Watching the NBA

[brewcity77]

The NBA game has changed dramatically in the last 10-15 years. 

Exactly what has changed about college ball that's got you so excited? 

The game hasn't changed, the quality of player has simply returned to that level. But I saw that act before.

The college game hasn't changed, it is change. Look at playing styles. What Louisville does is different from what Wisconsin does is different from what UNC does is different from what Princeton does is different from what VCU does is different from what Indiana does is different from what Syracuse does from what Marquette does. The NBA is far more predictable in terms of what will happen both game-by-game and over the course of the season.

In addition, the player turnover creates more interest. Will that 5-star prospect live up to the hype like Anthony Davis, will he be a bust like Brian Butch, or someone that is good but still never meets his hype like Harrison Barnes? The short careers means teams can be radically different in just a year or two, whereas in the NBA you pretty much know what a team is from day one.

It's better drama, has a far more entertaining playoff, and most of the time has a far more real connection between the players and the fanbases. Yes, the talent level in the NBA is superior, but that is the ONLY thing that is superior. The college game wins every other aspect of entertainment.

[brewcity77]

Also, I like underdog stories. The NBA has none. In the past 15 years, only 2 guys not picked in the first round have made so much as second-team All-NBA, Gilbert Arenas and Ben Wallace (twice). It's predictable. You know the best players and teams all year long. There are no (college years) Dwyane Wades, Jameer Nelsons, Hakim Warricks, Adam Morrisons, Alando Tuckers, Stephen Currys, Wesley Johnsons, Kenneth Farieds, or Doug McDermotts. All of those guys were three star or lower recruits that we're first or second team All-Americans, and there's been at least one every year for the past 10 years (counting Curry for 2 years, though there were many others along the way). Not to mention the Butlers, Davidsons, Gonzagas, and other Cinderellas that have given us the kinds of upsets the NBA could never dream of.

[RawdogDX]

Better athletes, running better plays to perfection.  Some of us enjoy the sport for sport and don't need silly side stories to make things worth while. (WOW! a three star put up 22 today!!!)

If you think the Lakers, the Spurs and the Thunder are clones of one another than you don't know anything about basketball.

[forgetful]

Better athletes, running better plays to perfection.  Some of us enjoy the sport for sport and don't need silly side stories to make things worth while. (WOW! a three star put up 22 today!!!)

If you think the Lakers, the Spurs and the Thunder are clones of one another than you don't know anything about basketball.

The Lakers the Spurs and Thunder are very different teams.  The problem I have with the NBA is that it is no longer good basketball.  The reason being is that it is so star driven.  Players like Lebron travel nearly every possession.  And the star treatment on fouls is ridiculous.  Kobe and Lebron get breathed on and it is a foul.  But someone like a Norris Cole could get punched in the face by someone and it is just play on. 

The bigger problem I have is the announcers trying to tell us that all the calls are perfect, like we are too stupid to see the awful star bias.  Now, yes the chessman ship and execution at times can be great, but the star bias and announcers make it almost unbearable. 

[brewcity77]

Better athletes, running better plays to perfection.  Some of us enjoy the sport for sport and don't need silly side stories to make things worth while. (WOW! a three star put up 22 today!!!)

If you think the Lakers, the Spurs and the Thunder are clones of one another than you don't know anything about basketball.

Okay, okay, I get it, you love Michael Bay! Fine! Go watch Transformers again and leave me alone.

[GGGG]

The Lakers the Spurs and Thunder are very different teams.  The problem I have with the NBA is that it is no longer good basketball.  

That is absolutely false.  It is the very best basketball on the planet.  I understand some of brewcity's issues though.  There is more diversity in styles of play in college basketball.  Just like college football is more diverse in that respect than the NFL.  

The reason being is that it is so star driven.  Players like Lebron travel nearly every possession.  And the star treatment on fouls is ridiculous.  Kobe and Lebron get breathed on and it is a foul.  But someone like a Norris Cole could get punched in the face by someone and it is just play on.  

The bigger problem I have is the announcers trying to tell us that all the calls are perfect, like we are too stupid to see the awful star bias.  Now, yes the chessman ship and execution at times can be great, but the star bias and announcers make it almost unbearable.  

These sentences tell me that you really don't watch NBA basketball.

Lebron doesn't travel on nearly every possession.  He doesn't travel on most or even 10% of the time.  It rarely occurs.

NBA officials are almost always right when you slow down and watch the replay.  The "star system" you talk about is basically false when you see it in that light.  The NBA is a physical game...and bigger stronger players function better in that type of game.

But the announcers are generally terrible.  I'll give you that.

[RawdogDX]

Okay, okay, I get it, you love Michael Bay! Fine! Go watch Transformers again and leave me alone.

And I get that you love indi bands until they have a hit and then all of a sudden you are too cool for them.  Pompous much?

[ATL MU Warrior]

Okay, okay, I get it, you love Michael Bay! Fine! Go watch Transformers again and leave me alone.

I'd be grumpy too if I was a closeted fan of the swing.

[brewcity77]

And I get that you love indi bands until they have a hit and then all of a sudden you are too cool for them.  Pompous much?

Oh get over yourself. I don't like the NBA and suddenly I'm attacked for it? Give me a break. I don't like the league. I don't enjoy it. Apparently you do. So fine, enjoy it, but accept that not everyone will like what you like. I couldn't care less how you want to spend your time, so please stop trying to force crap down my throat and tell me I should like it.

I don't, end of story. Now how about moving on?

[RawdogDX]

Oh get over yourself. I don't like the NBA and suddenly I'm attacked for it? Give me a break. I don't like the league. I don't enjoy it. Apparently you do. So fine, enjoy it, but accept that not everyone will like what you like. I couldn't care less how you want to spend your time, so please stop trying to force crap down my throat and tell me I should like it.

I don't, end of story. Now how about moving on?

I need to get over it?  You have been insulting everyone who does.  You have written way more than i have and as usual you act like your opinion is a fact and that people who disagree with you are stupid.  You need to get over yourself.

[forgetful]

That is absolutely false.  It is the very best basketball on the planet.  I understand some of brewcity's issues though.  There is more diversity in styles of play in college basketball.  Just like college football is more diverse in that respect than the NFL.  

This is an opinion, so it can not be absolutely false.

These sentences tell me that you really don't watch NBA basketball.

Lebron doesn't travel on nearly every possession.  He doesn't travel on most or even 10% of the time.  It rarely occurs.

NBA officials are almost always right when you slow down and watch the replay.  The "star system" you talk about is basically false when you see it in that light.  The NBA is a physical game...and bigger stronger players function better in that type of game.

It depends on what one calls a travel.  If we go by the rules up until 2009 (when the NBA decided to change the rules) then yes he travels on every possession.  Even by the new rule he travels a lot (look up his crab dribble).  The problem is a lot of players grew up like I did with the 1.5 step rule.  Lebron is one of the chief users of the 2.5 steps that is now technically allowed.  That in my mind is still a travel and ruins the game.  

As for the fouls.  Like you say the NBA is a physical game.  Hence a foul can be called on every possession.  Lebron gets calls every time he misses.  Non-stars get about 1 in 10 calls (total guess to illustrate a point).  Every analyst agrees that Lebron is going to get a call every time.  That also ruins the game.

Euro league ball is actually probably a better product as far as 'pure' basketball is concerned.  The college game by moving closer to the NBA is also getting ruined in my opinion.

But the announcers are generally terrible.  I'll give you that.

[Pakuni]

If LeBron got a call every time he misses, wouldn't he be shooting 100 percent from the field?

[brewcity77]

I need to get over it?

Yes. Go back and look at the thread. I stated why I'm not interested and you and Horseshoe pounced. It started around the time I was called a terrible basketball fan and when you questioned my basketball acumen because I'm bored by the playoffs. So yes, you should probably get over yourself. Bear in mind the entire premise of the thread was someone who was asking if there were others that couldn't care less about the NBA. Many asserted that they aren't interested in it. Some people just don't care about the league and have perfectly valid reasons for that. It doesn't make them bad basketball fans, it just means they have different tastes. Enjoy what you want for whatever reason. But don't expect people to lockstep with you, especially on a board dedicated to a COLLEGE BASKETBALL TEAM.

Sorry, but the notion that everyone should like the NBA is stupid, and the notion that not liking the NBA indicates someone doesn't know much about the sport is also stupid. The two are mutually exclusive. Plenty of people prefer the college ranks for any number of reasons. That doesn't make them bad fans or basketball stupid, it just means they have different tastes.

[real chili 83]

I find myself watching when there's a team with an MU alum on tv.  Other than that, don't care.

During my MU time, the Bucks were fun to follow with Sidney, Bon Lanier, Winters, etc.  Eddie Doucette was great to listen to.

One of my favorite highlights was when the Bucks were playing Detroit.  Lambier was being his typical whining, elbow throwing pansy.  Lanier decided he had had enough, and landed a haymaker square on Lambier's nose.  When they replayed it in slow mo, you could see Lambier's nose cave in, and then pop back out.  Needless to say, he hit the ground and didn't get up for a few minutes. 

The league was interesting when Kareem was still in the league, while Bird and Johnson were taking off.   

Seems like the league headed south during Jordan's dynasty.  Putting players like Rodman and Pippen around him really detracted from Jordan's (and the nba's) aura.  Yes, the bulls were damn good with those players, but Rodman and Pippen weren't the most likable sorts.

[Blue Horseshoe]

Seems like the league headed south during Jordan's dynasty.  Putting players like Rodman and Pippen around him really detracted from Jordan's (and the nba's) aura.  Yes, the bulls were damn good with those players, but Rodman and Pippen weren't the most likable sorts.

Yes, Jordan playing against and beating the likes of Magic Johnson, Clyde Drexler, Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, and John Stockton in the NBA finals over the years was a total dud. He could have used some real competition.

[Boards]

Just curious, where are you guys located?

I think a lot of it depends on if you have a good team or not.  If I lived in Minnesota, I wouldn't be watching the NBA.

You obviously aren't watching the NBA to begin with because in Minnesota there is a dynasty currently in the works. Core: Kevin Love, Ricky Rubio and Nikola Pekovic. Watch the Twolves snag a 5th seed or higher in next year's playoffs.

[GGGG]

Hmmm....I like what the Wolves are doing, but 5th seed?

I have OKC, San Antonio, LA Lakers, LA Clippers, and Memphis above them.  And then you have Dallas, which is bound to bounce back, and Denver.

Not sure about that.

[MerrittsMustache]

Seems like the league headed south during Jordan's dynasty.  Putting players like Rodman and Pippen around him really detracted from Jordan's (and the nba's) aura.  Yes, the bulls were damn good with those players, but Rodman and Pippen weren't the most likable sorts.

Yeah, the NBA would have been much better off if the Bulls kept Jordan playing along side the likes of Orlando Woolridge, Dave Corzine and Brad Sellers.

[GGGG]

Seems like the league headed south during Jordan's dynasty.  Putting players like Rodman and Pippen around him really detracted from Jordan's (and the nba's) aura.  Yes, the bulls were damn good with those players, but Rodman and Pippen weren't the most likable sorts.

The four highest rated Finals of all time were all during the Jordan era.  All six Bulls Finals are in the top 9 all time.  (The other three were 1987-89...all of which involved the Lakers.)

[MarsupialMadness]

The NBA season is too long and there are too many teams -- no reason to have crappy teams in small markets that lose money.  If the league cut out anywhere from 4-8 teams, remaining teams would have better bench players and the league would be more exciting as a whole.  Now, you have teams  where the #3 and sometimes even #2 "star" on the team is a no-name guy. 

Also, the globalization of the NBA, which helped the NBA in terms of worldwide popularity, made it a little disinteresting for American fans, either consciously or not.  There were way too many European players in the early to mid 00's that no one in the states could relate with.  The NBA was in a dark time from the period Jordan left until Wade, James, Melo, etc entered the league.  It's now finally starting to pick itself up. 

I feel like NFL is always king in American sports MLB has the long history and tradition that everyone loves.  But baseball has been getting less popular over the years (at least it seems to me) and NBA basketball is on it's way back up.  The same thing is happening with MLB right now that happened to the NBA 10 years ago -- the superstars that were household names are starting to fall off, so now these new young guys are getting in the spotlight, but if they can't sustain the spotlight they'll soon be forgotten.  We have the new young big names like Braun and Fielder and Hamilton, etc, but it's not like it was in the 90's and 00's with the household names.

[CTWarrior]

I'm starting to watch the NBA again as MU players make their way onto teams.

I much prefer the college game, but its just a matter of taste.

Because of the shot clock, the NBA has too much one-on-one, not enough team ball.  That's what the mass audience likes, it's just not what I like.  I wish more teams would get around the shot clock by pushing the ball up the floor, like the 80s Lakers.  The Thunder play a bit like that, and they are enjoyable to watch.  Also, because of the shot clock, strategy rarely beats talent in the NBA.  A lot of people probably like that talent wins out, but I like to see the smart teams beat the talented ones once in a while.  Regular season upsets generally are a road weary good team losing to a fresher weaker team on the road.

The other big thing is that the NBA season is way too long and pointless.  You know who the top playoff teams are going to be 30 games into the season.  The other 52 games are to figure out the 7 and 8 seeds who are going to get bounced in the 1st round anyway.  The only thing that changes over those 52 games is that some teams get healthy and some teams get hurt.  I know baseball is twice as long, but the standings change a great deal from the half way point to the end of the season.

That said, the NBA players are the best in the world, and despite perception they play very good defense.  I understand if people prefer the NBA game.  It's just that I don't.

[RawdogDX]

Yes. Go back and look at the thread. I stated why I'm not interested and you and Horseshoe pounced. It started around the time I was called a terrible basketball fan and when you questioned my basketball acumen because I'm bored by the playoffs. So yes, you should probably get over yourself. Bear in mind the entire premise of the thread was someone who was asking if there were others that couldn't care less about the NBA. Many asserted that they aren't interested in it. Some people just don't care about the league and have perfectly valid reasons for that. It doesn't make them bad basketball fans, it just means they have different tastes. Enjoy what you want for whatever reason. But don't expect people to lockstep with you, especially on a board dedicated to a COLLEGE BASKETBALL TEAM.

Sorry, but the notion that everyone should like the NBA is stupid, and the notion that not liking the NBA indicates someone doesn't know much about the sport is also stupid. The two are mutually exclusive. Plenty of people prefer the college ranks for any number of reasons. That doesn't make them bad fans or basketball stupid, it just means they have different tastes.

awwww... poor little guy got "pounced on"

I never would have cared if you didn't like the nba.  I started making fun of you after you had written 3 posts of about 300 words each and said that watching a draft for 4 hours, so that you could see two guys get their name called( by a team that they aren't going to) is more fun that watching game 7 of a play off series.  Not originally you said that you avioded the regular season then you ramped it up to the finals not being fun.  Since then you've put more work into this thread than you probably put into some of your college finals.

Just type less.  Take some deep breaths and stop calling people immature, stupid and whatever else pops into your head.  realize that this is a COLLEGE BASKETBALL TEAM forum and that people may make fun of your ideas.

BTW: i suggested watching the 3rd transformers the other night and mrs rawdog turned it down and opted for Human Centipede 2.

[MerrittsMustache]

Let me start by saying that I'm apparently one of the few NBA fans on this board. However, one of my biggest beefs with the NBA is that at the start of each season, there are only 3 or 4 teams that have a legitimate shot at winning the championship while the rest of the teams are playing to either make a respectable run in the playoffs, develop some young guys or lose enough to get a good draft pick. Prior to this past season, if I had bet you $1 million on who would win the championship and given you everyone EXCEPT Miami, Chicago and OKC, would you have taken the bet? No chance. What if I gave you ONLY Miami, Chicago and OKC? You'd take it in a second.

[nyg]

I like the NBA also, but mainly when the playoffs start.

The salary issues are going through the roof and unrealism is starting to take over.
Deron Willams gets 100M for 5 years, 20M a year.

Jeremy Lin talking to Houston Rockets and may get a contract which the Knicks can counter with.  Would pay Lin 15M a year in last two years of a four year contract.  If he signs with Knicks, thats like 5 Knicks making at least 15M a year.  Thats crazy.........  Jeremy Lin, 15M a year, thats crazy..........

[real chili 83]

The four highest rated Finals of all time were all during the Jordan era.  All six Bulls Finals are in the top 9 all time.  (The other three were 1987-89...all of which involved the Lakers.)

You are correct with the stats.  Great ratings, great games.

My point is that...in my opinion.....after watching the bulls win with guys like Rodman, and Pippen, then Jordan getting suspended from the league, aka, his baseball sidetrack, it started to feel like you had to take a shower after watching them.  And, no I don't have anything against the bulls.

I am amazed and impressed with how the NBA markets itself.  They are a machine.  More power to them.