[Paint Touches] Strotman: Blue's own mistake lands him undrafted

[mu_hilltopper]

.. his mistakes was signing with an agent when he did that prohibited him coming back when he saw he would not be a first round pick.

IIRC, Vander declared just a couple days prior to the "withdrawal" date.   Roughly, It didn't matter that he hired an agent.    The window was almost closed anyhow.

[bilsu]

Going into the last pick, if you assume Bilas's 10 best remaining players was accurate (which Blue was not on), Blue was not even close to being drafted. I do think once you got to the last 5 picks he was better off not being drafted. He should look at Bucks or Boston as they seem to be teams that he might have a chance of making. I think Blue would have been better off returning to MU, but I have a feeling MU by March will be a better team without him. The 30 plus minutes he would of played will be valuable playing time for the new players.

[MUFC9295]

After another year with MU, would Vander be in any better a position to be drafted?   I've thought all along some of these kids don't want to go to school, they want to play.  It might be wishful thinking to go to the League.  But maybe he lands in Europe or Asia and never has to pick up another book before and after practice.

[Hards Alumni]

IIRC, Vander declared just a couple days prior to the "withdrawal" date.   Roughly, It didn't matter that he hired an agent.    The window was almost closed anyhow.

Correct.  

I can't believe all of the people on here saying that Blue made a bad decision.  You don't know.  You don't.  There is just as good of a possibility that if Blue played at MU next year, and played well, that he does not get drafted.  There are too many broad assumptions being made by a lot of people here.  Next years draft class is absolutely stacked.  If Blue (as some have said) was sick of school and had the chance to fulfill his dream of possibly getting drafted this year... then why not give it a shot?  If things went badly (which they did) he still has a lot of options.  Free agent market, NBADL, foreign leagues... All which pay him money.  Money he will earn a year earlier than if he would have waited.  

Sure Blue could have come back for his senior year, and he COULD have blown up and gotten drafted next year.  But who is to say?  Maybe instead he blows out his knee?  

Personally, I don't hold any sort of grudge toward the guy, but a lot of people want to call him stupid or point fingers... but really, its total speculation.

[BCHoopster]

Correct.  

I can't believe all of the people on here saying that Blue made a bad decision.  You don't know.  You don't.  There is just as good of a possibility that if Blue played at MU next year, and played well, that he does not get drafted.  There are too many broad assumptions being made by a lot of people here.  Next years draft class is absolutely stacked.  If Blue (as some have said) was sick of school and had the chance to fulfill his dream of possibly getting drafted this year... then why not give it a shot?  If things went badly (which they did) he still has a lot of options.  Free agent market, NBADL, foreign leagues... All which pay him money.  Money he will earn a year earlier than if he would have waited.  

Sure Blue could have come back for his senior year, and he COULD have blown up and gotten drafted next year.  But who is to say?  Maybe instead he blows out his knee?  

Personally, I don't hold any sort of grudge toward the guy, but a lot of people want to call him stupid or point fingers... but really, its total speculation.

Not very person wants to go to college, he wants to play ball and not study, so he will get his chance one year earlier, so be it.  Some college kids take a semester abroad there junior
year, so Vander now can to.  The difference he will get paid and do what he loves to do, and does not have to go to class.  It is not so bad.  I would hope Vander realizes that he should
go back to school and graduate someday.  Good luck for his drive to his goal, the NBA.

[bilsu]

IIRC, Vander declared just a couple days prior to the "withdrawal" date.   Roughly, It didn't matter that he hired an agent.    The window was almost closed anyhow.

The odd thing about how it works is that you had to pull your name out by April 16th, but you could put your name in up to April 30th. The only reason for Blue to put his name in before April 30th was that he wanted to go no matter what. My guess is that Blue would of declared even if we had lost to Davidson. Every year there are at least a dozen players who declare that have no chance of making it. They just want out of college for whatever reason.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Thank you for another outstanding in-depth article.

One edit:  should be "brass tacks" not "tax"

[Hards Alumni]

Not very person wants to go to college, he wants to play ball and not study, so he will get his chance one year earlier, so be it.  Some college kids take a semester abroad there junior
year, so Vander now can to.  The difference he will get paid and do what he loves to do, and does not have to go to class.  It is not so bad.  I would hope Vander realizes that he should
go back to school and graduate someday.  Good luck for his drive to his goal, the NBA.

Right on.

[bilsu]

Not very person wants to go to college, he wants to play ball and not study, so he will get his chance one year earlier, so be it.  Some college kids take a semester abroad there junior
year, so Vander now can to.  The difference he will get paid and do what he loves to do, and does not have to go to class.  It is not so bad.  I would hope Vander realizes that he should
go back to school and graduate someday.  Good luck for his drive to his goal, the NBA.

I would say not wanting to go to college is short sighted thinking, which is a bad decision in the long run. Basketball wise it probably does not matter for Blue, but he will be done playing in another 15 years or sooner if he gets injured.

[BCHoopster]

I would say not wanting to go to college is short sighted thinking, which is a bad decision in the long run. Basketball wise it probably does not matter for Blue, but he will be done playing in another 15 years or sooner if he gets injured.

Do you think that Bennett, Noel, McLemore wanted to go to school, really, they were forced by ridiculous rules that they can not get a job out of high school in there field.  Those kids are
going to make more money than most people even if they are only in the league a few years.  Do you think DWAde is going to go back to school or Lebron James, Kobe?? 

[ChicosBailBonds]

Yeah I think this is a good point.  I doubt Vander gets drafted next year too.

Why?

He made a huge jump this year.  I would not expect as huge next year, but certainly continuing the arc of improvement.  He could have honed his two weaknesses this year and put them on display....more consistent outside shooting and PG play. Remember that he was a young junior, another year of maturity and improvement would have positioned him well.

I think Draft Express had it right on him.  Head scratcher for him to come out this year, likely late first rounder next year.  Oh well.

[Hards Alumni]

Why?

He made a huge jump this year.  I would not expect as huge next year, but certainly continuing the arc of improvement.  He could have honed his two weaknesses this year and put them on display....more consistent outside shooting and PG play. Remember that he was a young junior, another year of maturity and improvement would have positioned him well.

I think Draft Express had it right on him.  Head scratcher for him to come out this year, likely late first rounder next year.  Oh well.

Until you look at the quality of the talent that is coming out next year it looks like a head scratcher.  Probably the best class since 2003.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Maybe Blue messed up. But how many of us would have left MU early if we had an opportunity to play professional basketball?

That all depends.  If the draft gurus say another year in school will give you an BETTER opportunity to play professional basketball, most of us would have stayed.  His decision to leave shocked everyone, including his head coach.  He had the information...as DraftExpress interview said, he was practically begging someone to say it's possible you will get drafted.  Ask enough girls to dance eventually one is going to say maybe.

[Dawson Rental]

Strotty,  can we read the piece you wrote if Vander would have been drafted?

That piece would have been less about Vander and more about Buzz's Midas touch.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Until you look at the quality of the talent that is coming out next year it looks like a head scratcher.  Probably the best class since 2003.

The draft experts know that (strong class next year), and they said he would be drafted next year.  Just as the draft experts knew this year it wasn't a strong draft, and they said he wouldn't be drafted.  They were 1 for 1, and I'm going to wager a solid year next year likely they would be 2 for 2.

We will never know.  Good luck to the kid.  School doesn't seem to be his thing, which should surprise no one here going back to his high school days.  Hopefully he can shine in the Summer League, work on his game and get picked up.

[mu_hilltopper]

MU alums tend to highly value a few things in play here .. education and a degree, the MU experience of being in college (et cetera) .. and to an extent, loyalty.

While none of us "really know" what was in Vander's brain, he wanted out of the Marquette family, and it's obvious people are irked at what appears to be a disconnect of those values.  

Vander isn't that much unlike any kid who drops out of college, finding a new path.  Because one could feel like it's a disrespect of the above mentioned values, it's thought of as a "bad decision."

Blah, blah, blah, he'll see the world overseas, likely hopping around from team to team over the next 10 years and put food on his table one year earlier than he would have, had he stuck at MU and maybe brought us to the 3rd weekend in the dance.

[LAZER]

The draft experts know that (strong class next year), and they said he would be drafted next year.  Just as the draft experts knew this year it wasn't a strong draft, and they said he wouldn't be drafted.  They were 1 for 1, and I'm going to wager a solid year next year likely they would be 2 for 2.

We will never know.  Good luck to the kid.  School doesn't seem to be his thing, which should surprise no one here going back to his high school days.  Hopefully he can shine in the Summer League, work on his game and get picked up.

I think the experts refer to the strength at the top of the draft.  I don't know if the talent will be that much different in the late first round and second round.

[Jay Bee]

I think Vander's decision was reasonable.

How many think his 2FG jump shooting would have been as accurate as a senior as it was as a junior?

[ChicosBailBonds]

MU alums tend to highly value a few things in play here .. education and a degree, the MU experience of being in college (et cetera) .. and to an extent, loyalty.

While none of us "really know" what was in Vander's brain, he wanted out of the Marquette family, and it's obvious people are irked at what appears to be a disconnect of those values.  

Vander isn't that much unlike any kid who drops out of college, finding a new path.  Because one could feel like it's a disrespect of the above mentioned values, it's thought of as a "bad decision."

Blah, blah, blah, he'll see the world overseas, likely hopping around from team to team over the next 10 years and put food on his table one year earlier than he would have, had he stuck at MU and maybe brought us to the 3rd weekend in the dance.

There are some people here that fit that description, no doubt.  There are also some here that regardless of what it would do or not do for the team or the NCAAs (it's a crapshoot, no guarantee he stays they don't get knocked out in the first round) his dreams had a lot better shot if he stayed around.  Purely basketball improvement perspective....that was consistently mentioned by GMs, writers (Parish, Goodman) and draft gurus.  Take the team success out of it for a moment, and just focus on his ability to get to that dream, what was the best path?

[Hards Alumni]

The draft experts know that (strong class next year), and they said he would be drafted next year.  Just as the draft experts knew this year it wasn't a strong draft, and they said he wouldn't be drafted.  They were 1 for 1, and I'm going to wager a solid year next year likely they would be 2 for 2.

We will never know.  Good luck to the kid.  School doesn't seem to be his thing, which should surprise no one here going back to his high school days.  Hopefully he can shine in the Summer League, work on his game and get picked up.

You might be right.  Then again, go and look at the mock draft from last July and compare it to the results from last night.  You might find out that the experts are just guys who are wrong as often as they are right.  Total crapshoot.   Remember when Shabazz Muhammad was a can't miss player?  He went 14th and was then traded... in a weak draft.

[mu_hilltopper]

Take the team success out of it for a moment, and just focus on his ability to get to that dream, what was the best path?

To use your phrase .. that was a crapshoot too.   Maybe the 2014 draft was stacked, maybe he would have excelled next season at MU, maybe we would lose to 2014's version of Davidson.  Maybe he would have tweaked his knee.  Who knows.  Maybe playing another year would have bumped his chances.

What we do know is .. that he'd be drafted this year was a minority opinion, and in the end, was proved wrong.  

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Until you look at the quality of the talent that is coming out next year it looks like a head scratcher.  Probably the best class since 2003.

Well, I think you just have to evaluate:

Could Vander improve his stock in his senior year of college enough to get drafted in a "deep draft"? vs leaving early in a weak draft.

I think he would have been better served to come back for his senior year, but that's easy for me to say.  

[LAZER]

I think Vander's decision was reasonable.

How many think his 2FG jump shooting would have been as accurate as a senior as it was as a junior?

Maybe we think that, but I doubt Blue entered the draft thinking, "well this is as good as it's gonna get for me, I'm probably not gonna get any better, I better go now"

[ChicosBailBonds]

You might be right.  Then again, go and look at the mock draft from last July and compare it to the results from last night.  You might find out that the experts are just guys who are wrong as often as they are right.  Total crapshoot.   Remember when Shabazz Muhammad was a can't miss player?  He went 14th and was then traded... in a weak draft.

Absolutely correct, it is a crapshoot, especially when people blow up, etc.  Though Shabazz was still a lottery pick last night. 

However, when on the cusp of the draft (only 60 days out, not 1 year out), the experts are all saying WTF (experts meaning GMs, draftniks, head coaches, college basketball writers), that carries more weight.  IMO.

[swoopem]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. My guess is that when he looks at his peers, by peers I mean the guys he played with on that USA team, he sees them doing well in the NBA so he compares himself to those players and thinks he belongs in the same league as them (litterally). Hell, the starting backcourt on that team was Vander, Kyrie Irving, and Austin Rivers who I know he keeps in touch with so he most likely wants to be on their level and feels he belongs there. Simple psych 101