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Author Topic: Get your discounted ads now  (Read 9999 times)

ChicosBailBonds

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Get your discounted ads now
« on: September 13, 2007, 03:54:12 PM »
Full Page ad in the NY Times for normal organizations $167,157

Full Page ad in the NY Times if you're MoveOn.org and want to rip General Petraeus   $65,157....a discount of $102,000.


I'm sure the Times will provide equal discounts to Republicans, conservative groups, etc.  I'm sure that will happen.

By the way, the Times ended trading yesterday at $20.72, a FIVE YEAR LOW.  Nice going Pinch.

Murffieus

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The General "Betray Us" Ad!
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2007, 08:38:02 AM »
The Investor's Biz Daily points out this morning that the NY Times not only allowed that "seditious ad" to be printed on the first page, but actually gave MoveOn.org a huge discount. IBD reports that the NYT dropped the price by 2/3 ($181,692 to $65,000). The Ad (encouraged by the nation's "newspaper of record") attempts to place Gen Patraeus in the same category as Benedict Arnold (have they gone mad?). But what should we expect? The Ad which was timed to coincide with Gen Petraeus's congressional testimony on the progress in the war fits very nicely with the NYT's own view of the war.

Meanwhile ads which appear regularily of late on Fox News in support of the war (I've seen them, they are not inflammatory in the least) have been turned down on CNBC and MSNBC by NBC who attempts to explain this away by citing a "network policy" of rejecting ads from groups that touch on "controversial issues of public imporatance"-----this also according to IBD!

Go Figure !
« Last Edit: September 14, 2007, 08:40:16 AM by Murffieus »

augoman

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2007, 12:49:23 PM »
the nytimes shows once again why it's barely fit to wrap fish in.  A paper I looked forward to reading on weekends no longer has any credibility-

Murffieus

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2007, 01:10:35 PM »
According to the AP this morning, Guiliani is going to respond with a full page ad of his own, and is asking the NY Times for the same 60% discount that moveon.org got-----we'll see what happens !

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #4 on: September 14, 2007, 01:13:46 PM »

tower912

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #5 on: September 23, 2007, 03:07:45 PM »
With the reich-wings long standing habit of tearing down decorated veterans once they espouse a position they disagree with, a la Hagel, Murtha, Kerry, Cleland, Gore, Shinseki, Powell, etc, I am amused at how "offended" they are that an advocacy group copied the tactics of the Swiftboat veterans.    I thought the ad was tacky, personally, but I thought the reaction by the right was hysterical.   I am also amused at how little play Admiral Fallon's opinion of General Petraeus is receiving.   You would think when a general's superior officer publicly refers to him as an ass-kisser, it would get more play.   But, I have always admired this administration's ability to control the story.   It is their gift.
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ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #6 on: September 23, 2007, 07:07:37 PM »
With the reich-wings long standing habit of tearing down decorated veterans once they espouse a position they disagree with, a la Hagel, Murtha, Kerry, Cleland, Gore, Shinseki, Powell, etc, I am amused at how "offended" they are that an advocacy group copied the tactics of the Swiftboat veterans.    I thought the ad was tacky, personally, but I thought the reaction by the right was hysterical.   I am also amused at how little play Admiral Fallon's opinion of General Petraeus is receiving.   You would think when a general's superior officer publicly refers to him as an ass-kisser, it would get more play.   But, I have always admired this administration's ability to control the story.   It is their gift.

Hilarious.

First off, the swift boat veterans were just that...veterans that served with Kerry, including several congressional medal of honor winners, bronze star, silver star, etc.   

Now, if you can explain to me how MorOn.org is equivalent to those veterans, have at it.  It's an open forum and I look forward to hearing how they are similar.

Avenue Commons

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #7 on: September 24, 2007, 08:48:53 AM »
With the reich-wings long standing habit of tearing down decorated veterans once they espouse a position they disagree with, a la Hagel, Murtha, Kerry, Cleland, Gore, Shinseki, Powell, etc, I am amused at how "offended" they are that an advocacy group copied the tactics of the Swiftboat veterans.    I thought the ad was tacky, personally, but I thought the reaction by the right was hysterical.   I am also amused at how little play Admiral Fallon's opinion of General Petraeus is receiving.   You would think when a general's superior officer publicly refers to him as an ass-kisser, it would get more play.   But, I have always admired this administration's ability to control the story.   It is their gift.

Hilarious.

First off, the swift boat veterans were just that...veterans that served with Kerry, including several congressional medal of honor winners, bronze star, silver star, etc.   

Now, if you can explain to me how MorOn.org is equivalent to those veterans, have at it.  It's an open forum and I look forward to hearing how they are similar.

The "Swift Boat Veterans" were a bunch of political pawns and liars. http://www.factcheck.org/article231.html
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tower912

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #8 on: September 24, 2007, 06:22:01 PM »
Well, Chico, it turns out that moveon.org wasn't even being original.   They were stealing from Limbaugh and applying the phrase in a more lyrical fashion.
http://mediamatters.org/items/200709220003


If I had realize that they were plagiarizing Limbaugh, I, too, would have been offended.    I look forward to your outrage at a radio talk show host accusing a senator of betrayal.   Shameful. ;)
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mviale

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #9 on: September 24, 2007, 09:23:24 PM »
non-issue - free speech

Move On
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Murffieus

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #10 on: September 27, 2007, 06:51:17 PM »
Apples and Oranges----it's one thing to refer to the leading general in the war on terror as "General Betrayus" and completely another thing to call one of 100 Senators, Senator Betrayus" !

Hagel had himself (re-election) rather than principal in mind when he was leading the charge on the republican side of the aisle to surrender in Iraq. Since he has announced that he WON'T run for re-election, we haven't heard a peep out of him!

mviale

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #11 on: September 27, 2007, 10:53:04 PM »
free speech Murf - since when is this off limits?
You heard it here first. Davante Gardner will be a Beast this year.
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=27259

Murffieus

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2007, 07:33:11 AM »
You're right "free speech"-----I'm not saying that its illegal to refer to Gen Petraeus in such a manner-----I just question the patriotism of those that print and champion such garbage.

Utile et Dulce

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2007, 08:11:10 AM »
its treason!!!!

these move-on traitors should be executed on tape -------- and broadcast to the Middle East as a show of our unwavering nerve!!!!

How we let "political dissent" remain alive and well in this country is an absolute mystery to me!!!!

How dare someone disagree? Don't they care about patriotism????!!!!
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Murffieus

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #14 on: September 28, 2007, 10:14:37 AM »
Prevent Offense----disagreeing is one thing, but disagreement should be accompanied by at least some respect for the other point of view-----whatever happened to the concept of "loyal opposition"?

Utile et Dulce

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #15 on: September 28, 2007, 03:17:30 PM »
you can not equate a poorly-made argument to a lack of patriotism

i have no problem with you disagreeing, thinking the ad was filth or writing a letter to the editor with your disgust. i am tired, however, of the unpatriotic idea that dissent somehow equals treason, not matter how uncivilized the language
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Murffieus

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #16 on: September 28, 2007, 09:21:54 PM »
Moveon.org's Ad was not desent---it went far beyood desent. You say that I say it's "treason"----not so-----but it is unpatriotic. What is very wrong though is to portray General Petraeus as guilty of treason!

I ask you again----whatever has happened to the "loyal opposition" in this country!
« Last Edit: September 28, 2007, 09:25:56 PM by Murffieus »

mviale

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #17 on: September 28, 2007, 11:46:19 PM »
They call Lincoln a traitor when he protested our war with mexico in the 1840s when our govt claimed Mexico posed a threat to us.

They were wrong then and they are wrong today. Peace & dissension is not unpatriotic
« Last Edit: September 28, 2007, 11:51:28 PM by mviale »
You heard it here first. Davante Gardner will be a Beast this year.
http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=27259

Murffieus

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #18 on: September 29, 2007, 06:22:39 AM »
You mean after the slaughter at the Alamo,war with Mexico wasn't justified?
If it wasn't justified then, why not?

I don't know if you are correct or not on Lincoln being against the Mexican war, but a private citizen, Lincoln or anyone else can criticze a war------but let's not confuse Lincoln's supposed "loyal opposition" to the war with moveon.org's character assasination of the Gen Petraeus in an attempt to discredit him----he's just doing the job he was trained for-----and doing it very well by the way, which is why Moveon.org attacked him!

Moveon's NYTimes ad portraying Petraeus as guilty of treason was unpatriotic and dispicitable!!

There were citizens in our history that were against every war we've ever fought-----the other point of view is important, but let's contain that view within the boundries of "loyal opposition" !

Utile et Dulce

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #19 on: September 29, 2007, 07:55:03 AM »
Problem is, you can't specify which (legal) dissent is patriotic and which isn't.

Can you disagree? Yes. Can think that Petraeus was character assassinated? Sure. Can you believe in some misguided theory that every argument has a logical and cohesive opposite that should be respected with "loyal opposition?" I guess.

What you can not do is call legal free speech unpatriotic when in fact the very use of free speech is the most patriotic thing you can do in this country. You are falling into the trap this administration has laid so masterfully. You are either with us or against us. A patriot or a traitor.

The idea that patriotism is flag waving, yellow ribbon tying, war supporting, "rah-rah USA is number 1" is tearing at the very fabric of this country.

Patriotism is dissent...even if you disagree with the way it is written.
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tower912

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #20 on: September 29, 2007, 09:32:00 AM »
http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=1140

Loyal opposition like this?   I particularly like the insults directed at General Clark.    How dare they?       


Or support for the troops like this?
http://mediamatters.org/items/200709270010
« Last Edit: September 29, 2007, 10:16:43 AM by tower912 »
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Murffieus

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #21 on: September 29, 2007, 04:05:16 PM »
Tower------What insults directed at General Clark?-----who took out a full page ad in the NYTimes depicting General Clark as a traitor? Who? When? IT DIDN'T HAPPEN!

BTW-----Your links are within the context of the "loyal opposition".

Prevent offense----we live in representative government----Bush got a vast majority of the congress (and Tony blair) to start the war (everyone saw the same intelligence), he was reelected in 2004 to manage the war as commander in chief-----his term is up in January 2009----if Hillary wins, we'll see what she can do and what the consequences are of what she does!

Every war we quit on (surrender) makes the next one harder to fight----Al Quida and Iran get a lot of their motivation from our pullout of Vietnam!

Utile et Dulce

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #22 on: September 29, 2007, 11:03:40 PM »
What?

The actions of Hillary or Dubya have zero impact on your use of the word "unpatriotic" to describe an organization lawfully practicing their right to free speech.

My contention here is not with the war or any other ill this country is facing. It is purely with the current conservative notion that opposition equals treason, which was summed up nicely by your calling out MoveOn as unpatriotic for their ad.

I'm not going to argue those other points with you. You don't care what I think and vise versa. But the discussion about free speech is vital. Don't change the subject to something that has no bearing.
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Murffieus

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #23 on: September 30, 2007, 08:27:26 AM »
I keep telling you that it isn't the opposition to the war that "equals treason" ----it's when someone or some organization places a full page add in the NYTimes depicting a very honorable man who happens to be the lead general in Iraq as guillty of treason -----this is over the top, far over the top.

Having said that ----adamant opposition to the war does give aid and comfort to the enemy (results in more dead Americans)----and this oppositions enables the enemy and motivates them to keep fighting as they believe the American will, will wain (ala pullouts of Vietnam, Lebanon, Somalia, etc). Their motivation is that America doesn't have the stomach for war----and it wom't be long before public opinion forces a surrender!

Thank God for GWB who gets it !


Utile et Dulce

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Re: Get your discounted ads now
« Reply #24 on: September 30, 2007, 10:39:26 AM »
Murf, that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard.

You can not segregate opposition into "acceptable" and "non-acceptable" and then label one patriotic and one unpatriotic.

I know that doesn't fit into the "for us" or "against us" black and white world the conservative right live in...

Was the ad over-the-top? That's a matter of personal opinion, I guess. Aside from "General Betrayus", the ad was largely an exercise in factual contradictions to the statements of the General -- hardly impugning his character.

Regardless, OVER-THE-TOP does not equate to a lack of patriotism or treason.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2007, 10:45:24 AM by Prevent Offense »
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