[Cracked Sidewalks] CrackedSidewalks interview with DraftExpress

[CrackedSidewalksSays]

CrackedSidewalks interview with DraftExpress

Written by: noreply@blogger.com (muwarrior92)

I had the pleasure of speaking with Jonathan Givony today about Vander Blue and other Marquette players and their perspective NBA draft status.  Givony is the owner and founder of DraftExpress.com.  The site has information on the top high school, college and international basketball players as well as the D-League.  Part of what draws fans to their site is the mock drafts they do for the NBA.  Though it is not an exact science, Givony and his team do their best to talk to agents, GMs, coaches and others to get a feel for where a player may be drafted.

Today we caught Givony on the phone in Portland where he is attending the Nike Hoops Summit and asked him some questions about Vander Blue and other Marquette related topics.


Q:  Were you surprised to hear Vander Blue declare for the 2013 NBA Draft yesterday?

A:   I was not totally surprised because I had numerous agents call me throughout the year and especially in the month of March asking my thoughts on where he might get drafted.  They were telling me he really wanted to enter the draft and essentially didn't want to take no for an answer as he was determined to find someone to tell him he was a first round pick.  Most of the people I spoke with believe he is probably a second round pick that could work his way up, but that he would be better off going back for his senior year because he is very young for his class...he is only 20 years old.  Blue would be a young senior at 21 if he had returned.


Q: Is it your opinion that he is probably a second rounder?

A:  Tough to say what every NBA team thinks. It's very possible 25 or 26 teams feel one way, but if one or two teams like him in the first round, they might take him.  Or maybe some say they will take him early in the second round.  He was very active early on getting information about the NBA so its possible that some discussions have been had that lead to an earlier pick based on those discussions.  But my general projection is that he is a second round pick right now that could work his way up.  Depends how he does in workouts, interviews.   (EDITOR NOTE: as of today, DraftExpress has him going 26th in the second round, or the 56th overall player out of 60)


Q: What are his weaknesses or strengths?  Is size a hindrance?

A: I don't think he has bad size for a shooting guard, he doesn't have great size but he's not too small for that position. He needs to improve his shooting.  He's not a guy that can't shoot, he's made some 3's, but his shot selection isn't great, which he will have to work on.  I don't think it's out of the question that he develops and improves his shooting.  Wes Matthews, wasn't a great shooter at Marquette, but he developed into a good shooter in the NBA and is paid a lot of money as a result.  You can't rule out that Blue won't improve in this area like Matthews, but it depends on his work ethic.


Q: When you put your mock draft together, do you only focus on players that are for sure coming out or do you speculate also on those you think might come out?  Vander Blue wasn't listed in your mock draft for 2013, but is listed in 2014 as a first rounder for example.

A: We try to project who we think is going to come out based on what we are hearing.  Also some educated speculation, for example, we had Phil Pressey in our draft all year long because he is older and we expected him to go to the draft.  We also had Marcus Smart in our mock draft for 2013, but were surprised last night when he decided to go back to school so he is no longer on the board this year.  Its not an exact science. I thought Vander Blue was going to go back to school from what we heard, but then he changed his mind and decided to enter so now he is in our mock draft.


Q:  Your perception of the draft this year?  Is it weak and driving people to enter early?

A:  You need to separate different parts of the draft.  If you are the Bobcats, Cavaliers, or Magic, for them it might be a weak draft because for them they probably won't get the return on their very high picks they would hope for.  There aren't many sure fire superstars at the top.  However, as you move
down the board there are a lot of good players, good depth.  Teams in the mid first round or later, they are excited about this draft.  They know there will a number of interesting prospects to choose from.  There's a ton of big men, which you usually don't see, some good wing players, some depth at some positions.  I think this is a pretty normal draft to be honest with you, but it depends really from where you are drafting.


Q: One final question, what are your thoughts of Davante Gardner and Jamil Wilson of Marquette and their NBA draft prospects?

A: Both of them have very interesting attributes that will be interesting for the NBA.  Wilson has great size and length for a 3, some decent versatility.  Needs to be more consistent as he can fade in some games and you wonder if he needs a bit more toughness.  I think he is someone that has a chance to help himself with a strong senior year.  Gardner, if he has a really good off-season and loses some more weight, he can be a very interesting prospect.  He is so productive, even with limited minutes.  Great hands, great touch, great feet and he's pretty skilled player offensively and rebounds, too.  If he has a good off-season and into play next year, he can creep up into some discussions.  He led the Big East in PER (Player Efficiency Rating), which is pretty impressive.






http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2013/04/crackedsidewalks-interview-with.html

[PaintTouches]

This was a fantastic interview. Thanks for the insight.

[MU82]

"I don't think it's out of the question that he develops and improves his shooting.  Wes Matthews, wasn't a great shooter at Marquette, but he developed into a good shooter in the NBA and is paid a lot of money as a result.  You can't rule out that Blue won't improve in this area like Matthews, but it depends on his work ethic."

OK, you want to know when Matthews really took a step forward and improved his shooting?

AS A SENIOR AT MARQUETTE!

Matthews' numbers his sophomore and junior seasons were very similar to Vander's numbers as a junior. Matthews came back and improved his shooting across the board. Shot .475 overall, .368 from 3-point range and .829 from FT line as a senior. Also upped his scoring average to 18.3.

No, that senior season didn't help Wes get drafted. But it did help him become an NBA player.

[onepost]

They were telling me he really wanted to enter the draft and essentially didn't want to take no for an answer as he was determined to find someone to tell him he was a first round pick.

This was by far the most telling part of the interview. Pretty much confirmed what we all knew about Vander from Day 1: he wanted to get out of college ASAP, it was just a matter of when was his stock gonna be high enough. A friend of mine talked to Vander the night before he declared and he said (paraphrasing) "My stock rose because of the Tournament run and I didn't feel like I'd be able to keep that level of play up all of next year."

So in that case, I'm not too heartbroken. If he was gonna spend all next year worrying about his draft status and not buying into the team 100%, then I'm fine with his decision. Doesn't sound like NBA confidence to me though.

[UticaBusBarn]

The interview was timely and most insightful, especially Blue's desire to make the NBA jump no matter what anyone said.

Blue certainly has a lot of physical tools, works hard, and if he has as much drive/passion as the article infers, he will make it one one way, or another.

The comments on Wilson and Gardner were a bonus ... even though we all know Wilson needs more motor and that Gardner needs less pounds.

[LastWarrior]

Great piece guys!  Really hope nothing but the best for Vander.  I'll be rooting for him to make it!  That senior season is really important fringe players... Wes, Jerel, Lazar, Jimmy, DJO & Jae.  Understand Vander is determined but so were those guys.  They took their senior year to work on their game.  The NBA doesn't afford that luxury to fringe players.  I fear Vander will be eaten up and lost in the NBA shuffle.

[brewcity77]

"I don't think it's out of the question that he develops and improves his shooting.  Wes Matthews, wasn't a great shooter at Marquette, but he developed into a good shooter in the NBA and is paid a lot of money as a result.  You can't rule out that Blue won't improve in this area like Matthews, but it depends on his work ethic."

OK, you want to know when Matthews really took a step forward and improved his shooting?

AS A SENIOR AT MARQUETTE!

Matthews' numbers his sophomore and junior seasons were very similar to Vander's numbers as a junior. Matthews came back and improved his shooting across the board. Shot .475 overall, .368 from 3-point range and .829 from FT line as a senior. Also upped his scoring average to 18.3.

No, that senior season didn't help Wes get drafted. But it did help him become an NBA player.

But that doesn't mean Blue's shot can't improve somewhere other than Marquette. With likely even better coaching and training staff at the next level, there's no reason he can't become a shooter on par with Wes. I look more at how close Blue's numbers mimic Jerel's and wonder I McNeal would have been better off declaring after his junior year.

If Blue puts up similar numbers as a senior (say 16 ppg, 33% from 3) is he more attractive or less because he's a year older and his game seems to have plateaued? It's easy an clearly en vogue to criticize his decision, but even practicing against NBA players could be more beneficial in the long term than if he were basically the same player for another year at MU.

[mu_hilltopper]

I look more at how close Blue's numbers mimic Jerel's..

The huge (HUGE) difference was that .. Jerel was great for a freshman.  He was excellent as a sophomore and junior.   Vander?  His first two seasons were .. not comparable.

.. and wonder I McNeal would have been better off declaring after his junior year.

McNeal had a monster senior year.  Monster.   And didn't get drafted.  I think you could make the opposite point.  Vander should have used McNeal's path as guidance.  Even with a monster senior year, McNeal (who was better than Van in every major category) missed the draft. 

[Lennys Tap]

The huge (HUGE) difference was that .. Jerel was great for a freshman.  He was excellent as a sophomore and junior.   Vander?  His first two seasons were .. not comparable.

McNeal had a monster senior year.  Monster.   And didn't get drafted.  I think you could make the opposite point.  Vander should have used McNeal's path as guidance.  Even with a monster senior year, McNeal (who was better than Van in every major category) missed the draft. 

McNeal and Blue had similar stats their junior year. Vander is bigger and more athletic, this is deemed a weak draft and post Wes, Lazar, Jimmy and Jae Buzz has some chops/capital with NBA coaches and GMs. I'd say advantage Van.

[MU82]

But that doesn't mean Blue's shot can't improve somewhere other than Marquette. With likely even better coaching and training staff at the next level, there's no reason he can't become a shooter on par with Wes. I look more at how close Blue's numbers mimic Jerel's and wonder I McNeal would have been better off declaring after his junior year.

If Blue puts up similar numbers as a senior (say 16 ppg, 33% from 3) is he more attractive or less because he's a year older and his game seems to have plateaued? It's easy an clearly en vogue to criticize his decision, but even practicing against NBA players could be more beneficial in the long term than if he were basically the same player for another year at MU.

Fair enough, brew. As usual, you make many logical points.

I still believe Vander will not make it in the NBA, but he might not have made it even if he had come back and had a spectacular senior year. I like the comment just above yours talking about how every recent Marquette draftee benefited significantly from his senior season at MU. I believe the odds of Vander being a first-round draft pick -- and thereby getting guaranteed millions -- would have increased substantially had he come back and shown improvement as a senior.

In a few years, I guess we'll all know about Vander's NBA career or lack thereof.

[jesmu84]

I believe the odds of Vander being a first-round draft pick -- and thereby getting guaranteed millions -- would have increased substantially had he come back and shown improvement as a senior.

Ah. But there's the rub right there. What if Vander had come back for his senior year and not gotten any better? I'm not saying worse, but what if he plateaued? Unless we won it all with him as our leader, his stock isn't going to be higher, and probably lower, than it is right now. Risk management.

[Jay Bee]

OK, you want to know when Matthews really took a step forward and improved his shooting?

AS A SENIOR AT MARQUETTE!

When Buzz became head coach.

[Lennys Tap]

CrackedSidewalks interview with DraftExpress

Written by: noreply@blogger.com (muwarrior92)

I had the pleasure of speaking with Jonathan Givony today about Vander Blue and other Marquette players and their perspective NBA draft status.  Givony is the owner and founder of DraftExpress.com.  The site has information on the top high school, college and international basketball players as well as the D-League.  Part of what draws fans to their site is the mock drafts they do for the NBA.  Though it is not an exact science, Givony and his team do their best to talk to agents, GMs, coaches and others to get a feel for where a player may be drafted.

Today we caught Givony on the phone in Portland where he is attending the Nike Hoops Summit and asked him some questions about Vander Blue and other Marquette related topics.


Q:  Were you surprised to hear Vander Blue declare for the 2013 NBA Draft yesterday?

A:   I was not totally surprised because I had numerous agents call me throughout the year and especially in the month of March asking my thoughts on where he might get drafted.  They were telling me he really wanted to enter the draft and essentially didn't want to take no for an answer as he was determined to find someone to tell him he was a first round pick.  Most of the people I spoke with believe he is probably a second round pick that could work his way up, but that he would be better off going back for his senior year because he is very young for his class...he is only 20 years old.  Blue would be a young senior at 21 if he had returned.








Q: When you put your mock draft together, do you only focus on players that are for sure coming out or do you speculate also on those you think might come out?  Vander Blue wasn't listed in your mock draft for 2013, but is listed in 2014 as a first rounder for example.

A: We try to project who we think is going to come out based on what we are hearing.  Also some educated speculation, for example, we had Phil Pressey in our draft all year long because he is older and we expected him to go to the draft.  We also had Marcus Smart in our mock draft for 2013, but were surprised last night when he decided to go back to school so he is no longer on the board this year.  Its not an exact science. I thought Vander Blue was going to go back to school from what we heard, but then he changed his mind and decided to enter so now he is in our mock draft.

So he wasn't surprised that Vander declared for the draft. In fact, all year he was hearing from agents that Blue wanted to come out. But he didn't list him in Draft Express all year because he didn't think he was going to come out. Hmmmm....

CYA , talk out of both sides of your mouth, just as I suspected.

[ChicosBailBonds]

So he wasn't surprised that Vander declared for the draft. In fact, all year he was hearing from agents that Blue wanted to come out. But he didn't list him in Draft Express all year because he didn't think he was going to come out. Hmmmm....

CYA , talk out of both sides of your mouth, just as I suspected.

I think the written word can be deceiving...in fact I know it can.  As he told me, he was not surprised because Vander was the one wanting to come out. So he wasn't surprised because of what Vander wanted to do, not necessarily what the correct basketball decision was.  Did he think it was the right move or what a basketball person would recommend....no, he did not....nor did almost everyone they talked to (or Jason King, or Parrish, or Goodman, etc, etc)  That's the difference and a distinctive one you are missing, but the written word can do that without inflection, etc.  Nearly everyone he talked to said Vander should stay, he's only 20, which is young.  In summary, he wasn't surprised because despite what the experts were saying, Vander wanted out to pursue the NBA.   He's tying the lack of surprise to Vander's desire to get out, not on his value in the draft.

That's the way I took it.  I see nothing incongruent at all with the way he answered the questions because as we all know, some kids just make questionable decisions.  We'll see if that is the case here.  Hopefully not, but when kids make questionable decisions or flip flop, then it becomes "less surprising".  

[MU82]

Ah. But there's the rub right there. What if Vander had come back for his senior year and not gotten any better? I'm not saying worse, but what if he plateaued? Unless we won it all with him as our leader, his stock isn't going to be higher, and probably lower, than it is right now. Risk management.

You are entitled to that opinion, and it's certainly reasonable. However, I believe that if Vander worked as hard between his junior and senior seasons as he did between his sophomore and junior seasons, he would have gotten substantially better. Heck, he got better between Feb. 1 and March 1 this year.

But this is all conjecture. We don't know how good he would have gotten. I fear he has consigned himself to the life of a basketball nomad.

I hope I'm wrong and I wish him well.

[Spotcheck Billy]

This does sound like he thinks he couldn't play at the level he did this March for much of next year in which case his stock likely would not improve. Good luck Vander I truly hope your decision works out well.

They were telling me he really wanted to enter the draft and essentially didn't want to take no for an answer as he was determined to find someone to tell him he was a first round pick.

This was by far the most telling part of the interview. Pretty much confirmed what we all knew about Vander from Day 1: he wanted to get out of college ASAP, it was just a matter of when was his stock gonna be high enough. A friend of mine talked to Vander the night before he declared and he said (paraphrasing) "My stock rose because of the Tournament run and I didn't feel like I'd be able to keep that level of play up all of next year."

So in that case, I'm not too heartbroken. If he was gonna spend all next year worrying about his draft status and not buying into the team 100%, then I'm fine with his decision. Doesn't sound like NBA confidence to me though.

[Spotcheck Billy]

Q:  Were you surprised to hear Vander Blue declare for the 2013 NBA Draft yesterday?

A:   I was not totally surprised because I had numerous agents call me throughout the year and especially in the month of March asking my thoughts on where he might get drafted.  They were telling me he really wanted to enter the draft and essentially didn't want to take no for an answer as he was determined to find someone to tell him he was a first round pick.  

what rules are there for players still with eligibility having contacts with agents?

[ChicosBailBonds]

This was a fantastic interview. Thanks for the insight.

Thank you....keep up the GREAT work over at PT....love your stuff over there.

[ChicosBailBonds]

what rules are there for players still with eligibility having contacts with agents?

Should make it clear here that the agents were talking to Givony, not to anyone else.  I don't want anyone to think the agents were talking to VB, as that is not what he said. 

I don't know the answer to your question, but did want to clear that up.

[brewcity77]

The huge (HUGE) difference was that .. Jerel was great for a freshman.  He was excellent as a sophomore and junior.   Vander?  His first two seasons were .. not comparable.

Yeah...you'd think that, wouldn't you? Only it's not true. Blue was more efficient offensively as both a freshman and sophomore than McNeal was. McNeal put up bigger numbers because he had a much higher usage rate, but had Blue not had DJO, Butler, and Crowder around him, his offensive efficiency indicates he probably would have put up numbers equal to or slightly better than Jerel did.

Jerel McNeal Efficiency
Vander Blue Efficiency

McNeal had a monster senior year.  Monster.   And didn't get drafted.  I think you could make the opposite point.  Vander should have used McNeal's path as guidance.  Even with a monster senior year, McNeal (who was better than Van in every major category) missed the draft.

So based on what you said, Vander could have a monster senior year and still not get drafted? All the more reason to throw his hat in the ring now. I really think this makes my point rather than disproving it.

[ATL MU Warrior]

Yeah...you'd think that, wouldn't you? Only it's not true. Blue was more efficient offensively as both a freshman and sophomore than McNeal was. McNeal put up bigger numbers because he had a much higher usage rate, but had Blue not had DJO, Butler, and Crowder around him, his offensive efficiency indicates he probably would have put up numbers equal to or slightly better than Jerel did.

Jerel McNeal Efficiency
Vander Blue Efficiency

But Blue did have DJO, Butler and Crowder around him, so what Topper said is true, except in your little fantasy land you created for yourself so you could be right.

[nycwarrior]

After pages of bias, it was nice to read something that felt objective. Thank you for the interview.

[T-Bone]

When Buzz became head coach.

I agree.  A different system allowed Wes' game to mature very quickly - it became an open game, without 50,000 scripted plays that seldom worked. 

However, in much the same way Van's game could take a significant jump with another coach. 
Considering how awful his shot looked his 1st and 2nd years and how much better it looked his Junior year, it might have continued to improve under Buzz and Co. 

We'll never know. 

[4everwarriors]

Blue will make the league. Might need a year of seasoning, but the make up of his fabric says he makes it.

[brewcity77]

But Blue did have DJO, Butler and Crowder around him, so what Topper said is true, except in your little fantasy land you created for yourself so you could be right.

LOL 

If I could create that fantasy land, I'd be a much richer man because I'm sure Pomeroy makes plenty off his website. Wish I could have created that.