The Todd Mayo Effect...and shortened rotation

[chapman]

The truth with Todd is somewhere in the middle.  It takes awhile to overcome a multitude of issues, second, third, fourth chances to warrant being a person that can be counted on.  It's also no secret that Todd was the upperclassmen (perhaps not alone) that brought frustrations with how his minutes were being handled to Buzz a couple weeks ago, and since that happened he has been used differently.

[brandx]

What a difference the game was from early in the year. Guys are looking to score now instead of whatever the goal was on offense earlier. When Jake or Todd or Jamil was open on the wing, instead of passing the ball around the perimeter, they looked to score whether it was shooting the jumper or taking it to the hoop.

Took a long time to get there this year.

[BCHoopster]

Like most teams you need 3 scorers, Todd can give you 10-15 every night, Juan a basket or two.  If Jake is not on fire like yesterday, they need a third scorer.  Jamil needs to score and lately
he is putting up shots in the first half and not playing passive.  You win when all three can score, but when Jake and even Derrick score they are that much better.  Crieghton is beatable as long as they are controlled on the 3 point line, rather see them score a two then a three all the time.  Have to play your man, not doubling all the time.  They can double McDerrmott, but that
is it.  It is more important to guard McDermott on three point line.  The three frosh can wait there turn, Taylor as you can tell, can not guard.  Win with the veterans, one game at a time.  Nice
to see Chief Cohen in the audience wearing an MU jersey, any other recruits at the game?  Ahmed Hill must be excited to take Jakes place next year, a three point shooter in college is essential
for numerous reasons.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Todd determines Todd's minutes. He is clearly one of our most talented players and makes the team better. Unless Buzz is trying to take this season, he would only not play Todd if there were off the court issues, practice issues, or not playing to the game plan issues. All of those are within Todd's ability to control.

Someone made a great post on here a while ago about the importance of basing playing time off following the coach's plan rather than by talent. What kind of message does it send to the team if a player gets to play when he is ignoring the coach's directions? The rules only apply if you aren't talented? Well all these kids think they are talented. It would be anarchy.

I'm glad Todd has found his way onto the court. We need him out there.

BTW, Todd has been in our top 5 minutes per game all season. So he's been getting starter's minutes all year

[MarquetteDano]

Someone made a great post on here a while ago about the importance of basing playing time off following the coach's plan rather than by talent. What kind of message does it send to the team if a player gets to play when he is ignoring the coach's directions? The rules only apply if you aren't talented?

I have the answer:  it is called St. John's.  All that talent the past few seasons and this is their first shot at a tourney bid.  And even then they are a bubble team.

[PGsHeroes32]

Now TODD has finally allowed himself to be played more.  He isn't academically ineligible, which stunted his growth last year.  He isn't late for practice, which caused him to be suspended this year.  Did you ever think that he is playing more now because he possibly has figured it out and *earned* his playing time?  That maybe Buzz's approach with him has worked?  And he has played 20+ mpg in every game since before Christmas with only two exceptions.  It's not as though Buzz never played the guy.

Todd played 20+ mpg as a freshman.  The most any freshman has played under Buzz.  Todd is the one responsible for his problems.

See heres the thing. Peoples perceptions about todd are not correct if you see Buzz quotes during games. Even he acknowledges that Todd wants a longer leash. Oj freaking Mayo acknowledges it.

If he's late for practice and is bench for a full GAME. Fine. We are talking about him coming off the bench, playing 3 minutes, turning the ball over and hitting the bench again. Not acceptable.

It's not about his behavior or lack there of. It's about the amount of time/stretches he gets WHEN HE IS DRESSED AND AVAIALABLE.

Sorry, but Buzz doesn't think "Dang Todd wasn't eligible last year for a portion of 2012 so I'm going to pull him after 3 minutes in a 2014 game against Butler.

[PGsHeroes32]

The problem that Buzz faces with *this* three guard line up though manifested itself yesterday.  Rebounding is really going to be a problem with this group.  None of the three guards can rebound like Vander or Trent could.  (Vander played that wing-guard position as a sophomore that Trent played last year.)  And as willie said, Todd wasn't great on defense last year.

This is why he likes starting Juan.  Juan is a better defender, especially with his length against a team like Xavier.

No, its a problem against a team like Xavier. Maybe Butler too but they are bad.

No other team in this league rebounds like Xavier. They kicked our ass on the boards no matter who was out there. Ox? Chris? Jamil? Steve? you name them, we were not going to rebound.

And do not try to justify starting Juan or more importantly the starting 5 we have went with the last two game. I will rattle off the difference in play if need be.

[ChicosBailBonds]

I have the answer:  it is called St. John's.  All that talent the past few seasons and this is their first shot at a tourney bid.  And even then they are a bubble team.

They made the NCAAs in 2011 under Lavin.

[GGGG]

Sorry, but Buzz doesn't think "Dang Todd wasn't eligible last year for a portion of 2012 so I'm going to pull him after 3 minutes in a 2014 game against Butler.

Not what I said, nor is it what I implied.

[GGGG]

And do not try to justify starting Juan or more importantly the starting 5 we have went with the last two game. I will rattle off the difference in play if need be.

Here is all the justification I need....

Last two games with that line up...two leads when Juan and Otule were subbed out.  Game.  Set.  Match.

[keefe]

Have you ever been a coach?

I coached Little League in Jakarta.

[muguru]

See heres the thing. Peoples perceptions about todd are not correct if you see Buzz quotes during games. Even he acknowledges that Todd wants a longer leash. Oj freaking Mayo acknowledges it.

If he's late for practice and is bench for a full GAME. Fine. We are talking about him coming off the bench, playing 3 minutes, turning the ball over and hitting the bench again. Not acceptable.

It's not about his behavior or lack there of. It's about the amount of time/stretches he gets WHEN HE IS DRESSED AND AVAIALABLE.

Sorry, but Buzz doesn't think "Dang Todd wasn't eligible last year for a portion of 2012 so I'm going to pull him after 3 minutes in a 2014 game against Butler.

Thank you!! This sums up exactly what I was trying to convey.

[PGsHeroes32]

Here is all the justification I need....

Last two games with that line up...two leads when Juan and Otule were subbed out.  Game.  Set.  Match.

Alright game on.

yesterday, Stainbrook was abusing Chris down low to start(did miss a bunny) We were down 6-4. Jake happened to hit a 3 right as Todd and Ox were to be subbed in. So, 7-6. I guess, youre right we were up by 1. After that? 12-2 run with Todd and Ox in.

Second half is where this get's really fun. Xavier quickly cuts it to 5. Buzz being the smart man that he is realizes this lineup is just not logical. It brings Todd and Ox to the scorers table. We have awful stagnant offense but get a gift from god and have Xavier deflect the ball out of bounds. In come the boys. Jake immediately is found off a screen for the in bounds 3. You may say coincidence, why wouldn't you? I say it's because we have more scoring threats. But let's not allow that to be the only example....Jake canned a couple more 3s after that!!!! Why????? Because the other team simple cannot just focuse on disallowing his shot when you have Todd who will take it to the rack at will and a 290 pound bull.

GAME. SET. AND MATCH.

[PGsHeroes32]

stupid double post

[jsglow]

No doubt that until the offense/defense sets started with Ox and Chris that getting the 'Big 5' out on the floor was a key to success yesterday.

Look, MU's recipe for success this year is quite restricted.  Buzz has necessarily had to sacrifice some things he holds dear to generate wins in non-traditional ways.  Yesterday we again lost the battle of the boards while we absolutely owned the turnover margin denying Xavier enough possessions to generally hold a meaningful 3-4 possession lead throughout.  Todd's minutes reflect the development of our 3 guard lineup.

What's not lost on me is Jamil's improving ability to stay out of foul trouble and remain on the floor for extended minutes.  He picked up his second foul yesterday with about a minute to go in the half.  It was never a factor in the second.  Jamil has to be on the floor.   

[keefe]

Buzz has necessarily had to sacrifice some things he holds dear to generate wins in non-traditional ways.

Glow

Why the hate for Jake?

[MarquetteDano]

They made the NCAAs in 2011 under Lavin.

IIRC, that wasn't his team though.  That was really his predecessor's team.

[GGGG]

Alright game on.

yesterday, Stainbrook was abusing Chris down low to start(did miss a bunny) We were down 6-4. Jake happened to hit a 3 right as Todd and Ox were to be subbed in. So, 7-6. I guess, youre right we were up by 1. After that? 12-2 run with Todd and Ox in.

Second half is where this get's really fun. Xavier quickly cuts it to 5. Buzz being the smart man that he is realizes this lineup is just not logical. It brings Todd and Ox to the scorers table. We have awful stagnant offense but get a gift from god and have Xavier deflect the ball out of bounds. In come the boys. Jake immediately is found off a screen for the in bounds 3. You may say coincidence, why wouldn't you? I say it's because we have more scoring threats. But let's not allow that to be the only example....Jake canned a couple more 3s after that!!!! Why????? Because the other team simple cannot just focuse on disallowing his shot when you have Todd who will take it to the rack at will and a 290 pound bull.

GAME. SET. AND MATCH.

Right...so they extended the lead the starters already built.  Therefore I believe the starting line-up is justified.

Your screaming isn't going to change my mind either.

[PGsHeroes32]

Right...so they extended the lead the starters already built.  Therefore I believe the starting line-up is justified.

Your screaming isn't going to change my mind either.

yeah, I know your mind doesn't change. I think it is clear you have the "everyone gets a participation trophy" view on things and losing is ok. We have been over this.

But yeah that lineup has built so many leads!!!! we were 8-5 in the non conference!!! Let's go!!!

O and you can ignore the vanishing second half lead til todd came in.

It's alright!!! What would this board be if we didn't have the occaisional subjective fan.

I'll watch the games. provide specific objective examples. You remain subjective with "shouting" deflections. Everyone else will read the comments. Gain some valuable knowledge(not provided by you).

And the board will carry on!!!

[GGGG]

yeah, I know your mind doesn't change. I think it is clear you have the "everyone gets a participation trophy" view on things and losing is ok. We have been over this.

Never said anything of the sort.  I just think that Buzz wants to start a defensive line up, and that's OK with me when they actually build leads.  Why would anyone argue with those results?

But yeah that lineup has built so many leads!!!! we were 8-5 in the non conference!!! Let's go!!!

Uhhh...how many times has that particular line up actually started?  Do you know?

O and you can ignore the vanishing second half lead til todd came in.

Not sure why you don't think I like Todd playing.  I had been arguing for him playing more minutes for awhile.

[PGsHeroes32]

Never said anything of the sort.  I just think that Buzz wants to start a defensive line up, and that's OK with me when they actually build leads.  Why would anyone argue with those results?


Uhhh...how many times has that particular line up actually started?  Do you know?

Not sure why you don't think I like Todd playing.  I had been arguing for him playing more minutes for awhile.

That being a "defensive" lineup is a myth though. That group gets scored on all the time. Heck while 6 wasn't even a lot in a 4ish minute stretch its a lot more then the 2 that the offensive group gave up during the onslaught. Then I can point to games like ASU where they got murdered.

How times has it started? No idea but almost positive all of non conference so my 8-5 points stands. If not, I know Ox didn't start during non conference and Todd couldn't pay 5 million to start. So the starting 4 guys who can't score thing stands.

I guess I don't know your views on Todd. You are always playing the devils advocate side to pro Todd. So it comes across as you being fine that he's not playing.

As I said a few posts prior. If he gets in trouble and is not allowed to play, that is fine. That is on him. There are standards. But, if he is deemed ready and able to play in a game the taking him out after a small stretch because he cuases a turnover(usually this) or maybe a bad shot. Is just straight up dumb.

We are seeing now the last few games that even while we still have many imperfections. This team is capable of winning basketball games when a certain group of 5 get minutes together.

[GGGG]

I guess I don't know your views on Todd. You are always playing the devils advocate side to pro Todd. So it comes across as you being fine that he's not playing.

That's because you continue not to be able to tell the difference between "being fine that he's not playing," and understanding *why* he is playing the role he is.

[PGsHeroes32]

That's because you continue not to be able to tell the difference between "being fine that he's not playing," and understanding *why* he is playing the role he is.

But I don't think you do. As I now will have to say for the 3rd time today....he has gotten inconsistent stretches all year long...except the last 2 games could make a case for last 3.

And guess what we have won!!!

So whatever it is that you are understanding. Is not a correct approach. Buzz has done wonder since being here but his use of Todd has been one of his miscues. He may have just corrected that miscues in the knick of time if we keep this streak up.

[GGGG]

But I don't think you do. As I now will have to say for the 3rd time today....he has gotten inconsistent stretches all year long...except the last 2 games could make a case for last 3.

And guess what we have won!!!

So whatever it is that you are understanding. Is not a correct approach. Buzz has done wonder since being here but his use of Todd has been one of his miscues. He may have just corrected that miscues in the knick of time if we keep this streak up.

Given Todd's lack of personal accountability, I completely understand why Buzz hasn't had the faith to play him more.  Good thing that Todd is making the most of of his earned opportunity. 

[BallBoy]

But I don't think you do. As I now will have to say for the 3rd time today....he has gotten inconsistent stretches all year long...except the last 2 games could make a case for last 3.

Define inconsistent.  In 12 conference games, he play 20+ minutes 10 times.  Marquette is 6-4 in that stretch.

In the two games he did not get 20+, MU was 1-1.  One being GU and the other SJU.  SJU was not Mayo's best game so we can understand why he did not get his average.

In 7 of the 12 he played 26+, MU is 5 - 2.  He only has one game above 30+ and MU is 1-0.  The majority of his conference games are between 26-29 minutes.  I would say that is fairly consistent. Of MU's 25 games, Mayo had two DNP (one injury and one suspension) so he appeared in 23 games.  He played 20+ minutes in 18 of those. 

The five were:
Grambling State - 17 minutes in a blow out so he was being protected.
CS Fullerton - 8 recovering from the sprained ankle so again limited minutes
Ball State - 9 minutes in a blow out so he was being protected
GU and SJU that I mentioned earlier. 

If you mean he isn't getting enough minutes that is another story but his minutes have been consistent.