Diamond Stone

[JWags85]

And the funniest thing is that you just named 5 of the point guards who are perceived to be the best point guards in the league, and yet they have...0 rings combined.  The quarterbacks of basketball teams.

Give me Rondo and Parker running my team over any of those guys if I'm going for a championship this year.

'

The same Tony Parker who has averaged over 18 pts a season for the last decade?  Id say Parker is closer to the 5 listed than he is Stockton or even Rondo.  The Heat won 2 rings without a true PG.  You could argue Chalmers, but it was offense being started by committee. 

[wadesworld]

'

The same Tony Parker who has averaged over 18 pts a season for the last decade?  Id say Parker is closer to the 5 listed than he is Stockton or even Rondo.  The Heat won 2 rings without a true PG.  You could argue Chalmers, but it was offense being started by committee.  

When Stockton was at his best he was averaging between 14-17 ppg.  I think Parker is more of a Stockton in that he isn't coming down the court and dominating the ball for entire possessions like the 5 guys listed do (with the possible exception being Chris Paul).  I don't know the exact numbers, but when you have guys like Durant and Aldridge next to you as a point guard, you should be more concerned with getting them the ball and the offense rolling than you are with finding your own shot.  There is no reason for a point guard with a Durant type of scorer next to you having more shots than the Durant type of scorer.  Too often for my liking guys like Lillard and especially Westbrook look for their own shots.  Parker does not.  He certainly isn't scared to take the shot if it's there, but he's more interested in ball movement and getting the offense going.  Same with John Stockton.

I would argue that LeBron was Miami's point guard, and while obviously a great scorer, he is also unselfish relative to his ability to score the ball and is willing to sacrifice some of his own shot attempts to get others involved.  And I cannot stand LeBron.

[4everwarriors]

When it comes to Looney predictions I'll stick with his dentist. 

Murray, you're a smart man and I always liked you. Keep the faith, Bro.

[PGsHeroes32]

You know, it is a mutual decision.

lol. Everyone needs their Ners comment once in a while I guess.

[Goose]

I'm with Murs on this one.

[4everwarriors]

I'm with Murs on this one.

Smart dude #2. Happy holidays, kin.

[reinko]

Define a "true" point guard. Is traveon jackson a true PG? Derrick Wilson? Junior Coudagan? I'm curious. PGs have changed, they need to score now. The best PGs in the NBA aren't John Stockton and Mark Price. Guys like Westbrook, Paul, Wall, Lillard, Irving, etc. can score and distribute. I've seen enough from Duane Wilson to think he can score and distribute, he's been great in only 10 college games. I'll take Duane over all the PGs listed above.

Didn't know this guy could hoop.

[esotericmindguy]

And the funniest thing is that you just named 5 of the point guards who are perceived to be the best point guards in the league, and yet they have...0 rings combined.  The quarterbacks of basketball teams.

Give me Rondo and Parker running my team over any of those guys if I'm going for a championship this year.

Come on now, Derrick Fisher has 3 or 4 rings, Chalmers has 2, Cassell has 2 and Stockton has 0.

[wadesworld]

Come on now, Derrick Fisher has 3 or 4 rings, Chalmers has 2, Cassell has 2 and Stockton has 0.

Again, I think anybody who understands the game of basketball can understand that LeBron James was the point guard for the Heat's championship teams.  Are you trying to use Sam Cassell as an example of a bad starting point guard that won an NBA Championship?  Sam Cassell was a very, very good point guard in the NBA for a long time.

In 22 NBA seasons he averaged 16 ppg, 6 apg, 3 rpg, and 1.1 spg.

Fisher wasn't outstanding but he certainly wasn't awful, was very clutch, and had the intangibles you looked for in a solid point guard.

You just don't see score first point guards winning NBA Championships very often.  Just see how silly the Spurs, with Parker, make the Thunder, with Westbrook, look.  The Thunder have all the pieces for an NBA Title, but in my opinion they never will with Westbrook (or Reggie Jackson) running the show.  Best offensive player in the game, maybe ever, strong interior defense, a big who can score.  Just need a true point guard.  Would love to see Durant play with Rondo.  That would be a show.

[MU82]

There's a difference between a "scoring point guard" and a "pass-first point guard who can score."

What category did Jerry West fall into? Walt Frazier? Derrick Rose?

Magic and Stockton certainly were pass-first, but either could take over a game by scoring, especially Magic.

Westbrook and Iverson made it to NBA Finals but didn't win, just like Stockton did. Nash never even reached an NBA Finals and he's probably considered a top-10 all-time PG.

Who was the Bulls' PG? Not Paxson or Armstrong, but Pippen, although Jordan always had the ball at crunch time.

You can call Fisher the Lakers' PG but Kobe had the ball.

What I'm getting at is there's no universal definition of a PG.

If I'm coaching a college team, I'd prefer a coach-on-the-floor type PG who also can score when necessary. I definitely want a guy who can hit the open J -- and the more range the better because he sometimes will have the ball 25 feet from the basket with the shot clock running down. Obviously, he should be able to create off the dribble for others and for himself. He must be able to make FTs because he will be fouled late.

Sounds quite a bit like Travis Diener, no?

[wadesworld]

There's a difference between a "scoring point guard" and a "pass-first point guard who can score."

What category did Jerry West fall into? Walt Frazier? Derrick Rose?

Magic and Stockton certainly were pass-first, but either could take over a game by scoring, especially Magic.

Westbrook and Iverson made it to NBA Finals but didn't win, just like Stockton did. Nash never even reached an NBA Finals and he's probably considered a top-10 all-time PG.

Who was the Bulls' PG? Not Paxson or Armstrong, but Pippen, although Jordan always had the ball at crunch time.

You can call Fisher the Lakers' PG but Kobe had the ball.

What I'm getting at is there's no universal definition of a PG.

If I'm coaching a college team, I'd prefer a coach-on-the-floor type PG who also can score when necessary. I definitely want a guy who can hit the open J -- and the more range the better because he sometimes will have the ball 25 feet from the basket with the shot clock running down. Obviously, he should be able to create off the dribble for others and for himself. He must be able to make FTs because he will be fouled late.

Sounds quite a bit like Travis Diener, no?

Good post.  I can agree with all of this.  I think Noskowiak will fit the mold by the time he is an upper classman.

[rocky_warrior]

Hey, is there any way you can unfollow a thread on this site?

I believe I made one comment about 13 pages ago, and now I regret it, because this overwrought topic keeps popping up on my "new responses" page.

Yes, just click "Notify" again at the top or bottom while reading the thread.  A popup should confirm and ask if you want to disable notifications.

[g0lden3agle]

Hey, is there any way you can unfollow a thread on this site?

I believe I made one comment about 13 pages ago, and now I regret it, because this overwrought topic keeps popping up on my "new responses" page.

I didn't even know people used the new responses page.

[bilsu]

True point guard needs to be able the bring the ball up, run the offense and most importantly distribute the ball. Scoring helps, but is not as imporatnat as distributing the ball.
Travis Diener, Sam Worthen, Tony Miller, Lloyd Walton, Cordel Henry, Dominic James to name some of them. To me the former MU point that I would most like to add to this team would be Travis Diener. I am sure some would pick Dean Meminger, but he was not a great distributor. Diener could pass and shoot. The most fun to watch would be Sam Worthen.

[MUMonster03]

So originally he was to commit shortly after NLI day, then before HS season in early December. Now it's almost January and he is still uncommitted. Does this mean he just can't decide between his final three or is considering opening his recruitment back up to others because he is not liking what he is hearing/seeing from the others?

Just seems odd that such a highly ranked player has yet to commit.

[Tugg Speedman]

So originally he was to commit shortly after NLI day, then before HS season in early December. Now it's almost January and he is still uncommitted. Does this mean he just can't decide between his final three or is considering opening his recruitment back up to others because he is not liking what he is hearing/seeing from the others?

Just seems odd that such a highly ranked player has yet to commit.

I agree ... you have to assume that as of now he has not made a decision.  The reason is either he doesn't like his current list and wants to expand it to more or he's re-considering college basketball altogether (i.e., at risk of not qualifying and thinking about non-college options).

Because if you do know what you want to do, then commit and let the fanbase love pour in.

[wadesworld]

So originally he was to commit shortly after NLI day, then before HS season in early December. Now it's almost January and he is still uncommitted. Does this mean he just can't decide between his final three or is considering opening his recruitment back up to others because he is not liking what he is hearing/seeing from the others?

Just seems odd that such a highly ranked player has yet to commit.

He can't get himself the grades to become eligible.

[Tugg Speedman]

He can't get himself the grades to become eligible.

and if he doesn't ... NBDL or Europe?

[MerrittsMustache]

and if he doesn't ... NBDL or Europe?

Or Louisville.

[Benny B]

Or Louisville.

Or Syracuse.  After all, wouldn't be the first time they let a kid who couldn't make grades play the.... uhhhhh.... what's the number that comes after 4?

[Stretchdeltsig]

His non-commitment does make you wonder about his grades and ability to make it in college.

[4everwarriors]

Y'all seems to think it has more to do with readin', writin', and ''rithmetic. I'm figurin' he needs to pull a Derrick Rose, aina?

[GGGG]

Y'all seems to think it has more to do with readin', writin', and ''rithmetic. I'm figurin' he needs to pull a Derrick Rose, aina?

Remember with the sliding scale between core GPA and standardized test score, it is a little of both.

[Tugg Speedman]

Y'all seems to think it has more to do with readin', writin', and ''rithmetic. I'm figurin' he needs to pull a Derrick Rose, aina?

So their is some geeky librarian type 17 year old girl with coke bottle glasses about to take a SAT and her ID says "Diamond Stone?" 

And when do the "North Koreans" hack into Dominican's computers and his grades "all of sudden" qualify!

[Marquette Fan in WI]

He can't get himself the grades to become eligible.

Is this fact or speculation?