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Next up: A long offseason

Marquette
66
Marquette
Scrimmage
Date/Time: Oct 4, 2025
TV: NA
Schedule for 2024-25
New Mexico
75

Norm

Has MU ever hired a coach that was fired from his last job before?

Dawson Rental

Quote from: mugrack on March 22, 2014, 01:48:47 PM
Hire Howland, keep Chew, all is good.

According to another poster, insidetheleague, Chew is going to VT.
You actually have a degree from Marquette?

Quote from: muguru
No...and after reading many many psosts from people on this board that do...I have to say I'm MUCH better off, if this is the type of "intelligence" a degree from MU gets you. It sure is on full display I will say that.

Warrior_2002

The more I think about it the more I want Howland for these reasons:

1 - afraid MU will make a stupid decision like O'Neill
2 - afraid we'll get some off the wall assistant that either isn't as good as we thought or has eyes on blue bloods
3 - afraid we'll prematurely hire Wardle and if he doesn't have success will take time firing because he is one of our own, setting the program way back.
4 - He wants to come here (so he says)
5 - he's been successful as said above
6 - He produces talent (if the style wins I don't care how boring it is.  the boring style is the stupidest reason I've heard for not hiring a guy - I want to win)
7 - trying to hire the studs like Marshall might take too long causing us to scramble for someone else after Howland decides he can't wait for us and goes to USF or something

I'm not 100% in on Howland, but I'm getting there. Just the thoughts that are going through my head.

willie warrior

While Howland could be a good choice, there is the baggage of what went on at UCLA out there. I don't claim to know the facts, but why does a school fire a 3 time FF coach. The stories being put forth are partying , drugs, etc. and letting the players control things. So we need to be cautious, but urgently so. Do our current recruits even know who the guy is?
I thought you were dead. Willie lives rent free in Reekers mind. Rick Pitino: "You can either complain or adapt."

NavinRJohnson

Quote from: willie warrior on March 22, 2014, 04:52:09 PM
Do our current recruits even know who the guy is?

Who cares? Current recruits should be the last thing considered in trying to hire the right coach. They are just a notch below assistant coaches.

Warrior_2002

Exactly.  Just tell the kids you took UCLA to 3 final fours in a row.  They'll also watch ESPN and see that the analysts all know he's a good coach.  And his X's and O's are solid. 

Rockmic87

Quote from: willie warrior on March 22, 2014, 04:52:09 PM
While Howland could be a good choice, there is the baggage of what went on at UCLA out there. I don't claim to know the facts, but why does a school fire a 3 time FF coach. The stories being put forth are partying , drugs, etc. and letting the players control things. So we need to be cautious, but urgently so. Do our current recruits even know who the guy is?

The majority of the ppl on MUSCOOP would easily trade the MU BBall program having "partying , drugs, etc. and letting the players control" issues, if Howland takes MU to 3 final 4...

Mumichfan06

I don't waddle to hear another thing about Wardle until his resume looks like this.

Howland knows how to recruit, win, and take players to the NBA. This would be a huge W for Marquette Basketball.

Tums Festival

While Shaka Smart would be an excellent hire, my concern is if he were to come here he'd be rumored for numerous jobs as soon as he has success. Then what? We're back in the same situation where he'd leave and we're back to the revolving door. While Ben Howland may not be the perfect choice (who is?) he might be just what we need right now. And even though many people on this board have concerns about him, no one has said he can't coach and can't win.
"Every day ends with a Tums festival!"

willie warrior

Quote from: Rockmic87 on March 22, 2014, 05:04:41 PM
The majority of the ppl on MUSCOOP would easily trade the MU BBall program having "partying , drugs, etc. and letting the players control" issues, if Howland takes MU to 3 final 4...
Sorry--I do not believe that and certainly do not believe the admin does.
I thought you were dead. Willie lives rent free in Reekers mind. Rick Pitino: "You can either complain or adapt."

Blackhat

If we're going old...what about Steve Fisher?

Rockmic87

Quote from: willie warrior on March 22, 2014, 05:09:51 PM
Sorry--I do not believe that and certainly do not believe the admin does.

Then you and the admins are in the minority.

Rockmic87

Quote from: Rockmic87 on March 22, 2014, 05:18:53 PM
Then you and the admins are in the minority.

But then, anytime a program establishes a Dynasty of success, it usually comes crashing down eventually (i.e. USC and Ohio State Football).

GooooMarquette

Quote from: willie warrior on March 22, 2014, 04:52:09 PM
While Howland could be a good choice, there is the baggage of what went on at UCLA out there. I don't claim to know the facts, but why does a school fire a 3 time FF coach. The stories being put forth are partying , drugs, etc. and letting the players control things. So we need to be cautious, but urgently so. Do our current recruits even know who the guy is?

Howland did great at UCLA while he was recruiting and coaching his own way (hard working kids, like the kids he coached at Pitt).  They didn't get into any trouble, and made it to - but didn't win - three Final Fours.  The problem was that UCLA fans weren't satisfied with three Final Fours without a championship and didn't like the defensive mindset of the team, so he was pressured into recruiting Pirima Donna kids he didn't really want and ratcheting up the tempo. He lost control of those kids, and ultimately that's when things went south.

I think he learned from that experience that you stick with what you know and recruit the kids you want-and at Marquette that would play just fine.

Got this from a good friend who is a UCLA alum and big fan...and who loved what Howland was doing before he let the "win a championship at all costs" people get to him.

Mumichfan06

Quote from: Stone Cold on March 22, 2014, 05:16:54 PM
If we're going old...what about Steve Fisher?

Fisher isn't leaving the sunny seaside town of San Diego for the twlight of his career. His hard work has finally paid off at SDSU.

Tums Festival

Quote from: GooooMarquette on March 22, 2014, 05:23:15 PM
Howland did great at UCLA while he was recruiting and coaching his own way (hard working kids, like the kids he coached at Pitt).  They didn't get into any trouble, and made it to - but didn't win - three Final Fours.  The problem was that UCLA fans weren't satisfied with three Final Fours without a championship and didn't like the defensive mindset of the team, so he was pressured into recruiting Pirima Donna kids he didn't really want and ratcheting up the tempo. He lost control of those kids, and ultimately that's when things went south.

I think he learned from that experience that you stick with what you know and recruit the kids you want-and at Marquette that would play just fine.

Got this from a good friend who is a UCLA alum and big fan...and who loved what Howland was doing before he let the "win a championship at all costs" people get to him.

Great points. There was a definite change in the direction of that program after his initial success. The kinds of kids he recruited at Pitt and at the beginning at UCLA are the type Marquette wants too.
"Every day ends with a Tums festival!"

Blackhat

Weren't they his predecessor's recruits he won big with at UCLA?

Rockmic87

Quote from: Stone Cold on March 22, 2014, 05:31:12 PM
Weren't they his predecessor's recruits he won big with at UCLA?

No.  But you can make that argument with Roy Williams on his first NC at UNC!

mikekinsellaMVP

Quote from: GooooMarquette on March 22, 2014, 05:23:15 PM
Howland did great at UCLA while he was recruiting and coaching his own way (hard working kids, like the kids he coached at Pitt).

I think he learned from that experience that you stick with what you know and recruit the kids you want-and at Marquette that would play just fine.

One incredibly toxic player almost single-handedly crashed that program.  Hopefully it's a situation Howland learned from.  While I think our expectations are much higher than they were six years ago, I don't see the "whoever it takes to win" pressure being put on our coaching staff.

GooooMarquette

Quote from: Stone Cold on March 22, 2014, 05:31:12 PM
Weren't they his predecessor's recruits he won big with at UCLA?

No, most were Ben's recruits.  He actually struggled a bit his first two years.  They went to the FF in his third, fourth and fifth seasons.  And even in their first FF run, most of the players were his frosh and sophs (Farmar, Afflalo, Shipp, Mbah a Moute).

Blackhat

"Couple of veiled Ben Howland references just four minutes into the game," noted Walton's television partner, Dave Pasch, and the broadcast just sort of took off from there.

From a high up UCLA alum on Howland:  

Walton said this coming out of the first media timeout: "After years of shadow-boxing the apocalypse and wandering the land, the clouds have parted and people are having fun here. The atmosphere is totally different. [The Bruins are] up and down the court and they're passing the ball around and they're scoring and putting on an entertaining product. So things are getting a lot better here. People couldn't be happier or more proud."

Now I'm not nearly high enough to figure out how a Grateful Dead lyric about "shadow-boxing the apocalypse and wandering the land" applies to UCLA's program under Howland in recent years, so I won't even try. But, at this point, is there anything longer and stranger than Walton's obsession with Howland? If you watch closely, you can almost see Pasch rolling his eyes at the UCLA icon, and it's pretty bad when fellow ESPN employees are publicly calling for Walton to shutup or at least backoff.

"Ben Howland deserves better," tweeted ESPN analyst Seth Greenberg. "Give it a break Bill."

Blackhat

Their offense sucked according to Bill Walton.

Silkk the Shaka

Quote from: Stone Cold on March 22, 2014, 05:46:06 PM
"Couple of veiled Ben Howland references just four minutes into the game," noted Walton's television partner, Dave Pasch, and the broadcast just sort of took off from there.

From a high up UCLA alum on Howland:  

Walton said this coming out of the first media timeout: "After years of shadow-boxing the apocalypse and wandering the land, the clouds have parted and people are having fun here. The atmosphere is totally different. [The Bruins are] up and down the court and they're passing the ball around and they're scoring and putting on an entertaining product. So things are getting a lot better here. People couldn't be happier or more proud."

Now I'm not nearly high enough to figure out how a Grateful Dead lyric about "shadow-boxing the apocalypse and wandering the land" applies to UCLA's program under Howland in recent years, so I won't even try. But, at this point, is there anything longer and stranger than Walton's obsession with Howland? If you watch closely, you can almost see Pasch rolling his eyes at the UCLA icon, and it's pretty bad when fellow ESPN employees are publicly calling for Walton to shutup or at least backoff.

"Ben Howland deserves better," tweeted ESPN analyst Seth Greenberg. "Give it a break Bill."

Walton's a free spirit who appreciates the beautiful improvisational game basketball can be. Howland looks like a bit of a joyless curmudgeon that runs a conservative, restrictive, grind-it-out offense. Can't argue with the results, but I tend to be on Walton's side.

chapman

#48
Five part, 20+ minute Howland interview from September with Seth Davis

"Hopefully I can get the best job available out there that fits me and will also be a great fit for the university".  Katz and Parrish say he thinks this is it.

Part 4 gets into the Walton criticism and his style criticism: "There's no question, we will run more wherever I'm at a year from now."  Says that UCLA was one of the better teams in the nation at fast break scoring last year, when they won the Pac 12 starting three freshmen.

Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAiHZhQZksQ
Part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n46qzr5LLXE
Part 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5nuLbMJ8oo
Part 4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5fmtUDSQLA
Part 5 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qvi1D9yiaiU

I can slurp this.


Eldon

I want to slurp!!

Please let me SLUUUUURP!!!

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