compensate for being a high altitude, the Tan one rejected this use.  Since they had it, he then put a couple of exercise bikes in it and made up some loopy training exercise all for the purpose of calling some reporters so he can say "look how cool we are."

Added:

Altitude tents are so last decade.  The new toy everyone wants is Alter-G or "zero gravity" treadmills!  How many does IU basketball have?  You think they have one in their altitude chamber too?

But again, Tom was using them in the exact same way that professional basketball teams were using them. So he was following the lead of experts in the field. If he was using them incorrectly, it's because experts were also using them incorrectly.

[Tugg Speedman]

But again, Tom was using them in the exact same way that professional basketball teams were using them. So he was following the lead of experts in the field. If he was using them incorrectly, it's because experts were also using them incorrectly.

I disagree with that ... I've been a competitive runner for decades.  I'm well into understanding how to train endurance athletes.  In this circle altitude tents became popular in the 1990s and it was understood 15 years ago that what MU did with them in 2007 was wrong.

Now if you want to tell me that the dirty little secret is that a lot of trainers and strength/conditioning (s/c) coaches for professional teams and top D1 schools are really not that good, I would not disagree.  I've met a number of trainers and s/c coaches that I have left shaking my head at how that got that job and why they are allowed to mess with multimillion dollar athletes.

[314warrior]

Again, their is nothing wrong with coming up with the idea of using altitude chambers.  They are legitimate training tools that can be effective in improving endurance.  So, yes the training staff might have said the concept was a good idea.

The problem was the implementation.  Not only were they being used incorrectly, but incorrect in a way that reduced one's endurance. So, they were actually making things worse.  How did that happen?  Two possibilities:

You are correct.  They used these devices incorrectly.  If other pro teams were using them for hypoxic or hypobaric training, they were also using them incorrectly (or at least in an unproven way).  

Live high-train low encourages new blood cells to grow, increasing endurance.  Live low-train high just results in difficult and sub-optimal training.  There is some conflicting data about live-low-train high exercise (it may be useful for altitude acclimation), but it is very far from providing any well established benefit. Even a live high-train low regimen would have minimal benefit for sports like basketball or football - certainly not for players that are still growing physically and not already at peak athletic endurance which normally occurs later in life (mid 20s-early 30s).  I was on campus at the time and had an endurance athlete friend who lost his mind at how the university was wasting money on its athletes.  It was a stupid purchase.  Perhaps those chambers had some very good sales teams in the mid-2000s.

[wadesworld]

You are correct.  They used these devices incorrectly.  If other pro teams were using them for hypoxic or hypobaric training, they were also using them incorrectly (or at least in an unproven way).  

Live high-train low encourages new blood cells to grow, increasing endurance.  Live low-train high just results in difficult and sub-optimal training.  There is some conflicting data about live-low-train high exercise (it may be useful for altitude acclimation), but it is very far from providing any well established benefit. Even a live high-train low regimen would have minimal benefit for sports like basketball or football - certainly not for players that are still growing physically and not already at peak athletic endurance which normally occurs later in life (mid 20s-early 30s).  I was on campus at the time and had an endurance athlete friend who lost his mind at how the university was wasting money on its athletes.  It was a stupid purchase.  Perhaps those chambers had some very good sales teams in the mid-2000s.

Yup.

[ChicosBailBonds]

But again, Tom was using them in the exact same way that professional basketball teams were using them. So he was following the lead of experts in the field. If he was using them incorrectly, it's because experts were also using them incorrectly.

Exactly my point, but for some people connecting all the dots doesn't seem to matter.  The fact that the experts in the field were using them the same way is apparently not worthy of comment, or the fact that we were relying on those experts and professionals to do their job and do it correctly. Instead we get a guess on what might of happened and pass it off as fact.

Funny to read this stuff, that's for sure.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Just like it's not Bert's fault Monarch gave a tshirt to Steve and then lied about it, but according to chicos that falls on Bert because he's the boss. But the lack of control over his players at IU is not Crean's, either, so...

A few problems with your analogy...

1) Monarch's boss was Bert.   The head trainer's boss is not the basketball coach.  The training staff services multiple teams
2) Monarch has to pass a NCAA certification test like everyone else in the department.  The basketball coach is not expected to be an expert in O2 levels, training procedures, the latest ways to tape ankles, etc....that's why they rely on medical advice from the trainers, doctors, etc...the experts
3) Under your analogy, if there is a corruption in the data file of a video provided while scouting a team, the head basketball coach is supposed to know how to fix that corruption...not the vendor or the video coordinator

You're better than this Wade.....really not your best efforts or Heisenberg's.  It is early in 2015 still.  You both get a mulligan

[ChicosBailBonds]

You are correct.  They used these devices incorrectly.  If other pro teams were using them for hypoxic or hypobaric training, they were also using them incorrectly (or at least in an unproven way).  

Live high-train low encourages new blood cells to grow, increasing endurance.  Live low-train high just results in difficult and sub-optimal training.  There is some conflicting data about live-low-train high exercise (it may be useful for altitude acclimation), but it is very far from providing any well established benefit. Even a live high-train low regimen would have minimal benefit for sports like basketball or football - certainly not for players that are still growing physically and not already at peak athletic endurance which normally occurs later in life (mid 20s-early 30s).  I was on campus at the time and had an endurance athlete friend who lost his mind at how the university was wasting money on its athletes.  It was a stupid purchase.  Perhaps those chambers had some very good sales teams in the mid-2000s.

Maybe they were all using them incorrectly.  Stupid purchase?  That's hindsight.  At the time, it was considered cutting edge.  To the point that several folks in that article said they will be the norm within a decade.   Other pro teams were using it for the same purpose we were.  So MU tried to get ahead of the curve and get an advantage..oh the holy hell why would we want to do that?  How terrible.

You know, there was a day not so many years ago when Rick Majerus and others wanted training table, better weight room, etc...to keep pace or get a recruiting edge.   The administration didn't want to do it, it was a "stupid purchase".   That mindset finally began to change.  We went after something we thought would give the team an edge, like other pro teams had done.  A few years ago we started using SportsVU which we share with the Milwaukee Bucks.  It's about trying to get an edge. Some things will work, some will not.   Do you want your program stagnating on this kind of stuff, or trying to be a leader?

Whatever floats your boat guys, but this may be one of the silliest ones in awhile. 

[wadesworld]

A few problems with your analogy...

1) Monarch's boss was Bert.   The head trainer's boss is not the basketball coach.  The training staff services multiple teams
2) Monarch has to pass a NCAA certification test like everyone else in the department.  The basketball coach is not expected to be an expert in O2 levels, training procedures, the latest ways to tape ankles, etc....that's why they rely on medical advice from the trainers, doctors, etc...the experts
3) Under your analogy, if there is a corruption in the data file of a video provided while scouting a team, the head basketball coach is supposed to know how to fix that corruption...not the vendor or the video coordinator

You're better than this Wade.....really not your best efforts or Heisenberg's.  It is early in 2015 still.  You both get a mulligan

1) I'm thinking the strength and conditioning coach, the one who works directly for the basketball team, is probably someone they would turn to when looking for "cutting edge" conditioning tools.
2) Yes.  Monarch needed to pass an NCAA certification test just like everyone else in the department.  So why is Bert the one to blame for Monarch's failure to carry out those standards, and then lying about it?  I continue to be baffled by this.  We're talking about a professional who failed to do his job properly, and you want to blame this on someone else.  This isn't some toddler who can't control his behavior.  We're talking about an adult, who gets paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to do his job properly, and failed to do so.  I'll tell you what, if I went into my company's bank account and started slowly transferring money from it into my personal bank account without their consent, I'm going to go ahead and say I'm the one who will be going to jail, not my CFO.  But hey, maybe some lawyers should give your reasoning a try, I bet that'll work out real nice for them.
3) If the video coordinator can't figure out how to fix it, should we blame the coach since he's the boss?  To you, it depends.  Is the coach Bert, or is it Crean?  If it's Crean, it's obviously the video coordinator's fault.  If the boss is Bert, Bert has no control of his employees and needs to be held accountable.

Glad you were able to settle the restless IU fans down during your absence.  We missed you here.

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

As I recall, the issue wasn't so much that Marquette had these chambers, as unusual as that was, it's that the small town, social climbing, nouveau riche Crean thought it was important that everybody knew how much the things cost!  This is the same douche bag who had his coaches riding around in gold Hummers. He also tried to impress recruits by showing up at their homes in the middle of the night in a limo. Either he has the tiniest penis in major collegiate athletics or he's a modern day Jethro Bodine. My God was he the worst!! Buzz was a 1000x more appealing!

[wadesworld]

As I recall, the issue wasn't so much that Marquette had these chambers, as unusual as that was, it's that the small town, social climbing, nouveau riche Crean thought it was important that everybody knew how much the things cost!  This is the same douche bag who had his coaches riding around in gold Hummers. He also tried to impress recruits by showing up at their homes in the middle of the night in a limo. Either he has the tiniest penis in major collegiate athletics or he's a modern day Jethro Bodine. My God was he the worst!! Buzz was a 1000x more appealing!

Works for me. I'll leave it there.

[4everwarriors]

As I recall, the issue wasn't so much that Marquette had these chambers, as unusual as that was, it's that the small town, social climbing, nouveau riche Crean thought it was important that everybody knew how much the things cost!  This is the same douche bag who had his coaches riding around in gold Hummers. He also tried to impress recruits by showing up at their homes in the middle of the night in a limo. Either he has the tiniest penis in major collegiate athletics or he's a modern day Jethro Bodine. My God was he the worst!! Buzz was a 1000x more appealing!

I'm down with this too, kin. For the record, count me in for figurin' he's a member of the tiniest penis group, aina?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

NVM, not really worth it. It's been seven years, how have people not gotten over this?

[mu_hilltopper]

NVM, not really worth it. It's been seven years, how have people not gotten over this?

Can't you just envision the MUScoop Nursing home in the year 2055, all these guys in their rocking chairs, wrapped in blankets, smelling like Ben Gay, reminiscing about the Apocalyptic Chamber that that fool Crean ate his breakfast in?

[4everwarriors]

Ben Gay? More like rancid canned prunes, aina?

[Golden Avalanche]

NVM, not really worth it. It's been seven years, how have people not gotten over this?

Because people are inherently pathetic losers whose lives stack up so small in the meaningful ways they hoped for as a youth that the bitter vitriol they now weaponize against those in public positions is the only vindication they have, however shallow, to remain alive in this squalid world of their own creation.

[GooooMarquette]

Geez, it's time to move on.

The way TC left was pretty lame, but he brought us a Final Four, DWade, Travis, the Amigos, Lazar.  Good >>>>>> Bad.

[WellsstreetWanderer]

When I joined Scoop I remarked that many on here, present company included, at times seemed like a murder of crows or a group of shut-ins.
My experience in medical industry leads me to remember that there are toxicity issues with hyperbaric chambers. Used for hypoxia but can't see how intermediate use would lead to increased red cell manufacture.

[Skatastrophy]

Geez, it's time to move on.

The way TC left was pretty lame, but he brought us a Final Four, DWade, Travis, the Amigos, Lazar.  Good >>>>>> Bad.

False.

[wadesworld]

When I joined Scoop I remarked that many on here, present company included, at times seemed like a murder of crows or a group of shut-ins.
My experience in medical industry leads me to remember that there are toxicity issues with hyperbaric chambers. Used for hypoxia but can't see how intermediate use would lead to increased red cell manufacture.

Ask Dr. Crean.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

False.

So if you could give back the final four, D Wade, Travis, the three Amigos, getting into the BEast, etc in exchange for not having Tom Crean as a coach for nine years, you would do it?

I honestly don't know what this board perceives as Crean's sins. He was, according to many scoopers, a douche, had odd habits, may or may not have been responsible for wasting money on some sort of altitude chamber, never followed through on his donation to the soccer team, and left his job in a very unprofessional manner. If you told me in 1999 that this would be what I had to endure for hiring Tom Crean, but I would be rewarded with a final four, a future NBA hall of famer, entry into the Big East, and all the success of the Buzz Williams era, I would take that deal in a second. In fact, every single scooper would have made that deal. Honestly, I think the price tag for Buzz' success was actually a lot more difficult to swallow.

Al really f**cked over all future Marquette coaches. If you aren't great and retire here, you are doomed to be hated by this fanbase.

[Silkk the Shaka]

So if you could give back the final four, D Wade, Travis, the three Amigos, getting into the BEast, etc in exchange for not having Tom Crean as a coach for nine years, you would do it?

I honestly don't know what this board perceives as Crean's sins. He was, according to many scoopers, a douche, had odd habits, may or may not have been responsible for wasting money on some sort of altitude chamber, never followed through on his donation to the soccer team, and left his job in a very unprofessional manner. If you told me in 1999 that this would be what I had to endure for hiring Tom Crean, but I would be rewarded with a final four, a future NBA hall of famer, entry into the Big East, and all the success of the Buzz Williams era, I would take that deal in a second. In fact, every single scooper would have made that deal. Honestly, I think the price tag for Buzz' success was actually a lot more difficult to swallow.

Al really f**cked over all future Marquette coaches. If you aren't great and retire here, you are doomed to be hated by this fanbase.

Why do you either have to love him or hate him unconditionally? I thank him for all the things you listed. Great. Now in the next stop, do worse than you did at MU, so that it makes us look better. Thanks again. I hold this view for Buzz as well, and if Wojo leaves I will for him too. No hard feelings. I just want what I perceive to be the best for MU at all points in time, no matter how minimal it may be.

[Dawson Rental]

Decided to do a little research, and it looks like Zaire is either turning 13 next month, which would make him a 2019, or is a 2020 (no indication of age other than 5th grade).

http://theybf.com/2012/02/10/exclusive-pics-zaire-wades-big-fabulous-sporty-10th-birthday-hosted-by-daddy-dwyane

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/highschool-prep-rally/dwyane-wade-son-zaire-one-nation-top-fifth-101514122.html

http://www.middleschoolhoops.com/zaire-wade-2020-basketball-profile-middleschoolhoops-com/

Philip Flory was 14 when he was offered and committed to Marquette. Plenty of history of coaches offering kids that young, though eighth grade to freshman year is about as young as most schools go. Watching the video from 18 months ago, he looks really little (they all do) but it seems like he's likely in 7th grade now, so I'm sure the interest will start rolling in within the next couple years.

I suppose it's a positive that Wade has been reconnecting with the program since Wojo arrived, they have a previous relationship through USA basketball, and daddy is already dreaming of his kid wearing the blue and gold, but I'm not going to spend any more time hoping for Zaire until we have a better sense of where he's at. Maybe in a year or two, but there are a lot of recruits left between now (still have 2015 openings) and then.

No sweat Brew, I'll pickup your slack.

LittleMurs, Zaire Wade to Marquette fan number two.  Number one has been claimed by his Daddy.