The Everlasting Craptastical Mystery Thread

[TJ]

Gun to my head, I think there was a small brushfire but the Williams put it out and we're good.

Most likely scenario.

[brewcity77]

Or he's not calling the shots and Pilarz and the BOT are.  What I don't get, is what could they possibly know now that they didn't know months ago when the off court issues surfaced?  If all of this is true, they'll have some SERIOUS answering to do.

Well...personally, I think that regardless. So maybe more accurately, LW, Pilarz, and the BOT have someone in mind that they think the fans would embrace immediately and wouldn't lead to a step down.

As far as issues...if the reports that some have put forth that this has been brewing for months, maybe they were just waiting until the end of the season. Would have been rather shocking to dismiss Buzz in January, especially as they'd likely have had to install Benford as caretaker and not been able to announce a splashy hire to appease the major donors shortly thereafter.

[mu03eng]

I know how to spin it: "The guy left for S-M-freakin'-U.  13-19, 11th place in CUSA SMU.  What do you want me to say?  He must have been tired of all the winning he was doing here and wanted a chance to lose 20+ games every year as his new school enters the Big East.  I can't force the guy to stay here.  If money is all that motivates him, then so be it.  We'll do our best to find someone a little less crazy to be the next coach."

Thats the initial spin, but Buzz also has something to say and based on Buzz so far I don't think he would have any hesitation to put "the truth" out there, and that's the thing MU would have spin problems with.

[mu03eng]

One key overlooked factor of all of this - or at least a factor that might have been discussed 30-40 pages ago - is that, to the "average" fan, they:

a) don't know or can't recall anything about the alleged assault
b) if they do know anything, there aren't any specifics out there, hence the MU brand isn't severely damaged
c) hardly anyone other than MU boosters or WI fans know/care about the six tickets reported on last week

So, that being said, for MU to potentially go the way of letting the coach in the name of "saving the brand!" would make no sense at all.

If anything, it would only
a) bring the prior issues to the forefront
b) make MU a joke by releasing Buzz for what aren't deemed issues of his fault (in the public eye at least)
c) frighten off any "name" coaches to come here. After all, "if eveyone loved Buzz and they canned him, why should I step into that sh!tstorm?"

+1, my thoughts exactly.

[Niv Berkowitz]

Thats the initial spin, but Buzz also has something to say and based on Buzz so far I don't think he would have any hesitation to put "the truth" out there, and that's the thing MU would have spin problems with.

True, but he didn't get into specifics about New Orleans. Don't forget that.

[MerrittsMustache]

True, but he didn't get into specifics about New Orleans. Don't forget that.

Exactly. Given all the connections that Buzz has, he is definitely not one to burn bridges.

[TJ]

Thats the initial spin, but Buzz also has something to say and based on Buzz so far I don't think he would have any hesitation to put "the truth" out there, and that's the thing MU would have spin problems with.

Then you follow up with: "The guy wanted to be god, but since I worked for Notre Dame I was forced to memorize Rudy so I know '1) there is a God, and 2) neither Buzz nor I are him'"

[NersEllenson]

I know how to spin it: "The guy left for S-M-freakin'-U.  13-19, 11th place in CUSA SMU.  What do you want me to say?  He must have been tired of all the winning he was doing here and wanted a chance to lose 20+ games every year as his new school enters the Big East.  I can't force the guy to stay here.  If money is all that motivates him, then so be it.  We'll do our best to find someone a little less crazy to be the next coach."

TJ - This isn't 1 penny about money.  Not 1 penny about money.  Who is responsible for "all the winning he was doing here??"  Think Buzz is responsible for that?  Think that will change if he goes to SMU and can recruit within Texas all he wants, without all of the ignorance of some in the MU BOT/Admin, and not have to deal with a witch hunt local newspaper/police force like the MJS and MPD??  If Buzz goes to SMU, SMU will be a Top 5 Big East Team in 4 years, and in all likelihood MU will be a bottom feeder in the Big East..unless somehow MU can land Shaka Smart...which I think is a LONG, LONG, LONG shot.

[mu03eng]

True, but he didn't get into specifics about New Orleans. Don't forget that.

Yeah but New Orleans wasn't a national story.  Buzz leaving MU to go to SMU is a NATIONAL story for both parties especially given how quiet things have been nationally compared to even last year.

[MUMac]

True, but he didn't get into specifics about New Orleans. Don't forget that.

There was a lawsuit pending with New Orleans.  He couldn't get into specifics.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

[quote author=mu03eng link=topic=31777.msg379964#msg379964

If Larry is a smart guy, unless there is some bad stuff about the program that hasn't come out yet there is no way he could let Buzz go.
[/quote]

From a macro perspective, this is the only thing that makes sense if Buzz goes to SMU.

Pilarz and Larry are presumably smart guys. I don't think they would give up a cash cow like Buzz simply because they "don't get along". Nor do I think Buzz would leave MU and the roster he has to go to SMU simply because he doesn't like his new boss. Buzz has coached EVERYWHERE. He's had lots of bosses. He knows how to handle them.

We'll never know, but if he leaves, my gut is that there is some more serious stuff under the surface, and maybe it is best if everybody does just move on.

If he's back, I hope MU continues to use the team as a marketing/outreach program for the school. I've met most of the players at various meet and greets, and they seem like decent kids.

[Daniel]

True, but he didn't get into specifics about New Orleans. Don't forget that.

I do not think Buzz would ever bad-mouth Marquette. Period. I just don't ever see him doing that. Ever.

[Aughnanure]

Shaka has been very clear about the fact that he's staying at VCU.  I wouldn't get too focused on that idea.

Yeah sure, cause coaches are always truthful. I'd still doubt it, but I'm just making the point that if the administration is really pushing Buzz out then they better hell have great hire waiting in the wings that they are already talking to.

[dw3dw3dw3]

Add... Don't worry though because we think we have the inside track to hire one of the hottest young coaches around... Yep you guessed it. Brian F'n Wardle. Currently tearing it up at UW-GB, signing 7 footers left and right, in addition to a few 5 footers.

That's not really a joke, maybe a bit of Oliver Stone mixed with the book of Revelation, but not a joke since its conceivable that it could happen.
A) They have a seven footer and 2 guys who are listed in the 5 ft range (one of them might actually be 4'11")
B) If Buzz is forced out for failing to control guys, there is no way they could bring in anyone who would actually go after any inner city talent. One incident under a new coach within the first year and it becomes an institutional problem in the media, meaning School/AD can't handle it. The only way they could minimize that risk is to raise admission requirements like a Northwestern (maybe ND?). That means the new coach wouldn't be touching MPS or CPS on a regular basis. The coach would be forced to recruit against ND, Northwestern, and Stanford in the Chicago and Milwaukee burbs. At that point realistically your only name candidate is Chris Collins (who people said would be interested in Northwestern) and your backup candidate is Brian Wardle. If you were to raise that bar and an incident happened, it would be browsed over by the media. Shades of gray in that being racist, stereotyping, etc.. but it's the only way they could go if Buzz was forced out.  
C) Adding to the conspiracy is that Brian was on campus/at the game for senior day (or the game before that), pretty easy for LW to give him an informal interview at that point.

[Norm]

Just a quick comparison of the two programs:

SMU
96 seasons: 1202-1149, .511
9 20+ win seasons
10 NCAA appearances
1 Final Four (1956)
2 NITs
Moody Coliseum capacity: 8,998

Marquette
95 seasons: 1494-913, .621
33 20+ win seasons
30 NCAA appearances
3 Final Fours (1974, 1977, 2003)
1 NCAA Championship (1977)
1 NCAA Runner Up (1974)
16 Sweet 16's
15 NITs (1 Championship - 1970)
Bradley Center capacity: 18,850

[jaybilaswho?]

TJ - This isn't 1 penny about money.  Not 1 penny about money.  Who is responsible for "all the winning he was doing here??"  Think Buzz is responsible for that?  Think that will change if he goes to SMU and can recruit within Texas all he wants, without all of the ignorance of some in the MU BOT/Admin, and not have to deal with a witch hunt local newspaper/police force like the MJS and MPD??  If Buzz goes to SMU, SMU will be a Top 5 Big East Team in 4 years, and in all likelihood MU will be a bottom feeder in the Big East..unless somehow MU can land Shaka Smart...which I think is a LONG, LONG, LONG shot.

Do Texas schools treat their basketball programs with as much of a "win at all costs" mentality as they do with their football programs? you know within the confines of the NCAA rulebook.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

TJ - This isn't 1 penny about money.  Not 1 penny about money.  Who is responsible for "all the winning he was doing here??"  Think Buzz is responsible for that?  Think that will change if he goes to SMU and can recruit within Texas all he wants, without all of the ignorance of some in the MU BOT/Admin, and not have to deal with a witch hunt local newspaper/police force like the MJS and MPD??  If Buzz goes to SMU, SMU will be a Top 5 Big East Team in 4 years, and in all likelihood MU will be a bottom feeder in the Big East..unless somehow MU can land Shaka Smart...which I think is a LONG, LONG, LONG shot.

Seems perfectly rational.

[T-Bone]

True, but he didn't get into specifics about New Orleans. Don't forget that.

I believe neither Buzz nor UNO could discuss any specifics per their settlement agreement.  Just how those things normally work.  

IF Buzz were to leave, it would be much the same.  

[Warriors10]

Just a quick comparison of the two programs:

SMU
96 seasons: 1202-1149, .511
9 20+ win seasons
10 NCAA appearances
1 Final Four (1956)
2 NITs
Moody Coliseum capacity: 8,998

Marquette
95 seasons: 1494-913, .621
33 20+ win seasons
30 NCAA appearances
3 Final Fours (1974, 1977, 2003)
1 NCAA Championship (1977)
1 NCAA Runner Up (1974)
16 Sweet 16's
15 NITs (1 Championship - 1970)
Bradley Center capacity: 18,850

SMU: AD and Prez that want him a lot
MU: AD and Prez that don't seem to care if he stays or not.

[GGGG]

Uh oh. I am hearing things that leads me to believe buzz isn't going to be here. He is handling this better than TC is but it is but it is stretching out the process. Have a feeling goose and muguru were right about how this has been brewing for awhile...even prior to LW being here.

[Aughnanure]

TJ - This isn't 1 penny about money.  Not 1 penny about money.  Who is responsible for "all the winning he was doing here??"  Think Buzz is responsible for that?  Think that will change if he goes to SMU and can recruit within Texas all he wants, without all of the ignorance of some in the MU BOT/Admin, and not have to deal with a witch hunt local newspaper/police force like the MJS and MPD??  If Buzz goes to SMU, SMU will be a Top 5 Big East Team in 4 years, and in all likelihood MU will be a bottom feeder in the Big East..unless somehow MU can land Shaka Smart...which I think is a LONG, LONG, LONG shot.

I know you LOOOOOVEEEE buzz, but seriously. Top 5? He'll be competing with UT, A&M, Kansas, Oklahahoma and every other freaking school (its freaking Texas, they dont all lean to the in-state schools - especially ones with ZERO history or proof of success). I don't know how MU will do, but if we can keep the majority of the current team, we should be fine with a new coach and have a chance to build momentum with him (a la Buzz).

[NersEllenson]

SMU: AD and Prez that want him a lot
MU: AD and Prez that don't seem to care if he stays or not.

Ding
Ding
Ding

[TJ]

TJ - This isn't 1 penny about money.  Not 1 penny about money.  Who is responsible for "all the winning he was doing here??"  Think Buzz is responsible for that?  Think that will change if he goes to SMU and can recruit within Texas all he wants, without all of the ignorance of some in the MU BOT/Admin, and not have to deal with a witch hunt local newspaper/police force like the MJS and MPD??  If Buzz goes to SMU, SMU will be a Top 5 Big East Team in 4 years, and in all likelihood MU will be a bottom feeder in the Big East..unless somehow MU can land Shaka Smart...which I think is a LONG, LONG, LONG shot.

HA!!!  Good stuff.  Sadly I think you're being serious.

SMU doesn't suddenly get UT's recruits because they have Buzz.  SMU doesn't suddenly ease their admissions requirements because they have Buzz.  SMU doesn't suddenly jump up to anything better than 5th best program in the state of Texas just because they have Buzz.  You don't think there will be scrutiny placed on a basketball coach making almost $3M per year?  Nothing would get easier for him; everything would be significantly harder.  I personally am a big fan of Buzz and I actually think he could slowly but surely make it work, but there will be no overnight success at SMU - with or without Buzz.  

And your Pollyanna attitude about Marquette is disturbing.  I'm glad you have such faith in Marquette that you think MU will fall to bottom feeder immediately.  The program is bigger than one man.  MU will be fine either way, even if there is a short setback.

Finally, I personally don't think this is anything but a big overreaction to nothing and I don't think Buzz is all about money.  My post was a response to the question "How do you spin it if you're LW and Buzz leaves?"  Take it with a grain of salt.

[LAZER]

I know you LOOOOOVEEEE buzz, but seriously. Top 5? He'll be competing with UT, A&M, Kansas, Oklahahoma and every other freaking school (its freaking Texas, they dont all lean to the in-state schools - especially ones with ZERO history or proof of success). I don't know how MU will do, but if we can keep the majority of the current team, we should be fine with a new coach and have a chance to build momentum with him (a la Buzz).

If Buzz leaves there will be an exodus of current players and recruits, it will be ugly for the next couple of years.

[Aughnanure]

Uh oh. I am hearing things that leads me to believe buzz isn't going to be here. He is handling this better than TC is but it is but it is stretching out the process. Have a feeling goose and muguru were right about how this has been brewing for awhile...even prior to LW being here.