New Standards for hoops players

[Lennys Tap]

So we should recruit lesser players because we can't let that pesky NBA thing stand in the way of our grad rate???

Exactly. If we can just eliminate potential NBA players from the program everything will be hunky dory.

[LloydMooresLegs]

2 very specific items I heard besides the GPA standards.  Hoops players will not be able to live in Humphrey until at least their junior year.  There will be some sort of board that will vote on potential borderline recruits including any junior college possibilities.  How will buzz react to different standards being put on Junior college players when he went to a JC?

I have no issue with these two potential changes.  Good to have hoops players mixing it up first two years with the rest of campus--good for them and good for the other students.  Maybe I am naive, but that shouldn't be a huge negative (yes, and I have seen - lived in-- McCormick) in recruiting.  And there already is a group (not a "board", I guess) that votes on potential borderline recruits (and borderline non-athletes, for that matter)?  Any FFPs out there?

[Goose]

Lloyd

Proud FFP here!!!!

[Lennys Tap]

I have no issue with these two potential changes.  Good to have hoops players mixing it up first two years with the rest of campus--good for them and good for the other students.  Maybe I am naive, but that shouldn't be a huge negative (yes, and I have seen - lived in-- McCormick) in recruiting.

Fine that you have no issues, but you are naive as to the impact on recruiting. Humphrey Hall is a huge selling point, and I've heard that directly from players.

[Lennys Tap]

mueng03 - agreed - MU may find itself in a SLU like situation based on the events you outlined

That's much different than the tinfoil hat crowd telling the works their sources say Pilaez and Williams desire to bring MU down to the SLU level. 

I don't know that anyone said they wanted us to go backwards as a program. I certainly didn't, but if their policies and leadership get us there I'll still hold them responsible.

[LloydMooresLegs]

Fine that you have no issues, but you are naive as to the impact on recruiting. Humphrey Hall is a huge selling point, and I've heard that directly from players.

Yeah, as I think about it, maybe the fact that Newman and Laz had to live in McCormack was the reason that we recruited... Newman and Laz...

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Any possibility in your mind that these changes while not intended to directly run Buzz off or decrease the emphasis on basketball, may lead to this as indirect or unintended consequences?  I think the majority of the concerned individuals on this board don't think that LW and Pilarz are attacking Buzz and mubb but that they are doing things that can be foreseen to negatively impact both situations.

Just think of the confluence of events a year from now that could really impact the future success of the program because we're messing with happy unnecessarily.
-Conference realignment(where is MU when the music stops), could be a bad situation at the same time
-Buzz leaves because he is unhappy
-MU continues to have PR issues because of an increased sensitivity in the media market and MU's inability to get out of its own way on PR matters.

All of this combines to leave MU in a very vulnerable position.....that is my concern and how we might end up as SLU if we aren't careful

- We don't know what the changes are (IF ANY).
- We don't know who has signed off on them (maybe the SMU thing gave Buzz leverage and the revised changes are fine with him now)
- We don't the effects of the possible changes.

You might be 100% right, and this might be the end of MU athletics as we know it.

Or small tweaks might ease some BOT's concerns and the program will keep rolling.

[LloydMooresLegs]

Lloyd

Proud FFP here!!!!

One of my best friends was an FFP.  

Actually, one of the best things I did first week of school was to start hanging with the FFPs--they already had the run of the place, knew where to hang out, knew all the hoops players etc...a nice way to get a stumbling start.  fixed

[ATWizJr]

One of my best friends was an FFP.  

Actually, one of the best things I did first week of school was to start hanging with the FFPs--they already had the run of the place, knew where to hang out, knew all the hoops players etc...a nice way to get a stumbling start.  fixed
[/quote  How was the food?

[Canadian Dimes]

my wife is an FFP'er!!  I guess I had to prey on the less intelligent   

[jfmu]

Buycks, Hayward and Crowder are a high majority?

Was it even possible for Buycks and Crowder to graduate? With not all of their Juco credits transferring, I imagine it would be difficult to graduate in two years even with summer sessions.

[🏀]

Was it even possible for Buycks and Crowder to graduate? With not all of their Juco credits transferring, I imagine it would be difficult to graduate in two years even with summer sessions.

Unsure on Buycks, but Jae is very, very close. If he didn't have to transform his game into a 2 or 3 for the NBA and leave early, he would have been able to graduate a few days ago with a normal class load.

[GGGG]

my wife is an FFP'er!!  I guess I had to prey on the less intelligent   

Frankly, I'm just amazed that any of us are married.

[Goose]

Dimes
What year FFP was your wife? All of us less intelligent students hung closely together. Who knows maybe we were FFP'ers together!!!

[lab_warrior]

My sisters were also FFP'ers...they are big fans of the program. 

[reinko]

My sisters were also FFP'ers...they are big fans of the program. 

As was my sister.  I probably should have been, but transferred in.   

[lab_warrior]

I believe they were even on the program brochure for the next years' FFP. 

HUMBLEBRAG.

[mu03eng]

- We don't know what the changes are (IF ANY).
- We don't know who has signed off on them (maybe the SMU thing gave Buzz leverage and the revised changes are fine with him now)
- We don't the effects of the possible changes.

You might be 100% right, and this might be the end of MU athletics as we know it.

Or small tweaks might ease some BOT's concerns and the program will keep rolling.

We are in agreement as is I think 90% of the board, its just a matter of which group has the padlock off the pitchfork shed and which still has it locked up. 

[TedBaxter]

http://www2.housing.wisc.edu/masterplan/lakeshore/renderings.php

I'd rather have the Marquette freshman and sophomore players living in a dorm with character like Carpenter Hall instead of  this new housing complex in Madison.  I'm sure Kevon Looney and Diamond Stone will agree.  Instead of the tranquility of Lake Mendota, the Marquette players can hear the hum of I-43.

[Blackhat]

sounds like a domerish initiative for sure. 

[Hoopaloop]

So you're okay if our standards are higher than Purdue, Indiana, Wisconsin, Syracuse, Villanova etc.? Fine. How do you think Painter, Crean, Bo, Boeheim or Wright woulld be with it if their administration  upped their standards while the rest of their competition stood pat? Of course, that won't happen. Nobody could be that stupid/shortsighted. Right?

The problem I have with your argument of our standards being tougher than PU, Wisconsin, IU, etc is that they aren't recruiting kids at the minimum standards anyway.  Marquette is.

PU had 7 guys make academic all big 10 this year. Wisconsin had 2.  Indiana had 7.  MU had zero.  Last year MU had one - a walk-on in Frozena. 

Whether we believe majors at those schools are easy or not, they aren't any easier than MU's majors yet they are having every bit the success MU is (UW and IU made the Sweet 16 and Purdue should have) yet they have kids far exceeding what we are academically.

PU, UW, IU may keep their standards at the NCAA min levels but that doesn't mean they are recruiting at the min. standards.  Based on the number of players making all big ten academic teams at universities considered higher ranked than MU academically, that certainly bears out to be the case.  Your argument doesn't hold up in my opinion.  Those three examples you gave have the same standards MU has today, yet they are already recruiting better student athletes based on all-conference basketball honorees and having the same success on the basketball court.  In parallel, there are rumors here that some of our guys are on the road to flunking out or are barely hitting the requirements now, let alone any type of honors.

I, for one, believe MU can field competitive basketball teams every bit as good as ours currently is with kids that are above the minimums.  The three schools you used are great examples of this happening.  There are others throughout the nation.  I believe in Buzz, MU and potential high school kids out there and there are clear examples it can be done at schools not named Stanford or Duke. 

Why are you not a believer in Buzz, MU and the student athletes?

[Lennys Tap]

Then why aren't their graduation rates better than ours?

[real chili 83]

Lenny,
Great points and right on target. Love the ND football comparison and agree completely.

And last I heard, this fixed all of ND's problems.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/chi-notre-dame-qb-rees-jailed-in-police-confrontation-20120503,0,299209.story

http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/wsbt-notre-dame-quarterback-linebacker-arrested-thursday-morning-20120503,0,7930931.story

[cheebs09]

What are Academic All-American standards? A 3.5? Shoot, I would have been considered a student at the minimum if I was an athlete I guess. I'm sure there have been plenty of successful non-athletes that didn't get a 3.5. Just because you aren't an Academic All-American doesn't mean that you aren't a solid student. I know of many players at MU that were very good, but not All-American players. It's different criteria, but being named a basketball All-American or achieving Academic All-American means you are elite, not that everyone else is just at the minimum.

[forgetful]

The problem I have with your argument of our standards being tougher than PU, Wisconsin, IU, etc is that they aren't recruiting kids at the minimum standards anyway.  Marquette is.

PU had 7 guys make academic all big 10 this year. Wisconsin had 2.  Indiana had 7.  MU had zero.  Last year MU had one - a walk-on in Frozena.  

Whether we believe majors at those schools are easy or not, they aren't any easier than MU's majors yet they are having every bit the success MU is (UW and IU made the Sweet 16 and Purdue should have) yet they have kids far exceeding what we are academically.

PU, UW, IU may keep their standards at the NCAA min levels but that doesn't mean they are recruiting at the min. standards.  Based on the number of players making all big ten academic teams at universities considered higher ranked than MU academically, that certainly bears out to be the case.  Your argument doesn't hold up in my opinion.  Those three examples you gave have the same standards MU has today, yet they are already recruiting better student athletes based on all-conference basketball honorees and having the same success on the basketball court.  In parallel, there are rumors here that some of our guys are on the road to flunking out or are barely hitting the requirements now, let alone any type of honors.

I, for one, believe MU can field competitive basketball teams every bit as good as ours currently is with kids that are above the minimums.  The three schools you used are great examples of this happening.  There are others throughout the nation.  I believe in Buzz, MU and potential high school kids out there and there are clear examples it can be done at schools not named Stanford or Duke.  

Why are you not a believer in Buzz, MU and the student athletes?

A few things.  Saying that Bo doesn't recruit students at the minimum is a bit misleading.  Bo recruits from outside of the big cities in Wisconsin (he did recruit Vander).  In those areas they frankly don't give less than a C regardless of how poor of a student they were.  Grade inflation is rampant in suburbs and less so in the inner cities.  

Second, I would rather give a kid from a disadvantaged area a chance than requiring top grades.  Some of the brightest kids I worked with over the years are the ones you are saying to pass on and the worst people I have worked with are the academic all big 10 types.

The stories of success despite adversity are worth a ton more to me than PU's 7 academic all americans.  Also, as far as I'm aware the Big East hasn't announced their 2011-12 academic all-conference yet, so to claim we have 0 is just plain abusing statistics.