Do we now root for the ACC to blow up?

[honkytonk]

You seriously think if Virginia jumps to the B1G they would consider GU?  The ACC is not that stupid.

I didnt suggest that Georgetown would replace a football school.

The ACC would obviously shore up their football membership and make sure they have 12, first and foremost. So...twelve football schools....plus ND....plus .....Georgetown, maybe? Not an impossibility...at all.

[GGGG]

You're fooling yourself if their will ever be stability.  Stability only applies to the B1G because they make more money then anyone else (thanks to the Big Ten Network or BTN).  Have you noticed no one leaves teh B1Ga nd everyone wants in.  That is because of one reason, the money they make with the BTN.

You get stability by getting more money.  To get more money, you have to take risks.  That means ND if you can get them to reconsider.  If not, the new conference is on a road to mid-major.

This is cute. 

It also doesn't really matter because the ACC isnt going to blow up.

[Tugg Speedman]

This is cute. 

It also doesn't really matter because the ACC isnt going to blow up.

Don't be so sure.  The ACC football schools make less money that the SEC, B1G and B12.  Because of this they are vulnerable, and will always be vulnerable. 

They just lost Maryland.

[GGGG]

Don't be so sure.  The ACC football schools make less money that the SEC, B1G and B12.  Because of this they are vulnerable, and will always be vulnerable. 

They just lost Maryland.

Maryland was desperate.  I don't think other schools are necessarily interested at this point.

[Tugg Speedman]

Maryland was desperate.  I don't think other schools are necessarily interested at this point.

Not interested in making more money?  Your comment is 180 degrees off from all the comments/stories about the ACC.  That is most schools want out to the B1G (Virginia, UNC) or the SEC/B12 (Clemson, G-Tech, Miami and FSU).  The hold up is some of these conferences are not sure they want them or state legislatures are putting rules on them (UNC has to take NC State and Virginia has to take Virginia Tech).

They are definitely interested as they are the next lowest grossing football major football conference now that the Big East is gone.

[GGGG]

Not interested in making more money?  Your comment is 180 degrees off from all the comments/stories about the ACC.  That is most schools want out to the B1G (Virginia, UNC) or the SEC/B12 (Clemson, G-Tech, Miami and FSU).  The hold up is some of these conferences are not sure they want them or state legislatures are putting rules on them (UNC has to take NC State and Virginia has to take Virginia Tech).

Find me a single report that points to this as a fact and not mere speculation.  Just one. 

[Tugg Speedman]

Find me a single report that points to this as a fact and not mere speculation.  Just one. 

So your made up speculation that you invented tonight for this thread is better than the multiple stories that say half the ACC is ready to jump.

So yes all the stories are speculation but they are much more informed than your "Maryland was desperate.  I don't think other schools are necessarily interested at this point."  Their is not basis in truth in this statement. 

Maryland was not desperate, they represented the DC TV market for the BTN, just like Rutgers represented the NYC TV market for the BTN.  The rest want to jump because they would make more money on the B1G, SEC and/or B12.

Simple Economics

[Pakuni]

So your made up speculation that you invented tonight for this thread is better than the multiple stories that say half the ACC is ready to jump.

Could you link a credible news story reporting that half the ACC is ready to jump?

[Tugg Speedman]

Could you link a credible news story reporting that half the ACC is ready to jump?

I will but you will dismiss them as not credible.  But they are more credible that Sultan's invented opinons.

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8718339/16-team-big-ten-michigan-state-spartans-ad-mark-hollis-sees-advantages

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1418981-seven-steps-the-acc-could-take-to-prevent-being-carved-up-by-the-sec

http://augustafreepress.com/2012/11/26/chris-graham-what-uva-unc-to-big-ten-would-mean/




The reason they are credible is the economics say they are credible.  ACC schools that leave will make more money in the B1G and SEC.

[honkytonk]

So yes all the stories are speculation but they are much more informed than your "Maryland was desperate.  I don't think other schools are necessarily interested at this point."  Their is not basis in truth in this statement. 

Maryland was not desperate

 

In the Big Ten, as in most conferences, each school receives an equal share of the league’s annual revenue. But Nebraska, which entered the Big Ten for competition in 2011, won’t receive the full share of revenue for several years, according to reports. Loh didn’t know it, but the Big Ten also was negotiating a deal to bring in Rutgers that would phase the Scarlet Knights into the conference over time. ...

The Big Ten’s desire was to have new members earn a gradually larger piece of the revenue over a six-year period. But Maryland felt its stability in the ACC offered more bargaining leverage than Rutgers had in the crumbling Big East.

“There is no reason for us to leave,” Loh said. “So if we are going to consider, seriously, leaving, it has got to be worth our while.”

Perhaps, if the Big Ten really wanted Maryland, the two sides could figure out a way the Terrapins could receive a larger share of the Big Ten’s pie earlier. The potential solution was to get creative, according to two people with direct knowledge of the deal. By front-loading the deal — moving some money from years well into the future to the Terrapins’ first six years in the conference — Maryland was able to secure the cash it will need to address some of its immediate financial problems.

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id/67782/maryland-to-get-front-loaded-deal-from-b1g

[Tugg Speedman]

So the only people that leave their job for a higher paying job are "desperate?" 

Maryland, like just about every other school is in desperate financial trouble.  What else is new?  And, as Michigan's AD said on 60 minutes a few weeks ago, only 22 FBS schools make money.  The rest lose money.  It is a safe bet that virtually all the ACC schools are in the lose money camp.

The better question is why was the B1G do desperate to get Maryland?  Why not hold out for Virginia?

[ChicosBailBonds]

Because we could pick up a high profile school in ND. (They are essentially a non-football school)

Well, I think you have it wrong in your thinking.  I don't think you are close, actually.  The more the music keeps playing, the more instability there is, the closer we get to a potential of a day where you have 4 or 5 super conferences and then the world won't even be recognizable for our little school. 

[GGGG]

So your made up speculation that you invented tonight for this thread is better than the multiple stories that say half the ACC is ready to jump.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/colleges/an-analysis-of-marylands-potential-move-to-the-big-ten/2012/11/18/e382308a-31d3-11e2-9cfa-e41bac906cc9_story.html

"With its athletic department facing a nearly $5 million annual deficit that is rapidly compounding and stands to top $17 million by 2017, Maryland this summer cut seven of its 27 varsity sports — a move projected to pare roughly 7 percent from the $57.7 million annual budget. But unless the Terps figure out how to boost the revenue side of their ledger, even more draconian measures are likely in store."


No apologies are necessary.

[Tugg Speedman]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/colleges/an-analysis-of-marylands-potential-move-to-the-big-ten/2012/11/18/e382308a-31d3-11e2-9cfa-e41bac906cc9_story.html

"With its athletic department facing a nearly $5 million annual deficit that is rapidly compounding and stands to top $17 million by 2017, Maryland this summer cut seven of its 27 varsity sports — a move projected to pare roughly 7 percent from the $57.7 million annual budget. But unless the Terps figure out how to boost the revenue side of their ledger, even more draconian measures are likely in store."

This passage describes most schools across the country.  As I noted above only 22 of 125 FBS schools make money the rest lose money, just like Maryland (and most of the other ACC schools).  This is hardly unique.

You want me to believe that Maryland, and any other school in the ACC, could always leave for more money but where never interested until now and only because Maryland is "desperate" because of their financial situation.   Otherwise, the prospects of jumping did not interest them?  You have a strange view of economics and why we have college sports and how ADs measure their success.

Here is how the world works, all AD and Presidents want to jump to conferences that make them more money at any time.  Maryland made a better case than everyone else (like Rutgers) that they can get the BTN in their market.  The B1G agreed and added them.   No desperation here at all, smart business.

Wrong on this, wrong on Mayo in the other thread.  They night is young Sultan, want to go for the trifecta?

[Tugg Speedman]

Well, I think you have it wrong in your thinking.  I don't think you are close, actually.  The more the music keeps playing, the more instability there is, the closer we get to a potential of a day where you have 4 or 5 super conferences and then the world won't even be recognizable for our little school. 

That day already arrived yeas ago.  Remember football drives the bus and we now have 4 or 5 super conferences.  Too much money to grab for for the music to stop anytime soon. 

We are a basketball school so we have different issues.  But what you said is totally correct for the little football schools like Uconn, three NC in basketball in the last 12 years and no one wants them because they worth is measured by their football team.

[ChicosBailBonds]

That day already arrived yeas ago.  Remember football drives the bus and we now have 4 or 5 super conferences.  Too much money to grab for for the music to stop anytime soon. 

We are a basketball school so we have different issues.  But what you said is totally correct for the little football schools like Uconn, three NC in basketball in the last 12 years and no one wants them because they worth is measured by their football team.

Not there yet.  You still have the Big 12, you still have other buffers...we're closer, but we're not there yet.  When I say THERE, I mean 4 super conferences and no more NCAA Division I.  No more MU playing Wisconsin, no more MU playing ND, no more MU playing Ohio State because they will be governed elsewhere by their own governing body.

This is why you don't want the ACC to break up.  Why you don't want the Big 12 to break up. 

[Tugg Speedman]

This is why you don't want the ACC to break up.  Why you don't want the Big 12 to break up. 

I get it but wishing the ACC doesn't break up does not mean it will stop it.  What the ACC needs is better football that gets them TV revenue on-par with the SEC, B1G etc.

Until then they are next to go after the Big East died yesterday.  That reality must be considered and when the ACC goes (not if) their will be schools up for grabs.  Maybe we can get ND as they are independent in FB.

[honkytonk]

I get it but wishing the ACC doesn't break up does not mean it will stop it.  What the ACC needs is better football that gets them TV revenue on-par with the SEC, B1G etc.

Until then they are next to go after the Big East died yesterday.  That reality must be considered and when the ACC goes (not if) their will be schools up for grabs.  Maybe we can get ND as they are independent in FB.

ND plays 23 Div 1 sports. How many sports do you really think the new conference is going to sponsor? What would they do with their baseball program, for example?

They can stay in a depleted ACC which would still likely sponsor more sports or they can join the new conference for a couple of sports, move another sport to some other conference....another sport will have to go somewhere else. Before long, moving from the ACC to the new conference will result in ND being a member of about 6 different conferences. Not happening.

[Tugg Speedman]

ND plays 23 Div 1 sports. How many sports do you really think the new conference is going to sponsor? What would they do with their baseball program, for example?

They can stay in a depleted ACC which would still likely sponsor more sports or they can join the new conference for a couple of sports, move another sport to some other conference....another sport will have to go somewhere else. Before long, moving from the ACC to the new conference will result in ND being a member of about 6 different conferences. Not happening.

OF ND's 23 sports, only two make money ... football and basketball.  The other 21 lose money.  Whatever sports are not covered by our new conference, or the ACC, will go into special conference for that sport, like Hockey (the ACC does not have Hockey).

Money losing sports are irrelevant to the decision of what conference to join.

[honkytonk]

OF ND's 23 sports, only two make money ... football and basketball.  The other 21 lose money.  Whatever sports are not covered by our new conference, or the ACC, will go into special conference for that sport, like Hockey (the ACC does not have Hockey).

Money losing sports are irrelevant to the decision of what conference to join.

Right. So ND will just dictate which conferences will accept ND's non-revenue generating sports. And Im sure the ACC will gladly accept most of them. 

[Tugg Speedman]

Right. So ND will just dictate which conferences will accept ND's non-revenue generating sports. And Im sure the ACC will gladly accept most of them. 

None of this had anything to do with them accepting the ACC invitation.  Women's field hockey played no role in the decision.

[GGGG]

This passage describes most schools across the country.  As I noted above only 22 of 125 FBS schools make money the rest lose money, just like Maryland (and most of the other ACC schools).  This is hardly unique.

You want me to believe that Maryland, and any other school in the ACC, could always leave for more money but where never interested until now and only because Maryland is "desperate" because of their financial situation.   Otherwise, the prospects of jumping did not interest them?  You have a strange view of economics and why we have college sports and how ADs measure their success.

Here is how the world works, all AD and Presidents want to jump to conferences that make them more money at any time.  Maryland made a better case than everyone else (like Rutgers) that they can get the BTN in their market.  The B1G agreed and added them.   No desperation here at all, smart business.

Wrong on this, wrong on Mayo in the other thread.  They night is young Sultan, want to go for the trifecta?

Whatever dude.

I provided evidence to back my assertion that Maryland was desperate - they dropped multiple sports and were facing huge budget deficits.  You provide no evidence that suggests that any other ACC school is looking to leave, much less a handful of schools like you originally asserted.

So sorry that I do not take your opinions as facts.

[honkytonk]

None of this had anything to do with them accepting the ACC invitation.  Women's field hockey played no role in the decision.

If UConn, SU, Pitt, BC, Duke and Wake all remained in the ACC, why would ND move to a worse bball conference....that will definitely make less money...and sponsor less sports forcing ND to find homes for whichever sports the new conference doesnt sponsor???? That move would make no unnatural carnal knowledgeing sense at all.

A depleted ACC will still make more bball money than the new conference.
A depleted ACC will provide a home for many more of ND's sports.

[Tugg Speedman]

If UConn, SU, Pitt, BC, Duke and Wake all remained in the ACC, why would ND move to a worse bball conference....that will definitely make less money...and sponsor less sports forcing ND to find homes for whichever sports the new conference doesnt sponsor???? That move would make no fracking sense at all.

A depleted ACC will still make more bball money than the new conference.
A depleted ACC will provide a home for many more of ND's sports.

If another school leaves the ACC, it's dead.  It will not survive.  Just like we knew the Big East was gone when Pitt and 'Cuse left.  If another school leaves the ACC, it will slowly bleed to death, like the BE.

Again, Uconn has won 3 Bball National Championships in the last 12 years.  They also arguably have the best women Bball program ever.  Yet, as of this writing, no one wants them.  That is because Football is all that matters.  Uconn is nothing because their football is nothing.  The rest does not matter.  So, what you argue above are not the things these decisions are made on.

ND agreed to play 5 ACC football games a year (but not join as a FB member).  This year they played four ... BC, Wake, Miami and Pitt.  ND is not going to water down their FB schedule with 5 games against lousy FB programs like Uconn, Wake, Duke, Pitt, Louisville and 'Cuse.  They could have stayed in the BE and done this.

If another school leaves the ACC, they will die and ND will leave.  The only question is do they hook up with us or does the B1G relent and take them as a non-football member?

[Pakuni]

I will but you will dismiss them as not credible.  But they are more credible that Sultan's invented opinons.

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8718339/16-team-big-ten-michigan-state-spartans-ad-mark-hollis-sees-advantages

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1418981-seven-steps-the-acc-could-take-to-prevent-being-carved-up-by-the-sec

http://augustafreepress.com/2012/11/26/chris-graham-what-uva-unc-to-big-ten-would-mean/




The reason they are credible is the economics say they are credible.  ACC schools that leave will make more money in the B1G and SEC.

Not one of those links suggest what you claim they do.