Catholic 7 12th member

[bilsu]

Locally, sure. I think both Dayton and VCU draw great local ratings, but can they draw neutral eyes 1,000 miles away? At the moment I think VCU draws more neutral eyes.

Regardless, with no Gonzaga, I would take both Dayton and VCU. I just feel SLU is less of a proven commodity than the rest of our options.

Does Marquette draw neutal eyes 1000 miles away?

[brewcity77]

Does Marquette draw neutal eyes 1000 miles away?

Yes. I'm talking about college basketball fans that will turn on the TV at night and pick from the 4-5 games that are regularly on. I think that Marquette will pull in a lot more of those casual viewers than St. Louis. Similarly, Georgetown, Villanova, Gonzaga, Butler, Xavier will all also pull in those eyes.

The reason I like name-recognition programs is because we will be running up against Big Ten games, against SEC games, and others that also have name brands. We aren't as big a brand as those state schools, but I have no doubt a random viewer would sooner keep on a game with us or another school they expect to be making the tournament in a couple months than they would a game with a team that doesn't have a track record of success.

[Avenue Commons]

Having been on a lot of the C7 message boards, how I see the average C7 list:

1. Xavier
2. Butler
3. Creighton
4. Dayton
5. SLU
----------------------
6. VCU

From the VCU fans perspective:

1. Butler
2. Xavier
3. Dayton
4. Creighton
5. VCU
------------------------
6. SLU

From FOX's perspective

1. Creighton
2. Butler
3. VCU
4. Xavier
5. Dayton
----------------------------
6. Gonzaga

This is objective, fair, unbiased analysis/interpretation. It is accurate even though it is contrary to your teams's best interest.

How dare you post this on an Internet message board.

[MUMonster03]

Does Marquette draw neutal eyes 1000 miles away?

I think it depends on the particular game. Georgetown/Pitt/Villanova vs. Marquette is going to draw more national interest then USF/DePaul/Providence since the first set of teams and Marquette have had more recent success/better brand name recognition.

People in DC may not know where Marquette is located but they know we have a great basketball program.

[Chips]

I think you may be wrong on Dayton. The market may not be huge, but they draw ridiculously good ratings in it.

Vcu as well draws great ratings #Havoc

http://espnmediazone.com/us/press-releases/2012/11/60498/

Dayton #8, Richmond #20, Saint Louis #17

[Benny B]

Does Marquette draw neutral eyes 1000 miles away?

I once met someone from Denver who said he has followed Marquette since the days of Al McGuire.  Although as the crow flies, Milwaukee is just under a 1,000 miles from Denver; however, the guy thought Marquette was in the U.P., so that would be your 1,000 miles right there.

[Avenue Commons]

Creighton goes up a notch in my book.

Dayton is much more apealing than I initially thought.

[frozena pizza]

I think it depends on the particular game. Georgetown/Pitt/Villanova vs. Marquette is going to draw more national interest then USF/DePaul/Providence since the first set of teams and Marquette have had more recent success/better brand name recognition.

People in DC may not know where Marquette is located but they know we have a great basketball program.

To me, this is really the key for the new conference.  During the Great Midwest / Conference-USA era, I don't think we drew much national interest as an unranked team playing UAB and Southern Miss.  Once we joined the Big East (and post-DWade) and we were consistently ranked and playing against other ranked teams there was a lot more attention.  People will watch marquee games between highly ranked teams, no matter who is playing.  Someone with no connection to Marquette or their opponent is not going to care if neither team is good because there will always be a better game to watch.

[MUMonster03]

http://espnmediazone.com/us/press-releases/2012/11/60498/

Dayton #8, Richmond #20, Saint Louis #17

Is this market rating just for games watched in that market?

Just curious since I saw Milwaukee listed at .8 for MU and UW.

Also, surprised Indy is so low because that would be IU, Purdue, and Butler's biggest market.

[Pretzel]

Source: http://www.a10talk.com/2013/01/weekend-wrap-clarke-hospitalized-semaj-shines-and-uninspired-fans/

Below are the official home attendance averages according to Atlantic10.com, team record and percentage of capacity.

1. Dayton (10-6) 12,364 – 92% capacity
2. Xavier (9-6) 9,738 – 95%
3. VCU (14-2) 7,693 – 100%
4. Butler (14-2) 6,906 – 69%
5. St. Louis (12-4) 6,380 – 60%
6. Charlotte (14-2) 5,603 – 62%
7. Temple (11-4) 4,809 – 47%
8. UMass (11-4) 4,776 – 53%
9. Richmond (11-6) 4,770 – 52%
10. St. Joseph's (9-5) 4,064 – 97%
11. Rhode Island (5-10) 4,013 – 52%
12. St. Bonaventure (7-8) 3,834 – 70%
13. Duquesne (7-9) 3,032 – 68%
14. La Salle (11-4) 2,463 – 72%
15. Fordham (5-12) 2,061 – 59%
16. George Washington (7-8) 2,021 – 46%

[dwaderoy2004]

that's Dayton's pro and con in a nutshell: big attendance numbers, so-so W-L record.

[dwaderoy2004]

http://espnmediazone.com/us/press-releases/2012/11/60498/

Dayton #8, Richmond #20, Saint Louis #17

Is this data normalized for population?  In other words, could that 1.2 rating in St. Louis still have more people watching than a 2.0 rating in Dayton?

[bradley center bat]

yes

[Eldon]

Local STL TV making a push for SLU

http://www.kmov.com/sports/The-Catholic-7-and-St-Louis-University--187455451.html

[Jet915]

Local STL TV making a push for SLU

http://www.kmov.com/sports/The-Catholic-7-and-St-Louis-University--187455451.html

Seems like the biggest argument for adding SLU in that article is being in a urban environment.  Not sure I buy the "great SLU basketball pedigree" bit.

[TedBaxter]

This is just my own opinion, so you can argue against it all you want.

What schools like Butler, Creighton, Dayton, Saint Louis and Xavier have going for them, at least in my eyes, is not only the urban locations and basketball focus, but that they are private institutions and while some want to shy away from that aspect because of political correctness, I think this is the one thing that can help make this conference stand out nationally and in the medias eyes and let me explain.

The non-conference rivalries are great like the Wisconsin game for Marquette, but the conference season is special.  The Big East has been great for MU fans and the previous conferences have helped MU along the way, but there were always games against schools with no connection other than playing athletic events against each other and I'm talking differences in institutions, athletic offerings and even geographic reasons.   You even see the differences in established conferences like Northwestern in the Big 10, Vanderbilt in the SEC and Stanford in the Pac 12.

I think what alums and fans of schools around the country would embrace would be a conference that is being established to bring together like schools for the right reasons and not just for money and this conference has schools that are identifiable, by not only fans and alums of the schools, but also college basketball fans in general who would actually watch a conference game to see a conference that has a basketball focus and with schools that actually fit together.  That's why I favor the schools above over schools like VCU and Gonzaga, with Gonzaga out for location and VCU out because of the school profile itself.

I could actually see more alums getting interested in athletics since they could be cheering for their school because they would now be playing against the school attended by a sibling or another relative.  Look at the Diener family where you had siblings and cousins attending Marquette, DePaul and Saint Louis and from reading MU's message boards over the years, it's not unusual to have relatives attend different schools in this future conference.  The school pride issue is escalated and that leads to athletic and monetary interest.

Just one person's opinion and I'm a public university graduate saying this.

[Norm]

Good points Baxter, but I'd still take VCU in the league.

10 team league: C7, Xavier, Butler, Creighton.

12 team league: C7, Xavier, Butler, Creighton, St. Louis, VCU.

I'd take St. Louis over Dayton for two reasons.

One, they are a traditional soccer powerhouse, have won 10 NCAA championships and been to the NCAA soccer tournament more than any other school. The 12 team league mentioned above would have had more NCAA soccer tournament bids than any other conference in the country this past season, with two schools, Georgetown and Creighton, in the final four.

Second, their media market is a lot bigger than Dayton. St. Louis is the #21 TV market with approximately 1,243,490 households. Dayton is the #63 TV market with 498,270 households. In addition, the league would already have a southwestern Ohio team in Xavier in Cincinnati, where the market is #35 with 897,890 households.

VCU is a better option for both basketball and soccer--the two main sports of this new league--than Dayton is. And St. Louis is light years ahead of Dayton in soccer.

[Avenue Commons]

Everyone is going to regret how much time was spent on this when they hear VCU was only "considered" in passing.

[boyonthedock]

I once met someone from Denver who said he has followed Marquette since the days of Al McGuire.  Although as the crow flies, Milwaukee is just under a 1,000 miles from Denver; however, the guy thought Marquette was in the U.P., so that would be your 1,000 miles right there.

I've met multiple people in Milwaukee that didn't know Marquette was in Milwaukee. I met them in Milwaukee hotels, to be fair, but they knew about the basketball program.